BladeWise
Smash Lord
Here's a weird edgeguard for you, KirbyKaze. One of my favorites to do.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJihvDMPlTw#t=17m12s
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Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-
- Thread starter Silent Wolf
- Start date
www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJihvDMPlTw#t=17m12s
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I think that time-stamp captures the essence of my post perfectly. Good stuff.
The double booty-pop was also pretty good.
The double booty-pop was also pretty good.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Pop was intentional.
It's a Peach boards thing though - you wouldn't understand.
It's a Peach boards thing though - you wouldn't understand.
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
OMG man I wanna have poutine with Diakonos!!
Actually I wanna have poutine in general
Can we have poutine at Impulse please?
Actually I wanna have poutine in general
Can we have poutine at Impulse please?
Divinokage
Smash Legend
The poutine we had on sunday was pretty godlike.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I'll bring you to Smoke's Poutinerie. It's pretty good.
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
:poutine: 
Silent Wolf
...
ive never had poutine. i always think of pootie tang when i hear it so i imagine its dope
Jethrotex
Smash Journeyman
Louis C.K. is a funny man, I'd like to see him covered in cheese and gravy as well.
unknown522
Some guy
That's it! We're all going to smokes when you guys come. It's not too far from the venue (well, driving...)
yeah man. T-Rex Poutine ftw.
Do you remember what the name of the place was? I'm gonna upload some pics soon
Divinokage
Smash Legend
It was called "La Banquise"
Bing
Smash Master
Yo we went to La Banquise the first night, was a 30 minute walk from the terminal
God Damn that was worth it.
14$ La Matty: Bacon, Green Peppers, Onions, Mushrooms
Also how do you use Fox with a barely functioning control stick and C-stick?
God Damn that was worth it.
14$ La Matty: Bacon, Green Peppers, Onions, Mushrooms
Also how do you use Fox with a barely functioning control stick and C-stick?
ViperGold42
Smash Lord
what important things are we talking here than? isnt this the Fox questions thread?
Fortress | Sveet
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http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=97603
please read stickies or search for information before asking
FrootLoop
Smash Lord
ya get outta here with ur fox questions we're discussing important things
valgar2900
Smash Journeyman
mortal kombat voice (round 1 Fight)
ViperGold42
Smash Lord
I hate to be living in the most Overrated state in the universe.
Lovage
Smash Hero
7% of me wants to try writing a really comprehensive fox guide
93% of me doesnt give a ****
93% of me doesnt give a ****
ViperGold42
Smash Lord
ahmen brother
valgar2900
Smash Journeyman
u should its been a long time since i came in here to see how the mu have changed.
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
This game is too complicated for guides
Go out there and fight
Go out there and fight
Bing
Smash Master
I agree I mean we already have a tech guide and for Fox most MU's are the same... Strike First,Strike Hard no mercy sir!(Chant from the Cobra Kai in the Karate Kid)
For the record, I did say most.
For the record, I did say most.
ViperGold42
Smash Lord
wow could have said that instead of having somebody telling me to go **** off.thank you
Bing
Smash Master
Im not being entirely serious, there is a lot more to it, and certainly times to be defensive and play smart.
unknown522
Some guy
Silent Wolf
...
i think a lot of the good fox players wanna make a guide but dont think theyd finish it lol. a guide with video examples would be sick tho
rokimomi
Smash Lord
How about talking through a match or something like Lucien did? Wouldn't be super organized but I'm sure it'd be well received.
Fortress | Sveet
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Lovage, if one of you worked on an outline for what needed to be included in either a text or a video guide, im sure the collective fox MBR members would be willing to work together to fill in the blanks. Personally, I could help by proving screen captures of specific scenarios if a list was given to me.
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
I hella wanna make a guide too but i suk and i think i don't play fox how you're "supposed" to play fox
hey but if you guys make a guide i'm down to help
maybe if we all do 7% it can add up to ONE HUNDRED %%%%
edit: btw fox thread more like poutine thread. **** canada is tight lol <3 all you guys
hey but if you guys make a guide i'm down to help
maybe if we all do 7% it can add up to ONE HUNDRED %%%%
edit: btw fox thread more like poutine thread. **** canada is tight lol <3 all you guys
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
couldn't focus on studying for finals today so I watched a bunch of Dr. Peepee vs HBox's friendlies from Herb 3 and wrote a bunch of notes on Fox vs. Puff (tested some of this stuff this past weekend as well, i.e. full jump drill, which I am now convinced ***** jigglypuff)
Note these are random notes, primarily for myself, and therefore probably don't apply to everyone and DEFINITELY don't cover every single option in each situation. so it's not a comprehensive list of stuff that works on puff, just ideas I thought might warrant more exploration.
Anyone wanna tell me if any of this doesn't make sense?
>>VS. JIGGLYPUFF TACTICS
(NEUTRAL GAME)
- Example of Fox vs Jigglypuff neutral game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJtWQjXiLUI#t=1m12s
PP makes Hungrybox wary to go deep by dashdancing. PP chooses not to commit with an approach, but PP could have attacked HBox's position if he wanted to. Immediately after HBox's first two full jump bairs, PP could have full jump naired/daired onto the side platform to combo. (Visually confirm the full jump bair then immediately rush in and do a deep full jump aerial in case they react and pull back.) PP also could have done a full jump aerial to meet the third full jump bair, or ran under HBox and baired behind HBox's bair hitbox. Furthermore, running into a shield (Mango approach) and following that with WD oos (forward/backward appropriately) would have been a good response to the landing bairs. Finally, HBox decides to go in, and does a deep landing bair trying to catch PP out of his dashdance. PP doesn't fall for the approach and HBox shields.
- Example of Fox dashdancing poorly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJtWQjXiLUI#t=3m30s
PP gets baired out of his dashdance. He should have reacted to the rising bair and either a) ran under HBox (possibly followed by a full jump bair), b) challenged HBox after the rising bair with a full jump nair or dair, or c) shielded. Remember that when you shield a landing bair from a Puff, wavedash oos (into jab, etc.) is a very good option. There are probably other options (attempt to trade with usmash, full jump waveland onto side platform) but these aren't as safe.
- Full jump drill is very good vs. Jigglypuff. Unlike vs. Peach where drilling her into the ground can be ineffective or even dangerous, drilling Jigglypuff into the ground nets you at best a shine (and therefore knockdown), and at worst a drill on her shield (i.e. she reaches the ground before you and gets her shield up) which leads to good shield pressure. Puff's oos sucks and her knocked-down state sucks so both of these are good. Even if Puff escapes, she's still on the ground and has to find a smart way to take to the air again, which isn't always easy. You can throw a full jump drill between her bairs and stop her wall.
- See PP's approach at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_uc3f98Ue4#t=2m3s
From side platform, bait Jigglypuff to try to put pressure on you, then full jump high over her, fastfall through the top platform and bair. (I think Lucky talked about this exact situation in an interview at Pound 4)
- PP's full jump nair at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_uc3f98Ue4#t=2m48s
Beats double jump bair and fade away falling bair/land (which HBox did). When you full jump in with nair, aim to jump just out of range of Puff's bair, and aim deep to cover the most space.
- Another good example of full jump nair: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=5m12s
Mango throws the nair out right after HBox's high bair ends, and although HBox pulls back, Mango still clips him with the nair on the way down and gets a shine off.
- Running under Puff and full jump bairing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m59s
HBox goes high to try to catch Mango jumping, but Mango runs under him, full jump bairs, and gets a very fat combo.
- If you WD backwards towards puff and then SH bair with the wavedash momentum, you can move faster than a Puff pulling back. Combined with WD OOS, I think this is an effective (and safe) way to beat Puff's neutral game and fish for kills at high percent.
(DEFENSIVE GAME)
- Escaping from Jigglypuff's pressure: When on the defensive, it's generally better to go under Jigglypuff than over. Perfect example of what NOT to do: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9yHBWMRrkM#t=4m9s
Note these are random notes, primarily for myself, and therefore probably don't apply to everyone and DEFINITELY don't cover every single option in each situation. so it's not a comprehensive list of stuff that works on puff, just ideas I thought might warrant more exploration.
Anyone wanna tell me if any of this doesn't make sense?
>>VS. JIGGLYPUFF TACTICS
(NEUTRAL GAME)
- Example of Fox vs Jigglypuff neutral game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJtWQjXiLUI#t=1m12s
PP makes Hungrybox wary to go deep by dashdancing. PP chooses not to commit with an approach, but PP could have attacked HBox's position if he wanted to. Immediately after HBox's first two full jump bairs, PP could have full jump naired/daired onto the side platform to combo. (Visually confirm the full jump bair then immediately rush in and do a deep full jump aerial in case they react and pull back.) PP also could have done a full jump aerial to meet the third full jump bair, or ran under HBox and baired behind HBox's bair hitbox. Furthermore, running into a shield (Mango approach) and following that with WD oos (forward/backward appropriately) would have been a good response to the landing bairs. Finally, HBox decides to go in, and does a deep landing bair trying to catch PP out of his dashdance. PP doesn't fall for the approach and HBox shields.
- Example of Fox dashdancing poorly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJtWQjXiLUI#t=3m30s
PP gets baired out of his dashdance. He should have reacted to the rising bair and either a) ran under HBox (possibly followed by a full jump bair), b) challenged HBox after the rising bair with a full jump nair or dair, or c) shielded. Remember that when you shield a landing bair from a Puff, wavedash oos (into jab, etc.) is a very good option. There are probably other options (attempt to trade with usmash, full jump waveland onto side platform) but these aren't as safe.
- Full jump drill is very good vs. Jigglypuff. Unlike vs. Peach where drilling her into the ground can be ineffective or even dangerous, drilling Jigglypuff into the ground nets you at best a shine (and therefore knockdown), and at worst a drill on her shield (i.e. she reaches the ground before you and gets her shield up) which leads to good shield pressure. Puff's oos sucks and her knocked-down state sucks so both of these are good. Even if Puff escapes, she's still on the ground and has to find a smart way to take to the air again, which isn't always easy. You can throw a full jump drill between her bairs and stop her wall.
- See PP's approach at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_uc3f98Ue4#t=2m3s
From side platform, bait Jigglypuff to try to put pressure on you, then full jump high over her, fastfall through the top platform and bair. (I think Lucky talked about this exact situation in an interview at Pound 4)
- PP's full jump nair at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_uc3f98Ue4#t=2m48s
Beats double jump bair and fade away falling bair/land (which HBox did). When you full jump in with nair, aim to jump just out of range of Puff's bair, and aim deep to cover the most space.
- Another good example of full jump nair: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=5m12s
Mango throws the nair out right after HBox's high bair ends, and although HBox pulls back, Mango still clips him with the nair on the way down and gets a shine off.
- Running under Puff and full jump bairing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m59s
HBox goes high to try to catch Mango jumping, but Mango runs under him, full jump bairs, and gets a very fat combo.
- If you WD backwards towards puff and then SH bair with the wavedash momentum, you can move faster than a Puff pulling back. Combined with WD OOS, I think this is an effective (and safe) way to beat Puff's neutral game and fish for kills at high percent.
(DEFENSIVE GAME)
- Escaping from Jigglypuff's pressure: When on the defensive, it's generally better to go under Jigglypuff than over. Perfect example of what NOT to do: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9yHBWMRrkM#t=4m9s
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
Toph if you learned how to shield drop our Foxes would look identical
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
might add more to that post. about to (re)watch Mango vs Hbox @ G2
edit: btw, only tangentially related, but the other day I was practicing dashdance grabbing level 9 computers while staying just outside their range (got the idea from a post Cactuar made one time). I think it's pretty good o_O trains you to look for openings lol
edit: btw, only tangentially related, but the other day I was practicing dashdance grabbing level 9 computers while staying just outside their range (got the idea from a post Cactuar made one time). I think it's pretty good o_O trains you to look for openings lol
Fortress | Sveet
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I played symphony of the night while under geared to learn to look for openings. tools: jump, double jump, backdash, attack. effing love that game
Lovage
Smash Hero
sometimes when i knock away a cpu falco, i'll start dash dancing realistcally and imagine the angles + timings he could approach me. then i just hit him some more cuz its a dumb *** comp lol
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
notes on edgeguarding puff (note: this is pretty much about "safe" edgeguarding, i.e. edgeguarding from the stage and fighting jigglypuff while she's on the ledge while hopefully not getting gh3y3d)
(EDGEGUARDING)
- Vs. Jigglypuff on the ledge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=2m45s
Mango lands next to the ledge from a ledgehop bair attempt, shields to bait HBox to poke from the ledge, then pre-empts HBox's aerial by full jumping over it off the ledge into a shine. From here the edgeguarding process starts. Remember that although Jigglypuff gets 5 jumps in the air, not all of those jumps are "good" and therefore Jigglypuff has to make a decision eventually. (Note, Jigglypuff could also do an aerial to poke further onto the stage. This can be countered with a full jump bair: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m23s)
- Jigglypuff running out of jumps by the ledge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m5s
HBox jumps and pokes from beyond the ledge twice, but Mango clips him with a falling fair (nair might also work?) and puts HBox in a bad position because his "good" aerial jumps are gone. Mango takes the ledge and HBox fails to bait Mango to do a bad ledgehop bair. Then it's a 50/50 - Mango guesses HBox will fall towards the stage, but HBox goes to the ledge instead.
- More on edgeguarding Puff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m15s
I think if Mango had done run-off shine (to intercept HBox trying to grab the ledge) instead of full jump off into shine, he would've killed HBox. Worth experimenting with, particularly when Jigglypuff has used 2 or more of their aerial jumps.
(EDGEGUARDING)
- Vs. Jigglypuff on the ledge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=2m45s
Mango lands next to the ledge from a ledgehop bair attempt, shields to bait HBox to poke from the ledge, then pre-empts HBox's aerial by full jumping over it off the ledge into a shine. From here the edgeguarding process starts. Remember that although Jigglypuff gets 5 jumps in the air, not all of those jumps are "good" and therefore Jigglypuff has to make a decision eventually. (Note, Jigglypuff could also do an aerial to poke further onto the stage. This can be countered with a full jump bair: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m23s)
- Jigglypuff running out of jumps by the ledge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m5s
HBox jumps and pokes from beyond the ledge twice, but Mango clips him with a falling fair (nair might also work?) and puts HBox in a bad position because his "good" aerial jumps are gone. Mango takes the ledge and HBox fails to bait Mango to do a bad ledgehop bair. Then it's a 50/50 - Mango guesses HBox will fall towards the stage, but HBox goes to the ledge instead.
- More on edgeguarding Puff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLdlOpbLkS4#t=7m15s
I think if Mango had done run-off shine (to intercept HBox trying to grab the ledge) instead of full jump off into shine, he would've killed HBox. Worth experimenting with, particularly when Jigglypuff has used 2 or more of their aerial jumps.
unknown522
Some guy
Interesting
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
k I finished my vs. puff stuff and edited the above posts/organized points
plz read if you have time!! (*＾-＾)vｨｪｨ♪
plz read if you have time!! (*＾-＾)vｨｪｨ♪