Fourth and final community vote about Meta Knight.

[Hylian]

He was disagreeing with that sentiment and attempting to explain why... and the match-up ratios were an illustration. That's not idiotic, that's practical.

I don't think Steel was being idiotic at all, I think match-up ratios are idiotic.

MK is not a bad player, but his style of play isn't good for playing against Marth. He doesn't like "playing gay" for example.

Sure, he makes it work, but that doesn't mean that there aren't much more effective anti-marth strategies.

M2K you mean.

And his style is fine for anyone he plays against. Do you honestly think he plays the same against every character he plays? Have you seen him play against Ice Climbers? All he does is run away. Jason knows what works and saying his style is bad against marth when he doesn't lose to any is...strange. It's a preconceived notion that a certain style of play is the best against marth with meta. Isn't Jason the only MK to not have dropped a set to a Marth player? He knows what he's doing.

Character vs Character is far less important then Player vs Player at top levels of play.

 

[Llumys]

lol I'm spreading lies?
Olimar is not at a SLIGHT disadvantage to mk. Dair camping kills olimar so much. Even most mk's say this is an easy match up for them. Once a mk learns the match up (even if the olimar knows it) it's a joke. Olimar's priority is terrible in the air compared to mk's.

I'm not trying to be super pro ban here I'm just saying mk ***** a lot of characters.

Olimar's aerial priority isn't terrible compared to Meta Knight, Meta Knight's just a lot more flexible and is faster.

 

[blakinola]

If M2K camped, no one would ever win against him.

I respect him too much as a smasher.

Everyone HAS to run from IC's. Cept Snake.

 

[cutter]

Marths only thought the matchup was pretty much hopeless against MK because Emblem Lord believed that was the case. And because of that, most of the Marth boards followed him like brainwashed lemmings.

Sorry Marths (you know who you are), but I'm calling you guys out here. I agree with Hylian. Why should you rely on constructing matchups based on theorycraft when you should really be considering it from tournament play? That's where actual application of the game at the highest level takes place.

 

[Overswarm]

Have you seen him play against Ice Climbers? All he does is run away.

Yes.... except he ran TOWARDS them nonstop and constantly faired their shield and lost. Then he came back from loser's and THEN "played gay" because he knew he had to.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Well DUH. Marth is A Tier. Meta Knight is S Tier. Of COURSE they will have to play good Meta Knights, just like they will have to play good Snakes, good Falcos and whatnot else. Of course there are top players using Meta Knight - he's the best character!
Saying that's a problem is like saying that if you have to play a Snake that you're being crippled and never can win a national tournament.

...

MK beats Marth worse than Snake...

Because Marth is able to beat Meta Knight, which has been proven by 2 of his best players, who both stated - NEO here in this very thread - that their character definitely hasn't reached his peak.
If NEO or MikeHaze can beat good Meta Knights like Tyrant or DSF with only 50% of their character's potential (as NEO said), or even 70%, then guess what happens if they play with 100% of their character's potential?
Meta Knight has been taken extremely far, and his metagame has stagnated. Other characters are following up and that DOES happen, just look at Snake.

Who's to say MK has reached his peak? At this point, it's all assumption.

Well, that's the reason why Marth is in A Tier, and Meta Knight in S Tier? Because Meta Knight is a better character?

Yeah...

 

[DUCKAtl]

i was 3 stocking my friend's ganondorf with ddd and then he switched to MK and now i can only 1 stock him
BAN MK

no johns

You read my mind like an open book. Would you like a free t-shirt and a gift card?

same here, no johns

Yes.... except he ran TOWARDS them nonstop and constantly faired their shield and lost. Then he came back from loser's and THEN "played gay" because he knew he had to.

why run from ice climbers, if you camped they could easily get u off whatever ledge ur on

 

[Steel]

Marths only thought the matchup was pretty much hopeless against MK because Emblem Lord believed that was the case. And because of that, most of the Marth boards followed him like brainwashed lemmings.

Sorry Marths (you know who you are), but I'm calling you guys out here. I agree with Hylian. Why should you rely on constructing matchups based on theorycraft when you should really be considering it from tournament play? That's where actual application of the game at the highest level takes place.

Sure it is, unless one or both of the players **** up in that particular set or don't abuse their characters in the match up. Or maybe they just don't know how to go about a particular match up.

That's why theorycraft exists.

 

[Red Arremer]

...

MK beats Marth worse than Snake...

I disagree. But that's your opinion, and mine is mine.
Matchups are subjective overall.

Who's to say MK has reached his peak? At this point, it's all assumption.

Because he hasn't seen any major developments in the close past. Additionally, all Top Meta Knights, and many of the other Top players agree that Meta Knight pretty much can't be advanced a lot more.

 

[etecoon]

why run from ice climbers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHfGqpHBZI4

 

[Pr0phetic]

Marths only thought the matchup was pretty much hopeless against MK because Emblem Lord believed that was the case. And because of that, most of the Marth boards followed him like brainwashed lemmings.

Sorry Marths (you know who you are), but I'm calling you guys out here. I agree with Hylian. Why should you rely on constructing matchups based on theorycraft when you should really be considering it from tournament play? That's where actual application of the game at the highest level takes place.

Actually our view of MK has changed several times. EL did not feel it was completely hopeless until late in his Brawl career, and many Marth's are only acting like the bunch of non-sense whiners here, not cause of a role model. We only make our match-ups BASED on the highest level of play, and we are not modest, when we lose we explain why. I hate to play defense in here, but this ignorance of our boards has to stop.

I'm pretty sure MK is far into his metagame aswell.

 

[Steel]

Emblem Lord hasn't posted in a match up thread in almost a year.

 

[adumbrodeus]

I don't think Steel was being idiotic at all, I think match-up ratios are idiotic.

Fair enough, but that comment was a complete non-sequitar from the previous line of discussion (ratios are bad).

M2K you mean.

And his style is fine for anyone he plays against. Do you honestly think he plays the same against every character he plays? Have you seen him play against Ice Climbers? All he does is run away. Jason knows what works and saying his style is bad against marth when he doesn't lose to any is...strange. It's a preconceived notion that a certain style of play is the best against marth with meta. Isn't Jason the only MK to not have dropped a set to a Marth player? He knows what he's doing.

Character vs Character is far less important then Player vs Player at top levels of play.

Yes I have, and that's because he knows that if he doesn't "play gay" against ICs he'll lose. He prefers to win then "not play gay".


I said his "style", not his effectiveness. Nobody will argue with his effectiveness, however what I'm suggesting is that if he chose a more campy style against Marth, the sets would be more drastically in his favor.

Let me give you an illustration, martial arts. Let's say I'm a very effective grappler, but I'm nowhere near as good at striking. Now, let's say I'm facing an opponent that's much better then me at both. If we fight, pretty much 100% of the time, I'm gonna even lose if I get to grappling, he's too superior to me. But by the same token, almost 100% of the time, I'm gonna lose if he outspaces me and prevents grappling, pounding me with strikes the entire time.

Sure, I lose either way, but the difference is the loss is more dramatic, I actually look like I'm not helpless if he lets me grapple, and the match could be a long drawn out one, but with the same conclusion every time.


Basically, that's M2K, if he can win either way, in the marth match-up he'll stick to grappling because "playing gay", which is what striking is equivilent to in this match-up, isn't his style.


Basically, M2K is so effective that his style doesn't change anything in this match-up.

 

[Runawayfire]

Case: Dojo vs Dehf.

There is no reason that an mk player could not utilize this hyper defensive style of play against many if not all (excluding mk) characters to avoid all disadvantageous situations making the opponents chances for victory nearly zero.

 

[Kewkky]

no johns

same here, no johns

I have no idea what you're trying to say... Unless you're saying that you should be doing as well as you do against Ganondorf, against MK... Meaning MK is no better than Ganondorf. Because that's what I'm making your post out to be.

short funny lines as a reply = lots of confusion

why run from ice climbers, if you camped they could easily get u off whatever ledge ur on

you have no idea what you're talking about when they say 'camp with MK', apparently... Try getting MK to land and stay on the floor near you when he's aircamping you as you use IC's... You'll have a BLAST.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

I disagree. But that's your opinion, and mine is mine.
Matchups are subjective overall.

Uhh...

OK... I don't want to go into a Matchup debate here, but I really don't see how you came to this conclusion.

Because he hasn't seen any major developments in the close past. Additionally, all Top Meta Knights, and many of the other Top players agree that Meta Knight pretty much can't be advanced a lot more.

I understand this, and I hate to "what if" this to death, but you can never say "oh nothing new will come out," because you honestly cannot know that. I agree that it most likely won't advance much further, but saying that he's at his complete peak is a stretch.

Also, saying Marth's meta game is only at 50% is assumption. It's an educated assumption, based off of what we know, etc., but an assumption nonetheless.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Stop dropping my name guys k thnx.

Also this is very entertaining.

I like how you guys are debating as if MK might actually get banned.

This **** is classic.

*goes back to lurking

 

[Steel]

Also HYLIAN

Weren't you saying however many months back that G&W v Marth was **** near hopeless? Why? Because Marth has much better options in that particular match. Options is EVERYTHING.

And when you look at Marth v Meta... Marth's are SEVERELY limited.

 

[MarKO X]

lol @ EL with the cameo appearance.

 

[DUCKAtl]

I have no idea what you're trying to say... Unless you're saying that you should be doing as well as you do against Ganondorf, against MK... Meaning MK is no better than Ganondorf. Because that's what I'm making your post out to be.

short funny lines as a reply = lots of confusion


you have no idea what you're talking about when they say 'camp with MK', apparently... Try getting MK to land and stay on the floor near you when he's aircamping you as you use IC's... You'll have a BLAST.

trust me, MK is way better than Ganon, but have you thought that regardless of who your friend uses, unless he just presses b like a ***** the whole game, maybe he's just a better player

 

[thanortinzak]

I think MK should not be banned.

Guys, remember the phrases "No Johns" and "Playing to win?". All of MK's moves can be countered. The ones that can't (like Inf. Cape) are banned. Planking is banned too (but actually, there's ways to punish plankers too). Remember that everything has a counter to it.

I'm guessing you believe thats not true. Think again. I'll list at least one way to counter each of MK's moves (not including recoveries, although certain recovery moves may be punishable too).

-Special Moves-
Tornado: MK's Tornado is quite easy to punish. Punishable by lotsa moves like Snake/DDD utilt, etc. Heck, a falcon punch or falcon kick can beat it!

Drill Rush: Hilariously easy to punish when used by scrubs as an approach. However, rather hard to punish as a recovery move.

Down-B: If opponent is using this attack to get away, punish with projectile.

Up-B: Block the move, then hit with fast attack.
-------------------
Tilts

D-Tilt: Good shield eater. Hard to punish, but if your opponent keeps on doing it, just move out of it's range and hit with a far-reaching attack (like DDD's ftilt)

F-Tilt: F-tilt is a 3-hit natural combo (or whatever you call it). Ending of it has a bit of lag, use it to punish.

U-Tilt: MK's utilt is not a particularly good utilt, but anyways, try taking advantage of it's slight ending lag.
---------------------------------------------------------
Aerials
Nair: Airdodge, then punish. Or, just keep a safe distance.
Fair: If you're on the ground, try shieldgrab if you can. If you're in the air, try getting back down, so you can punish that attack with shieldgrab or poke if he does it again.
Bair: Same as Fair
D-Air: If on ground, roll away. If in air, once he hits you, get away from it QUICK so he doesn't do another one.
U-Air: Dodge, fastfall so you hit ground, roll away so he doesn't d-air you



---------------------------------------------------------
Other

Standard A: I don't think I need to explain this one xD. MK doesn't have a good jab. Anyone with half a brain can come up with ways to counter it.

Dash attack: Shield the attack, and grab.

--------------------------------------------


So there you go. I told you guys ways about how you can beat MK's moves, therefore proving he is NOT broken. He's just a really good character. But definately not broken.

And remember to play to win and don't john!

 

[CT Chia]

yeah from what i know the SBR is extremely biased and the majority of them use mk so of course they are taking adv of there power to keep mk in, also taking adv of the 2/3 vote to slim the pro ban chances of getting rid of mk.

This.

I'm extremely against needing the 2/3 majority. It makes no sense.

 

[HolyCrusader]

I think MK should not be banned.

Guys, remember the phrases "No Johns" and "Playing to win?". All of MK's moves can be countered. The ones that can't (like Inf. Cape) are banned. Planking is banned too (but actually, there's ways to punish plankers too). Remember that everything has a counter to it.

I'm guessing you believe thats not true. Think again. I'll list at least one way to counter each of MK's moves (not including recoveries, although certain recovery moves may be punishable too).

-Special Moves-
Tornado: MK's Tornado is quite easy to punish. Punishable by lotsa moves like Snake/DDD utilt, etc. Heck, a falcon punch or falcon kick can beat it!

Drill Rush: Hilariously easy to punish when used by scrubs as an approach. However, rather hard to punish as a recovery move.

Down-B: If opponent is using this attack to get away, punish with projectile.

Up-B: Block the move, then hit with fast attack.
-------------------
Tilts

D-Tilt: Good shield eater. Hard to punish, but if your opponent keeps on doing it, just move out of it's range and hit with a far-reaching attack (like DDD's ftilt)

F-Tilt: F-tilt is a 3-hit natural combo (or whatever you call it). Ending of it has a bit of lag, use it to punish.

U-Tilt: MK's utilt is not a particularly good utilt, but anyways, try taking advantage of it's slight ending lag.
---------------------------------------------------------
Aerials
Nair: Airdodge, then punish. Or, just keep a safe distance.
Fair: If you're on the ground, try shieldgrab if you can. If you're in the air, try getting back down, so you can punish that attack with shieldgrab or poke if he does it again.
Bair: Same as Fair
D-Air: If on ground, roll away. If in air, once he hits you, get away from it QUICK so he doesn't do another one.
U-Air: Dodge, fastfall so you hit ground, roll away so he doesn't d-air you



---------------------------------------------------------
Other

Standard A: I don't think I need to explain this one xD. MK doesn't have a good jab. Anyone with half a brain can come up with ways to counter it.

Dash attack: Shield the attack, and grab.

--------------------------------------------


So there you go. I told you guys ways about how you can beat MK's moves, therefore proving he is NOT broken. He's just a really good character. But definately not broken.

And remember to play to win and don't john!

Your going to get attacked by Meta-phobics.

 

[Emblem Lord]

lol @ EL with the cameo appearance.

Dude I'm reading this **** and people are dropping my name like wtf is going on?!?!?!

Also..I read that someone in this thread said Marth has a range advantage over MK.

It just gets better and better guys.

Keep it up.

 

[∫unk]

No, there is a question. You are turning a blind eye to results.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgNPbFf_cHM&feature=channel_page

Mikehaze took Jason to match 5 at evo. Mikehaze(as posted in his blog) is anti-ban and says he used to think Marth couldn't beat MK, but he's since changed that mentality and is now competing with the best players in the nation.

You can't pin numbers on match-ups. I'm sorry but it just doesn't work. You say the only way Marth can beat MK is if he outplays him the entire match. What kind of logic is that? The only way you are going to beat ANY top player is by outplaying them. You don't beat people at that level of skill by relying on your character advantage, you HAVE to outplay them. That's how you win in fighting games generally.

Eliminating opposing arguments or results by number theory(match-up numbers) is horrible. You can't just throw a ratio in someones face and claim that it isn't questionable. Even if you know everything about a character it doesn't mean you know **** about how to compete with them at top level play.

People like to throw their credentials around as a basis for their understanding of match-ups weather those credentials involve community contribution or something flaunting their knowledge of the character.

People need to just play and travel and realize that 90% of the things said on the board make no difference. Just because the marth boards have MK as being 65:35 or 70:30 over Marth doesn't make it true. Likewise, it doesn't make it false either.

Just play the game at determine things for yourself. Far too many rely on others information and opinions..bandwagon them if you will. Form your own opinions. Travel. Play the ****ing game.

you realize a month ago mike wanted metaknight banned. this is after he was good, way after whobo. mike kinda ***** himself in his own blog referring to his old blog

but i agree at top levels its about the players. mid levels its more about the characters... but frankly the mid level is paying the top level... isn't tournament attendance going down recently? maybe this has to do with it

i dont really care whether he gets banned or not but... when something like tyrant beats adhd with relatively very little diddy experience (even if it was close... it probably shouldn't be >_>), while adhd has huge mk experience, it makes me worried.

it also makes me worried that i've beaten several better players simply by abusing mk... they aren't top players but they're ranked high level players. how do i come back from BoA with 0% vs me at 120+% (teams 1v1)? i abuse the hell out of the fact that metaknight can approach with almost complete safety. i certainly wasn't outthinking him i was just using random pokes. hell even at whobo i literally beat utd zac's counterpick by just smart use of tornado. i have a few other examples if you want.

so the question is... do you cater to the top 1% of the metagame, effectivey ignoring everyone else or telling even great/ranked players to "get better". logic says yes. the people that pay the top 1% say no.

i also think its funny that if you remove the mk mains the pro ban is destroying the anti ban in the sbr vote count... and there happens to be an overabudance of mk mains voted in the sbr so far

i'm probably not coming back in here just throwing out my opinion

PLEASE READ BOTH SIDES OF THE ARGUMENT

edit: all number arbitrary. i dont know what im talking about. how do u play brawl?

 

[Laijin]

Only fighting game scrubs will actually ban a legit character from the game.
Grow some balls and like other fighting game players have done. Just look at other games and their star characters.

Magneto from MvC2
Karas from TvC
Saber from Fate/Unlimited Codes.

If you don't even know who at least one of those characters are, especially Magneto. Then don't reply to this post.
MK ban is ********, but the brawl community does annoy me. I know exactly how much the brawl community will get hurt from the ban, so I voted yes.

Edit: And yes. Voting Yes for that reason is me being a complete ****.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Saber?

psh.

It's all about Gilgamesh and Archer son.

Also vs games are not comparable to smash games. Hell most fighters aren't comparable to smash games.

*continues eating popcorn

 

[The 5th Horseman]

Your going to get attacked by Meta-phobics.

Was just saying that, lmfao.

 

[C!Z]

2/3 should definitely be needed, otherwise he's just another character for whiny people to ***** about.

 

[Hylian]

Also HYLIAN

Weren't you saying however many months back that G&W v Marth was **** near hopeless? Why? Because Marth has much better options in that particular match. Options is EVERYTHING.

And when you look at Marth v Meta... Marth's are SEVERELY limited.

Um, no that wasn't me. I've always done fine against Marths with GW. I think Marth has the advantage, but generally whoever is playing better in the match-up wins. I'm not going to use my options he shuts down, I'm just going to outspace him and bait to get safe hits >_>. It's worked pretty well so far. Last tournament I mained GW at I 2-0'ed Brolys marth with GW right after he knocked Roy_R out of the tournament in marth dittos.

I feel like MK has the same advantage over Marth as Marth has over GW. That certainly doesn't make him unviable by my standards to win a tournament.

I also think Marth has plenty of options vs MK. Just like GW has plenty of options against marth.

:/

 

[Kewkky]

trust me, MK is way better than Ganon, but have you thought that regardless of who your friend uses, unless he just presses b like a ***** the whole game, maybe he's just a better player

Not if you're jigglypuff, THEN the statement is true. No matter how good you are, tornado will **** all of your aerial approaches, and jiggs IS an aerial approach in and of itself. Ganondorf suffers offstage. :o

And I'm not implying anything, or comparing top players' playstyles or anything, so try to not put words into my mouth that the best Ganondorf beats the best Jiggs, I'm just using it as an example, since we're talking about scrubbish examples. :o

Plus he said that as a way of showing just how ridiculous "3stocking someone, then 1stocking someone when they change to MK" sounds.

2/3 should definitely be needed, otherwise he's just another character for whiny people to ***** about.

Over 50% of the community to whine about, apparently. No other character compares to MK's whiners. It must mean something...

Whatever you want though. If you'd rather play Brawl with MK and half the community gone, over Brawl without MK and less than half the community gone, be my guest. The more people = the more $$$ at tourneys and the more tourneys in general.

 

[Dragoomba]

Only fighting game scrubs will actually ban a legit character from the game.
Grow some balls and like other fighting game players have done. Just look at other games and their star characters.

Magneto from MvC2
Karas from TvC
Saber from Fate/Unlimited Codes.

If you don't even know who at least one of those characters are, especially Magneto. Then don't reply to this post.
MK ban is ********, but the brawl community does annoy me. I know exactly how much the brawl community will get hurt from the ban, so I voted yes.

Edit: And yes. Voting Yes for that reason is me being a complete ****.

Brawl is totally a traditional fighter.

 

[Red Arremer]

I understand this, and I hate to "what if" this to death, but you can never say "oh nothing new will come out," because you honestly cannot know that. I agree that it most likely won't advance much further, but saying that he's at his complete peak is a stretch.

I never said "oh nothing new will come out", I said that Meta Knight's game has been so exploited that the chances of his metagame advancing to a further degree is almost nil. That is all. I never said that there definitely wouldn't be any advancement at all, or that there will be no chance in hell he develops in any way. Now it's you who twists around my words in my mouth, so stop it yourself before you tell others to do so.

But okay, then I'll play along with you:
Who says that banning Meta Knight actually will have a positive effect on the community?
Who says that banning Meta Knight actually won't be simply replaced by another Top Tier character like Wario or Snake?

Right, nothing.

Also, saying Marth's meta game is only at 50% is assumption. It's an educated assumption, based off of what we know, etc., but an assumption nonetheless.

I was going off of one of his best players' statements. Sorry that I repeated what NEO said. I'd rather trust his word, since he's, y'know, one of the top Marth players in the world.

 

[The Brigand]

Only fighting game scrubs will actually ban a legit character from the game.

-later, same post-

I voted yes.

Sorry, but I just found that funny for some reason.

 

[MarKO X]

lol @ Magneto = MK
Because, you know, Storm and Sentinel (and even Cable, Sanford Kelly says hi) got nothing on Mag-****ing-neto, right?

 

[Emblem Lord]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=189737

It's not nice to lie Hylian.

 

[Gamegenie222]

Only fighting game scrubs will actually ban a legit character from the game.
Grow some balls and like other fighting game players have done. Just look at other games and their star characters.

Magneto from MvC2
Karas from TvC
Saber from Fate/Unlimited Codes.

If you don't even know who at least one of those characters are, especially Magneto. Then don't reply to this post.
MK ban is ********, but the brawl community does annoy me. I know exactly how much the brawl community will get hurt from the ban, so I voted yes.

Edit: And yes. Voting Yes for that reason is me being a complete ****.

Thank you, i said stuff like that earier in this blog and i agree with you just not the ban of Mk, i am still anti-ban.

 

[AtotheZ]

you realize a month ago mike wanted metaknight banned. this is after he was good, way after whobo. mike kinda ***** himself in his own blog referring to his old blog

but i agree at top levels its about the players. mid levels its more about the characters... but frankly the mid level is paying the top level... isn't tournament attendance going down recently? maybe this has to do with it

i dont really care whether he gets banned or not but... when something like tyrant beats adhd with relatively very little diddy experience (even if it was close... it probably shouldn't be >_>), while adhd has huge mk experience, it makes me worried.

it also makes me worried that i've beaten several better players simply by abusing mk... they aren't top players but they're ranked high level players. how do i come back from BoA with 0% vs me at 120+% (teams 1v1)? i abuse the hell out of the fact that metaknight can approach with almost complete safety. i certainly wasn't outthinking him i was just using random pokes. hell even at whobo i literally beat utd zac's counterpick by just smart use of tornado. i have a few other examples if you want.

so the question is... do you cater to the top 1% of the metagame, effectivey ignoring everyone else or telling even great/ranked players to "get better"

i also think its funny that if you remove the mk mains the pro ban is destroying the anti ban in the sbr vote count... and there happens to be an overabudance of mk mains voted in the sbr so far

i'm probably not coming back in here just throwing out my opinion

PLEASE READ BOTH SIDES OF THE ARGUMENT

Stuff like this I agree with. metaknight is too safe, lots of bias out of 1% of the community.

 

[gm jack]

At the moment, he is clearly the best. However, he isn't so good the only option to win is play MK or lose. Taking him out of the game stops any counter being found. Most characters have something on him, so you just have to play gay against MK and use your strengths.

Banning when the metagame is still changing (though slowly now) means that nobody has a chance to find out a way to beat MK solidly. For example, Bowser has his theoretical infinite regrab on him, but it is just limited by the difficulty of pulling it off (nearly impossible to be consistent). If MK was banned, it wouldn't be found.

As it stands, he is more than beatable by several characters, and he does perform worse on some stages than others (rather than being disadvantaged, he just gets less advantage than the other player on each stage).

As it stands there is no need to ban him.

 

[Omni]

You guys are nuts.