Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[4 Aces]

What's CC shine? I know what CC is, but CC shine is kind of a new term for me. Thanks for the tips on your last post, by the way. Where's the smiley face when you need it?!

 

[Giggidax]

Fox's aerials just seem better because Fox has better follow ups. i.e. Shine.

im talking about shffling fox's aerials
like its just quick since hes a fastfaller and has little lag time

 

[SCOTU]

im talking about shffling fox's aerials
like its just quick since hes a fastfaller and has little lag time

Fox does have the least ammount of airtime from a perfect shffl.

1st - Fox (15 frames)
2nd - Falco (17 frames)
3rd - Bowser (19 frames)
3rd - Roy
5th - Captain Falcon (20 frames)
5th - Link (20 frames)

We can clearly see that this is the list of top shfflers right here. /sarcasm. Yes, fox's is the fastest, but not the best.

EDIT: CC shine = Crouch Cancel, then shine. pwns Luigi's Up-b hard.

 

[noobmaster]

...

I can do this...
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=109726

...but need help doing this

00:59- 1:02
2:09- 2:17
2:26- 2:34

 

[SCOTU]

you don't need any help antempting anything from perfect control. There's a reason it's called that, and there's a reason everything is in it.

 

[noobmaster]

hey!

If its in there its possible and if its possible i want to attempt it...
if you don't know how to pull that stuff out don't cover it up by saying it shouldn't be attempted. I'll just wait for someone who does.

 

[Silent Wolf]

I can the the first one and the last one. :D

The shine turn arounds...good luck with those.
Down B, turn around while in it (Hit opposite direction you're facing), jump, air dodge at an angle towards the ground, repeat.

The last one you just dash jump, flick or tilt the control stick the opposite way you're dash jumping in and press B twice. Very fast.

I'll let scotu tell you the middle one.

 

[SCOTU]

Ha! i can do that one! (er... well... on a really good day... one so good i haven't had it yet...).

That's just multishining. Or jc shining. Consult Cunning's guide on JC shine infiniting. I'm too tired to explain it. Don't bother with it cause it's no good.

 

[Press22]

Hey, I need some help on my Fox Ditto's and against Marths.

Ok with the fox's I usually get ***** by drillshines. Also the grabs.

and on Marths I usually get knocked off and just get repetitive Fwrd Smasher when trying to recover, I need to make that stop.

Thx Silent Wolf, I'm about #4-7 Fox Here, so I REALLY appreciate the help.

 

[Silent Wolf]

In Fox dittos you have to be cautious more than assertive. If you go in for an aerial, it's much too easy for them to avoid and grab. What Vwins did to me at FC, was go in for an aerial, then immediately sidestep, and grab me, knowing I would try to grab him. So try that.

VS Marth, just stay away form the ledge. If he waits at the ledge, laser him.

 

[Press22]

Don't bite me but whats a sidestep, I probably know how to do it, just don't know thats the name for it.

Edit: thx for all the help, Silent Wolf - I'll make you a BEASTLY Fox Sig.

 

[Silent Wolf]

Spot dodge = Sidestep. Standing dodge. I don't know what else to call it. =/

 

[Deleted member]

In Fox dittos you have to be cautious more than assertive. If you go in for an aerial, it's much too easy for them to avoid and grab. What Vwins did to me at FC, was go in for an aerial, then immediately sidestep, and grab me, knowing I would try to grab him. So try that.

I also played both you and vwins at FC, although not in tournament, and I know what you mean. Standard fox does a single DD grab, and will usually fall for a jab.

A great fox secret is that his safest move is not actually the laser, but his drill. Drill grab is generally the way to go in fox dittos.

 

[SCOTU]

Yeah, he speaks the truth, and he's umbreonmow, he's got to be right. Oh, and shffld air whiffs can sometimes be protected w/ by use of jab/ftilt/dsmash depending on their spacing, since they'll try to grab you for sure.

 

[noobmaster]

thanks for the info silent wolf and scotu... didn't mean to sound rude...
well off to practice

 

[Shai Hulud]

How come I never see Foxes JC shine from shield? I've been pretty successful using that against pillaring Falcos. It's a difficult tech, but not beyond the ability of many of the players here.

 

[SCOTU]

because it's easier to hold side-C. has about the same results, unless you thunder's combo off the shine.

 

[Shai Hulud]

because it's easier to hold side-C. has about the same results, unless you thunder's combo off the shine.

And why wouldn't you do thunder's combo? Or tech chase, or whatever? It seems to me an aggressive response (JC shine) would be better than a passive one.

 

[SCOTU]

whatever works.

@ SW: its about time the stickies got cleaned up. (sweet, my shield guide made it into that guide index thing.)

 

[4 Aces]

Hold-C? What do you mean by that? And when you Shine out of a shield, are you on the ground or in mid air during the shine?

In Perfect Control, there's a part where Fox multishines, and at the same time, slowly advances in a direction. I was wondering how would you do that? Frame data would be awesome for this particular trick. Thanks in advance!

thanks for the info silent wolf and scotu... didn't mean to sound rude...
well off to practice

Hey! I'm on the same conquest like you!! Well...that's part of it. I can multishine, but not very well and only occasionally. Keep working at it!

Just noticed, but I'm no longer than a Smash Noob. *smiles*

 

[SCOTU]

By "Hold side-c" i meant buffer a roll. (see thread on shield pressure for more details and frame data).

When JCing a shine, it's not a true JC. Fox doesn't cancel the startup of his jump like he does for other JCs he actually leaves the ground and cancels his jump motion. he's in the air for 3 frames while in the shine, and during those, one can exert aerial control by angling the control stick during the jump just like any other jump. The trick is you have to have it in a position to shine again at the right time.

 

[Xeus]

whenever i attempt to waveshine i always end up doing a downward dodge(standing still dodge? lol) at the end of wavedashing instead of going straight to a shield

any ideas on how to avoid this?

 

[Silent Wolf]

Make sure you shine before trying to wavedash. That must be the case because you cannot sidestep out of shine.

 

[Xeus]

=) thanks for the quick reply ill go practice lol

 

[SCOTU]

Yeah, Pretty much between SW and I (and anyone else), we'll pretty much have your question answered right away.

 

[brawlpro]

I LOL AT U SCOTU(that was funny), i have trouble practicing waveshine, i keep on illusioning off stage, and its becoming a problem, i really don't wanna do that at SGAB midwest tourney, sucks i won't c u there sco2.

 

[Alexman0817]

I use a fox and I have trouble with mirror matches I hate playing vs fox I know I can chaingrab him and stuff but I just can't seem to run away from his deflector any suggestions?

 

[brawlpro]

wait till sco2 or SW check ur ?, in a fox ditto, shffling nair can usually be hard to shine, and drillshining works for me too, and if ur still havin probs or i didn't answer ur ? as u'd hoped, try using ur "deflector thing" on him, use it constantly, it might intimidate him, u can also spot dodge i guess...just wavedance or dashdance, play mind games with him, o and u already might know this but alwayz end ur chaingrabs with usmash.

 

[4 Aces]

By "Hold side-c" i meant buffer a roll. (see thread on shield pressure for more details and frame data).

When JCing a shine, it's not a true JC. Fox doesn't cancel the startup of his jump like he does for other JCs he actually leaves the ground and cancels his jump motion. he's in the air for 3 frames while in the shine, and during those, one can exert aerial control by angling the control stick during the jump just like any other jump. The trick is you have to have it in a position to shine again at the right time.

Wow, that's pretty cool. Man, you know a lot about this game. And then Brawl comes out...Anyway, to clear up one last thing, a JC is when you cancel the jump animation right?

 

[brawlpro]

umm...well yeah. scotu/sw can correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[Alexman0817]

Well I finish all my grabs with a U smash and he uses more the deflector than me but yes I drill shine and stuff I'm better than him its just I dont like playing ditto and I got to a point that tried to change my fox for a sheik or a Captain but It's not the same I've been playing a fox before I discovered shffling wavedash etc etc... and my friends say I shouldn't stop being a fox but I don't know =/ He copied MY FOX he's a total clone of me

 

[darkshy]

I'm having trouble with the short hop double laser. I can seem to get the timimng down. I mean I have to use 2 hands to do a few times. I try doing training modes but my fingers just don't move fast enough any help?

 

[brawlpro]

Well I finish all my grabs with a U smash and he uses more the deflector than me but yes I drill shine and stuff I'm better than him its just I dont like playing ditto and I got to a point that tried to change my fox for a sheik or a Captain but It's not the same I've been playing a fox before I discovered shffling wavedash etc etc... and my friends say I shouldn't stop being a fox but I don't know =/ He copied MY FOX he's a total clone of me

lets call the deflector "shine" from now on...
back to ur ?, maybe after u drillshine him, go ahead and dashdance until u figure out what direction he is gonna get back up by, chase him into a grab from there, i luv fox dittos, cause i get to chaingrab someone since i'm always fighting a marth. O and shffl a lot, its fun when i do it, u have to like doing stuff in order to learn it(maybe*), so learn to luv it when u land a shffl, nairs work great, so don't quit fox yet, if hes ur clone, change ur style, go from offensive to defensive, be a hybrid fox, and figure out his pattern.

 

[brawlpro]

I'm having trouble with the short hop double laser. I can seem to get the timimng down. I mean I have to use 2 hands to do a few times. I try doing training modes but my fingers just don't move fast enough any help?

slide ur thumb from y to b. make sure not to hit the c stick during the process. O and do not fast fall.

 

[darkshy]

I think I get it now. THanks for the advice appreciate it.

 

[brawlpro]

I think I get it now. THanks for the advice appreciate it.

No problem, i'm just glad i was able to help u

 

[SCOTU]

sweet. Don't have to answer any questions tonight.

 

[Silent Wolf]

sweet. Don't have to answer any questions tonight.

Sweet. Dont have to watch scotu answer questions for me tonight

 

[brawlpro]

Sweet. Dont have to watch scotu answer questions for me tonight

Sweet. Can't beleive my answers worked tonight.
I'm happy

Hey scotu, if u got free time and haven't already done so...the third link works in my thread now.

 

[ZeroP]

one question about the thunders-combo. after the shine is the wavedashtotapa timing or just fast fingers^^ and a second question: how can i train my fingers so they will be faster?