|FBT6 - BRAWL| March 20-21 Oshkosh, WI. West Circuit Event #2 - Results in 1st Post!

[chansen]

Christ, isn't stage striking optional anyway? For **** sake, if you don't like it so much (and your confident your opponent will strike lylat) then don't use it.

So it comes down to
a. You decide to ban lylat
b. You don't

So with all that plus this on the table, the game of stage striking comes down to gauging your opponent's hatred for lylat and whether or not you will have to strike lylat or you get the fun option of stroking a stage you might have a small dislike for. OR you could just agree that lylat is a garbs *** level and we could just pretend its on random. OR you could purposely pick lylat every time just to be safe (I would, all that background movement makes me want to barf) and totally throw your opponents sense of striking off. Then you would have to pretend that the level that they strike is the only level you can play at your maximum ability. Totally throwing their sense of confidence and giving you the mental edge in the match.

Or you could play melee. Problem solved.

My brain is full of mindgames, or I'm hella blazed.

edit: I always end up proofing my post right after I post them. But stroking was too good. And wow, lone.

 

[eighteenspikes]

ugh... I'll turn on stage striking loooooong before lylat is a random neutral

 

[Sago]

lylat is broken for sammy

 

[Wafles]

Wow Lone... 6 randoms is the worst idea ever. If you're johning about SV being neutral because of it's low ceiling, then how can you possibly argue that castle seige, delfino, lylat, or ps1 are neutral? lol...

Also I don't see how I'm missing the point. If my favorite stage is battlefield, and the other person knows it, they can just strike it and be a **** about it. So there's no chance of me getting my favorite stage, where at least with random I have a fair shot at getting my favorite stage (unless its banned).


If stage striking is optional, then what if one person wants to do it and the other person doesn't?

 

[eighteenspikes]

There's going to be locals here that have no idea what stage striking is, and it's kind of unintuitive. Let's "officially" keep first stage choice at random, and if both players want to stage strike, they can. It's basically a much more complicated way of having two players mutually agreeing on a stage, which has always been kept optional.

For the sake of accommodating the stage strike system, I'm considering adding Delfino to the randoms, giving an odd 5 neutrals. Looking at the CP list, I believe it is the closest one to a neutral stage. I don't play Brawl that much so if someone wants to give me empirical evidence as to what other stage should be added in its place, I will reconsider

 

[Ulti]

My understanding of stage striking is that it isn't about playing your favorite stage first round; it's about allowing both players to play on an acceptable stage that doesn't terribly favor either character. The neutral 4/however many stages is standard for tournament play may be the most neutral stages in the game and may indeed not provide any substantial advantages for the vast majority of the match-ups, but in a few matchups they do and it's dumb that chance should decide whether or not match one is even. Players can choose whatever unbalanced CP stages they want in subsequent matches, but match one should be as even as possible considering how much it influences the set as a whole.

If both players agree to play SV or even Lylat first round, then they have effectively agreed to strike out every other stage. I mean honestly, if you ask someone to play SV first round then they'll agree 11 out of 10 times. I don't see how stage striking severely limits the player or degrades gameplay, especially since most people will simply SV anyway.

Edit: Same time post -- sounds reasonable.

My $0.02 >_>

 

[eighteenspikes]

Good clarifying post Ulti

ps I finally got around to updating the schedule

 

[Wafles]

Lylat is much more neutral than delfino, lol. Delfino isn't neutral at all.

Want evidence? Water hazzards in 2 parts of the stage, walk offs in 2 other parts. The passable platform allows for some wacky recovery gimmics, there are glitches where you can fall through the floor, there are walls posed for wall infinites from any characters with a locking dtilt or grab or whatever.

Lylat's issues: the stage tilts a little and has some issues with platforms.

Add lylat for optional stage striking, otherwise it's the random 4. There aren't 5 neutrals.

 

[Lokeloki]

BTW I will be bringing a full Brawl set-up
Captain Falcon FTW! He's too good

like i said, count me for a full brawl setup + tv

Am I not cool enough to be on the list?

 

[MachinegunNorm]

with stage striking on i'd never get to go to my favorite neutral.

iunno i don't see why people hate having it 4 random and i hate that people add the strangest stages past the 4 actual neutral stages. PS1 imo is the most neutral after those 4

 

[hunger!]

PS1 imo is the most neutral after those 4

sorry to say this norm but you're wrong. infinites against walls = closest to neutral now? again, im sorry to say, but Lylat is the closest thing to being neutral. it tilts and only a few characters can abuse the stage by attacking below it. basically it's battlefield with a little bigger boundaries and tilts. the tilting isnt a big deal. it doesnt screw over recoveries if you're not a downy ass bitch

edit: and it really doesnt matter wtf we say. it's up to the TO

 

[Wafles]

Spikes, talk to me on AIM tonight and we'll settle this.

 

[Endless Nightmares]

If Yoshi's is a neutral stage I don't see why Lylat can't be. They are both equally quirky and slanted at all times...

4000th post coming soon...lone will be involved

 

[lonejedi]

I just think it's stupid how theres only 4 stages, it makes a dull game even more dull. Melee had 6 stages, so it made the matches a lot more interesting. And you guys obviously never played melee. Hunger, Fox can infinite half the cast on Poke 1 in Melee, that didn't stop them from keeping it off of random. I honestly vouch for poke 1 on being random. There's no reason to ban something just because there are chances of infinites for like 15 seconds, then it morphs again.

Having only 4 randoms on, and possibly 2 is really really dumb.

 

[lonejedi]

Double post but..

But I defintiely think Halberd and Frigate Orpheon should be considered. Seriously, there are really no BAD things on these stages. Seriously, the level changes on Frigate are pretty much like pokemon 1 in Melee. What's the big deal? come on guys!

 

[Endless Nightmares]

I agree with Halberd, but Brawl PS1 has worse ledges than Melee Battlefield. Also the windmill messes things up as it is no longer pass-through

EDIT: vvv i beg to differ =p

 

[hunger!]

I am totally for stage striking, and here's why. Personally I've alwasy been against only 4 neutrals on random. That's so stupid. I usually ban BF everytime, and a lot of times, someone will ban FD, leaving only two neutrals, meaning either YI or SV being picked. There are a few levels which I believe should be neutral. Seriously SV has a really low ceiling which sucks for light weight characters, so how is that neutral? Where has YI has some issues as stateed before. And BF helps a lot of certain characters too, as does FD. If we have to do random stages, can we at least add lylat and delfino, or at least Castle Siege or Poke 1? Seriously I hate this argument on how OMG my favorite stage might get banned. I assure you, if I play someone on these boards who loves to play SV, I will personally ban it if we're only doing 4 random stages. I think we should either do stage striking or 6 Randoms. Because 4 randoms is ********.

I just think it's stupid how theres only 4 stages, it makes a dull game even more dull. Melee had 6 stages, so it made the matches a lot more interesting. And you guys obviously never played melee. Hunger, Fox can infinite half the cast on Poke 1 in Melee, that didn't stop them from keeping it off of random. I honestly vouch for poke 1 on being random. There's no reason to ban something just because there are chances of infinites for like 15 seconds, then it morphs again.

Having only 4 randoms on, and possibly 2 is really really dumb.

Couple Points Here:
1. You're being a total hypocrite by saying you support stage strike system and saying you want more than 4 stages on random. Stage striking makes it so there's 1 stage on random first match of every set.

2. Yes, fox could infinite waveshine someone on ps1 but the thing is in melee, he could only do it on the mountain stage. In brawl however, d3 can infinite you in like 4 different spots on the mountain stage and he can even infinite on the windmill stage too...Fox's waveshine was technical skill. hard to keep them in it etc. D3's dthrow isn't technical and is very easy to keep them in it. It's also not only for 15 seconds. It's like 45 seconds or something like that and d3's downthrow does what like 7-9? IMO, wall infinites are ******** and shouldn't be part of the game but w/e, not the point. Point is that lylat is the more neutral stage in this matter and ps1 shouldn't even be thought of being neutral.

3. If we do decide to do stage strike system (wafles said he is going to talk to spikes about it tonight) then the stages up for decision to be part of the neutral 5 in addition with YI, FD, BF, SV should either be Halberd or Lylat. But once again. IMO, stage strike system is ******** but it's up to TO.

edit: 4. Also before when you were talking about SV having alow ceiling. BF actually has the lowest ceiling of the neutrals. So...yeah.


edit: 56k, the white chick that you had before is way hotter than that black chick in your avi.

 

[Seanson]

i like stage striking because it increases my chance of winning the first game.

to clarify: some neutrals are bad for me and some CP stages are worse for me, so I usually ban the neutral bad for me in attempt to not play there (at risk of being CP for a worse CP stage later...). Like someone said, game 1 is important. I dont want to have to ban to help me win it. Game 1 should be the even (staged) one.

 

[LouBega]

stage striking is awesome.

i don't know if we can make it to this though because we'd have to leave at 7am to make it by 5, and i gots class.

 

[Sago]

i played a stage strike tournament in ohio and i thought it worked out very well

 

[Wafles]

The stage changes last much closer to a minute, and a dthrow or dtilt wall lock can rack up well over 100% even if it doesn't get started right after the change. That pretty much determines a stock, and with only 3 stocks, that provides for some issues. There are 4 neutrals, get used to it.

I'm all for stage striking being optional, but I am completely against having more than 4 neutrals.

 

[Sago]

okay heres what you do you put on like 7neautrals and then you make stage strikeing required problem solved, it would make it more fun... or we can use zjiins flippin flapjacks rules

 

[eighteenspikes]

wafles go on aim

 

[eighteenspikes]

after a chatroom discussion with several MN/WI smashers, I've decided that we're gonna keep it on the 4 random stages. However, I would also like to emphasize the option to mutually agree with your opponent, whether by agreeing on a first round stage, or agreeing to strike stages (honestly this is just agreeing to pick a stage, with a bunch of filler in the process) or other similar method. A player's desire to pick Random overrides any other method of stage selection.

Based on recent discussion, a decent amount of players like stage striking, so there shouldn't be many problems with arranging an alternate method. I just don't find striking to be solid or efficient enough to mandate.

 

[Sago]

awsome lets play GREEN GREENS FIRST ROUND bABY

 

[betterthanbonds9]

awsome lets play GREEN GREENS FIRST ROUND bABY

I'll CP 75m
what now?

2^9 posts!

 

[eighteenspikes]

haha, I remember at Articuno Confirmed For Brawl, I played Zicore and we mutually went to 75m. What a great set.

 

[MurdaMoe]

Double post but..

But I defintiely think Halberd and Frigate Orpheon should be considered. Seriously, there are really no BAD things on these stages. Seriously, the level changes on Frigate are pretty much like pokemon 1 in Melee. What's the big deal? come on guys!

alot of ppl cant even recover on frigate. lmaoooo

halberd is alright, but those lasers and bombs can be gay.

 

[hunger!]

ok all this bickering is pointless. its a mw:w circuit event. have whatever rules NO KOAST has.

 

[Seanson]

sounds like you still need to decide which stage gets added to the 4 for stage striking, since it needs an odd number and all. which is kind of what the debate on the last few pages was anyways

 

[Scythe]

It shoudl totally be Lylat, there's no hazards or walk offs. It's just battlefield that tilts a little bit and has a distracting background.

 

[Jahordon]

Sago, you better hope I don't show up. Your record against me in tournaments is not so good .

 

[MachinegunNorm]

It shoudl totally be Lylat, there's no hazards or walk offs. It's just battlefield that tilts a little bit and has a distracting background.

lylat or PS1, those two are good.

 

[Kirk]

I'm personally for stage striking...but it seems that discussion already passed. *shrug*

As for the 5th neutral, it would have to be either lylat or ps1. I'm fine with either.

 

[chansen]

awsome lets play GREEN GREENS FIRST ROUND bABY

reppin that empire stage like a mofukka.


Green Greens Awesomeness Breakdown:
1. Its acronym is gg, which stands for good game, so your bound to have a good match.
2. It's technically D3's home stage. And he's a thug, so I'd trust his pick.
3. Lots of epic mind games happen there.

 

[Wafles]

I will always mutually agree to Green Greens. =)

ok all this bickering is pointless. its a mw:w circuit event. have whatever rules NO KOAST has.

Midwest Circuit rules has way too many starters. Get some jerk and they can strike 3/4 of the starters, either forcing the starter they want, or going to what should have been a counterpick. For striking at FBT6 there will be 5 starters, more or less eliminating this issue. Striking isn't required, but the vast majority will agree to it, some locals will obviously just need explaining.

 

[DonVitoOR]

I call... hacks.

 

[Chris is me]

I've got a really dumb idea if people want a 5th neutral for stage striking: PictoChat.

No, seriously. Pretty much none of the transformations individually would be counterpick and if there's any infinites D3 can abuse, they only last a matter of seconds. I can't think of any transformation that gives anyone a decent character advantage there at all, and the effects aren't completely random / game****ing.

 

[Cook]

Is there a reason why this starts Friday instead of Sunday? Does WI not have classes on Friday? Seeing as how this is a circuit event, I think it would be better for those of us from out of state if this thing was happening over the weekend.

 

[Chris is me]

Yeah, starting this on Friday is really annoying for me as I'd have to somehow travel 300 miles in 2 hours x_x.