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Final Smash: Mario vs. Link vs. Pikachu vs. Bowser (vs. Unconfirmed)

tuggawugga

Smash Rookie
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Jun 19, 2007
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somewhere
personally, if any final smash is a 1-hit kill, its just an easy way for n00bs to win. who else would use a final smash on anyone to do a 1-hit kill but n00bs? unless the person you were brawling with really got you pissed. that'd be way different.
 

gamelover15

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 26, 2006
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Las Vegas
Of the confirmed ones, the best are Mario, Pika, then Link. All Final Smashes give (almost) a definite kill, but Mario can do multiple kills and goes over the whole stage. Pika's can also, but it is just like the hammer where you have to get them to kill them. Link's can get one person, but you can miss the attack.

Mario's is total ownage ><
 

abby ratso

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 24, 2006
Messages
15
Mario's for the average player
Pikachu's for the skilled player since he would dodge the attacks and such
 

SpitFire15

Smash Ace
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669
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In your kitchen, drinking your kool-aid
Of the confirmed ones, the best are Mario, Pika, then Link. All Final Smashes give (almost) a definite kill, but Mario can do multiple kills and goes over the whole stage. Pika's can also, but it is just like the hammer where you have to get them to kill them. Link's can get one person, but you can miss the attack.

Mario's is total ownage ><
Link's FS will definately require some baiting.
 

DonkeySmasher

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 25, 2007
Messages
761
i don't think these final smashes are definite kills

mario's will push them and do about 25 damage

pika will hit them up and do 15 damage but can hit multipeley

link will do 40 damage but only one person

i believe that those will basically summon all final smashes

either large but weak

complex but you can kill yourself

or solo but ton of damage

of course these are all hypothesis and nintendo's usual design of trying to balance everything
 

HellsAngelLust

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Jun 24, 2007
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non of your concern yet lol
non that i know of lol but anyway i think pikachus would do some major damage if some one learns how to work it but i think link for now has the best for targeting on chracter so i think it would be best for one on one fighting but marios looks more of a group kirbys well what do we really know besides the fact that he is trying or going to eat who ever he catches
 

DonkeySmasher

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 25, 2007
Messages
761
i would like to see characters like bowser avoid the generic final smashes

i would rather see him attacking in a clown car, swinging a chain chomp, or bringing in his minions instead of the obvious giant fireball
 

Katy Parry

The Only Zelda in Indiana
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justysuxx
I agree, i think he should have like:
Bullet Bill Storm!!

It's pretty self-explainatory.

But Zeldas....wow.
Or ganondorf=ganon=death.

Bowser could also "transform" into giga bowser.
 

_Phloat_

Smash Champion
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Dec 1, 2006
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Tennessee V_V
I think because you can die if you misuse pikachu's, and you have to hit them with good aim in a small amount of time, that it will do the most amount of damage even if you hit for only a small percentage of the time it is out..

It would have great combo'tunities to..

U-throw to instant FS... Doom combo, or even U-chainthrow into FS once they try and get away.
 

HellsAngelLust

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Jun 24, 2007
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non of your concern yet lol
i mean we cant think about zeldas yet until we know if she can transfrom into sheik but yeah i really do wonder what her is i also want to know what foxes is i bet it will be cool and peach omg what would peach do and yoshi lolz this is fun to think about oh and what about Luigi i hope he is not a copy or Marios and what about C. Falcon and every one else who i have not named wow i cant wait to see

*gose and builds a time mechine*
*hits the start button and watches it blow up * ****it
 

HumanIce

Smash Cadet
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Jun 28, 2007
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Iceland
Mario's final smash is the best, it hits everyone.. pikchu's one was cool.. but you might be able to escape it.. and link's one only works on one person..
 

HellsAngelLust

Smash Apprentice
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Jun 24, 2007
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non of your concern yet lol
zeldas final smash will be changing into sheik.

it will only last for a limited time, though.
how do you know if you going to spit something like this out you are going to have to give a lil info of where you got yo info lolz but i dout it that would be lame if they did that they might as well just slaped sheik on from the start :psycho:duh
 

Fawriel

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i mean we cant think about zeldas yet until we know if she can transfrom into sheik but yeah i really do wonder what her is i also want to know what foxes is i bet it will be cool and peach omg what would peach do and yoshi lolz this is fun to think about oh and what about Luigi i hope he is not a copy or Marios and what about C. Falcon and every one else who i have not named wow i cant wait to see

*gose and builds a time mechine*
*hits the start button and watches it blow up * ****it
Zelda:
Triforce explosion of light
<- final battle spoilers
Fox: Something with Arwings. They'll probably be a stage hazard somewhere again, so why not?
Peach: Down-Smash. Err, actually... I could see her gaining some sort of power-up. Or make everyone paralyzed like their shield was broken. With a LOVE ATTACK <3
Yoshi: Good question. Maybe he hatches a few Yoshis who follow him for a while or so, like the Ice Climbers.
Luigi: Luigi, in some Mario RPG, has gained control over thunder. It's not that likely to be translated into Brawl, though, I think. He's also said to have control over gravity, explaining his strange abilities. Whatever it is, it'll be funky. Unless it's the stupid vacuum.
 

_Phloat_

Smash Champion
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Zelda:
Triforce explosion of light
<- final battle spoilers
Fox: Something with Arwings. They'll probably be a stage hazard somewhere again, so why not?
Peach: Down-Smash. Err, actually... I could see her gaining some sort of power-up. Or make everyone paralyzed like their shield was broken. With a LOVE ATTACK <3
Yoshi: Good question. Maybe he hatches a few Yoshis who follow him for a while or so, like the Ice Climbers.
Luigi: Luigi, in some Mario RPG, has gained control over thunder. It's not that likely to be translated into Brawl, though, I think. He's also said to have control over gravity, explaining his strange abilities. Whatever it is, it'll be funky. Unless it's the stupid vacuum.
Lol, good post, I like it, and it makes a lot of sense

Luigu has control of gravity 0_0,,,, It looks as if he has control of traction xD
 

Stuhddabahkz

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May 17, 2007
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133
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I like the fact that some FS affect everyone (Mario's) and some affect one player (Link's), that's cool. Link's is the best, IMO. Fawriel, those ideas are a little...farfetched, Zelda's is reasonable. And Peach's seems overpowered, but an alright idea.
 

Fawriel

Smash Master
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oblivion~
Thanks, Phloat.

Stuhda...Stuhddabahkz... do explain how they're far-fetched.
Fox already has the Arwings as a probable stage-hazard, they are what defines him as a character and he has the motion where he calls his Star Fox companions ( special taunt in Corneria and Venom ).
Yoshi's does seem a little far-fetched, but they supposedly planned making a Ditto Pokeball Pokemon that turns into your character and helps you, and Yoshi is all about eggs and the fact that there are many of them and stuff.

In the end, the sky is the limit with Final Smashes.
We had huge fireballs and lots of slices. Everyone though Pikachu's would be one of either; probably thunder everywhere or maybe a volt tackle at a single person. Now it turns out he volt-tackles, but he actually TURNS into a ball of DEATH that you can control.
Nobody thought Wario would use his bike in-game, but there he is with a move that makes an item appear on the battlefield. A constant item with various moves that introduces a sort of "riding" mechanic at least for Wario himself. That would've seemed far-fetched a while ago.
*rests his case*



EDIT in regard to the post below:
Okay, there are SOME unrealistic Final Smashes. Like those that require creating a whole new character and moveset and such. Far too much work for a single move.
 

Tsuki

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Jun 23, 2007
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I guess Snake's will be something like a sleeper hold or so that paralyzes and/or does a lot of damage.
It would suck but what else should he do =/
 

VA

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May 18, 2006
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Summon specials are lame, I would rather see actions, like giant fireballs and slash moves a la Link, Mario and Pikachu.

I really hope to see some defensive specials, Healing/Damage Reduction/Movement Increase/Status Change. I don't know exactly but some kind of moves that do little damage and set up for some heavy beatings would be nice imo.

I'm not really a fan of the apparent imbalance of the Final Smashes so far. Mario's screen spanning damage-a-rific Final Smash disappoints me, I hope it isn't as damaging or as easy to hit with as it seems at the minute...
 

HellsAngelLust

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Jun 24, 2007
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non of your concern yet lol
lawl i hope link can call his horse but hes TP >_< maybe he can wolf form huh huh oh yeah
That would be dumb to me but maybe someone will like it but i dout if it will happen lolz i mean it would make a great smash attack but a regular Special move not it would be lame just leave it to wario and his chopper :chuckle:

@vanityangel that is so ture i really do hope they do that to give SSBB more than what melee had but i have to say for right now until they are used on me to still a win i like the whole final Smashes lolz and nice nick by the way lol

I think that Snake will have something to do with bombs and chaos lolz but i can't wait to kick out Zamus' whip lolz but what about pit i think he will just either charge one person and do something like link or he will fly around the field very fast slashing every one i have no ideas on meta, Zamus, fox, or DK as of now but i will think of something
 

Fawriel

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Bowser wins by far.


Final Smashes seem like a way to even out the tiers, don't you think?
Those characters who are actually strong but barely get a chance to show their strength in Melee got the seemingly most powerful Final Smashes ( Pikachu, Bowser... )
Sure, not a lot of evidence, but what could POSSIBLY be a more destructive Final Smash than THIS?

We should seriously consider using Smash Orbs in tournaments.
 

DamaGe

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Messages
17
Giga Bowser *****... end

Links final smash also looks pretty cool imo.
 

Dylan_Tnga

Smash Master
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Bowser wins by far.


Final Smashes seem like a way to even out the tiers, don't you think?
Those characters who are actually strong but barely get a chance to show their strength in Melee got the seemingly most powerful Final Smashes ( Pikachu, Bowser... )
Sure, not a lot of evidence, but what could POSSIBLY be a more destructive Final Smash than THIS?

We should seriously consider using Smash Orbs in tournaments.
Meh, and base the chances of victory on an item that can make you invincible? Yeah lets turn on hammers and stars too *rolls eyes*

its a thought but no final smashes.. tiers.. even out... gah...

WHERE DO YOU ALL GET THIS STUFF?! Its like 90% or more of the people who post here think melee is some sort of imbalanced disaster of a game. All that will EVER matter in smash is skill, get skill, you win. Play a low tier as well as Taj proved himself with mewtwo for all I care just STOP THE WHINING ABOUT BALANCE, its a unique fighter with over 20 characters with unique movesets based on unrelated video games.. there will ALWAYS be tiers. someone will always be on top, someone will always be on bottom.
 

Fawriel

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It was just a thought. We don't know enough about Final Smashes yet, they might just provide interesting strategic value and be balanced or something. Who knows.
Plus, items seem so awesome this time around they might just decide to hold some item tournaments. That could be fun.

And I'm not whining about balance and I'm not saying a tier list won't exist. I'm just a bloody perfectionist. I've not played a single game yet that didn't contain some kinda flaw that made me curse it at some point.
Melee WAS quite balanced, to be sure. Taj can theoretically beat a skilled Fox with Mewtwo. Yayz.
That doesn't change the fact that you have Pichu ( Strengths: Agile ) next to Marth ( Fast, amazing range, amazing priority, amazing strength, amazing combos... ).

If Brawl's more balanced, yay. If it stays the same, fine.
 

gnosis

Smash Lord
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meridian ID
Meh, and base the chances of victory on an item that can make you invincible? Yeah lets turn on hammers and stars too *rolls eyes*

its a thought but no final smashes.. tiers.. even out... gah...

WHERE DO YOU ALL GET THIS STUFF?! Its like 90% or more of the people who post here think melee is some sort of imbalanced disaster of a game. All that will EVER matter in smash is skill, get skill, you win. Play a low tier as well as Taj proved himself with mewtwo for all I care just STOP THE WHINING ABOUT BALANCE, its a unique fighter with over 20 characters with unique movesets based on unrelated video games.. there will ALWAYS be tiers. someone will always be on top, someone will always be on bottom.
Considering that Sakurai stated that one of his focuses was balance for Brawl, I see no problem with people speculating on how he might go about at least -attempting- to balance it.

The question of if his balancing schemes work out or not is currently unanswerable, but trying to figure out what Sakurai's attempting isn't too farfetched of a topic.

So that might be part of why so many people bring up balance.
 

Dylan_Tnga

Smash Master
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Montreal Canada
It was just a thought. We don't know enough about Final Smashes yet, they might just provide interesting strategic value and be balanced or something. Who knows.
Plus, items seem so awesome this time around they might just decide to hold some item tournaments. That could be fun.

And I'm not whining about balance and I'm not saying a tier list won't exist. I'm just a bloody perfectionist. I've not played a single game yet that didn't contain some kinda flaw that made me curse it at some point.
Melee WAS quite balanced, to be sure. Taj can theoretically beat a skilled Fox with Mewtwo. Yayz.
That doesn't change the fact that you have Pichu ( Strengths: Agile ) next to Marth ( Fast, amazing range, amazing priority, amazing strength, amazing combos... ).

If Brawl's more balanced, yay. If it stays the same, fine.
thanks for not getting pissed at me despite my rudeness. Its not even you and im sure you can guess that but hundreds of posters, many of them wickedly more ignorant than you complaining about melee like its the worst game ever because they suck at it and need something to john about.

Im just ranting though >.<

Bowsers final looks -TOO- badass.

Considering that Sakurai stated that one of his focuses was balance for Brawl, I see no problem with people speculating on how he might go about at least -attempting- to balance it.

The question of if his balancing schemes work out or not is currently unanswerable, but trying to figure out what Sakurai's attempting isn't too farfetched of a topic.

So that might be part of why so many people bring up balance.
Very true.
 

the grim lizard

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 26, 2004
Messages
3,130
WHERE DO YOU ALL GET THIS STUFF?! Its like 90% or more of the people who post here think melee is some sort of imbalanced disaster of a game. All that will EVER matter in smash is skill, get skill, you win. Play a low tier as well as Taj proved himself with mewtwo for all I care just STOP THE WHINING ABOUT BALANCE, its a unique fighter with over 20 characters with unique movesets based on unrelated video games.. there will ALWAYS be tiers. someone will always be on top, someone will always be on bottom.
Actually...Melee had a lot of things wrong with it, having said that, I still play it for hours and hours at a time, and it's the only game that lives in the Cube.

It's easy to tell what was wrong with Melee...Fox, Sheik, Marth...you get the idea. There were a few characters are very tippy top of the tiers, and there were a lot of fun characters who nobody touched at the bottom (Ness, Bowser, Mewtwo, Zelda, etc.) It really wasn't because people didn't like them or their moves, they just didn't like them because they couldn't become insta-good with them the first time they picked them up. That's what was wrong with it. Argue if you want, but it's the truth.

You should have to practice no matter what character you're using, but they need to eliminate those top/high tiers and those bottom/low tiers. I don't mind if there are tiers (some characters will always end up being easier to use or ultimately having more potential), but they could all be a lot closer to one another, and it could DEFINITELY be a lot more balanced. An quick way to tell if it is a balanced game: a more even spread on character use. That's a pretty good indicator because it means people are picking based on flavor of the character or because its their favorite, and not because they can fsmash with marth all day.

Look, I love Melee as much as the next guy, but I'm not going to sit here and pretend it was perfect. It definitely had some areas of improvement, and I think Sakurai knows that and is accounting for it in Brawl. Trust me, though, when I say it will be more balanced if you see a better distribution of characters being played/mained.

Edit: and on that note, you can say "look at Taj, he mastered Mewtwo," but you can't really say "look at ________ he mastered [Sheik/Fox/Marth]." sure, there are people who are really good at them, but most of that is just a style thing; really, you should be seeing the same sort of thing as far as style with all the characters.
 

Cenedar

Smash Ace
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Apr 8, 2007
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525
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Spear Pillar
Both Lizard and Dylan bring up good points. There are some characters, as Lizard said, that seem to be easier to pick up and be good with (Fox, Sheik, etc.). When a friend of mine first started playing Melee, I remember him saying how much better Falcon was than, say, Bowser, because he was able to pick up and defend himself with Falcon faster and more effectively.

But Dylan is right in that ANY character requires skill to master and really be good with. The way I see it, I don't see tiers in characters... I see tiers in the people who play the games. You're either good, or you're not. Melee was a wonderful game, duh. It's as close as we get to perfection without being perfect. I'm sure Brawl will be the same way.

Sakurai can try some things to balance out some characters and that's fine with me. But Dylan's right, there will always be tiers as long as there is competitive play.

P.S: I have also seen alot of balance whining out there, and quite frankly, it's starting to get irritating.
 

Dylan_Tnga

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You should have to practice no matter what character you're using,
Ok. Well then I guess I can get my friend whos never played ssbm before, make him pick shiek and tell him to ftilt and then jump and forward air and he will get out of pools in a tournament, right?

Dude, you DO have to practice smash no matter what character you do not only to gain skills but to keep in shape. Do you have any idea how easy it is to get rusty at smash? I start to lose touch after a few days and I -always- need a 1 to 2 hour warmup before I am playing anywhere near 90 percent of my full skill and like 3 to 4 hours of playing before I am at my max.

but they need to eliminate those top/high tiers and those bottom/low tier
They. Who the heck is they? I know YOU might know this, but the way people talk about tiers around here I think a lot of people don't know this, and it shocks me.

Nintendo (le gasp) doesn't make the friggin' tiers. They make the characters, the stages, the game. Its up to them to be creative with the characters and its up to US to learn how to use them.

Famous example is the iceclimbers, no one thought they were really THAT great before. Then chudat comes along, mains them for awhile and figures out all these desynching techniques and wins tournaments.

Nintendo doesn't give a rats *** about how bowser will fare against fox in a 1v1 setting with no items. ITS OBVIOUS THAT FOX HAS THE ADVANTAGE. No matter WHAT they do, bowser is a huge friggin' target where as fox is small and fast. In a 1v1 setting, a character like fox, speedy but hard to hit is obviously top tier material.

Simultaneously, fox is among the fastest fallers. making him easy to combo which means...

You should have to practice no matter what character you're using
if you don't practice with fox, vs a good bowser, kirby, luigi, mario, ness, and ESPECIALLY donkeykong, you will get *****. GG no re, *****.

Fox is a great character but it takes a LOT of skill to sepperate yourself from the herd of fox players and trust me if you have skill then its not hard to take down a fox player.

Remember that this game should always function by malva's law. ''Don't get hit'' smash is an intellectual game about noticing the patterns in your opponents playstyle and improvising a new one based on an instintual mastery of your main characters moveset that will counter the one he is doing. It is up to YOU to create various playstyles and to master the various movesets of the characters you choose to play.

On an equal skill level, yes, fox falco marth shiek peach and falcon dominate and the higher tier has a better chance of winning, but it is still garunteed. Realize that skill level is the real factor and that like I said before in another thread, counterpicks play a WAYYY bigger role than tiers at the highest and even medium levels of competitive play. Counterpick characters and stages are what you should be worrying about, not tier lists.

P.S: I have also seen alot of balance whining out there, and quite frankly, it's starting to get irritating.
VERY irritating. This game doesn't need to be balanced and Nintendo never had the tier list in mind in the first place when they made the game.

sakurai said:
To be honest, there are a LOT of characters that offer a slightly different flavor this time around. If you think they’re all going to be the same as they have been, it’ll be rough for you.
That should be enough for you. The characters are going to change, the game is going to be different.

Nintendo has NO idea what the tier standings are going to be. They have NO idea which techniques are going to be abused and why at the top levels of play.

Sakurai's sole duty in making these GREAT games is to bring a bunch of loved characters together to clash and to make the experience fun with incredible graphics, gameplay, and awesome movesets for each character, and he includes enough techniques in both of the first two games to make them competitive at a VERY high level.

Since the game at the highest level requires you to know how to use or at least counter the advanced techniques, but that is JUST the beginning of one's journey to the top in smash. Techniques must be learned but it is the intellectual game that takes a lifetime, and there's no tier list holding you back from developing that.

The problem is that half of you dont look at smash with any ****ing respect. (not pointing any fingers, you know who Im talking about) and think that this game is about lives, damage, percentage, and tiers.

It is NOT about that. Smash is an intellectual game, it is like chess mixed with starcraft in hyperspeed. If you don't see the underlying intellectual game in smash. THIS IS WHY YOU ARE LOSING NOT BECAUSE Fox Iz Br0ken

So to recap...

Tiers exist, but they barely apply to you anyway unless you're top level. but hmmm I don't see many of the top players whining about the balance thing.

Skill is and always will be the deciding factor in a smash match.

Smash is far more intricate and complicated than you've summed it up in your mind. it is an intellectual game of massive proportions and infinate potential always ready to offer us more, if we the players seek it out.

Fox's upsmash isn't why you lose to fox. the reason you lose is because you SUCK and you should train harder and get the heck off smashboards and start practicing. No matter WHAT character you play.

Woah. rantage.
 
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