Fourth and final community vote about Meta Knight.

[Brinzy]

And while you're at it, ban Zolios. Ajajaja

 

[MaNg0]

cause melee is ****..

and brawl is ok I GUESS

 

[Red Arremer]

Can a moderator officially ban the argument about comparing the validity of characters in other games with brawl?

It's not working.

Can a moderator officially ban the argument about Meta Knight ****** and invalidating the whole and/or majority of the cast?

It's not working.

 

[Zolios]

Can a moderator officially ban the argument about Meta Knight ****** and invalidating the whole and/or majority of the cast?

It's not working.

Well played sir.

Well played.

 

[MaNg0]

loooooooooooooooooooool

 

[Palpi]

Budget, we're comparing to other games because people in this community are too eneducated to make intelligent decisions or hold legitimate debates. They aren't random spewed facts for propaganda, facts from other games make sense regardless if you want to beleive them or not.

Not this community, just on smashboards, big difference.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Can a moderator officially ban the argument about Meta Knight ****** and invalidating the whole and/or majority of the cast?

It's not working.

One is true, the other isn't.

@Palpi: Brawl is not a normal fighting game. I think that explains it on its own. If you compare to Street Fighter, then you're going in a whole other realm.

 

[Rykoshet]

Except for the fact that it's true. His "worst matchup" is a debatably even fight depending on who you ask.

 

[Brinzy]

One is true, the other isn't.

You mean the comparison to other games is working and MK doing what a top tier does isn't, right?

It's ok if this isn't what you mean. That would just mean you're wrong.

I win.

 

[Rykoshet]

Budget, we're comparing to other games because people in this community are too eneducated to make intelligent decisions or hold legitimate debates. They aren't random spewed facts for propaganda, facts from other games make sense regardless if you want to beleive them or not.

You're free to throw any other fighter at me and I'll feel free to tell you why the comparison isn't valid.

You mean the comparison to other games is working and MK doing what a top tier does isn't, right?

It's ok if this isn't what you mean. That would just mean you're wrong.

I win.

But banning him is not the answer. We're forgetting that Brawl isn't even a good competitive game. If we ban MK, I promise you that there will sprout up in its place. ICs will rule the game with their infinites.

And Robs will still **** their faces off

Marth will dominate because, on paper, MK's the only thing keeping him from ****** the entire game.

Yeah if you don't count snake or DK or anything like that, even on paper.

Maybe Snake will move into position as the most broken thing since sliced bread.

Dedede will like to have a word with you.

EVERY other character in the ENTIRE game can be reasonably counterpicked. If they lose on skill then so be it.

 

[Zolios]

I retract my statement. It's not that comparing brawl to other multiplayer fighters is bad...it's just that no one here is able to do it well enough.

 

[Brinzy]

Ryko, I am never wrong.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

You mean the comparison to other games is working and MK doing what a top tier does isn't, right?

It's ok if this isn't what you mean. That would just mean you're wrong.

I win.

...

->The point


Your head


Metaknight is doing what a top tier should do, sure. But he's also doing what nothing should do-being the absolute best call in almost every realistic situation. I know about those CP rants SuSa had a while back, so almost every. But if you want to win, play Metaknight and your chances are higher.

You're free to throw any other fighter at me and I'll feel free to tell you why the comparison isn't valid.

What he said.

 

[Palpi]

Lol ryko....

/suicide

"But if you want to win, play Metaknight and your chances are higher."

No ****ing way!

 

[ShadowLink84]

By the way.

I want to state that this whole Meta Knight ban-issue hurts the community a lot.

I agree with this.

He is a nuisance to many, but it would hurt the community. I think if Meta Knight gets banned, a lot of Meta Knight players would simply quit the game and play something else. That means that we'd lose quite a lot of players, not only on Top level (Mew2King), but also throughout high and mid level play.

Doubt it. Only high level MK players really win tournaments, everyone else just eats the dirt because they are outplayed.

Let alone why care about who would quit? Metaknight is certainly the most popular character, but his banning would not resulting all those MK players quitting brawl. Frankly, if you quit a game over a character, that alone says you're not mature enough to deal with the situation.

A good player is a good player regardless on the character they use, why whine about the loss of 1 character? Why even let that whining affect the debate itself?

"If MK is banned, I am quitting brawl."
Fine, who cares, good players will still win.

Furthermore, I think that many players of other characters are exaggerating their matchups against Meta Knight in order to have him banned faster, since - while not being a horrible one to most of the cast - he still gives them a slight disadvantage. With one disadvantage and the best character gone, these characters' players think they will magically do better at tournaments, while not keeping in mind that the characters that give them more problems will definitely see an increase from the Meta Knight players that stay in the game. The community has been so clenching onto the chance of Meta Knight being banned that I don't think that many things have been evaluated rationally.

I don't see anyone really exaggerating he matchup to being worse than it is.
If anything, there were TONS of instances where people would downplay the matchup with MK during their attempts to understand and combat the character.
Anyone remember when Diddy was claimed as neutral?
Or Falco?
Or DK?
Or several other characters?

The reason I think its so much of an issue, is because in an attempt combat the character, people were disillusioned when they realed that the characters whom they believed would do well against MK,simply did ot.

I certainly do not see anyone exaggerating the matchups. I do see them exaggerating about the effects the would occur regarding MK's banning.

Fox will still eat ****.
Same with Mario, Bowser,DK etc etc.

Simply because even with MK gone, there is usually another character with a similar ratio.

However, in everygame the banning of the best character in a game would cause very little change.
Simply because the best character tends to have his matchups more uniform. Mostly 6-4'sor mostly 65-35's.
Si him being banned does nothing because he was hitting everyone equally as hard. Or there are other characters who would substitute for that matchup ratio as well.

Hence why we can only ban if its a "play MK" or lose situation.

Do you agree to this spade fox?

In conclusion, while I do think Meta Knight's presence hurts the community as a whole, this is only due to the whole ban-talk.

It would have happened eventually because its impossible to deny MK's results without feeling some anxiety.

 

[Rykoshet]

Ryko, I am never wrong.

Except for the part where you are.

 

[MaNg0]

So in the end ur banning a character for being good?

I mean i dont check brawl results often but last few

tourneys ive seen mk hasnt won..

Its pretty much the "noobs" who want

him banned because they dont want to learn how 2 fight/deal

with him

lol

 

[illinialex24]

I believe Ally has shown by beating M2K and doing very well that Metaknight is not unbeatable and not worth banning and not perfect, but he should be banned lol

 

[Brinzy]

That is not a serious post.

Obviously MK centralizes this game the most and obviously he assists in invalidating characters in this game who would otherwise, maybe, stand a better chance in this game.

Except for the part where you are.

See above.

 

[Rykoshet]

I mean i dont check brawl results often but

There is no but, you like every other person only checks for the exceptions.

I believe Ally has shown by beating M2K and doing very well that Metaknight is not unbeatable

*sigh*

People are making this big *** deal that ally is now 2 and 2 or 2 and 3 or what the **** ever with m2k or some **** and think it's some big *** revolution for the game.

It isn't. The very FIRST time m2k played ally he later dropped by and said that in friendlies they pretty much went even. It comes as no surprise that as ally got better and time progressed that their record might *gasp* even out. Mother ****er lost the very next week. This is the same **** as when NL went 2-0 on m2k then it took people forever to realize that when jason finally picked up on him he straight up mopped the floor with diddy kong.

 

[Matador]

Can a moderator officially ban the argument about comparing the validity of characters in other games with brawl?

It's not working.

Especially for melee.

Please god this. Comparing smash to existing fighters DOES NOT WORK.

Lmfao, because Brawl's so special right?

It's the same thing. If one character shuts down many other character's options, then it's the same problem. If I were taking it out of context like "one stock = one round" when referring to a 0-death, THEN I'd say StfuMatadorUjustDoesn'tEvenKno

Quit *****-footing around my posts and respond to them. If it doesn't work, tell me why. I swear pro-ban is worse than Palin.

 

[MaNg0]

LOL that could be true


I GOT AN IDEA

LETS BAN BRAWL!!!!!

u guys can come play melee..

get ***** by fox...

want him banned..

continue playing and realized that he is beatable


yaaaay

meleeeee

 

[Red Arremer]

Well played sir.

Well played.

I am to please.

One is true, the other isn't.

But both "arguments" are crap and not true.

Except for the fact that it's true. His "worst matchup" is a debatably even fight depending on who you ask.

No it isn't. I wouldn't count that, from the whole A to C Tier an amount of characters I can count on one hand, who have a very bad matchup with Meta Knight to be "****** the whole cast" or "invalidating the majority".
Everyone below C Tier is unviable to begin with, and slight advantages are not "****" or "invalidating".

As said, the whole community clenching on a possible ban of Meta Knight made the people so delusioned that they actually stop being rational and see Meta Knight as undefeatable God. In the subconsciousness they want him banned, so they downplay their character and overexaggerate Meta Knight's advantage.

I mean, look at it - Marth's players say he's getting ***** by Meta Knight and he invalidates their character completely. Yet the two best Marths constantly place high in big tournaments with the best Meta Knights among them despite going only Marth. How is that possible?
Since Tyrant and other Meta Knights constantly play high in big tournaments, as well, I doubt you can say that NEO and MikeHaze are just better than Tyrant and co. They just found ways to overcome Marth's disadvantages by playing differently. But no, the people don't believe that their matchup ratios to which they clench to could be actually wrong. Meta Knight CANNOT be worse than they thought. It's impossible to them.

This is what that whole Ban-talk has actually brought. People who are bitter. On both sides, actually.

 

[Palpi]

Ban Mango amirite?!

 

[Rykoshet]

LOL that could be true


I GOT AN IDEA

LETS BAN BRAWL!!!!!

u guys can come play melee..

get ***** by fox...

want him banned..

continue playing and realized that he is beatable


yaaaay

meleeeee

Even on paper melee fox has a disadvantaged matchup. Ideally when playing frame perfect he's untouchable but that's not how the game works so invalid comparison.

As said, the whole community clenching on a possible ban of Meta Knight made the people so delusioned that they actually stop being rational and see Meta Knight as undefeatable God.

Undefeatable? Of course not, beyond reason? Yeah. Character's broken, and there is no way to put him in a disadvantageous situation. That's not reasonable in any sense.

 

[Palpi]

Isn't it only 1 bad match-up on 1 stage?

I havn't looked in a while, forgot.

 

[MaNg0]

U cant ban mango... lol



Well since u have already acknowledged that fox is beatable

that means u can come play melee

=D

loool

 

[Palpi]

I think we should ban stage banning for metaknight mains!



---------------^

IS THAT REALLY TOO STUPID!?

 

[Matador]

And Robs will still **** their faces off



Yeah if you don't count snake or DK or anything like that, even on paper.



Dedede will like to have a word with you.

EVERY other character in the ENTIRE game can be reasonably counterpicked. If they lose on skill then so be it.

MK doesn't have evens? Marth vs DK/Snake and Snake vs D3 is even or debatable for it. And the rest of the cast they have advantages over, or pretty close to it...just like MK.

And when's the last time you've seen Lain/Meep lose to a ROB...better yet, when's the last time you've seen a ROB?

 

[Rykoshet]

Isn't it only 1 bad match-up on 1 stage?

I havn't looked in a while, forgot.

Which gets banned when it comes up.

Marth vs DK/Snake and Snake vs D3 is even or debatable for it.

Rofl no it isn't. The way it works for marth vs snake is "if snake gets taken off the stage there is no reason he should come back". Last I checked snake falls into that category against far far far worse characters, it's called having a laughable recovery. He falls into that category against Ike and Ike is a downright terrible *** character. It's still in snake's advantage, any sensible marth will tell you that. Snake loses to dedede and the debatable matchup is him vs falco. A 6-4 isn't an unbeatable situation, it doesn't change the fact that they characters can be counterpicked.

 

[Zolios]

Mango ****ing stole the avatar of my alt. Jerk.

Anyway, I'm actually Anti-ban Matador, I'm just saying you can't compare brawl to other multiplayer fighters since this situation is very unique.

 

[MaNg0]

this was my first avatar on smashboards ever ...

and im only gonna have it for like 30 mins

then u can have it back

=D

 

[ShadowLink84]

U cant ban mango... lol



Well since u have already acknowledged that fox is beatable

that means u can come play melee

=D

loool

You can't call a character beatable if the reason he is beaten is due to the user being imperfect.
That's like saying we should have allowed Akuma in ST because scrubby Akuma' lost to an amazing Ken.

Be serious now Mango.

 

[Binx]

LOL Mango, anyways I voted to keep MK in the game, I don't use him that often but I definitely see plenty of

holes in his game that can be taken advantage of by a skilled player. People just need to learn where they

are and take advantage when the situation comes up.

 

[Chexr]

The only way I would start playing brawl again is if MK is banned. He makes Wolf completely unplayable.

 

[Palpi]

Chexr, I really hope you aren't serious. Wolf is horrible, not only metaknight makes him not tourney viable.

 

[SOVAman]

The only way I would start playing brawl again is if MK is banned. He makes Wolf completely unplayable.

THIS IS WHY YOU BAN HIM

people like him and thumbswayup will play brawl

:DDDDDDD

 

[Dogg/Naoki/Suzaku]

No user can play perfect.

 

[The Filth]

The only way I would start playing brawl again is if MK is banned. He makes Wolf completely unplayable.

I think you'll find Wolf makes Wolf completely unplayable.

I voted for a ban, because I think the resulting ****storm would be hilarious.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

The only way I would start playing brawl again is if MK is banned. He makes Wolf completely unplayable.

And then you can deal with D3.

Have fun

Edit: Mk doesn't even **** wolf imo