FINAL QUESTION for E for All Expo Attendees (Brawl: Failure or Success?)

[Burning Soul]

My personal opinion is that people should put more faith in brawl. It's just a demo.

 

[PKnight]

I like to use this example whenever this debate comes up, and really it's simply my own opinion.
To let you know which 'side' I'm on, I typically play casually, although I have attended several local tournies that were very competitive, and yes, very fun.

Street Fighter II is by no stretch of the imagination a 'complex' game. Block, jump, hit your opponent with 4 attacks and you win.
And yet, there are tournaments and what not based off of that game, which obviously means that there is a competitive community behind it.
Now perhaps it's more deep than I give it credit for, because a competitive SFII player could probably mop the floor with me, and I'm no slouch when it comes to that game.

However, all I'm really saying is that Brawl will more than likely be a different game than Melee completely. Same basic ideas, and easy to pick up perhaps, but someone with a certain level of skill will always (Barring lucky item drops, which aren't competitive anyways) win a match against a person playing casually. Well, usually anyways.

In my opinion, almost all fighting games have something to them that can and more than likely will turn them competitive in nature.
Will it be as 'complex' as Melee? Maybe not. But I can pretty much guarantee that Brawl will still definitely have a level of skill that still needs to be mastered.

How do we find out?
Why, we play it when it comes out, of course.
Until then, there's really no end to this debate. Haha, and even then I doubt there'll be an end too... But oh well. To each their own I suppose. ^^

 

[Star105]

my post is ignored.............. oh well

Smash is geared towards a myriad number of people pros, noobs, casuals.....ect....

the competitive community will not die because of brawl because of the myriad number of things you can do in the game.

it does not matter whether advanced techs are in or not because their will probably be new ones to pass the time.

also the demo is just a version of the game to get us to have a feel for the game so we anticipate it more and more peoplewill buy it. it is by no means the final version or w ill not change in game play. maybe the techs will be back or not. it can go either way.

oh yeah........ this game will be awesome but don't expect no change of the techniques.

 

[Youkai Master]

Seriously what is the reason for removing reversible B moves? It makes no sense it only takes something out of the game, an option that would affect nothing except give more depth to the game.

At least with things like automatic ledge sweetspotting, you have a new option to work with, which you can develop new strategies with. Or without DJC you can now do aerials while moving up. Or with momentum airdodging you can now jump or attack after doing one...

See? it's taking out a mechanic/option but replacing it with a new one so as to not lose any depth. BUT when you take something out and don't put anything in its place you're basically just making the game more shallow (i.e. less deep).

It doesn't hurt anyone to put something like reversible B moves or B canceled aerials because it would just be OPTIONAL, you could choose to do it or you could choose not to (as if it weren't even in). It's perfect because it just adds more variety, more strategy, more DEPTH...


I seriously hope this kind of things will be added to the final version, it will only help Brawl have more variety and longevity in the long run... which benefits EVERYONe. Things like wavedashing or traditional L-canceling don't bother because there are new mechanics in its place. But taking something out just because, and leaving an empty hole there just doesn't make any sense...

 

[Hydde]

Seriously what is the reason for removing reversible B moves? It makes no sense it only takes something out of the game, an option that would affect nothing except give more depth to the game.

At least with things like automatic ledge sweetspotting, you have a new option to work with, which you can develop new strategies with. Or without DJC you can now do aerials while moving up. Or with momentum airdodging you can now jump or attack after doing one...

See? it's taking out a mechanic/option but replacing it with a new one so as to not lose any depth. BUT when you take something out and don't put anything in its place you're basically just making the game more shallow (i.e. less deep).

It doesn't hurt anyone to put something like reversible B moves or B canceled aerials because it would just be OPTIONAL, you could choose to do it or you could choose not to (as if it weren't even in). It's perfect because it just adds more variety, more strategy, more DEPTH...


I seriously hope this kind of things will be added to the final version, it will only help Brawl have more variety and longevity in the long run... which benefits EVERYONe. Things like wavedashing or traditional L-canceling don't bother because there are new mechanics in its place. But taking something out just because, and leaving an empty hole there just doesn't make any sense...

yeah i forgot about the reverse B...and yes i have to admit that it blows. That special feature needed to be there but oh well.

About the L cancelin.... Gympyfish said it IS there. but is just needs to be done diferently.

 

[Mr.C]

Yes the Lcancel in brawl is fast falling towards the ground and before you hit the ground you do an aerial. Which is gay.

 

[tshahi10]

I say it is a failing sucessful good piece of trash

SOme things are good, some are not
a lot is different from melee.
somethings like taking out the reverse b was just stupid, but a short hopped triple laser reverse b retreatingis messed

 

[red stone]

I've been here for like, forever. And i'm not part of the competitive community, i could care less about tourneys. The game's sheer fun and coolness is what made me hang out around smashboards. And i have noticed many more that do just the same, you just have to look at the Back room community; most of the people there just enjoy the game but are not REALLY competitive about it, and some of them are the oldest members around.

wow, a tourneyist? what did you even talk about before brawl?

 

[M3tr01D]

I didn't go to E for All but I've played a lot of different games in various tournaments, and taking stuff out or making the process more simple has never made the game better for high level players. I'm somewhat worried about the removal of wavedashing and the removal of L cancel. Tech speed and skill need to be required in all games to seperate the players and make practicing have a purpose.

 

[tennisthehilife]

I agree that we need depth to make this game ever lasting.

There is no doubt, every one will buy this game, but that doesn't mean that this game will be played forever by the casuals + nongamers

Worries:
According to this article, 67% of Wii owners don't play their games! (not sure its true but, its partially true to me)
http://blogs.cnet.com/8301-13506_1-9799172-17.html?tag=cnetfd.blogs.item
Sadly I agree with this, I have 4 wiimotes, 2 nunchucks, Wii Sports, Wii Play, + Twilight Princess. I don't see that much games I want to jump out and buy. Its been a year and I'm disappointed because I could of gone for a year w/o buying it (actually I had lots of fun w/ my 3 games). I bought the Wii b/c there were lots of potential, games I wanted to buy (Brawl, Mario Kart, Mario Tennis, Galaxy, No More Heroes... ). When I get Brawl I'm gonna play my Wii every day!

Melee has lasted for me + all of you guys for like 6 years now. W/o depth Brawl might not even last 2 years and just become a game on the shelf.

So Brawl does need advanced techs/high lvl only pro can do stuff so this game can be really deep and this game will keep on living. Removing + limiting us too much will make this game too easy to play = not play anymore. (I'm not saying keep all techs, Melee 2.0, but don't limit us too much---> unreversible B)

My Point:
-Right away Brawl will be bought by everyone in the world.
-Depth is important or else it might not even last as long as Melee. We are not sure how deep/competitive this game is yet but I hope so.
-Gimpyfish shows that this game has promise.
I have faith that Brawl will be the best game ever. -^_^-

 

[Kimosabae]

Jumpinjahosafa:

Just to let you know, you're diverging into a tangential psychobabble that has little to do with the crux of my argument -- but I'll entertain you anyway.

So you're saying that if you take a bunch of gamers, and somehow bestow them with the knowledge of how to program video games, they will make a better game than actual programmers?

No. Didn't state or imply anything of the sort, actually, but I can use your sorry attempt at sarcasm to illuminate something for you: yes!

My generation is growing up and we still like video games. Subsequently, we're getting jobs in the very industry that gave birth to our interests.

I don't know if you know who David Sirlin is (it'd be telling of you if you didn't. I suggest you Google him if you don't.), but he's the old school competitive SF player that Capcom recently employed to tweak and re-balance the re-release version of Puzzle Fighter that people are currently enjoying on Xbox Live Arcade. This serves as poignant counterpoint to your cynicism.

If that was true, there would be tons of better games out at the moment.

Really, who's to say video games aren't better today?

Nolan Bushnell doesn't count.

All i'm saying is trust the programmers with their job, and don't try to act like you can do better.

I trust Hal to make a fun video game. I don't trust them to make a competitive fighting game and my trepidations are quite justified.


-SynikaL


_______________________

Also i'm really not digging the amount of people who think they are higher than others because they THINK they know so much about someone.

Get the **** off your high horses.[/QUOTE]

 

[Sensei]

I agree that Brawl should not have less depth than Melee. There is nothing wrong with having a lot of advanced techniques in a game if it really fun to play. Casual gamers as well as hardcore gamers will benefit from what the game has to offer. I'm not too worried about this because I will have fun regardless, and I can still play melee or ssb64 if by some chance I totally don't like brawl, though I doubt it. This game is bound to have additional advanced techniques that have yet to be discovered. All we can do is wait...

 

[Heavyarms2050]

i dont mind they taking out reverse neutral B because it always annoy me when im jumping backward and try to shoot an arrow at my opponent but then i turn around

 

[BentoBox]

"FINAL QUESTION for E for ALL Expo Attendees"

 

[BigRick]

You guys should buy Accent Core, then try to play it at a high level.

Then you guys will probably stop complainin about Brawl being less technical.


EDIT: And let me clarify something for all of you guys. More options doesn't necessarily mean more depth.

 

[NessPaulaJeffPoo]

i think the only reason people will say brawl is a failure is because there no wavedash. Plus i thought lag cancel is still in

Ok, if you are a "hardcore" gamer and you are pissed that wavedashing is out...then ok.

If you are calling Brawl a failure due to lack of wavedashing, then you are not a hardcore gamer.

Stop crying over a technique that made you "better" than others. If you are any good at all, you will learn to compensate for a part of it being removed.

Its looking like Ness isn't going to make it into Brawl and he was my main in Melee. And, ya I am sad that he won;t make it, but am I calling it a failed game? Hell no! That would be immature and reflect me as a bad player. I will just get good with someone else. That is what the devout wavedashers are going to have to do. Get over it and move on and if you are any good at this game at all, you can live without it.

 

[Mr.C]

i dont mind they taking out reverse neutral B because it always annoy me when im jumping backward and try to shoot an arrow at my opponent but then i turn around

.........................

i think the only reason people will say brawl is a failure is because there no wavedash. Plus i thought lag cancel is still in

no one cares about wding being in....lol

if its in will that be cool? yes. It will add a lot of things to the ssbb meta game.

is it a necessary thing to have? no.

wave dashing does not make you better. lol

 

[NES n00b]

i dont mind they taking out reverse neutral B because it always annoy me when im jumping backward and try to shoot an arrow at my opponent but then i turn around

First of, lol. Glad you aren't designing this game.

You guys should buy Accent Core, then try to play it at a high level.

Then you guys will probably stop complainin about Brawl being less technical.


EDIT: And let me clarify something for all of you guys. More options doesn't necessarily mean more depth.

I would not be comforted by the fact that another game has alot of technical skill involved while Brawl right now doesn't seem to require much at all.

You are correct when you say that more options doesn't always mean more depth. However, the more viable and balanced options overall (the more options that are usable at highest metagame) = more depth.

Thank you Emblem Lord. XD

 

[Heavyarms2050]

Ok, if you are a "hardcore" gamer and you are pissed that wavedashing is out...then ok.

If you are calling Brawl a failure due to lack of wavedashing, then you are not a hardcore gamer.

Stop crying over a technique that made you "better" than others. If you are any good at all, you will learn to compensate for a part of it being removed.

Its looking like Ness isn't going to make it into Brawl and he was my main in Melee. And, ya I am sad that he won;t make it, but am I calling it a failed game? Hell no! That would be immature and reflect me as a bad player. I will just get good with someone else. That is what the devout wavedashers are going to have to do. Get over it and move on and if you are any good at this game at all, you can live without it.

I can wavedash, but i dont use it (not very useful with link IMO). Im not crying about it, im just saying that a majority of the people, not including me, will say that brawl is a failure because lack of wavedash.

First of, lol. Glad you aren't designing this game.

well seems somebody in the designer team has the same view as i do

 

[messiahfreak2000]

Ummmm you have some good points when it comes to smash in general, but i disagree about techs. Yes, you may be able to beat people who use adv. techs while u do not, BUT, if the pweson can apply them correctly to his game, he will be able to defeat you. I remember, i thought i was good since i had been playing smash since it came out, but techs helped my game alot. When i didnt know about techs, i had beaten every single person i had ever met in smash, but when i learnt about the competative smash community, i was blown away by how bad i really was. Not sure how good you are, but if u can use techs to enhance your game, u can become much bettr. Ok i'm done.

i probably could use techs to advance my game (l-cancel and dash cancel seem like the only useful ones to my style). besides it doesn't matter if someone can use it correctly/effectively. point still remains that simplicity (non tech user) CAN beat complexity (tech user). its just a matter of the mind. anyways, i have yet to test my skills in the competitive scene.

(man i love discussions)

 

[messiahfreak2000]

"FINAL QUESTION for E for ALL Expo Attendees"

keeping on track has kinda gone out the door now (myself included)

 

[Mr.C]

i probably could use techs to advance my game (l-cancel and dash cancel seem like the only useful ones to my style). besides it doesn't matter if someone can use it correctly/effectively. point still remains that simplicity (non tech user) CAN beat complexity (tech user). its just a matter of the mind. anyways, i have yet to test my skills in the competitive scene.

(man i love discussions)

No they cant. You will never see a person who knows how to play this game and can use advanced techniques correctly be beaten by someone who doesn't.

I'll tell you exactly what will happen when you test your skill in the competitive scene. You will go to a tournament (an actual tournament with good well known players not a downtown gaming shop tournament.) thinking you are good and actually know how to play the game. Then you will get 3-4 stocked.

After you get 3-4 stocked you have two paths to choose from.

1. Quit the game because you are not good enough. (or come on the boards and flame competitive players and complain about how Melee is broken and you're happy that brawl is destroying its meta game)

2. Practice and become "good enough."

 

[messiahfreak2000]

No they cant. You will never see a person who knows how to play this game and can use advanced techniques correctly be beaten by someone who doesn't.

I'll tell you exactly what will happen when you test your skill in the competitive scene. You will go to a tournament (an actual tournament with good well known players not a downtown gaming shop tournament.) thinking you are good and actually know how to play the game. Then you will get 3-4 stocked.

After you get 3-4 stocked you have two paths to choose from.

1. Quit the game because you are not good enough. (or come on the boards and flame competitive players and complain about how Melee is broken and you're happy that brawl is destroying its meta game)

2. Practice and become "good enough."

like i said before, i have yet to really test my game. personally, i'm not much of a complainer, if they're better, fine. i'll see how they play and figure a counter. practice makes perfect. a person can know all the fancy stuff but a few simple moves can bring 'em down. meta game, a skilled player can work in any situation, regardless if they know techs or not. this would make for an interesting test.

 

[Mr.C]

At least you chose path #2 <3

 

[messiahfreak2000]

At least you chose path #2 <3

thanks man. the true spirit of fighter takes whats given him/her, refines it, tests it, and refines it more (was that fortune cookie or what?). so in regards to brawl, man its smash bros. we love the smash bros series because its different than the other fighting games out there. take whats given you and if it completely blows, then it completely blows. if it reaches the acceptable level, then take whats there and work with it.

 

[NES n00b]

like i said before, i have yet to really test my game. personally, i'm not much of a complainer, if they're better, fine. i'll see how they play and figure a counter. practice makes perfect. a person can know all the fancy stuff but a few simple moves can bring 'em down. meta game, a skilled player can work in any situation, regardless if they know techs or not. this would make for an interesting test.

Well, if we are talking about Melee, it won't happen. If you are in MS, I would drive down to your place just to show you. Anyways, not only will the person be faster by the techs, they will also have more experience reading styles and have more options of which to mindgame you. In other words, tech skill + mindgames is really hard for someone who doesn't use techs at all to deal with. Glad you don't complain. Good choice.

Discussions are fun. ^_^

 

[Stryk9]

man this is intense. i've been following this thread and what and intense read. i just recently joined to engage myself in such healthy discussions. my status says noob but i've been playing since smash first arrived so if i may, i'll post a few thoughts.

now everyone is talking about lack of techs being good or not. i know none of these techs (i know how to perform them but have not yet perfected them). that doesn't necessarily mean i'm a noob. i can bet i could probably bet either i could whup half your butts or put up a good fight despite the fact you may know techs. does this mean techs are useless? far from it! but consider this:

ever notice how smash bros is ridiculously simple when compared to other fighting games? granted there are a few moves that add depth (that aren't tricks/glitches) but on the whole, its a simple game: simple easy to use attacks coupled with random craziness. those who know these techs and consider themselves pros, bravo! points for your dedication! does it make you a better fighter? not necessarily in my opinion. all it means is you know how the system works and can exploit i more than others. my little brother is an insane fighter knows none of these techs. he's refined fox to the point where he's simply put: a manbeast. the way his reactions and mind works blows me away, granting him victory virtually every battle. his claim to fame is that every person he's met the first time, he hasn't lost the first one on one match.

in regards to brawl and it being simple : it makes sense. every smash game thus far has been simple in concept and execution, thats what made the game fun in the first place! thats why most of us were drawn to it to begin with. a simple concept, creative use of features, added the the sheer craziness of it all was an award winning formula for smash bros.

the sense of elitism if one knows techs seems kinda ridiculous. sure its a neat and effective trick, but if i can figure a counter to it, then whats the point? (which is how my little bro plays). techs does not mean better, it simply shows dedication (or lack of a social life )

end of thought

this thread has aloooot of BS but this post is just too nub so i had to qoute it. There is no way you could beat even a minisucle percentage of tech skilled players wihtout tech skill imo. If a person can naturally l cancel and has played the game as long as the person who can not........=the person without the tech skill will get *****. thank you.

 

[tennisthehilife]

This thread has 5 stars? already? wait 5 stars? This is a nice debate (well I guess mean debate) but where are the E for All Expo Attendees's opinions?

 

[Stryk9]

like i said before, i have yet to really test my game. personally, i'm not much of a complainer, if they're better, fine. i'll see how they play and figure a counter. practice makes perfect. a person can know all the fancy stuff but a few simple moves can bring 'em down. meta game, a skilled player can work in any situation, regardless if they know techs or not. this would make for an interesting test.

the contradiction here is that a good player DOES know the techs, because they are an integral part of being a good player. Yes aniki doesnt wavedash and became a pseudo figure head for newbs that didnt like wavedash, but Aniki is an amazing strategist and has amazing techskill using everything othe than wavedash.

 

[Johnknight1]

All we've seen is some of the best and worst players ever play Brawl, with TWO NEW CONTROL TYPES (CC and Wiimote sideways=fish out of water), new pysics that is more change from SSB64 to SSB Melee (more fish out of water), completely changed verterans (fish out of water), items on every match (fish out of water in some cases), Assist Trophies active (fish out of water), Final Smashes on (fish out of water), and time play (mostly fish out of water). Sounds like a lot of fishes out water to me! seriously though, we've barely seen anything of Brawl. If you were to hand me a new controller type, or the GCN, which one do you think I would be better with=???

Hell, anyone that knows even the basics of advanced play and advanced techs with Melee playing Brawl with the GCN controller could beat ANYONE AT THIS POINT with any of the other 3 controller options at Brawl. No doubt. It's like telling you to win a basketball game, when you only know the basics, and it's the NBA Championship. Expect several more advanced techs to arrive in the future, because basically everyone sucked due to being fishes out of water. No offense people, but if you had a GCN controller at E for All, you'd be like 100 times better!

TOO EARLY TO SPECTATE PROPERLY!

 

[FlyingBlackJesus]

I was at E for All and my impression was quite good, they did remove a lot from the game (read: wavedash L-cancel) to make it more open to newer players and less hardcore gamers however there still was a lot in there to enjoy, Characters felt a lot "lighter" so I got the sensation of feeling like evasion was a lot simpler which went on in a match were my opponent and I went the full two minutes without landing a killing blow (lord knows I mess up and suicide with 5 seconds left) just smacking each other around to about 200% each so it may make matches more interesting now. Also, with a lack of wavedashing, it may mean more mindgames and everyone wants more of those.

 

[Pink Reaper]

you can l-cancel, its just significantly harder to do. In order to l-cancel you must jump, fast fall, and then attack. You must actually attack after you fast fall but before you hit the ground. This may mean that some attacks will be un l-cancelable but its still technically doable

 

[MuffDiver99019]

wii was aimed for kids to start with, in fact, I think ssb and ssbm were both aimed for kids, but competitive people started playing and owning all the kids so kids either gave up or started learning crazy stuff.

from the manual and how to play screen, it's evident that ssb series was always aimed to be a party game not a tourny game, so it 's obvious why the game gets less complex but more flashy. kids can play them and doesn't have to be pros to be able to win.

there's a reason why ssb series always looks fun while metroid series always seemsdark and heavy.

 

[CHAOSDRAGON88]

There will always be classes in fighting games; THE GOOD,THE NORMAL,THE GREAT AND THE BAD. regardless of the game there will be skill rankings.

 

[bluekitsune13]

wii was aimed for kids to start with, in fact, I think ssb and ssbm were both aimed for kids, but competitive people started playing and owning all the kids so kids either gave up or started learning crazy stuff.

from the manual and how to play screen, it's evident that ssb series was always aimed to be a party game not a tourny game, so it 's obvious why the game gets less complex but more flashy. kids can play them and doesn't have to be pros to be able to win.

there's a reason why ssb series always looks fun while metroid series always seemsdark and heavy.

I agree wholeheartedly. Where Street Fighter or Tekken are aimed less at the younger kids, and more at competitive gamers, Smash is a kids game. I'm totally fine with that (I'm still a kid at heart). I still don't see the whole fuss with all this change though. Monotony is the one thing that ruins sequels for me. Take Halo. People say it's the greatest game. I played Halo 2 and hated it. When I went to play Halo 3, I didn't really notice much different to care (at least in the gameplay, which comes before extra features for me).

Now, Nintendo had always had a history of change. That is why they can keep making sequels as good, or better than their last game. Super Mario Bros. 2 was different than the first one (at least in America), SMB3 was different than both of those, World was different too. Or even with more modern games too, like Zelda. Zelda Wind Waker was different then any other Zelda game, in its wonderful art style. People may hate it, but that is why I love Nintendo. They mix stuff up. Just look at that Wiimote you hold in your hands!

It's been said before, and I'll say it again. I want Super Smash Bros. Brawl, not Super Smash Bros. Melee 2. Melee will still be there if Brawl happens to "suck."

 

[messiahfreak2000]

Well, if we are talking about Melee, it won't happen. If you are in MS, I would drive down to your place just to show you. Anyways, not only will the person be faster by the techs, they will also have more experience reading styles and have more options of which to mindgame you. In other words, tech skill + mindgames is really hard for someone who doesn't use techs at all to deal with. Glad you don't complain. Good choice.

Discussions are fun. ^_^

sadly, no, i ain't i MS. i'm in Central Oregon. as far as mindgames, yea, i can see how techs would expand the mindgame. but if another player who isn't easily wavered by mindgames can see/work thru it (like my little bro, i throw everything i have and some new stuff and he always sees thru it).

Discussions are most fun.

 

[CaliburChamp]

Im sure Brawl will be more competitive than SSB 64 with online modes. Aerial combat in brawl will be more deep than in Melee. In brawl your able to air dodge and then jump to perform an aerial attack. Although I'll miss wavedash, especially for the slow characters. With out wavedash, it seems like the faster characters will have more mindgames with dash dance, like Sonic.
The slower characters probably have to resort to something else. Ice Climbers and Luigi are going to have a hard time if wavedash is not included.

 

[err]

if another player who isn't easily wavered by mindgames can see/work thru it (like my little bro, i throw everything i have and some new stuff and he always sees thru it).
.

then quit attacking and let him mess up. work on punishing all his mistakes

or land short with an aerial attack (be sure to l-cancel) and tilt/smash him when he dives in to punish

or just keep having fun.

 

[Ogre_Deity_Link]

OMGZ!!!! n0 tehcz?!?!?!

I got an idea! Why don't we make MORE TECHS!!! FIVE, SIX button involving techs with 1/100000th of a frame to pull it off in! AND IT MAKES EVERYONE GO 1BAJILLION MILES AN HOUR!!!! YA!! Oh and the attacks are too easy for n00bs to pull off and makes everything random, so it should all be seven button attacks with strange degrees for the joystick! YEAH! LET'S CALL IT MORTAL KOMBAT BRAWL! OR SOUL CALIBUR BRAWL! YEAAAHHH!!!

God, quit your *****ing. I'm sure if they made this game so hard that only Melee players could play it, you wouldn't hear a god****ed adv. player complain.

Oh and for the record for the OP? Casual players out number you. Nintendo cares only 'bout moneyz. Do the math.

 

[SirKibbleX]

Lemme think about this from a different direction... how is a quick tap of a jump and an immediate direction click and L or R a difficult button combination? It's no harder than shffling or, hell, even a simple Shoryuken. Have you guys ever tried to do Akuma's Hell Death Murder super move or tried to use one of magneto's extremely long combos from MvC2 (I admittedly cannot do them, but I have tried) ? Well, I honestly realize we are using a limited-bandwidth device (it's a controller with maybe 5 buttons and a pair of sticks, not a keyboard with 100+ buttons), and wonder how many other ways could wavedashing be implemented without threatening and accidental use of another move?

Also I think I agree that there should be some kind of advanced how-to-play in the game to teach all the advanced techs that are available. The fact that Short-hopping, L-Cancelling and teching (as well as, arguably, dash-dancing, jump-cancelling, crouch-cancelling, and shield-grabbing) are intended mechanics that have no in-game description does slightly bother me.