Final Fantasy IX Mafia | Game over! | Who won? :o

[#HBC | J]

 

[July]

Request replacement, or well, Gordito's /out of Leopard Skin Taser.

I really do hate doing this type of stuff, and call people out for "not making the commitment bla bla bla", but :/... Sorry

It's okay Gord, no worries.

/Request switch from Leopard Skin Taser slot to July

Please bear with me, I'm in the process of catching up now, I'll have a catch-up post tonight still.

 

[July]

Alright, to start off...I kind of understand what Gord was getting at with SangfroidWarrior, with the intro post there are some comments that stand out because they just don't add up:

J: He also comes in simply asking questions, but I think that's just how he normally plays when nothing really is going on. He's being very hardheaded wrt Dad's posts. He doesn't seem to get his logic. Not a scum tell, but interesting. His votes have pretty good logic behind them. I don’t know if I completely agree, but, at the moment, he’s not just looking for silly reasons. I dislike, though, that he assumes that, since people have the same reads as him, they have to be town. Town.

Kuz/Soup: He's just walking around in circles and I think that's just the hydra in general. But, he seems pretty town to me. But, he's attacking LST because he seems scummy, mostly because of one post where he pretty much just talks. To use Dad's words "all huff and puff and no action." He seems to be working, albeit in a slightly confusing manner. Town.

The analysis of J talks about him being hardheaded wrt to Dad's posts. Honestly I just found this to be a strange way to explain the interaction, because I think that since you say that Dad's play style is scummy asking some questions and challenging Dad on their reads is a good thing.

As for the last line of the J analysis, I deff know from playing with J before that J doesn't assume same reads = town, so that definitely had to be misconstrued or misunderstood.

Hilt: Hilt seems to be very pushy and confused. Post #157 seems... off to me though. Not sure why. But, he doesn't seem very pro-active in the game. I would be hard-pressed to find a post in which he did something for his own reasons, not because somebody asked him something. That is, up until around #241. But, still, it doesn't really seem to be taking any incentive. His long list makes me think he might possibly be town, but I'm not sure. His #275 makes me feel even better. Null leaning scum because of his previous inactivity and requiring people attacking him to really start working.

The read on Hilt seems very weak as well, and the main reason Sang lists for suspicions of Hilt are that he's not very proactive, "pushy" and "confused". I remember Hilt saying early on that he doesn't post much though, so I don't think him being responsive as long as he provides reads and scumhunting when he responds should really be held against him. Another thing is that the accusations of pushy and confused don't really get explained, along with #157 which makes this read feel forced.

Red Ryu: Attacking inactives seems to have been all he has done, and it's weird. His back and forth with J (around like 270) makes me feel only marginally better about him, but I'm still nervous around anyone that wants to lynch inactives just because they're inactive. His posts are so short and mostly all have only like, at most, 2 lines of content in them. It's mostly all quotes. Faking content? He doesn’t give much information on his thoughts and yet expects a lot from others. Scum.

Acrostic: He makes a mistake calling the mod-confirmed a mafia, and he gets attacked for it, but it seems just like a newbie mistake being as he's a newbie. His vote on Seph seems RVS to me. He's being overdefensive for reasons he doesn't need to be (97/98), and I don’t understand it. I kind of like his 107 though. His #190 just makes him seem like a major wagon-jumper. I don't like it. His long posts are weird and contain mostly fluff. And by “fluff” I mean the stuff you put in an essay to make it seem like you’re actually doing work. It's... hard to read sometimes. I don't understand his #349 against Dad though. It was based on time restraints and we all get busy sometime. It's not a legitimate reason to me. Digging? Maybe. Null leaning scum.

Then these two reads...the result almost seems flipped. You really breeze through the analysis of RR, and you even present a little good and bad with RR saying his back and forth with J made you feel marginally better. Even if it only makes you feel marginally better, that's a lot better than it seems for Acrostic. This attack is full on with accusations of being overdefensive, wagon jumper, fluff,digging...but in the end RR's read is scum and Acrostic's is null leaning scum, doesn't seem right to me. And then followed by the RR vote, it just seems like taking the safe choice instead of being a little more risky and placing a vote on Acrostic.

Sang's #398 has a lot of content, and I am glad to see that she did tweak her read on Hilt but surprised she moved her read to null on Acrostic at the same time. Other than that the post was pretty legit, and we (well, I) don't feel like you are faking content.

I can understand concern about Sang being off, mostly with misconstruing things and some weak reasoning behind reads, and out of respect for Gord IGMEOY Sang. However, I do think with Sang there has been some town motivation behind some of her posts, especially rereading and reevaluating in #398 and providing questions along with content, and her recent play has been much more observant.

Unvote

Alright thanks. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Herp. Putting RR at L-2. Reason is on #372.

Unvote, Vote: Red Ryu

This is right after the accusation of Dad lying that was shown to be a false accusation. This vote on RR seems extremely convenient after that attempt to cast suspicion on Dad failed, but even more sketchy is Acrostic's reason to vote RR which he redirects to his #372:

@Tom: What are your reads for today and who do you want lynched?

@RR: RR an explanation to why you decided to transition from me to Seikend would be nice. When I asked you to come at me, I wanted you to come at me so I could see you scumhunting and being pro-town before we decided to lynch. Bleck.

@Sangfroid:

Spoiler

Being agitated =/= being over defensive.



There was no wagon to jump-on. Therefore I cannot be a wagon-jumper. Was I trying to get votes on LST? Yes. And it was because there was little to no content from that slot.



He writes too much. Y/N?



Are you serious? Dad lied. No one commented on it. J gave it a complete pass. If someone lies then town should be curious about the intent. It's not based on time restraints. It's based on why Dad would lie in the first place when it was something as trivial as a hydra disagreement. It was not based on time restraints. Re-read and reassess.

This post is mostly about Dad, and about not being a wagon hopper. The point about RR honestly didn't stand out upon my first read of it and this post shows a very weak intention to lynch RR until it becomes a necessity when the Dad point falls through.

That seems to be the general consensus on me this game. I didn't have a strong scum read aside from Dad when I did a re-read. I don't feel fantastic about RR either. But I think an RR lynch today is better than having a possible NL. I also think that pushing the lynch early is a better choice than scrambling at the last minute in case something happens. In other words, I don't feel strongly about RR being scum, but at the same time I don't feel like he's bled town with recent material or persuaded me on why I shouldn't vote him. All I see is him deciding to center his vote from me to Seikend.

This is so scummy. Acrostic makes sure that he is on the RR wagon, but he expresses doubts about it and really rides the middle with his opinion on RR, saying he doesn't feel fantastic about RR but it's better than a NL. This is a really easy way to distance himself from RR while still accounting for his hop on the wagon by explaining it's better than a mislynch. Definitely need to look into Acrostic on a RR scum flip, still on a RR town flip but I think from this RR/Acrostic scum team is likely.

Seik wagon, would you move to RR? Would you to stop a NL?

LST, being realistic, do you think Sang's going to get lynched toDay?

No, and I do not want to see Sang lynched toDay, I think her posts have improved since her intro post. She's deff one to keep an eye on, but toDay absolutely has to be between RR/Acrostic/Seikend.

As for Seikend, his recent posts honestly haven't attracted my attention...they are just null. There are a lot of clarifications and questions but I still doubt whether or not you are scumhunting. However, that's a lot better than I feel about Acrostic right now...

Even though this factor offers no good solutions, I still feel still feel it suffers from benign confusion. And despite this rather impasse conclusion, I feel that his lynch will clear up some pollution.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I saw no hint that you wanted to lynch AM before this. What are your reasons for supporting an AM lynch?

Also there is no way that would happen toDay, and especially this close to the deadline it's shady that you just threw out the idea of an AM lynch and just buried it in this rhyme; there is no reason to tip-toe around a read like this. All I see as justification for the idea of an AM lynch is "it suffers from benign confusion", which is also extremely vague.

Different, Weird, Lazy. You sure do ask a lot of questions that tend to go nowhere.

This is such a terrible answer to this question and then at the end you throw it back on J as if he was in the wrong for asking your opinion on players. It's like you are purposely being shifty about your reads.

@Everyone: Can you please comment on what you think of Acro's reasoning to vote RR? Do you agree with my 553?

Acrostic's reasoning for voting RR is awful, he says that he is okay with lynching RR even though he thinks he's town because if not he'll be a mislynch for scum to push later on...I have heard this reasoning before and I hate it and I don't think it does any good to lynch someone you think will flip town just so it doesn't happen later in the game, its counter-intuitive to scumhunting.

Yes, I agree with your 553.

I'm not weird at all. Why is RR asking you to comment on his reads if he knows that you are reading wrong? This makes even less sense from a null-town perspective because he seems to imply that he genuinely wants feedback from someone who wrongly has a scum read (on him). If he thought you were scum or null-scum then at least he could try to find out who your partners might be from your response.



I already have. You've already commented on how you think it is scummy. I have stated that RR's play is anti-town with his unexplained vote switched and poor rebuttals. I know you know that I've already gone over this. Despite this my gut read is that RR is still town because no one is really coming to help him out (scum-mates) and he just seems so lost this entire game. However his play is still fundamentally anti-town and I would prefer if we lynch him today rather than have him as a questionable read or a possible push at a later point in this game.

First things first, if you are gonna call someone else weird you shouldn't be surprised when you get called weird right back (that just peeved me).

Next, this logic is just terrible. You say in this very post you have a gut read that RR is town, and he is asking J, a null-town read of his to comment on his reads, and you take issue with that? If RR is town he would still want town to win, and by talking his reads out with J now, if he flips town then J can use that information to factor into his own reads. If he was town and thought J was scum or null-scum, why bother asking J for reads instead of pushing J for a lynch instead of himself? As it is, it's null because we don't know if he's scum and what his intention is for gaining J's reads.

You make a lot of assumptions about RR, such as that his scummates would come out and defend him and they haven't so he's prolly town. You don't factor in, however, inactives or bussing, so you are writing off RR as town for invalid reasoning all around. And then supporting his lynch because he's anti-town :-/

Did he hammer me?

Cause I was town and wasn't lying.

This doesn't feel genuine to me at all, not going to save you from a lynch.

RR's play hasn't changed at all, and his claim is null. Honestly it was hard to focus on RR over Acrostic.

Haha same, okay but speaking of which just saw the clock and it's 1:11 so that leaves 23 hours.

Unvote
Vote: Red Ryu

Can't swing Acro lynch in this time.

Btw Sang, you have been here this entire time on the J vs. Acro debate. What did you gain from that and what is your new found read on Acro based on it?

Are you sure an Acrostic lynch can't happen? He's so scummy

RR has been pretty scummy and I can support his lynch, honestly I remember more about him from before I caught up when he was focused on lynching inactives and such, this read Acrostic caught my attention (in the worst way possible).

Vote: Red Ryu

RR is now at L-1.

Gathering my thoughts:

Scum

Acrostic
RR
Seikend (need to reread his latest posts when I have time)

Slightly Scummy

SangfroidWarrior (IGMEOY)

Null

Tandora
Tom
Seph

Everyone else is either leaning town or town read.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Deadline in 11 hours
July replaces Leopard Skin Taser
Mass Replacements or modkills will happen during the Night phase

---

Voted | Voter(s) | Votes/Lynch
Acrostic | Red Ryu | 1 / 8
Seikend | Aggressive Mediation, Panta, Dad | 3 / 8
Red Ryu | Seikend, SangfroidWarrior, Hilt, JTB, J, July | 6 / 8

---​

Not Voting: Tandora, Tom, Sephiroths Masamune, Acrostic
Takes 8/14 to lynch

 

[#HBC | J]

@Mod: July is voting RR.

We need two more votes. Come on already!

Shoooot we have less than 9 hours till deadline.

 

[#HBC | J]

Acro unvotes RR when his logic is beaten and vote is needed.

Seph says RR should be lynched but doesn't vote him.

Daddy's voting Seik for some revelation and won't vote RR.

Tom/Tanny, lol

AM/Panda, who the eff even knows?

@July: I really liked your last post.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

@J. Did dad ever explain his vote on Seikend?

So, wait, deadline is at 6PM Eastern? Ugh that really sucks.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

EBWOP: @Mod. That's not directed at you. Just the inactivity in this game and how I don't think anyone is going to be here within the next 3 hours.

 

[JTB]

If a NL does happen, I will be paying close attention to those on Seikend/not voting if RR flips scum in the future.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

vote: RR

there

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

As for the last line of the J analysis, I deff know from playing with J before that J doesn't assume same reads = town, so that definitely had to be misconstrued or misunderstood.

It was. I have never played an online game against J before so all I have to go off of is his IRL play style.

The read on Hilt seems very weak as well, and the main reason Sang lists for suspicions of Hilt are that he's not very proactive, "pushy" and "confused". I remember Hilt saying early on that he doesn't post much though, so I don't think him being responsive as long as he provides reads and scumhunting when he responds should really be held against him.

I missed a lot during my first read, such as a few things that people had done as well as where Hilt said he doesn't post much. I agree with the last statement as well. I'm not sure if I said that before but I'm saying it now.

Then these two reads...the result almost seems flipped. You really breeze through the analysis of RR, and you even present a little good and bad with RR saying his back and forth with J made you feel marginally better. Even if it only makes you feel marginally better, that's a lot better than it seems for Acrostic. This attack is full on with accusations of being overdefensive, wagon jumper, fluff,digging...but in the end RR's read is scum and Acrostic's is null leaning scum, doesn't seem right to me. And then followed by the RR vote, it just seems like taking the safe choice instead of being a little more risky and placing a vote on Acrostic.

I've played with Acro before in Newbie 13 extensively. I played with RR a tiny bit in Newbie where he was claimed cop. At that point, Acro's posts seemed more like nothings but it still seemed to me like he was hunting. RR, on the other hand, just seemed to be trying to bail himself out and trying to get rid of inactives.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Soupa what is your read on Red Ryu?

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

L-1 with nobody else really here. Mass modkills and replacements should be fun. *note the sarcasm* Oh, well. It can't be helped. Let's see if anyone gets back here before deadline and can change their vote.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

I think the lynch is bad, but I'll do it if no one else is here to hammer.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

So, if you feel that the lynch is bad, who do you think we should lynch? Because you're the only other viable option that people would be willing to lynch.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

And why isn't your vote on that person?

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

So, if you feel that the lynch is bad, who do you think we should lynch? Because you're the only other viable option that people would be willing to lynch.

I'd prefer Dad|July if I was picking out of players who have been semi-active. If I had a full lynch choice then I'd go with Sephiroth Masamune. Considering the difficulties in completing this wagon, I don't believe that I'm a "viable option," however if I'm not night killed then tomorrow I'm probably going to be tunneled non-stop.

And why isn't your vote on that person?

The lynch wouldn't materialize and there won't be sufficient pressure on either of them to give me substantial responses. I did vote them before throughout the course of today, but I think LST ignored my question wrt Ignatius and changed his fos so I didn't press on it & Dad's been Dad.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Sangfroid are you suggesting that I vote Dad|July instead of hammering on Red Ryu?

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

Could you give me your reasons for wanting Dad and July dead? Because I don't see it. And I'm pretty sure nobody else does either. I don't get the "Dad's been Dad" part either. And if LST didn't answer you, why not keep pressuring, especially if you think they have been avoiding answering you. Ask July about it.

And, I want RR dead over a NL any day, but you voting somebody just because other people want a hammer doesn't seem right.

I'm more curious as to why Seph, AM, Panta, and Dad haven't been active in forever.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

This is right after the accusation of Dad lying that was shown to be a false accusation. This vote on RR seems extremely convenient after that attempt to cast suspicion on Dad failed, but even more sketchy is Acrostic's reason to vote RR which he redirects to his #372: This post is mostly about Dad, and about not being a wagon hopper. The point about RR honestly didn't stand out upon my first read of it and this post shows a very weak intention to lynch RR until it becomes a necessity when the Dad point falls through.

My reason for Dad being scum ended up being a misunderstanding on re-read. Therefore I dropped the point after J pointed it out to me. It is not a matter of convenience. That was my lead on Dad at the time and it turns out that I was mistaken so I dropped it. The transition to RR was the next logical option given my list of reads.

I've done this but I'll go again haha. I am calling RR scum because I dislike what he has done this game thus far. He hasn't scum-hunted really at all besides his tiny little push on you in the beginning but even then, it didn't hold much weight/didn't make sense. Lately the most he can be seen doing is policing inactives and that's it. When asked to give reads he cops out with saying, "The inactives are my scum-reads." which doesn't really help anything at the current time considering the entire game has a lot of inactives. Bottom line, he doesn't do much, he's a bit lurky, and he only focuses on inactives. The last point is the strongest point because that's all he has done.

Re-read and found it, tried to ask you for this yesterday. This struck me as a PL on someone who has been PL'ing others. Don't see this as being inherently scummy. Again.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Could you give me your reasons for wanting Dad and July dead? Because I don't see it. And I'm pretty sure nobody else does either. I don't get the "Dad's been Dad" part either. And if LST didn't answer you, why not keep pressuring, especially if you think they have been avoiding answering you. Ask July about it.

#190 for LST
#348 for Dad

And, I want RR dead over a NL any day, but you voting somebody just because other people want a hammer doesn't seem right.

I don't see how demoralizing town for tomorrow by forcing an NL is a better alternative. Especially since people will get "reads" from this lynch.

I'm more curious as to why Seph, AM, Panta, and Dad haven't been active in forever.

Well Dad just posted. AM is V|LA and the hydra is mostly Washed I believe. Panta doesn't usually post a lot and Seph usually doesn't post that frequently either.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

I tried to answer all your questions. If I missed any, then I apologize. I'm going to hammer.

 

[JTB]

You got less than 30 minutes, do it.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Vote: Red Ryu

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

We'll see how it lands in a bit I guess. It'll give us all time to review. Thanks for answering my questions, Acro.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Day 1 Ends!

Red Ryu [Vivi Orunitia, Town Voteblocker] has been lynched!
Night 1 begins. Send in Night actions until Wednesday, 10th.

EVERYBODY PLEASE SEND IN YOUR ROLE AND CHARACTER NAME. I HAVE LOST SOME DATA DUE TO A COMPUTER ERROR.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Told ya, gl Town.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Traveling Cat replaces Tom. Thanks a lot!

 

[~ Gheb ~]

...the previous day seemed to be fruitful at first glance. The people that have gathered in the castle found a likely suspect in Vivi, who is not only a black mage of mysterious origins but who also sneaked into the castle to watch the play without a ticket in his possession - there was no doubt in the minds of the people that his attendance was suspicious enough to warrant arresting him. Believing they had found the one who kidnapped they went to their beds for a night of sleep after an eventful day.

Before the sun rose a high-pitched scream could be heared througout the halls and chambers of the castle. One of the servants found the stunned body of Cinna on the castle floor, unable to move or to speak. The diagnosis: paralysis based on black magic.

"Black Magic..." emperor Cid spoke to himself. "That means that arresting the other black mage did not help to cause an end to all this. Safe to assume we caught the wrong one yesterday ... either way, this has gone beyond the kidnapping of Princess Garnet. We're dealing with a group of people that attempts to directly harm the peace upon this world. Let us not waste time and take a close look at whom could be responsible for this again!"

Seikend [Cinna, Vanilla Townie] has been killed during the night!
Day 2 begins. Deadline is on Wednesday, 17th.

Not voting: Tandora, Traveling Cat, J, July, Aggressive Mediation, JTB, Dad, Hilt, Acrostic, Sephiroths Masamune, Panta, SangfroidWarrior;

Takes 7/12 to lynch!

 

[Dad]

Vote: Acrostic

I'm willing to listen to you J, consider it once in a lifetime.

brb ISO'ing acrostic

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Vote: Acrostic I'm willing to listen to you J, consider it once in a lifetime. brb ISO'ing acrostic

To save you from having to do an ISO:

J's fos begins around the point I voted you because I was under the impression that you were lying. I then state that the RR lynch is likely going to be an ML and at nature is a PL (we're PL'ing someone who is pushing PL's on inactives) because although the play is anti-town, I couldn't find anything scummy with it.

End of the day RR throws out that he thinks he was hammered and he is town. I take it as face value because I couldn't see scum RR saying that. I'm stuck between Seikend|RR. I was Seikend's scum partner in Newbie 13 and noted that his play was different, so I was under the impression that he was town. I had no leads though and hammered on RR at the end of the day to produce a direction for town today as I felt that this was TvT and I was more likely wrong about RR being town than Seikend.

J|July weren't happy with my reasoning and stated that they think my RR justification is scummy. I didn't come up with an elaborate defense and stated my impressions (EM style) as it mostly gravitated towards his last post. However I also felt that I was right because RR's posts weren't fundamentally slanderous or questionable in nature, it is that he was just uncooperative. RR had little assistance from anyone so I took it as RR playing poorly|anti-town play but not scum play.

 

[traveling cat]

@Acro: You think that's the only scummy thing you've done?

@Dad: Why vote someone before you ISO them?

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

I don't believe that I have been scummy. However things people might try to make a case on me would be:

[a] RVS Behavior - Fossing JTB and getting pissed off
Phasing out mid game, missed out on conversations between J & Dad
[c] Initial vote on LST and not pushing on LST
[d] Voting Dad because I thought he lied but it was an incorrect assumption
[e] PL case on RR wagon yet being on RR wagon
[f] Getting off RR wagon only to hammer RR
[g] Admitting to not having strong scum reads by the end of D1
[h] Dialogue with J, debating with J, accusations wrt to J
Lack of an actual two-way conversation with RR

 

[#HBC | J]

Acro, you're telling the story differently in your 711 plus there's already enough of a case on you from Myself/Sang/July.

Vote: Acrostic

Daddy, since it seems your number 1 scum-pick died in the night, who are you looking at now? Are you really just going to be sheeping me? Also you've listened to me before in PF.

TC, Hi hi. Thanks for replacing in and could you tell us a scum-read or two of yours if you are fully caught up? Could you then tell us which situations you thought to be the most telling?

^Tanny, when you get here could you do that as well.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

@Dad: What were your reasons for voting RR & Seikend? Why do you think that J is town?

@Sangfroid: Is this a "gut" town read on Dad then?

Kuz/Soup: He's just walking around in circles and I think that's just the hydra in general. But, he seems pretty town to me. But, he's attacking LST because he seems scummy, mostly because of one post where he pretty much just talks. To use Dad's words "all huff and puff and no action." He seems to be working, albeit in a slightly confusing manner. Town.

@July: Can you explain why scum would try to bus their partner D1 while trying to establish distance?

 

[#HBC | J]

Acro, do you plan on responding to July's big post against you?

People who didn't talk much near the end of yesterDay really should start talking.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Your case on a large part, was dependent on an RR scum flip. You stated that I was distancing myself from RR assuming that RR would flip scum. The fact that you're not reconsidering this irks me as you should be questioning further on how your context behind the lynch was wrong.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Acro, do you plan on responding to July's big post against you?

People who didn't talk much near the end of yesterDay really should start talking.

I did already. #700.

 

[#HBC | J]

Your case on a large part, was dependent on an RR scum flip. You stated that I was distancing myself from RR assuming that RR would flip scum. The fact that you're not reconsidering this irks me as you should be questioning further on how your context behind the lynch was wrong.

At first yes it was dependent, however I actually did say that I changed my mind to regardless of RR's flip, I wanted you dead the most. Here is the post.

RR, agree with your 566 with extra emphasis on the ewww. Now I have changed my mind to regardless of what you flip, I want Acro looked up with extreme scrutiny. With what you pointed out in bold, I want people to look at your two's posts to see if they see what I am getting at. I was saying that I would explain it when I have the chance but I still believe you have a high probability of flipping scum.

Seik wagon, I will only be voting him if it is needed I hammer him, otherwise I want people on the RR wagon.

 

[#HBC | J]

I did already. #700.

Woops my mistake. ^^"

Anyways, who are you personally looking at toDay? Do you have any scum-picks?