Q&A Falco, King of the Birds: Game Play Discussion

[#HBC | Ryker]

Looks like bair is gonna be Lombardi's best kill move, and with what seems to be better overall recovery, he might be able to go a decent distance off stage for the kill?

The thing is that everyone can go for YOLO edgeguards much easier in this game because you can't just get edgehogged.

 

[S2rulL]

The thing is that everyone can go for YOLO edgeguards much easier in this game because you can't just get edgehogged.

Very true, I just like how his kill options are very different in this iteration, as opposed to the previous titles

 

[King Funk]

Anyone got any details on Falco's custom moves?

 

[Rich Homie Quan]

YOLO edgeguarding is the way to go.

 

[Alphicans]

Shaya, I hope you're right about falco, but I think you might be underrating how important lasers were for falco in brawl. Falco's jab and normals might invalidate lots of the cast in brawl, but GaW does the same, and so do a lot of high/top tiers in regards to their own singular moves. I hope you see my point.

Your analysis is pretty convincing, and I do hope you're right. Falco was my first main in brawl, and so I was really looking forward to him, but without a fluid laser game and nerfed dair (on the whole) not only does he seem just alright, he doesn't look as fun to play. Can't wait to see game play though.

 

[Shaya]

There is a lot of inherent respect players had to give towards Falco due to lasers and the effects of losing that are yet to be seen over all.
The lack of them also hurts aggressive options a lot as laser -> dash attack/jab/grab were all so potent.

I use the term respect though, as the better player's abilities to power shield, walk and also successfully react and punish side-b were consistent at top level. To the point that Falco players would be relying on spot dodge more than his actual tools to continue the charade. Laser -> Dash attack will be SORELY missed though, and yeah I may be overhyping falco as the effect of losing that does impact his zoning pressure. But eh, shine looks good, rolls look good. If you can use lasers to cover people's high height options and shine is good enough for a long range zoning tool close to the ground then I feel the effects will be similar.

 

[Gamegenie222]

Falco still da god yes please. Glad to see people got of out there emo Falco phase now cause I just wanna shoot people in the knees.

Sooo...I'm gonna be the best and currently as of now am going to main him. Played him and definitely like his tools. Having 's bair is a HUGE reason I'm gonna finally use an actual bird.

As someone who liked Wolf I knew you would come to the bird for the bair dance lol. Best of luck to you and praise bird jesus.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I never laseredwith Falco anyway, so the projectile nerf doesn't bother me.

I don't mind the Dair change since the properties of spikes have changed drastically in this game.

 

[ADAPT Chance]

I'm fine with Falco's nerfs. It will be interesting to see where Falco's playstyle goes from here.

 

[NintenRob]

What are all the changes Falco has receive? He looks like the least changed Hidden Characterfrom what I've seen.

 

[.Shìkì]

What are all the changes Falco has receive? He looks like the least changed Hidden Characterfrom what I've seen.

"Massive" endlag on his lasers, no short-hop-lasers, a minimal start-up on his dair and his Up-Smash now hits 2 times and from what I've seen its more powerful now.

 

[LuffyLink]

His final smash is still the Landmaster?! How Disappointing.

 

[meleebrawler]

"Massive" endlag on his lasers, no short-hop-lasers, a minimal start-up on his dair and his Up-Smash now hits 2 times and from what I've seen its more powerful now.

Massive in this case means "the same as always, but no way to weasel out of it".

 

[.Shìkì]

Massive in this case means "the same as always, but no way to weasel out of it".

Hence why i put it into " ", but everyone is losing their **** because "muh autocancel" and "muh shorthoplaserspam"

 

[meleebrawler]

Well, as i said earlier (or was it on another thread?) only Sakurais babies got new FS. Well and ZSS, but she doesn't count because there was no way she could have possibly retained her FS from Brawl as it was literally just becoming Samus again. Peach STILL spawns fruits that enemies can take to heal and doesn't put airborne enemies to sleep, Doc Mario got the same FS as Mario while even Dark ****ing Pit got at least a somewhat changed FS (again out of one of sakurais games), Sheik still has the light arrow, Lucina has Marth's FS... Did anyone believe Sakurai would make a new FS for Falco? Hell, even Falcondork is back.

And people dare say Sakurai isn't biased... HAH.

Well, Pittoo never has access to the Three Sacred Treasures, it'd seem pretty weird to the fans if he
used them. And his different FS is hardly unique (just a faster version of Zelda's Light Arrows).

 

[Tino]

"Personally, I prefer the air!" It would've made more sense if they gave him the Arwing as his final smash to fit in with that quote instead of the Landmaster. I mean, really?

 

[Pazzo.]

"Personally, I prefer the air!" It would've made more sense if they gave him the Arwing as his final smash to fit in with that quote instead of the Landmaster. I mean, really?

Falco's saying that if he had the choice, he'd be in an Arwing, but he'll take what he's got.

Anyway, The title of this thread should be changed.

Slippy's ship goes in for repairs.

Peppy's ship goes in for repairs.

Falco's ship is 'under maintenance'.

 

[CaptainCrisb]

Wait, was his down air nerfed? And the laser was nerfed?! NOOOO!!!!

 

[Ultinarok]

Sooo...I'm gonna be the best and currently as of now am going to main him. Played him and definitely like his tools. Having 's bair is a HUGE reason I'm gonna finally use an actual bird.

What are you going to do if Wolf makes it in as DLC and has his old tools? Always a possibility, the Wolf supporters are vouching for it in the big 8 alliance right now. Do you think you'd switch back to Wolf so long as he wasn't crippled?

On topic since this is a Falco thread, I feel like all of Falco's nerfs were justified. Most of his best tricks (laser locking, chaingrabs, short hop dair camping, jab spam) were sort of cheap and irritating and made Falco good for all the wrong reasons, unlike in Melee. With chaingrabs virtually non-existent, jab finishers, a slowed down and more strategic laser, and a slower dair, Falco will now have to rely on an exceptional combo game. This won't be a huge hindrance because his new U-smash, recovery buff, significant aerial buffs (a fair that's actually viable, Wolf's godly bair and a quicker Uair), still-good hitboxes, the fact that dair can now bounce up, setting up into bair and other combos, and general speed will make him a threat.

 

[Seagull Joe]

What are you going to do if Wolf makes it in as DLC and has his old tools? Always a possibility, the Wolf supporters are vouching for it in the big 8 alliance right now. Do you think you'd switch back to Wolf so long as he wasn't crippled?

If becomes DLC then I'd switch back .

 

[Ultinarok]

If becomes DLC then I'd switch back .

That's awesome. I'm currently their council rep so its good to have the best Wolf's support. I'm not you but I'm an adamant Wolf main, my name is also Joe, I play casual Yugioh in my spare time, and we're the same age, so its KINDA like your representing the Wolf community (kinda. Minus that whole being a lot better thing lol). I was never a BAD Wolf, I'm just not the BEST Wolf. You should join the alliance Seagull, the morale boost would be awesome .

 

[ArhyLis]

Sigh... Sakurai!. Well, I'm glad that Falco made it back, truthfully.

 

[Seagull Joe]

That's awesome. I'm currently their council rep so its good to have the best Wolf's support. I'm not you but I'm an adamant Wolf main, my name is also Joe, I play casual Yugioh in my spare time, and we're the same age, so its KINDA like your representing the Wolf community (kinda. Minus that whole being a lot better thing lol). I was never a BAD Wolf, I'm just not the BEST Wolf. You should join the alliance Seagull, the morale boost would be awesome .

What alliance lol?

 

[Ultinarok]

What alliance lol?

The big 8 alliance. Just a group of all the supporters for the 4 most requested newcomers (Mewtwo, Ridley, K. Rool, Isaac) and the 4 veterans who got cheated (Wolf, IC, Lucas, and Snake). We are the official support group for their possibility as DLC in the future. I know you're the Wolf guy, so I thought I'd ask if you want to be among the supporters. The group has the focus of showing Sakurai who we want to hold as a top priority for future inclusion. Not much effort is needed, it would just add a very prominent name to our list.

 

[Ffamran]

Huh, I just realized something. Isn't Falco's new Up Smash basically Wolf's Up Smash in function?

 

[Legend Vermillion]

Huh, I just realized something. Isn't Falco's new Up Smash basically Wolf's Up Smash in function?

Totally, it has two hits too.

 

[Sol0ke]

Looks like some of Wolf's moves live in Falco now

 

[Articablack]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but can Falco chain grab?

 

[CaptainCrisb]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but can Falco chain grab?

Chain grabs aren't in smash anymore. There's a period of time where, after you grab once, you can't grab again.

 

[Ffamran]

Looks like some of Wolf's moves live in Falco now

At least they transferred to a different character instead of relegating them as custom moves. Functionally, it's the same as Wolf's Up Smash, but still resembles the backflip except Falco has one foot lagging behind to make it a two-hitter. Also, Falco has Wolf's bair, right? Funnily enough, Yoshi has a backflip for an Up Smash now, so maybe Yoshi got Falco's move while Falco got Wolf's properties and another move.

 

[Sir Tundra]

One of best things that ever happened to not just falco but spacies in general is the fact that chain grabbings removed in smash 4. Now at first one might see this as an nerf cause chain grabbing was one of falco's greatest tools in brawl but let's look back for a moment. Let's look back at how much of a pain chain grabbing was for spacies. Like how one grab from an experience marth will completely wreck a spacie wondering why he can't DI for the life of him in melee(this only happens in FD). Or how pikachu pretty much had an advantage against both spacies because he can just chain grabbed to a high enough percentage to KO in brawl. Chain grabs were some of the biggest gripes for spacies due to their Fast falling speed and their low airspeed making them easy to chain grab with any character, Not to mention 0-deathed by a few characters some of which aren't even top tiers. Since chain grabs are not in smash 4 this alone will help out not just falco but fox as well since they no longer get easily gimped anymore especially now that there recovery is buffed. While falco has received some nerfs like SHDL no longer lagless when landed he has also gotten buffs along the way to back it up. He's not bad.. He just has a different playstyle to work with. It's hard to tell what position falco would be in but it sure as hell wouldn't be bottom tier like most people are saying.

Also I've been hearing falco can now up throw up air now if this is true then this might help out falco even more in this game... If anyone has a japanese copy with a capture card then footage would be much appreciated.

 

[Acton]

Also I've been hearing falco can now up throw up air now if this is true then this might help out falco even more in this game... If anyone has a japanese copy with a capture card then footage would be much appreciated.

I asked Zero if he'd be willing to demonstrate it in training mode on his stream. He did, plus several people in the chat say it's a thing now as well so yeah. . .

By the way I think your analysis is spot on! Falco's going to be more aggro in this game IMO.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JurOrl2liFg
^I've been posting this video all over the place. Falco still has his bread!

 

[Sir Tundra]

Zero actually showed on stream?!!! Well that's awesome.. I really wished I seen it though . Still now that this is actually confirmed true then this might make falco one of the most offensive powerhouses in ssb4 and a really huge threat in the meta game.

Also thanks man I've been looking at footage like shofu vs zef, and threads showing falco's buffs and putting it all together on what I think of him so far in this game... I can't wait to get the game to try out all of these techniques myself though

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

D-tilt > D-tilt > Reflector combos at low percents with Falco.

Pivot Tilt / Smashes with Falco are really good. He gains a good amount of distance and it looks like he wave dashes when doing it. For mind games I'll sometimes empty short hop into an instant pivot cancel U-smash to pretend I'm wavelanding. lol.

Dair spike into Nair is pretty good since it can bait air dodges.

Fair has a good landing hitbox so it's a bit safer now.

D- tilt combos into Fair at medium percents

D-throw with Falco is still pretty good.

Just some Falco stuff.

 

[Sir Tundra]

All of these sound interesting. However the Dair spike to Nair move does sound like rather risky to pull off do to the obvious start up that dair has.

 

[Rich Homie Quan]

An arwing laser and bombing raid would have been more suitable.

 

[Boshi PV]

Can't wait to give the old fire bird a shot. love his cocky attitude, really puts me in the mood to style on people. Hopefully he brings it in smash 4. Getting more hype for this game by the day!

 

[ImaClubYou]

My question is... can dtilt kill like in Melee or is it still Brawl?

 

[Sir Tundra]

From what I saw d-tilt seems to be like it was in brawl except its more of a combo set up. At least side b is now a reliable kill move since you don't go to helpless state. Plus RAR is still in SSB4 which helps out falco even more especially with the buffed up back air.

 

[ImaClubYou]

I've had an idea with Side B as a kill move. I haven't played the game yet outside of the demo, but how would it work as an edgeguard going into the ledge? You know, jumping off past your opponent then using it to line yourself up with the ledge, attempt to hit your opponent, and the regrab the ledge. Spammable technique.

Something that was pretty much suicidal and stupid to use in Melee or Brawl is now something worth considering.