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Fire Emblem: The Discussion Thread (keep FE Fates story under spoilertags)

EmblemPrincess

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Micaiah isn't a lord, Viper...

Not technically anyway. She is a main character though, so I do add her to the tier list I made earlier. We need more female lords who actually have the lord class. xP
 
D

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micaiah has a built in defense called dark affinity. she's also a large asset early in the game where thani nukes the knights that litter the early chapters that would otherwise eat up nolan's survivability. I don't see how any character with dark affinity, 1-2 range, a broken weapon, and high growths can be bad.
 

Chris Lionheart

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micaiah has a built in defense called dark affinity. she's also a large asset early in the game where thani nukes the knights that litter the early chapters that would otherwise eat up nolan's survivability. I don't see how any character with dark affinity, 1-2 range, a broken weapon, and high growths can be bad.
Dark Affinity is not a particularly great affinity for defense, as it only contributes +2.5 per support level (8 at Rank A) to dodge +0.5 attack per rank. Earth and Thunder, on the other hand, would give her a good defense. Sauren has a dark affinity. All magic has broken attack power and 1-2 range. It is impossible for high growths to be bad (you might say that the unit who has them has bad base stats, availability, etc., but these factors don't directly relate to their high growths).
 
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leonardo technically has high growths and he's pretty terrible.

I've already stated that I think Soren to be the best magic user and a great unit overall, but Micaiah is extremely close to him performance wise. Soren also has the benefit of being surrounded by other amazing units to minimize the care he needs.
 

EmblemPrincess

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Agreed. Soren's the best magic user. I think Bastian is second though. Micaiah isn't that great. I babied her so I could max her out and see how good she'd come out, but she was still bad. She's too hard to protect and light magic isn't as powerful as the other kinds of magic.
 

Chris Lionheart

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leonardo technically has high growths and he's pretty terrible.

I've already stated that I think Soren to be the best magic user and a great unit overall, but Micaiah is extremely close to him performance wise. Soren also has the benefit of being surrounded by other amazing units to minimize the care he needs.
Leonardo is rather bad, but he's very underrated, IMO. And yes, he does have high growths... but they are in the wrong places. I was referring to high growths that actually matter.

I hope you are not referring to endgame when you say performance-wise. If you just judge a unit by endgame (one of the easier parts of the game) potential, than even units like Fiona might look passable. Soren is good from start to finish, whereas Micaiah is struggling big time just to get to the finish.
 

Deathcarter

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Agreed. Soren's the best magic user. I think Bastian is second though. Micaiah isn't that great. I babied her so I could max her out and see how good she'd come out, but she was still bad. She's too hard to protect and light magic isn't as powerful as the other kinds of magic.
I honestly think Pelleas is the second best magic user, not because he is Soren good, but because he comes in on the most exp. rich path, he has exclusive use of Dark magic while Bastian has to compete with Soren for Rexcalibur and the others for the anima siege tomes, and he is not utterly impossible to use like most of the other Sages.

Provided, Sages are not particularly useful at endgame (except with the use of Nasir's White Tide), but Pelleas is the second best Sage on the grounds that he is easier to train than every other magic except Bastian and Soren, he gets exclusive use of Dark Magic, and he has the best endgame out of the magic users thanks to the slightly better damage output of Dark magic (unless you actually manage to train one of the Fire Mages).
 

Chris Lionheart

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I honestly think Pelleas is the second best magic user, not because he is Soren good, but because he comes in on the most exp. rich path, he has exclusive use of Dark magic while Bastian has to compete with Soren for Rexcalibur and the others for the anima siege tomes, and he is not utterly impossible to use like most of the other Sages.

Provided, Sages are not particularly useful at endgame (except with the use of Nasir's White Tide), but Pelleas is the second best Sage on the grounds that he is easier to train than every other magic except Bastian and Soren, he gets exclusive use of Dark Magic, and he has the best endgame out of the magic users thanks to the slightly better damage output of Dark magic (unless you actually manage to train one of the Fire Mages).
This is a somewhat agreeable statement. I do agree that Pelleas is the 2nd best magic user, thanks to having some of the best stats and use of Dark Magic. I argue with your opinion that Sages are not useful in the endgame. They are quite useful when they use a long-distance spell (blessed) and physic staves. Granted, you wouldn't want to have a large number of Sages... maybe 2 or 3, counting Micaiah. I have heard that Calill is a really good Sage... I just don't like her enough to give her a chance.
 

Deathcarter

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This is a somewhat agreeable statement. I do agree that Pelleas is the 2nd best magic user, thanks to having some of the best stats and use of Dark Magic. I argue with your opinion that Sages are not useful in the endgame. They are quite useful when they use a long-distance spell (blessed) and physic staves. Granted, you wouldn't want to have a large number of Sages... maybe 2 or 3, counting Micaiah. I have heard that Calill is a really good Sage... I just don't like her enough to give her a chance.
The problem with having Sages at endgame is that their damage output is particularly bad in the arguably easiest part of the game when practically every good unit (except ironically Haar and Gatrie who were gods in part 3) can clean house thanks to the ability to double things. I will note that they are useful in the dragon chapter since not even Tibarn can ORKO the red dragons there, the dragons are actually slow enough for the sages to double, and only them and Rolf/Shinon/Leonardo can attack Dheginsea without getting counterattacked. They are outclassed by the others when facing against every other type of enemy though.

However, I also agree that it is useful to bring one extra sage for healing purposes as opposed to Mist and Elincia mostly because those two are not really good against anything there.
 

kirbywizard

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Ah Meg, I remember my first play through ( which was on normal and this was my first fire emblem game but now I have all of the ones that came out in the US). The first time I saw meg I was like finally someone that can take hits. I gave her all my extra exp (seeing that I was only powering up Nolan and Edward a lot) and I kept doing so until at around half way through the game I noticed she had wat more speed then defense >__>. It was to late now so I kept leveling her up and for some reason she dodged almost every single attack and doubled all her enemys <_<. She ended up being very good until I gave her a steel sword when they blessed the items :(, the only use she had after I made that mistake was rescuing Silver Hair ( Silver Hair I ended up not giving much exp to on my first play through)
 

§leepy God

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Meg is the only character that I never upgraded, or even played on a stage, everytime I a chapter come's with her pickable, I always clicked her out. I've done this ever since I beat RD twice and notice that leveling her up will waste your time if unless you want the game to be more challenging. ]:<
 

Chris Lionheart

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Meg is the only character that I never upgraded, or even played on a stage, everytime I a chapter come's with her pickable, I always clicked her out. I've done this ever since I beat RD twice and notice that leveling her up will waste your time if unless you want the game to be more challenging. ]:<
Meg is the only character that I kill on purpose in every single playthrough. What's more fun than taking away her equipment and marching her into enemy lines? Or I could just use her sacrifice as a way to distract one enemy for a turn. :p
 

kirbywizard

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Meg is the only character that I kill on purpose in every single playthrough. What's more fun than taking away her equipment and marching her into enemy lines? Or I could just use her sacrifice as a way to distract one enemy for a turn. :p
The only characters I killed were the Laguz, I just hate them >_>. I only keep the Raven and Heron Laguz alive ( the pretty ones basically). I always have the tiger and cat laguz to get killed by fire mages <_<, and those hawks or whatever to get killed by wind mages.
 

Chris Lionheart

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The only characters I killed were the Laguz, I just hate them >_>. I only keep the Raven and Heron Laguz alive ( the pretty ones basically). I always have the tiger and cat laguz to get killed by fire mages <_<, and those hawks or whatever to get killed by wind mages.
I could never purposely kill one as attractive and tomboyish as Lethe. And Ulki is far too cool to kill (and his dodge rate is quite incredible).
 

Lord Viper

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Most of the Laguz was better in PoR, the way the Laguz battle got nerfed, Beast one's the most because they lose 4 points on their meter if they battle, Dragons got buff, they have better accuracy and can attack at a distant, and they lose one point from their meter every turn, and battle phase unlike the Beast and the Bird tribes. Also, trying to level them up took longer as well. In terms of power, (Lethe, Mordecai, Ulki, Nealuchi, Volug), those Laguz were not strong enough to take down one troop in one phase but need two or more most of the time if you don't have a very high level with them. In terms of key rolls where you couldn't level them up right, (Ena, Muarim, Vika, Kurthnaga), Muarim and Vika came eariler and was sweet, but then they were missing the whole time and now it's pointless to level them up, and Ena and Kurthnaga levels wasn't very high, but they did have good support for other troops with their specials.

And in the end of the game, all you need is the Laguz kings/queens, lol.
 

Chris Lionheart

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Most of the Laguz was better in PoR, the way the Laguz battle got nerfed, Beast one's the most because they lose 4 points on their meter if they battle, Dragons got buff, they have better accuracy and can attack at a distant, and they lose one point from their meter every turn, and battle phase unlike the Beast and the Bird tribes. Also, trying to level them up took longer as well. In terms of power, (Lethe, Mordecai, Ulki, Nealuchi, Volug), those Laguz were not strong enough to take down one troop in one phase but need two or more most of the time if you don't have a very high level with them. In terms of key rolls where you couldn't level them up right, (Ena, Muarim, Vika, Kurthnaga), Muarim and Vika came eariler and was sweet, but then they were missing the whole time and now it's pointless to level them up, and Ena and Kurthnaga levels wasn't very high, but they did have good support for other troops with their specials.

And in the end of the game, all you need is the Laguz kings/queens, lol.
Yeah, most of the laguz units were better in PoR. The cats didn't completely fail at life and the tigers were available for long enough to level up. The Hawks really stayed about the same- Janaff is still meh and Ulki is still one of the few non-royals good enough to be worth using. The dragons remain unavailable, only being usable for endgame. IMO, Kurthnaga is the best of the playable dragons, closely followed by Nasir. Ena is rather meh and Gareth fails at everything, except dying. Perhaps the greatest hit to the laguz is the lack of demi and laguz bands. Sure, laguz items are pretty much common enough to be eaten like candy, but these things take up a turn that could be used to attack. Wildheart is worth considering, but it has an even greater detriment to the stats of a laguz than the demi band. Ulki with Wildheart is still a dodging beast though... basically a second Tibarn but without the killing power.

The Laguz Kings and Queen are indeed as broken as ever. :)
 

EmblemPrincess

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^Well of course Kurthnaga would be the best dragon. He's a freaking black dragon, the most powerful kind of dragon in existence. XD

It's like comparing Skrimir to Ranulf. It's obvious who's the best. :p
 

kirbywizard

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The Laguz kings I think were like the other characters in FE games that come lat but are just monsters ( Athos, Ghota, and ect). The Laguz kings are easy to keep alive but the hard part is trying to kill them <_<. That is the hardest almost impossible task, to kill the Laguz kings <_<.
 

Nnoilalala

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Laguz > Humans.
They are more fun.
Even those I don't use, I can't bring myself to kill off.

The ones I love to kill are Soren, Jill + Mist. Just because.
 

Deathcarter

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Mordecai and Ulki are the only non-royal Laguz that can actually be considered useable. Mordecai, relatively speaking, is actually easy to level thanks to enough availability and the capability to actually do some damage on enemy phase untransformed as opposed to the fail cats/Kyza. Transformed, only mages (and MAYBE Dawn Brigade due to him not being fast enough to own them) are an actual threat.

His biggest weakness is that he will NEVER ORKO anything thanks to crap speed which puts him behind Janaff and Volug in offensive potential. Seriously, a fifteen speed cap for the class is utterly pathetic. Given all of that, he shines in Part 2/first half of Part 3 when most of the beorc are still unable to one round mosts enemies. Then, him outclassing everyone except Ulki, Janaff, Haar, and maybe Ranulf in durability makes him stand out.
 

Meorksies

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I don't usually use Laguz, but in my most recent play of RD, I used Ranulf for his support with Ike, and once he was reasonably high level, giving him Adept and Rend worked pretty well.
I know the whole added-skills-don't-reflect-how-good-a-character-actually-is thing, I'm just saying those skills worked well on him for me.
Not to mention Rend is a completely overpowered skill.
 

Meorksies

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Skills are fun.
In PoR... Nephenee with Wrath, Provoke, and Vantage... ZOMG PWN LOL.
I didn't use Nephenee in PoR, which I know puts me in a minority of one, but I gave the Provoke and Vantage combo to Gatrie. Make sure everyone attacks the tank, who may still one-shot you before you actually attack.

Also, in RD, take Trueblade Zihark, who comes with Adept and will have Astra, and give him a Brave Sword. See how many times he attacks.

EDIT: And let's not forget in PoR, give Mia a Killing Edge at a high level and Gamble. I never saw her hit chance get past about 60, but it was worth seeing the 100 critical chance.
 

EmblemPrincess

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Gatrie sure is a tank lol, I can agree with that. Ike becomes one himself in RD too. Dang that guy is good. XD

Also, 100 critical hit chance? Holy crap. o_o
 

Lord Viper

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I think either Mia or Shinon would have a critical hit that high. XD
 

Smash_Gigas

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The reason Mia is one of my favorite characters IS because of her Critical Hit ratio. I always give her the Luck boosters, and a forged sword with max Critical. Cracks me up.

Gatrie's cool, too. Same for Tauroneo and Brom.

Meg is the one tanker I never liked to use though. It was more effort than I'm willing to put forth to level her up.

As for the Laguz, I never really used them, either. If anything, Mordecai if I didn't have anyone better with me at the time.
 

Lord Viper

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Add in Volke. Baselard + Wrath + Gamble. His crit percentage will be very high that way.
**** I forgot about him, man he was very useful in PoR but didn't get much show time in RD.

Shinon is chuck norris <_<, and for some reason I always felt Rolf gets ***** by Shinon >_>. Shinon, you can have him solo most of the end-game, thats why I used Astrid once. She was kick *** on her horse and **** <_<
I guess Rolf would always stays behind Shinon. I really haven't tried Astrid in RD, though she does level up fast.
 

Teh Brettster

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Oh my gosh.
I swear, Path of Radiance hates me as much as I love it.
I'm playing through again, and my luck is every bit as bad as it was the first time through.
I play through chapter 14 , get everyone through it alive, recruit the ally, visit all places, and finish every last enemy on the map. Ike has a double hit on the boss to set up a guaranteed kill. The boss has like a 30-something% chance of hitting and a 30-something% chance of critical upon a hit. His biorhythm is relatively low.
Ike was on relatively high biorhythm and has full health. Between Ike's two attacks, the boss gets a critical and kills Ike.
Less than a 1 in 9 chance, plus differences in biorhythm. And the whole level was lost.
FML.
 

kirbywizard

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Oh my gosh.
I swear, Path of Radiance hates me as much as I love it.
I'm playing through again, and my luck is every bit as bad as it was the first time through.
I play through chapter 14 , get everyone through it alive, recruit the ally, visit all places, and finish every last enemy on the map. Ike has a double hit on the boss to set up a guaranteed kill. The boss has like a 30-something% chance of hitting and a 30-something% chance of critical upon a hit. His biorhythm is relatively low.
Ike was on relatively high biorhythm and has full health. Between Ike's two attacks, the boss gets a critical and kills Ike.
Less than a 1 in 9 chance, plus differences in biorhythm. And the whole level was lost.
FML.
Critical, that what makes you feel like turning off the game when you lose someone because of a low chance critical. I always find that for some reason a good amount of the time I have enmeys criticalling at like 20 or 15 percent at endgame >_>.
 

Meorksies

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If we're talking critical stories then try this; FE7 an enemy Berserker attacks Raven with a Tomahawk. 4% hit, 25% critical, calculating to a 1% critical chance (25% of 4 %). ...And gets it. Raven dies. WTF.
 
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