FL General Rules Discussion: Brawl

[doom dragon 105]

For suicides I think the person that did it should win like for example a gannonside. If you catch someone and kill them then you should win, thats just how I see it

As for the planking it dosn't bother me, and the Ike player was a idiot btw. He could have done eruption and hit G&W since eruption gets a frame or two of super armor. I do remember the hast FIU tourney Chaz was planking and some one just ran and grabbed the the ledge and Chaz was like o_O. So that doesn't bother me. Why can't we just the rules everyone else uses?

 

[Eight 52]

gay.

also, does brawl+ still freeze if rob air dodges?

You're like 3 months behind bro.

 

[Lizard]

There still is no definite way to get out of the marth/charizard chaingrab.

I feel as though suicide should go to the user as well. It sucks that it can cost the match, but we have to be wary of that. If a DDD is at 150 or so, and you are sitting comfy at 40, you do not have to approach! Percentage wins, so you have every right to stay in the middle of the stage and let them come to you.

 

[Stripesorbars3]

lol @ even discussing who should get the win on a suicide KO.

 

[Tommy_G]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NROLXF7P2DY
2:46 "Melee...is just...I don't like it because you run away a lot vs this one where you link up a lot of moves."
"Well this is also because there's a lot more DI in Melee, its like theres set combos in this one."
"Because you can just get out of the combos by DIing"

The only way we could do the suicide move is just letting the person who did the move wins.

fix'd

10smashbros64

 

[Stripesorbars3]

Tommy G wtf r u talking about.

that post confuses.

me.

 

[QDVS]

Yeah I have no clue what the part with the video means...

 

[Coffee™]

Too few tourniments going on in FL do not hold any specific rules as far as brawl goes. Little gay stuff that needs to be decided before every tourny. NOT experimented with during, making for echy situations.

Things i'd like to discuss in this thread first and formost are peoples views on the following:

DDD's infinite/Releasegrab chaingrabs on wario in place, and lucas,ness/marth cg. My opinion, ban all. The ddd one is easy, all are easy, simply require one dash animation in between each grab, otherwise it can be considered an infinite.

I wanted to bring this back up because after thinking about it a bit I started to wonder why most TOs bother to ban the DDD grab infinites and the other random character grab release infinites but most of the time state that the ICs are allowed to CG up to 200% or 250% before it is considered stalling.

As Seibrik said we could use bit of consistency at FL tournaments regarding this stuff and it seems kind of stupid that we allow IC CG infinites and ban most of the others.

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

The difference is difficulty in doing the move, but Afro's told me on countless ocasions that in other games when there are infinites of any kind, regardless of difficulty to do said move, if you lose control of your character for that period of time, and the only solution is dieing, than its still an infinite. Other games ban that **** on the spot, for example, El fuerte has an infinite and the next day it was banned.


Discuss?

 

[Rx-]

IC chain grabs are allowed because they are very difficult to do, and they don't make certain matchups unbeatable.

 

[Coffee™]

The difference is difficulty in doing the move, but Afro's told me on countless ocasions that in other games when there are infinites of any kind, regardless of difficulty to do said move, if you lose control of your character for that period of time, and the only solution is dieing, than its still an infinite. Other games ban that **** on the spot, for example, El fuerte has an infinite and the next day it was banned.


Discuss?

Under this logic the IC infinites should also be banned. However, in most reigons they're not and most people don't seem to have a problem with it, but yet ppl ***** about the DDD and other grab release infinites.

IC chain grabs are allowed because they are very difficult to do, and they don't make certain matchups unbeatable.

Difficulty shouldn't really be a factor. Most IC mains can do the CGs with great consistency and I'm sure their CG does make some matchups pretty much unbeatable.

 

[Rx-]

What happens is (unfortunately for Galuuda) if an IC player ever starts winning tournaments, or placing top three consistently, then we will have to reevaluate the IC infinites, and we will probably ban them.

As of yet, there's no proof in Florida that IC's have anything that makes them broken.

 

[Lizard]

Agreed with RX,

Until Icey's start dominating tournaments, the CG should stay unbanned, as frustrating as it can be

 

[Coffee™]

Agreed with RX,

Until Icey's start dominating tournaments, the CG should stay unbanned, as frustrating as it can be

I'm not talking solely about the IC CGs. Its about why do we say they should be unbanned yet we want to ban DDDs infinites and other grab release infinites. They're all the same thing more or less so why ban one and not the other or vice versa?

 

[Rx-]

Because DDD's infinites are very easy to do, and DDD is already a top character without them.

IC's infinites are very hard to do, and they still don't make IC's a broken character.

 

[Masky]

can't you just break out of DDD's infinite when he has to use the grab attack if you're not DK or Bowser?

PS if Wario infinites were banned that would make me very happy... though i think they probably should remain unbanned as long as the rest of the country leaves them

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

Difficulty or where the character stands with or without the infinite isn't what constitutes a ban or not. Is it an infinite? If yes, ban. Ifnot unban.

You could argue ics is worse since it works on everyone. But were not arguing which is more broken, we are arguing if ic is a ban or not.


Seeing as we can all agree it's an infinite, just like ddds, then it too should be just as equally banned.

 

[Coffee™]

Difficulty or where the character stands with or without the infinite isn't what constitutes a ban or not. Is it an infinite? If yes, ban. Ifnot unban.

You could argue ics is worse since it works on everyone. But were not arguing which is more broken, we are arguing if ic is a ban or not.


Seeing as we can all agree it's an infinite, just like ddds, then it too should be just as equally banned.

Well the smash community's general consensus is that IC infinites shouldn't be banned for various reasons and they affect more of the cast than DDD so why not just unban them all?

 

[AfroQT]

Arguing the difficulty of a infinite is fvcking stupid.
Period.
People can get D3's infinite down to muscle memory. (IE Seibrik)
People can get IC's infinite's down to muscle memory (IE Galuuda)

When it gets to the point that you WONT mess up (or very rarely), does it matter how difficult it is to do? Nope, it doesnt. If your going to ban ONE infintie you have to ban them all, REGARDLESS of difficulty. Because the fact is, it doesnt matter how difficult it is, people will learn to do it 99% of the time. The IC's chaingrab may be difficult, but that doesnt matter. Anyone who mains IC's knows how to do them so well it becomes as easy as D3's infinites......

 

[slikvik]

Arguing the difficulty of a infinite is fvcking stupid.
Period.
People can get D3's infinite down to muscle memory. (IE Seibrik)
People can get IC's infinite's down to muscle memory (IE Galuuda)

When it gets to the point that you WONT mess up (or very rarely), does it matter how difficult it is to do? Nope, it doesnt. If your going to ban ONE infintie you have to ban them all, REGARDLESS of difficulty. Because the fact is, it doesnt matter how difficult it is, people will learn to do it 99% of the time. The IC's chaingrab may be difficult, but that doesnt matter. Anyone who mains IC's knows how to do them so well it becomes as easy as D3's infinites......

<<<obviously not from FL so not necessarily my place, but you're ignoring the fact that ICs can easily be separated and getting the grab with ICs together is much more difficult than getting a grab with D3. I agree with you that the difficulty of performing the actual infinite shouldn't matter at all

 

[Master Raven]

I think Slikvik has a point. You can disable the ICs infinite if you seperate them, which isn't too hard from what I can tell, so I say that if there's really anyway to disable/cripple an infinite like ICs, then it probably shouldn't be banned.

 

[Coffee™]

I think Slikvik has a point. You can disable the ICs infinite if you seperate them, which isn't too hard from what I can tell, so I say that if there's really anyway to disable/cripple an infinite like ICs, then it probably shouldn't be banned.

You cannot get infinited by DDD by ledgecamping the whole game which isn't too hard either. Degree of difficulty should not really be a factor.

 

[Master Raven]

Ledgecamping the whole game would be stalling though...

 

[OverLade]

You cannot get infinited by DDD by ledgecamping the whole game which isn't too hard either. Degree of difficulty should not really be a factor.

D3s bair ***** most characters that try to ledgecamp. Plus you may fall behind anyway.

I dont think IC infinites NEED banning, but a limit wouldnt hurt.

 

[CO18]

Whats the point of banning the IC's infinte. When you see IC's winning everything then you should mention it even with the infinite they are easily beatable

 

[Coffee™]

Ledgecamping the whole game would be stalling though...

Its not stalling if you just get up when your opponent isn't near you

 

[Ruse]

Whats the point of banning the IC's infinte. When you see IC's winning everything then you should mention it

Exactly.

When the f*** does an IC main win a decent sized tourney?

The IC CG shouldn't even be up for discussion at this point, imo.

 

[AfroQT]

<<<obviously not from FL so not necessarily my place, but you're ignoring the fact that ICs can easily be separated and getting the grab with ICs together is much more difficult than getting a grab with D3. I agree with you that the difficulty of performing the actual infinite shouldn't matter at all

And its because the infinite can be stopped before it happens that i agree that the IC's one shouldnt be banned, but the D3 one should.

 

[AfroQT]

Its not stalling if you just get up when your opponent isn't near you

Yeah it is lol...

 

[FlatSoda]

Its not stalling if you just get up when your opponent isn't near you

if your opponent is just letting you? I wouldn't think it's stalling. But more or less a repetitive action like hanging on the ledge, getting up, getting on the ledge, repeat repeat repeat.

Ledgecamping the whole game would be stalling though...

The whole game? Of course. lol.


But if you're at a stock advantage, ie: 3 stocks vs 2stocks, camping and stalling are two totally different games.

Planking forces your opponent to approach you because of the stalling action. But if you're camping this also forces your opponent to approach you because you're at the advantage.

it's all arguable. But I'm sure no one's going to be planking or stalling. No one seems to argue in it's favor anyway.

 

[Galuuda]

stop trying to make a broken game...a...non-broken game. Every character has their gay versions of playing. It's called "tournament play" If you would've seen me and seibrik's match on saturday you would know what I mean. I'm not saying he shouldn't have done what he did, he played smart...and unfair.

But that is what brawl is, unfair, so banning these chaingrabs wont fix anything. Look at metaknight, completely broken, yet we never talk about banning the character himself. Look at the big picture.

I'm not being biased because the people who know me...which are masky, lio, and meowmix know i honestly NEVER practice this game...NEVERRRRR, my practice is tournaments, and the day before the tournament. IC chaingrabs are not hard to learn, and they're broken, but what characters arent broken in this game that we see commonly in tournament play?

What it comes down to is: why do you go to these tournaments? I come to these for fun, and only for fun. Not one ounce of me even cares if i win money or not. If you're going to these tournaments for money and not playing a top-high tier character, you're wasting your time. I don't mind adding into your paycheck seibrik, thank me later :D

My paycheck is much bigger ;D i meant that in multiple ways.....just...kidding...i think...?

But yeah i dont mind if you ban the IC's chaingrab honestly lol, i'd just pick up a new main and learn the unfair tactics of that character lol.

 

[The Sex Puma]

train yourself to get like reflex

 

[Rx-]

No one is going to ban the IC's infinite until you start winning, Galuuda


There aren't that many large tournament hosts in Florida.

Of the few that there are, there are almost none that are concerned enough with the rules to ban that sort of thing for their own reason.

If you're ever worried about the rules of tournaments going bad, just come to my tournaments. I'll never ban anything that shouldn't be banned.

 

[Masky]

I'm not being biased because the people who know me...which are masky, lio, and meowmix know i honestly NEVER practice this game...NEVERRRRR, my practice is tournaments, and the day before the tournament.

true. but you should come up to gville some weekend when there's no tournament

train yourself to get like reflex

how'd you know?

 

[Toneh]

If you're ever worried about the rules of tournaments going bad, just come to my tournaments. I'll never ban anything that shouldn't be banned.

Lylat!!!

hmM my sig randomly works again lol

 

[Coffee™]

And its because the infinite can be stopped before it happens that i agree that the IC's one shouldnt be banned, but the D3 one should.

Technically the you can "prevent" the D3 one as well. There is no enormous difference between them. Once they're both initiated they are infinites. If you ban/allow one you should do the same for the other. Its as simple as that.

Its not stalling if you just get up when your opponent isn't near you

Yeah it is lol...

Not really.

Stalling- The act of deliberately avoiding any and all conflict so that one may make the game unplayable.

The game doesn't become unplayable by stalling on the edge. It just makes it harder for one of the players to do damage to the other as they now have limited options.

All I'm saying is that if you ban/allow any kind of infinite you should ban/allow every kind, regardless of difficulty, character, characters it works on, etc.... Either way I'm not saying TOs should ban or allow them, thats their choice. I'm just saying they should be consistent when they do make a decision

 

[hee roe shee]

what happens, when we make all our general rules, but then we go out of state and they use diff rules? the inconsistency bothers me. we need general rules that the whole nation follows.

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

actually oos bans more stuff than fl does.

 

[OverLade]

I think being Realistic, D3s should be banned but IC's shouldn't be.

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

and how come?

u cant just say "being realistic" as if thats some sort of argument