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Fire Emblem: The Discussion Thread (keep FE Fates story under spoilertags)

TLMSheikant

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Rolf is pretty garbage and has no enemy phase at all EVER. He also comes at level 1, and in a low-turn count hard mode run (which is what this tier list is based on), he has no place on the team. Elincia just comes too late to be salvaged without a buttload of bexp, which is NOT in abundance on hard.

Sothe at least contributes with thieving utility in Chapter 22 (The priests) and Chapter 13 (The second boat level).

Volug is in Top because he ***** in DB part 1 and 3 at shaving turns.
Why would u deploy Sothe if you can just use Volke? I always found Elincia to be the best healer, even if she joins late. :S And the lack of enemy phase shouldnt make archers THAT bad, I can usually have a frontliner to take the hit anyway, with good positioning, archers are beast and since Shinon is gone for a good while and has poor bases when he rejoins, Rolf is better. Not to mention hes pretty useful against the ravens in the two ship chapters. Especially if you cant get to a treasure in time and u need to kill the raven to get the item. Good point on Volug though he does shave turns in a few DB chapters. And whoa @ jill so high in PoR, I knew she was good but not THAT good O_o. I also really doubt Gatrie is that good in RD, he may have beast hp, str, def and speed growths but his 31 speed cap will ultimately make him useless in endgame. Plus, generals have bad mobility :X.
 

Raziek

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Why would u deploy Sothe if you can just use Volke?

If you're doing LTC runs, Volke will not have enough time to grab everything himself.


I always found Elincia to be the best healer, even if she joins late. :S

I don't disagree, but because a large part of the ranking is based around how many turns using a particular unit can save you, Elincia is farther down due to her join time. That's why Titania is so high. She IS the earlygame.


And the lack of enemy phase shouldnt make archers THAT bad, I can usually have a frontliner to take the hit anyway, with good positioning, archers are beast and since Shinon is gone for a good while and has poor bases when he rejoins, Rolf is better. Not to mention hes pretty useful against the ravens in the two ship chapters. Especially if you cant get to a treasure in time and u need to kill the raven to get the item.
Ok, here's why archers are bad. TOPS, they get to kill 1 enemy per turn. (not counting Reyson's chanting) Why would you ever want that when Sages do 2-range better AND have 1-range, so they have an enemy phase. Rolf is OK for potshots on ravens, I'll grant you that.

The main point is, there's no point in using an archer, when you can use a paladin or a flier. Way more move, destroys them in stats, can slaughter EVERYTHING on the enemy phase, AND move again after attacking from 1 OR 2 range.


Good point on Volug though he does shave turns in a few DB chapters. And whoa @ jill so high in PoR, I knew she was good but not THAT good O_o. I also really doubt Gatrie is that good in RD, he may have beast hp, str, def and speed growths but his 31 speed cap will ultimately make him useless in endgame. Plus, generals have bad mobility :X.
Jill ignores terrain and has the durability that Marcia lacks. She is INVALUABLE for saving turns.

I'm not at all a fan of Marshalls, but Gatrie is one of the more durable GM members, and gives a good deal of contribution to that team, especially if you Crown him when he caps speed.
 

§leepy God

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Everyone should just realize Mia is the greatest character in PoR and RD, then they will make a game just about her, except she traveled in the future by some weird magic. :p
 

TLMSheikant

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If you're doing LTC runs, Volke will not have enough time to grab everything himself.


Oh, didnt think of that one :p.

I don't disagree, but because a large part of the ranking is based around how many turns using a particular unit can save you, Elincia is farther down due to her join time. That's why Titania is so high. She IS the earlygame.


Yeah, titania is a monster lol.


Ok, here's why archers are bad. TOPS, they get to kill 1 enemy per turn. (not counting Reyson's chanting) Why would you ever want that when Sages do 2-range better AND have 1-range, so they have an enemy phase. Rolf is OK for potshots on ravens, I'll grant you that.

The main point is, there's no point in using an archer, when you can use a paladin or a flier. Way more move, destroys them in stats, can slaughter EVERYTHING on the enemy phase, AND move again after attacking from 1 OR 2 range.


I still find archers useful :p. Personal experience.

Jill ignores terrain and has the durability that Marcia lacks. She is INVALUABLE for saving turns.

I see, she does get screwed most by RNG tho in my experience.

I'm not at all a fan of Marshalls, but Gatrie is one of the more durable GM members, and gives a good deal of contribution to that team, especially if you Crown him when he caps speed.

The Greils already have Ike, Haar, Titania, Neph, Boyd and Mia. There's no need for another unit with good defense...
Answers in quote
 

Raziek

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Well, my Ike evidently has no idea what Aether is, so I lost to the BK. I'll have to try again later. >_<
 

Raziek

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It's like 26. I lasted all the way to turn 5 and he never ONCE activated it, then the BK just pooped on me with Luna. Having Mist adequately leveled makes this section of the game a LOT easier though.

Furthermore, I actually leveled her to like, 20/10 Valk, just to back up my claims. She's a great healer, on par with Elincia. However, her combat (sans a magic sword) is still complete garbage, and it's UNBELIEVABLY impractical to have her fight enough to get to B swords for the Sonic Sword, even WITH a Steel Forge. I would literally have to let her solo a map and watch my turncount go to ****.

Barely worth the resources on normal, and I certainly think she isn't worth it for HM. Healing only, don't ever bother with combat.

Also, my Jill capped HP, Strength, Speed, Skill, and Defense. GOD TRANSFER FTW.
 

TLMSheikant

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It's like 26. I lasted all the way to turn 5 and he never ONCE activated it, then the BK just pooped on me with Luna. Having Mist adequately leveled makes this section of the game a LOT easier though.

Furthermore, I actually leveled her to like, 20/10 Valk, just to back up my claims. She's a great healer, on par with Elincia. However, her combat (sans a magic sword) is still complete garbage, and it's UNBELIEVABLY impractical to have her fight enough to get to B swords for the Sonic Sword, even WITH a Steel Forge. I would literally have to let her solo a map and watch my turncount go to ****.

Barely worth the resources on normal, and I certainly think she isn't worth it for HM. Healing only, don't ever bother with combat.

Also, my Jill capped HP, Strength, Speed, Skill, and Defense. GOD TRANSFER FTW.
WOW @ ur jill lmao. Its like my previous HM run Ike which I now use for transfers :p.
 

Mercenary

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Long time no see.

And... no one remembers me. But that's to be expected.
POR Tier List (Most recent version from serenesforest.net)

Titania tier

Titania

Top

Jill
Oscar
Kieran
Boyd
Marcia

High

Ike
Reyson
Tanith
Astrid
Makalov
Muarim

Upper-Mid

Nephenee
Mordecai
Lethe
Mist
Volke
Zihark
Soren
Mia
Stefan
Ilyana
Rhys


Mid

Sothe
Brom
Gatrie
Geoffrey
Calill
Tormod
Devdan

Lower-Mid

Haar
Largo
Ranulf
Tauroneo

Low

Janaff
Shinon
Elincia
Rolf
Ulki
Nasir
Lucia
Ena
Bastian
...

Oh, you were serious...
 

Raziek

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Indeed I was lmao.

On the topic of my transfer run, I ended up getting a God Jill (HP Str Skill Speed Def)

Ike capped str, skill, speed, def and HP
Neph capped Str, Skill, Speed, Def
Zihark capped Str, Skill, Speed, Def
Ilyana capped Magic, Skill, speed, Res
Elincia capped Magic and Speed
Astrid capped Str, Skill, Speed, Def

So..... I've got a pretty **** transfer team going into my RD playthrough.
 

Mercenary

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Indeed I was lmao.


You said it was from serenesforest.net, right? So someone else created it?

Either way, it's just so messed up that I won't even bother trying to fix it, and instead I'll present my own tier list (from Top to Bottom - Titania does not deserve her own tier) that I created yesterday.

Top tier - The game's most useful characters. They have great growths in all the right stats and have weaknesses that are tough for the enemy to exploit. They also are available for a good portion of the game, and are available for use in more than half of PoR's chapters. They also come in at the right level (not over or under-levelled). They usually don't require much effort to raise. One of these (Reyson) is up in this tier as well, but for different reasons.

Ike
Oscar
Jill
Zihark
Nephenee
Reyson
Boyd (Well, not really in the top tier. He deserves better than upper tier, but doesn't quite go here due to his shoddy defenses, and while his evade and HP are great, he's still rather vulnerable on the front lines. We'll just say he's in the bottom of the top tier.)

Upper tier - Some of the game's more useful characters. Some have great growths in the right stats, but have a weakness that the enemy can exploit. Some of these are fantastic units, but come in late. (By my standards, late in PoR is Chapter 20 or afterwards.) Some are fantastic units, but require some effort on your part to raise. Some come in either over-levelled or under-levelled.

Mia
Marcia
Mist
Titania
Soren
Ilyana
Tormod
Kieran
Elincia
Ranulf
Nasir
Largo
Stefan
Elincia
Tibarn
Naesala
Giffca

Middle tier - These guys are pretty useful if used correctly. Some of these are statistically inferior to those in the above tiers. Other have one or two weaknesses that hamper them consistently, but not to the point of where they become unusable.

Gatrie
Shinon
Ulki
Makalov
Astrid
Muarim
Lethe
Tanith
Calill
Volke
Rhys

Lower tier - These are the ones that have a few saving graces, but have too many weaknesses to be used seriously. They're maybe usable for a couple of chapters, or they can help you in a pinch. Others in this category are "replacement" units that should only be used if no one in their class has been trained up previously (these are the ones who cannot be expected to cap any stats at all).

Mordecai
Tauroneo
Haar
Geoffrey
Ena

Bottom tier - These guys are flat-out unusable. They have crap starting stats, crap growths, and have absolutely no saving grace. You're best off forgetting about them.

Janaff
Devdan
Brom
Lucia
Bastian
Sothe

(I wonder how Elincia made it with such mediocre retainers?)
 

TLMSheikant

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I havent played PoR or RD in a while. What I did was replay Shadow Dragon and then play in H5. Which is ridiculous, so far Im in chapter 3 -_-. I also played sacred stones before shadow dragon. Beat it in hard mode first time with Eirika, Seth, Ephraim, Vanessa (Falconknight)<3, Franz (Paladin), Tana(Falconknight), Innes(Sniper), Natasha (Valkyrie) and Marissa (Swordmaster) with the ocassional Colm (Rogue)to steal here and there. I gave tethis tome to eirika. She capped str, skl, spd, luck and res on her own and I gave her a seraph robe to also cap hp. BEAST. Vanessa was my MVP throughout the entire game. She capped str, skl, spd, lck. Got a bit res screwed though. I made her a falconknight.
 

Mercenary

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I havent played PoR or RD in a while. What I did was replay Shadow Dragon and then play in H5. Which is ridiculous, so far Im in chapter 3 -_-. I also played sacred stones before shadow dragon. Beat it in hard mode first time with Eirika, Seth, Ephraim, Vanessa (Falconknight)<3, Franz (Paladin), Tana(Falconknight), Innes(Sniper), Natasha (Valkyrie) and Marissa (Swordmaster) with the ocassional Colm (Rogue)to steal here and there. I gave tethis tome to eirika. She capped str, skl, spd, luck and res on her own and I gave her a seraph robe to also cap hp. BEAST. Vanessa was my MVP throughout the entire game. She capped str, skl, spd, lck. Got a bit res screwed though. I made her a falconknight.
Meh, I've never cared much for Vanessa. Tana is beast though, since she actually has a commendable strength growth. I like Natasha better as a Bishop because of Slayer, and I like Tana better as a Wyvern Knight because of the higher strength cap and Pierce.

On my most recent PoR playthrough...

Soren got Speed-blessed, but Magic-screwed. That's fine though, since I don't plan to use him this time around.

Boyd got Skill-screwed and slightly HP-screwed, but Speed-blessed. Which is really quite good, but I'll have to use some Secret Books for once.

Oscar got a little bit Strength-screwed, but he was blessed in Defense and Speed.

Mia got a little Strength-screwed, but Luck, Defense, and even Magic-blessed. I was actually planning to use Zihark this time around, but I'll use Mia if Zihark turns out unlucky.

Rhys got Luck-blessed, but Speed-screwed.

I'm currently on Chapter 8.
 

Raziek

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You said it was from serenesforest.net, right? So someone else created it?

Either way, it's just so messed up that I won't even bother trying to fix it, and instead I'll present my own tier list (from Top to Bottom - Titania does not deserve her own tier) that I created yesterday.
Ok, the first thing we should establish is that THAT tier list is based on HM, and around finishing the game in the fewest amount of turns possible. That said, if a character cannot help save you turns, they receive a rather low ranking.

That said, it's time for me to disagree with like 75% of your list.

Top tier - The game's most useful characters. They have great growths in all the right stats and have weaknesses that are tough for the enemy to exploit. They also are available for a good portion of the game, and are available for use in more than half of PoR's chapters. They also come in at the right level (not over or under-levelled). They usually don't require much effort to raise. One of these (Reyson) is up in this tier as well, but for different reasons.

Ike
Oscar
Jill
Zihark
Nephenee
Reyson
Boyd (Well, not really in the top tier. He deserves better than upper tier, but doesn't quite go here due to his shoddy defenses, and while his evade and HP are great, he's still rather vulnerable on the front lines. We'll just say he's in the bottom of the top tier.)
Ike is fine up here because you have him the WHOLE game, he *****, and he's forced. No downside to using him whatsoever.

Oscar is fine up here for similar reasons, except he's not forced, and has a horse + canto.

Jill is completely fine up here.

Zihark and Neph are NOT fine up here. Neither of them are mounted, they both come in somewhat underleveled and have rather rocky starts before they get going. They also do VERY LITTLE to save turns, since they lack mobility. These two should be in your upper tier.

Boyd is also more upper tier material, since he has durability issues, and again, isn't mounted. He DOES save turns though, which is why the Serenes tier list has him in top.

Upper tier - Some of the game's more useful characters. Some have great growths in the right stats, but have a weakness that the enemy can exploit. Some of these are fantastic units, but come in late. (By my standards, late in PoR is Chapter 20 or afterwards.) Some are fantastic units, but require some effort on your part to raise. Some come in either over-levelled or under-levelled.

Mia - Should be slightly lower, but still upper tier.
Marcia - Flies, comes earlier, great stats, Top tier.
Mist - Should be slightly lower, but still upper tier.
Titania - Titania IS the early game, that's why she has her own tier. Like, they actually did the math. You CAN rush the entire earlygame with Titania, because the BEXP you get from doing it is enough to keep the rest of your units still up to par, and you've now saved a dickload of turns.
Soren - Slow start, not mounted. Slightly lower.
Ilyana - See above. Thunder magic makes up for her being slightly ****tier.
Tormod - Joins FAR too late, the only real advantage he has over the other Sages is celerity. Lower-mid tier.
Kieran - Comes early, horse, axes, great stats, SUPPORTS WITH OSCAR AND MARCIA. Top tier.
Elincia - Way too late, doesn't save turns. She's a flying, crappier Mist who requires more effort. Low tier.
Ranulf - Doesn't really save turns, and is completely outclassed by Muarim, Mordy and Lethe. Lower-mid tier.
Nasir - Would be god tier if this was RD, because White pool was baller. Instead, he's just a ****ty combat unit with no mobility. Low tier.
Largo - Doesn't save turns, glass cannon, outclassed by Boyd. Lower mid.
Stefan - Is fine here, his only issue is his luck.
Elincia - You have Elincia twice.
Tibarn
Naesala - Royals aren't ranked, because endgame should be complete before they arrive (in hard mode). They also save you NO turns, yet cost you none either. So they aren't ranked.
Giffca
Middle tier - These guys are pretty useful if used correctly. Some of these are statistically inferior to those in the above tiers. Other have one or two weaknesses that hamper them consistently, but not to the point of where they become unusable.

Gatrie - Is fine here, mobility issues.
Shinon - Could be a little lower, because you'll never realistically use him for late game, though he does save a little bit in the early game.
Ulki - Low tier, hawks kinda suck in PoR
Makalov - High tier, he's mounted and awesome, just shows up a bit late.
Astrid - See above, but she has paragon to catch her up really quick.
Muarim - ***** face. High tier. Mobility *****.
Lethe - See above.
Tanith - See above, reinforce is pretty awesome, Earth affinity is WTFhax. She's a slightly less awesome Marcia who comes in RNG proof.
Calill - Is fine here, but knives suck.
Volke - Saves you turns, has theif utility. Upper tier.
Rhys - Is the only healer till like Chapter 11. Bottom of upper tier.

Lower tier - These are the ones that have a few saving graces, but have too many weaknesses to be used seriously. They're maybe usable for a couple of chapters, or they can help you in a pinch. Others in this category are "replacement" units that should only be used if no one in their class has been trained up previously (these are the ones who cannot be expected to cap any stats at all).

Mordecai - Slightly less awesome Muarim, avaliable earlier. High tier.
Tauroneo - Fine
Haar - Fine
Geoffrey - Mid tier, he's actually pretty decent, and gets the Paladin racial skill of +1 tier.
Ena - Bottom, she's garbage.

Bottom tier - These guys are flat-out unusable. They have crap starting stats, crap growths, and have absolutely no saving grace. You're best off forgetting about them.

Janaff - slightly better than bottom.Just above Ulki.
Devdan - Is better than you give him credit for. Lower-mid.
Brom - is better than Gatrie lol. Mid tier.
Lucia - Yep.
Bastian - Yep.
Sothe - Thieving Utility. Mid tier.

(I wonder how Elincia made it with such mediocre retainers?)
 

Mercenary

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Let's get something cleared up right now: Efficiency is not part of my playing style. How well the unit can shave turns is a non-factor to me, while it's clearly important to you.

Let's get something else cleared up: The order that I listed the units in for their respective tiers only matters in the case of Boyd. Nowhere else.

Zihark and Nephenee made it to the top tier because Zihark's Strength usurps those of other Swordmasters, and he has Adept and the Earth affinity, and Nephenee's Skill ensures that she'll even always hit with ranged lances. Her Speed gives her a near unbeatable evade, and it does more than enough to compensate for her unimpressive Resistance.

Marcia would be higher, but even though she's got some solid evade, she's quite fragile. Higher skill Snipers will decimate her pretty quickly. If not for that, she'd be in the top tier.

Titania is only in the upper tier because she's just an experience hog in the beginning, and why you'd want to use her offensively in the early game is beyond me. She has better growths than most beginning-of-the-game prepromotes, but even though she can dodge fairly easily, her Defense is quite poor by Paladin standards. That, and she lacks Strength. (You know what? I stand corrected. Let's move her to Middle tier.)

We'll move Tormod one tier lower, too. The Est archetype (these are the ones who join quite late, but can become great if you put forth the effort into catching them up to the rest of your army) fits him perfectly, but he's inferior to other Ests because 1) other mages can use Fire, so his proficiencies aren't too special, and 2) raising either Soren or Ilyana is considerably easier, and warrants just as much (if not more) payoff.

Kieran would be top tier, if not for the fact that he's the least durable of the Paladins. He can't take hits like Oscar can, and he can't evade like Astrid can. (Though a support with Oscar can help him with the evade.) Basically, Boyd on a horse.

If I remember correctly, you told me that Elincia is superior to Mist as both a healer (because she can fly) and a combatant (because of Amiti). You have little time to get her to be able to use magic swords (though I pulled it off once), but she's still great if you invest all the bonus EXP you need to get her up to par with. Fits the Est archetype beautifully.

Ranulf is, statistically, the best of the game's beasts. He comes in late, but at the right level, and with fantastic starting stats. Only real weakness is his horrid Resistance, and that destroys his bid for the top tier.

Nasir is a fantastic combatant whose Speed allows him to double most enemies, and whose Strength allows him to kill in one battle just about every time he attacks, given that the enemy is not a General or another dragon. Sure he's got mobility issues, but on every playthrough, I used the Boots on him.

Largo, while having garbage defenses, has fearsome Skill and Speed for an axe user. His Speed grants him a solid evade, which doesn't do enough to COMPLETELY make up for his defenses, it makes up for some of it. Plus, he's got a 15% critical rate like every other Berserker.

My bad. About having Elincia twice. I meant to put Rolf there.

Makalov is better than people give him credit for (I get the feeling that people judge him by his character portrait...), but his Skill and Resistance hurt him consistently. Still pretty useful, though.

Astrid's only serious drawback is her Strength. She's got incredible evade, and fantastic Skill, but her Strength keeps her from killing all but the lower Defense units near the end of the game. Usefulness dies down in the last few chapters because of that.

Muarim is a hell of a lot more usable than Mordecai because of the miles of Speed advantage, but Muarim takes hits more often than he dodges. Combine that with his low Resistance, and he's but enemy Fire mage fodder. Still quite useful, though.

Lethe... bleh. Sure she can jump right into the action, but what people often fail to see is that near the end of the map, when the action almost always intensifies, she goes back to normal form and becomes quite useless. Nothing but evade, and lacks the Strength to put a dent in most enemies later-game. Basically, a Swordmaster without the 15% critical rate.

As for Tanith, Reinforce is overrated. The units that she calls for are just so frail, and can hardly take more than a couple of hits. Their only real use is ballista bait. Statistically inferior to Marcia.

I'll bump Calill down one tier. Between her use of knives and unimpressive growth rates, she's hardly usable for more than three chapters or so. Only real edge to other mages is her starting proficiency of B in all types of Anima magic.

Maybe Volke belongs in the upper tier. Thief capability is always a plus, and Lethaility, though hardly dependable, is awesome if it activates. Maxes Strength, Skill, and Speed pretty easily.

Rhys would be higher if he wasn't so **** SLOW. That, and his pathetic Strength keeps him from double attacking with the heavier Light tomes.

Mordecai... is only useful for a few chapters. His crap Speed really puts a dent in him.

Geoffrey can never be expected to reach any stat caps, and it is for that sole reason that he is in the lower tier.

Contrary to popular belief, Ena isn't unusable. Granted, you'll have to use Boots on her, but really, she's not GARBAGE. It's just that Nasir is superior in every way.

Ulki probably should be bumped down a tier. His nasty Speed hurts him considerably, though Vigilance adds to his evade.

Janaff is pathetic. Though having great Speed, he's mediocre everywhere else. Insight is completely unnecessary. While Insight makes him ideal for Gamble, but critical hits still have a pretty slim chance of happening.

Devdan IS unusable. His growths are inferior to Nephenee's. His starting stats are OK for his level, but he does not hold a candle to Nephenee. Lower Strength, lower Speed, lower Skill... lower everything. Honestly, you're best off forgetting him.

Brom sucks. All of his growths are inferior to Gatrie's, and his starting stats are hardly Knightly. A half-baked attempt at sacrificing every other stat for a slightly higher starting Speed.

Sothe scraps the bottom because HE CANNOT PROMOTE. Even if you kept Blossom, his stats are inferior to the rest of your army later in the game. Because of Blossom, he gains EXP slower than laguz. I feel sorry for the poor dupe who poured boundless amounts of BEXP on him, only to find out that he couldn't promote.

...That took forever. D:
 

Raziek

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Let's get something cleared up right now: Efficiency is not part of my playing style. How well the unit can shave turns is a non-factor to me, while it's clearly important to you.

Let's get something else cleared up: The order that I listed the units in for their respective tiers only matters in the case of Boyd. Nowhere else.
Ok, so this is a tier list for a "casual playthrough", which is somewhat pointless and much harder to rank, because there is little in the way of quantifiable contribution, since you aren't look at turncount. Regardless, I still have a few complaints with your rankings.

Zihark and Nephenee made it to the top tier because Zihark's Strength usurps those of other Swordmasters, and he has Adept and the Earth affinity, and Nephenee's Skill ensures that she'll even always hit with ranged lances. Her Speed gives her a near unbeatable evade, and it does more than enough to compensate for her unimpressive Resistance.
This doesn't change the fact that the Paladins and Fliers still kick the crap out of them just because they can fly and move after attacking. They're the best units in their class, but their classes aren't really all that awesome. I still always use both of them, but it's not like they're the best units in the army.
Marcia would be higher, but even though she's got some solid evade, she's quite fragile. Higher skill Snipers will decimate her pretty quickly. If not for that, she'd be in the top tier.
If you're letting Marcia anywhere NEAR Snipers (which are uncommon to begin with), you're doing it wrong. She's also not even that fragile. Caps speed quickly, has around average luck, and still manages to obtain 18.5 Defense and 19.2 res. She's a faster, slightly weaker Jill.

Titania is only in the upper tier because she's just an experience hog in the beginning, and why you'd want to use her offensively in the early game is beyond me. She has better growths than most beginning-of-the-game prepromotes, but even though she can dodge fairly easily, her Defense is quite poor by Paladin standards. That, and she lacks Strength. (You know what? I stand corrected. Let's move her to Middle tier.)
Ok. If it's a casual playthrough where you disregard turncount, I can agree with your placement of Titania, since she's the worst of the Paladins overall (though still good). I personally never use her, since I don't like efficiency runs, but her merits still lie in that category. She's also clutch for helping out in some of the earlier chapters, like chapter 8.

We'll move Tormod one tier lower, too. The Est archetype (these are the ones who join quite late, but can become great if you put forth the effort into catching them up to the rest of your army) fits him perfectly, but he's inferior to other Ests because 1) other mages can use Fire, so his proficiencies aren't too special, and 2) raising either Soren or Ilyana is considerably easier, and warrants just as much (if not more) payoff.
No arguments here. All he really has going for him is Celerity, IMO.

Kieran would be top tier, if not for the fact that he's the least durable of the Paladins. He can't take hits like Oscar can, and he can't evade like Astrid can. (Though a support with Oscar can help him with the evade.) Basically, Boyd on a horse.
One word: Sol. Instantly fixes any durability problems he had, since the only Mastery skills worth using are Aether for Ike, and Sol for the Paladins. Lethality has such an abysmal activation rate that it isn't worth it. With his durability issues fixed, he has no downsides. Comes early, has AMAZING offense, and is a Paladin.

If I remember correctly, you told me that Elincia is superior to Mist as both a healer (because she can fly) and a combatant (because of Amiti). You have little time to get her to be able to use magic swords (though I pulled it off once), but she's still great if you invest all the bonus EXP you need to get her up to par with. Fits the Est archetype beautifully.
This is true, but because I was arguing under the efficiency category earlier, that was why I said she was supposed to be lower. Honestly, I don't really consider combat at ALL for my healers, unless they have nothing better to do. Since Elincia's Strength is garbage anyway, she's basically restricted to magic swords (she starts at D swords, so GL;HF) or healing, nothing more. She can heal from the start, so there's little reason to dump BEXP on her.

Ranulf is, statistically, the best of the game's beasts. He comes in late, but at the right level, and with fantastic starting stats. Only real weakness is his horrid Resistance, and that destroys his bid for the top tier.
Well, there's little reason to compare him to the tigers, so we'll just compare him to Lethe. And since we're now arguing this from general use, rather than efficiency, I will agree that Ranulf is better. He beats Lethe in everything but Speed (barely) and Luck, so he IS the better cat.

Nasir is a fantastic combatant whose Speed allows him to double most enemies, and whose Strength allows him to kill in one battle just about every time he attacks, given that the enemy is not a General or another dragon. Sure he's got mobility issues, but on every playthrough, I used the Boots on him.
Why make a slow unit passable when I can make a fast unit GODLY? 11 move Jill kicks the **** out of 7-move Nasir. Even 8-move Zihark or Neph is a better choice. He's only useful for walling in the final chapter, so he shouldn't be moving much to begin with. He also won't double much of anything, and I don't think he's quite strong enough to one-round stuff, so he leaves a lot of half-dead enemies, instead of clearing out a large clump, like other units.

Largo, while having garbage defenses, has fearsome Skill and Speed for an axe user. His Speed grants him a solid evade, which doesn't do enough to COMPLETELY make up for his defenses, it makes up for some of it. Plus, he's got a 15% critical rate like every other Berserker.
He's a glass cannon, and there are plenty of durable, offensive units that I can frontline with INSTEAD of him, so I don't bother.

My bad. About having Elincia twice. I meant to put Rolf there.
Snipers are garbage. No enemy phase = lol. Rolf not worth the effort, he's taking away a slot from any number of units that eclipse him in combat utility.

Makalov is better than people give him credit for (I get the feeling that people judge him by his character portrait...), but his Skill and Resistance hurt him consistently. Still pretty useful, though.
I will admit that I've never used Makalov just because he looks dumb. He's still a Paladin, and he still keeps up with all the others. So I'll agree that he's not quite top tier in a casual run.

Astrid's only serious drawback is her Strength. She's got incredible evade, and fantastic Skill, but her Strength keeps her from killing all but the lower Defense units near the end of the game. Usefulness dies down in the last few chapters because of that.
Astrid averages 23.5 Strength, and if you give her a Fighter or Wyvern band, she can easily cap it. Killer Bow and/or Forged Silver fixes her offense problems either way. Only drawback IMO is her slow start.

Muarim is a hell of a lot more usable than Mordecai because of the miles of Speed advantage, but Muarim takes hits more often than he dodges. Combine that with his low Resistance, and he's but enemy Fire mage fodder. Still quite useful, though.
As with Marcia, if you're sending Muarim at mages, you're doing it wrong.

He beats Mordy in Speed, Skill and res, loses everywhere else. Problem is, if he isn't doubling much anyway, I'd rather go with the one who hits harder. Either way, they're both great.
Lethe... bleh. Sure she can jump right into the action, but what people often fail to see is that near the end of the map, when the action almost always intensifies, she goes back to normal form and becomes quite useless. Nothing but evade, and lacks the Strength to put a dent in most enemies later-game. Basically, a Swordmaster without the 15% critical rate.
Cats DO kinda get the **** on the transform gauge end of things. I usually just give the Demi band to Ranulf if I use a cat. So, Lethe isn't super amazing in a casual run, it's saving turns where she shines. (Since if you're rushing, she's transformed pretty much the whole time)
As for Tanith, Reinforce is overrated. The units that she calls for are just so frail, and can hardly take more than a couple of hits. Their only real use is ballista bait. Statistically inferior to Marcia.
She may be somewhat inferior to Marcia, but she comes in RNG proof and is the only realistic magic sword user in the game. She's Earth affinity, can support Oscar, flies, and has Canto. She's still awesome in her own right, she's just the bottom of the awesome tier (Fliers/Paladins)

I'll bump Calill down one tier. Between her use of knives and unimpressive growth rates, she's hardly usable for more than three chapters or so. Only real edge to other mages is her starting proficiency of B in all types of Anima magic.
Agreed. I bench her immediately.

Maybe Volke belongs in the upper tier. Thief capability is always a plus, and Lethaility, though hardly dependable, is awesome if it activates. Maxes Strength, Skill, and Speed pretty easily.
He's high tier for Thief utility, not for combat. Knives aren't amazing, and Shade means he basically has no enemy phase, but he's not durable enough to frontline if he takes it off. Lethality doesn't activate enough to be useful.

Rhys would be higher if he wasn't so **** SLOW. That, and his pathetic Strength keeps him from double attacking with the heavier Light tomes.
Rhys shouldn't be attacking, and he gets benched once you have Sages + mounted Mist/Elincia. In casual runs, he's only useful up to that point.

Mordecai... is only useful for a few chapters. His crap Speed really puts a dent in him.
He hits like a MACK truck for the entire game. Let him one-shot SMs and anything that isn't a general for fun.
Geoffrey can never be expected to reach any stat caps, and it is for that sole reason that he is in the lower tier.
He's still a Paladin, he's RNG proof, he has Paragon, and he's the most durable, and probably 2nd or third best offensively. Average among the ****-tier.

Contrary to popular belief, Ena isn't unusable. Granted, you'll have to use Boots on her, but really, she's not GARBAGE. It's just that Nasir is superior in every way.
No, she's pretty much unusable. If for some reason you fail to attain Nasir, she has NO claim to the boots, and she's complete trash offensively. She doesn't even REALLY have durability going for her because she gets doubled by almost everything. At best, she's a sub-par Wall.
Ulki probably should be bumped down a tier. His nasty Speed hurts him considerably, though Vigilance adds to his evade.

Janaff is pathetic. Though having great Speed, he's mediocre everywhere else. Insight is completely unnecessary. While Insight makes him ideal for Gamble, but critical hits still have a pretty slim chance of happening.
Yeah, hawks are pretty garbage in this one. :(
Devdan IS unusable. His growths are inferior to Nephenee's. His starting stats are OK for his level, but he does not hold a candle to Nephenee. Lower Strength, lower Speed, lower Skill... lower everything. Honestly, you're best off forgetting him.
For a casual run, yeah. He's not as bad as some of the crap, but he's still eclipsed by way too many units to be useful.

Brom sucks. All of his growths are inferior to Gatrie's, and his starting stats are hardly Knightly. A half-baked attempt at sacrificing every other stat for a slightly higher starting Speed.
Whoops, guess I never really looked closely at that. You're right on this one.

Sothe scraps the bottom because HE CANNOT PROMOTE. Even if you kept Blossom, his stats are inferior to the rest of your army later in the game. Because of Blossom, he gains EXP slower than laguz. I feel sorry for the poor dupe who poured boundless amounts of BEXP on him, only to find out that he couldn't promote.
He still has thief utility for chapters where you need both him AND Volke to finish in a timely manner. Which, in reality, is like.... Palmeni temple, and chapter 13 (Astrid's join chapter). So yeah, bottom tier for casual play, but he still gets thief points.

...That took forever. D:
Slacker. :p
 

TLMSheikant

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So, anyone here hyped for mystery of the emblem? I love how u can create ur own unit. Caeda also seems as beastly as ever. 95 growth in speed lol. Marth actually has a skill growth, new units and it looks like itll be super fun. :D

Too bad we get it so late -_-, seriously considering R4'ing and getting it in ***.

EDIT- Why the f is short for japanese censored?
 

F8AL

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So, anyone here hyped for mystery of the emblem? I love how u can create ur own unit. Caeda also seems as beastly as ever. 95 growth in speed lol. Marth actually has a skill growth, new units and it looks like itll be super fun. :D

Too bad we get it so late -_-, seriously considering R4'ing and getting it in ***.

EDIT- Why the f is short for japanese censored?
Because today it is regarded as an ethnic slur, and people consider the term offensive.
 

Raziek

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That's..... rather ********.

I suppose we should censor Brits, Scots, Canucks, and a few other "slurs", should we not?
 

F8AL

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That's..... rather ********.

I suppose we should censor Brits, Scots, Canucks, and a few other "slurs", should we not?
Unlike the shortened version of the word "Japanese", those ones aren't considered offensive.

Back on topic, please.
 

OmegaXXII

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OMG!! I LOVE Fire Emblem! ^_^

So far I've only played Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance for the GNC, I love the story, it was full of suspense and this game was the first of it's kind that I've ever played. I'd say my favorite character I liked on there that were consistently on my team were Tatania, Oscar, Boyd, Shinon, Gatrie, Mordecai and Lethe, oh especially Stephan, I love the laguz tribes, I tried to defeat the Black Knight in Chapter ** but I ended up getting the pink dragon instead of Nasir.

Oh and Tibarn was such a cool character, I loved how powerful and godly he was, Reyson was very helpful as well, there are very few games which I really genuinely enjoy and Path of Radiance was one of them.

I can't wait to play FE: Radiant Dawn next month, I just bought it, I heard it's just as good and even longer? Hmm...

:phone:
 

camerino1

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I've talked to you about it before Omega, RD is in my opinion the best in the series. It's longer and has the Dawn Brigade (my personal favorites of the entire series, I just love them and find their chapters by far the most fun to play). Edward, Aran, Nolan and Jill always turn out great. Leo is iffy, but I find he is an awesome mage killer. Meg and Fiona will turn out good, but aren't exactly worth it. Zihark always lacks for me when compared to Edward, Tauroneo is a good Marshall and I always have a tough time between him and Gatrie. Laura has really good growths and will turn out fantastic, but it takes a long time to get there and might not be worth it as well, but she is needed for the DB's success. Micaiah is good, but not great and she is forced so you can't forget about her, same as Sothe.
 

Rutger

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RD really messed up supports.

But it also had no limit on who can support who and a better skill system. I really liked it but there was some questionable things done.

It's not my favorite but I want the next game to build on what RD did.
 

camerino1

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My favorites are Sword of Seals and Radiant Dawn. I really like Treck + Noah and Fir actually, I find that using that set up over Lance and Allan works for me personally. Also, my Noah in a recent playthrough turned out really nice. I also prefer Oujay over Dieck, but I like using both, and making Dieck use axes.
 

Fireman

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RD really messed up supports.

But it also had no limit on who can support who and a better skill system. I really liked it but there was some questionable things done.

It's not my favorite but I want the next game to build on what RD did.
RD could've done a lot more with that. That's the only thing that left more to be desired imo, the game was pretty great.

I wish Fire Emblem would bring back the lover system from FE4, that was genius. Characters developed a liking for each other based on being next to each other, and talking to each other, and your pairings affect who your character were in the 2nd half of the game. ->
All the characters in the first half of the game get killed off, thus leaving their children to finish the war. The children also inherit the parents skills, and weapons.

Favorite FE...such a tough question. It's a struggle to choose between Radiant Dawn and Fire Emblem 4 for me.
 

camerino1

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I can see Radiant Dawn is the one that most people say actually. Edward is my favorite and Lughnasad is my favorite weapon. I just really like the Dawn Brigade :p.

Favorite map is actually the Laguz one during part 3 with the DB.
 

OmegaXXII

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Well for those who didn't know, Nintendo held a conferance last night in Japan/yesterday, and guess what? Fire Emblem 13 got officially confirmed for the 3DS, that right, a new FE game, by the looks of things it seems that that will be the case because it looks like Fire Emblem 3DS will not be associated with any existing story. It will be brand new. Which is actually pretty good, here are some screenshot below:






It appears that his name of the hero is "Chrome" which is pretty interesting indeed, I am indeed going to get this game along with a "pink" 3DS that will soon release as well.

:phone:
 

Ussi

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Why is it called FE13?

remakes shouldn't count for FE11 and FE12 :|

but whateves, i think everyone is already going FE13 so no point in arguing.
 

OmegaXXII

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Why is it called FE13?

remakes shouldn't count for FE11 and FE12 :|

but whateves, i think everyone is already going FE13 so no point in arguing.
There is actually am FE12 in Japan if I'm not mistaking, I think it's referred to as My Unit, unless you mean Shadow Dragon?

Anyway, that's what it's officially is called so...yeah.

Also here is a screenshot below I found:



It seems that Chrome/Krom will weild a Falchion sword which is referred as the Sacred Sword Falchion, I think Liz (the girl) will use a staff as her weapon of choice, of course it's not meant to be used offensively, I heard a tag style of combat will happen according to a video I saw, I believe we may see side to side combat with allies so it's something good to look forward to.

:phone:
 

Ussi

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FE11 and 12 meant they both are remakes

FE12 is a remake of FE3

I know FE12 existed, i just don't get why it was called FE12, also its called New Mystery


I speculate the tag system a way to build supports faster and to split experience between units better (helps train those who need it)
 

camerino1

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I neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed a 3DS now, I guess this Christmas is going to be a big one for me. Laptop for sure, 3DS and MK3DS, then waiting for FE13. So exciting!
 

OmegaXXII

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FE11 and 12 meant they both are remakes

FE12 is a remake of FE3

I know FE12 existed, i just don't get why it was called FE12, also its called New Mystery


I speculate the tag system a way to build supports faster and to split experience between units better (helps train those who need it)
♥ I guess Intelligent System names the FE series according to the chronological order that they come out regardless of remakes or not.

The tag system will definetly be helpful in leveling up the weaker members in your army, I also heard that Chrome will definetly play similar to Ike, I'm not exactly sure how similar but by the looks of it they both seems to look the same in appearance and do similar moves, I just hope it turns out to be good.

:phone:
 

OmegaXXII

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Well, I can't blame them, it's the same reason why I'm even getting one in the first place, well actually because I also want to play Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon DS which seems like a good game based on Marth's, I've never played it nut I've heard good reviews about it, not to mention Caeda is on there as well, I'm hoping a Wii-U version will get announced as well, it should be fun indeed.

:phone:
 

Ussi

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I hope not, I like my fire emblem being portable. Usually means its faster when animations are off and I can play anywhere (family of TV/Wii hogs)
 

camerino1

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I want one for the Wii-U, and continuing in the Tellius series would be nice actually. Though I doubt it because Ike ran off with Soren, so I can't see much more story, unless Ike leads something on a new continent with an all new set of units and Soren by his side. I would like one on the Wii-U though.

Edit: Shadow Dragon has nice replay value because of the reclass system, but as a story game it's VERY dry. Play for the fun and not story and you'll be fine.
 

Rutger

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It wouldn't be impossible, just set it far in the future/past.

I'm okay with that, I would like to see the laguz again.
 

camerino1

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I want Edward back of all units, maybe they can chronicle the story of everyone when they're older and their children going into some similar war. (FE6-7 anyone?) Edward is my all-time favorite unit, he didn't get enough time in RD, because he has as much personality as the rest of the DB put together :p
 
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