1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

  3. Use the Smashboards Store to get awesome Smash stuff and support the site, like a Nintendo Controller or the Wii U - Gamecube adaptor ! Check out the inventory in our store and support Smashboards with your purchase today!

Falco Hitboxes and Frame Data

Discussion in 'Falco' started by Bones0, Mar 27, 2011.

  1. Bones0

    Bones0
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2005
    Messages:
    11,052
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Credits to SuperDoodleMan for move frame data.
    Images compiled and edited by Seikend.
    Multishine frame data provided by Kadano.
    Throw, tech, and get-up frame data provided by Magus420.
    All gifs are at 1/3 of the actual game speed.
    All aerials are performed while falling, therefore the hitboxes stretch upwards.
    To view the individual frames for each move's GIF, copy the image's URL and paste it into www.gif-explode.com. If you use Google Chrome, I highly recommend using the GIF Scrubber extension.
    Interruptible As Soon As (IASA): During these frames, you can only interrupt the attack with an A-button attack, walk, dash, jump, or crouch (except when the attack being interrupted is a down tilt).
    Auto cancelled moves have 4 frames of landing lag.



    Table of Contents:
    - Jabs
    - Dash Attack
    - Tilts
    - Aerials
    - Smash Attacks
    - Specials
    - Grabs
    - Throws
    - Dodges
    - Tech and Get-Up Frame Data
    - Ledge Options
    - Miscellaneous
    - Combos



    Jab 1
    [​IMG]
    Total: 17
    Hit: 2-3
    IASA: 16
    Window for Next Jab: 3-31
    Next Jab Starts: 6 (or later)


    Jab 2
    [​IMG]
    Total: 20
    Hit: 3-4
    IASA: 19
    Window for Jab 3: 1-20
    Jab 3 Starts: 7

    Jab 3
    [​IMG]
    Hits: 3-4, 10-11, 17-18, 24-25, 31-32 (6 frames between each kick)
    A full cycle: 36 frames


    Dash Attack
    [​IMG]
    Total: 39
    Hit: 4-17
    IASA: 36


    Forward Tilt
    [​IMG]
    Total: 26
    Hit: 5-9


    Forward Tilt (upwards)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 26
    Hit: 5-9


    Forward Tilt (downwards)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 26
    Hit: 5-9


    Up Tilt
    [​IMG]
    Total: 23
    Hit: 5-11
    IASA: 23

    Shield Stun: 11
    Shield Hit Lag: 5


    Down Tilt
    [​IMG]
    Total: 29
    Hit: 7-9
    IASA: 28


    Neutral Air
    [​IMG]
    Total: 49
    Hit: 4-31
    IASA: 42
    Auto cancel: <3 37>
    Landlag: 15
    L-Canceled: 7


    Forward Air
    [​IMG]
    Total: 59
    Hit: 6-8, 16-18, 24-26, 33-35, 43-45
    IASA: 53
    Auto cancel: <5 49>
    Landlag: 22
    Lcanceled: 11


    Back Air
    [​IMG]
    Total: 39
    Hit: 4-19
    IASA: 38
    Auto cancel: <3 23>
    Landlag: 20
    Lcanceled: 10


    Up Air
    [​IMG]
    Total: 39
    Hit: 8-9, 11-14
    IASA: 36
    Auto cancel: <7 26>
    Landlag: 18
    Lcanceled: 9


    Down Air
    [​IMG]
    Total: 49
    Hit: 5-24
    Auto cancel: <4 30>
    Landlag: 18
    Lcanceled: 9


    Forward Smash
    [​IMG]
    Total: 39
    Hit: 12-21
    Charge frame: 7


    Up Smash
    [​IMG]
    Total: 43
    Hit: 7-15
    Head invincible (but not beak): 1-10
    Charge frame: 2


    Down Smash
    [​IMG]
    Total: 49
    Hit: 6-10
    Legs invincible: 1-6
    Charge frame: 2
    IASA: 46


    Neutral B: Blaster (grounded)
    [​IMG]
    Total (single shot): 57
    Shot comes out: 23
    Repeated shots, every: 24 frames


    Neutral B: Blaster (airborne)
    [​IMG]
    Total (single shot): 42
    Shot comes out: 13
    Repeated shots, every: 16 frames
    Auto cancels upon landing

    Fastfall any time
    Laser lasts 99 frames


    Side B: Phantasm (grounded)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 59
    Falco starts moving away: 17
    Hit: 18-21
    Time to press B and stop Falco: 17-20
    Cancelling on frames 17-18 gives you the shortest Phantasm distance. Cancelling on frame 19 gives you the second shortest Phantasm distance. Cancelling on frame 20 gives you the third shortest Phantasm distance. Phantasm has 4 different lengths (the three shortens listed above as well as the full distance Phantasm).
    Can grab edge as early as 25.

    Landlag: 20
    Landfallspeciallag: 3


    Side B: Phantasm (airborne)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 59
    Falco starts moving away: 17
    Hit: 18-21
    Time to press B and stop Falco: 17-20
    The information for shortens is the same as for the grounded Phantasm.
    Can grab edge as early as 25

    Landlag: 20
    Landfallspeciallag: 3


    Up B: Firebird
    [​IMG]
    Total: 84
    Hit: 43-64
    When to Aim: 42

    Grabs nearby edges during charge up as early as 16.
    Grabs edges during moving part as early as 65 (going straight into wall).
    Grabs edges from downward angles.
    Grabs edges from either side.

    Landlag: 6
    Landfallspeciallag: 3


    Down B: Reflector (Shine)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 39 (or more)
    Hits: 1
    Invincible: 1
    Reflects: 4-21 or release+1
    Lag Upon Release: 19
    It can be jump canceled on the same frames it reflects.

    Damage: 8%
    Hit Lag: 5
    Shield Stun: 5

    Multishine Frame Data:
    1 Shine (hit), Hitlag
    2 Hitlag
    3 Hitlag
    4 Hitlag
    5 Hitlag
    6 Shine (2nd frame)
    7 Shine (3rd frame)
    8 Start Jump
    9
    10

    11
    12

    13 Airborne, Shine(hit), Hitlag
    14 Hitlag
    15 Hitlag
    16 Hitlag
    17 Hitlag
    18(2nd frame)
    19(3rd frame)
    20
    21 Land
    22 Start Jump

    23
    24
    25
    26

    27 Airborne, Shine(hit), Hitlag
    Repeat from frame 14.

    Opponents have a greater window to escape multishines after the second shine because you spend frames waiting to land on the ground before you are able to jump again. This data is based on a relatively fresh shine. If shine's move staling multiplier¹ is below 0.85, shield stun will last 1 frame less. This means frames 10 and 22 would be red, signifying the opponent is out of stun, instead of green. At maximum staleness, hitlag is 4 instead of 5 and shield stun 3 instead of 5.

    ¹There are 9 stale spots. Whenever you deal damage with an attack, that attack gets written to the first spot and all previous entries shift down by 1. The first spot decreases the damage dealt by subsequent use of that attack by 9%, the second spot by 8% and so on. If all stale spots contain the same attack, the next use of it will only do 55% of unstaled damage.


    SOURCE


    Grab
    [​IMG]
    Total: 30
    Grab: 7-8


    Dash Grab
    [​IMG]
    Total: 40
    Grab: 12-13


    Throws

    {Throw}: {Affected by weight?}
    {Released Frame}, {1st Actionable Frame} [{1stAF - Released}]
    ({Hitbox/es on throw animation if any}; {Other notable info})


    The release/total times include hitlag affecting the thrower, so if the animation were to release on 30 but has 3 additional freeze frames during it it'd be listed as 33.

    D-Throw: YES
    45, 56 [11]
    (Lasers on 23, 25, 28, 31;
    3 added freeze frames on each when the lasers connect, except for Fox only the first 3 lasers add freeze frames for Falco;
    Fox can A/S/DI the last laser hit with 4 frames of hitlag;

    hitboxes on lasers disappear upon hitting opponent)

    U-Throw: YES
    7, 39 [32]
    (Lasers on 18, 20, 24;
    Lasers are A/S/DI-able with 4 frames of hitlag;
    hitboxes on lasers disappear upon hitting opponent;

    opponent no longer a hitbox after release if hit by lasers)

    F-Throw: YES
    14, 37 [23]
    (Hitbox on left arm 10-13; 10-13 hitlag)

    B-Throw: YES
    9, 39 [30]
    (Lasers on 15, 18, 21;
    Lasers are A/S/DI-able with 4 frames of hitlag;
    hitboxes on lasers disappear upon hitting opponent;

    opponent no longer a hitbox after release if hit by lasers)

    SOURCE


    Roll (forwards)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 31
    Invulnerable: 4-19


    Roll (backwards)
    [​IMG]
    Total: 31
    Invulnerable: 4-19


    Spot Dodge
    [​IMG]
    Total: 22
    Invulnerable: 2-15


    Air Dodge
    [​IMG]
    Total: 49
    Invulnerable: 4-29


    Jumps

    First Jump (Full Hop)
    Airborne on: 6
    Air Time: 51
    Earliest FF: 27
    FF air time: 41

    First Jump (Short Hop)
    Airborne on: 6
    SH Air Time: 25
    Earliest FF: 14
    SH FF air time: 17

    Second Jump
    Earliest FF: 24


    Tech and Get-Up Frame Data

    Mostly self-explanatory. The "Horizontal Movement At" number is my best judgement of the frame you'd be reading and reacting to for the roll in that direction when techchasing. The higher the number is the less time you'll have after reading it to punish before the roll ends.

    In general, the ones with high distance and movement values will be more difficult to punish by reaction, though the size and position of the character matters as well like for Bowser his size effectively negates a fair amount of the distance it covers.

    Tech-Neutral
    Total: 26
    Invincible: 1-20


    Tech-Wall
    Total: 31
    IASA: 6

    (Input an upwards direction anywhere on 1-4 for walljump tech on 6)
    Invincible: 1-14

    Tech-Wall Jump
    Total: 40
    IASA: 1


    Tech-Ceiling
    Total: 26
    Invincible: 1-14


    Non-Teched Floor (Back & Stomach)
    Total: 26

    Non-Teched Ceiling/Wall
    Invincible: 1-15

    Getup-Neutral (Back)
    Total: 30
    Invincible: 1-23


    Getup-Neutral (Stomach)
    Total: 30
    Invincible: 1-23


    Tech-Roll Forward
    Total: 40
    Horizontal Movement At: 9
    Distance: 14.4 ft
    Invincible: 1-20


    Tech-Roll Backward
    Total: 40
    Horizontal Movement At: 6
    Distance: 14.4 ft
    Invincible: 1-20


    Getup-Attack (Back)
    Total: 49
    Hit: 17-19
    (Front), 24-26 (Behind)
    Invincible: 1-26

    Getup-Attack (Stomach)
    Total: 49
    Hit: 19-20
    (Behind), 25-26 (Front)
    Invincible: 1-26

    Getup-Roll Forward (Back)
    Total: 35
    Horizontal Movement At: 6
    Distance: 12.4 ft
    Invincible: 1-19


    Getup-Roll Forward (Stomach)
    Total: 35
    Horizontal Movement At: 8
    Distance: 12.6 ft
    Invincible: 1-19


    Getup-Roll Backward (Back)
    Total: 35
    Horizontal Movement At: 12
    Distance: 12.8 ft
    Invincible: 12-29

    (Not a typo. If the roll takes you to an edge you will slip off unless an attack is timed on that exact frame)

    Getup-Roll Backward (Stomach)
    Total: 35
    Horizontal Movement At: 5
    Distance: 12.6 ft
    Invincible: 1-24

    SOURCE


    Ledge Options

    Ledge Stand (<100%)
    Total: 34
    Invinvible: 1-30

    Ledge Stand (>100%)
    Total: 59
    Invincible: 1-55

    Ledge Roll (<100%)
    Total: 49
    Invincible: 1-34

    Ledge Roll (>100%)
    Total: 79
    Invincible: 1-62

    Ledge Attack (<100%)
    Total: 54
    Invulnerable: 1-21
    Hit: 25-34

    Ledge Attack (>100%)
    Total: 69
    Invincible: 1-53
    Hit: 57-59

    Ledge Jump (<100%)
    Total: 57
    Invincible: 1-14
    Soonest FF: 39

    Ledge Jump (>100%)
    Total: 57
    Invincible: 1-19
    Soonest FF: 44

    Miscellaneous

    Dash becomes Run: 12
    Turn-jump Threshold: 14
    Run turnaround: 24
    Landing Lag: 4

    Taunt
    Total: 114
    Heh!: 2
    Whoosh 1: 18
    Whoosh 2: 76

     
    #1 Bones0, Mar 27, 2011
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2016
  2. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    Even though I can see it is still being fixed as I speak, kudos for the effort.

    I already have both stratocaster's system bookmarked along with the SDM frame data stuff bookmarked, but it's an easier way for players to find the frame data specifically for a character like this.
     
  3. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    dude, fair has a blatantly superior hitbox to nair... why dont we use it?
     
  4. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    N-Air

    Total: 49
    Hit: 4-31
    IASA: 42
    Auto cancel: <3 37>
    Landlag: 15
    Lcanceled: 7

    F-Air

    Total: 59
    Hit: 6-8, 16-18, 24-26, 33-35, 43-45
    IASA: 53
    Auto cancel: <5 49>
    Landlag: 22
    Lcanceled: 11



    Fair has big gaps, is laggier, comes out slower and doesnt hit below too well.
     
    N0PE likes this.
  5. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    right, but it covers way more space in front of and slightly above you and the first hit has pretty useful knockback, so... why dont we use it?
     
  6. SpaceFalcon

    SpaceFalcon
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2007
    Messages:
    1,714
    Location:
    604
    i **** you all at this game.
     
  7. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    because when you normally approach people with falco, they arent above you. Theyre either in sheild or on the ground from the pressure.

    Think about when players normally fair now: when they opponent is already in the air, exactly where its good.



    Why dont we approach with it?

    It's slower to start and finish, thus you have much more chance to be sheild grabbed out of it during or after it. It doesn't hit as low, thus it needs to be timed really well to hit a lot of short characters. It has gaps so again more timing issues.

    If you think it's better then go for it, you'll notice shortly after it really just isn't that useful of a move to use in as many situations as nair or dair.



    I don't see how it looks better, the hitbox looks bigger yes, but thats the ONLY thing that looks better for it. The size doesnt matter if it doesnt hit the right areas in the first place.
     
  8. Strong Bad

    Strong Bad
    Expand Collapse
     

    • Moderator
    • Premium
    • Back Roomer
    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    24,183
    Location:
    Oakland, CA

    Pretty much all of the apparent hitbox that Fair has that's above Falco is due to hitbox dragging. The effective hitbox would be significantly smaller if you were nearing the peak of a jump.
     
  9. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    Exactly

    It is still higher up than Nair, but really it's just not as useful as you think it is FoxLisk. I think you're just looking at the pictures and not the numbers (cause the numbers aint there yet!)

    Also bones: i might actually start gathering some more specific frame data as in sheildstun length for certain attacks. I just realised that SDM's stuff doesn't cover that and i'd love to use that info personally.
     
  10. Bones0

    Bones0
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2005
    Messages:
    11,052
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Yeah, definitely man. You can just PM me whatever frame data you gather, and I'll add it in the thread. I will credit you obviously. I should be able to finish up adding SDM's frame data tomorrow after my morning class.
     
  11. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    you guys are nuts and seriously overreacted to my post and still havent answered my actual question of, 'why dont we use it?'
     
  12. SSBM_or_GTFO

    SSBM_or_GTFO
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Apprentice

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Messages:
    92
    Redact DID answer your question. :/
     
    N0PE and oboeotaku like this.
  13. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    oh my god you guys are idiots
     
  14. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    Please explain, or don't post
     
  15. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    the fair has a great hitbox in front of and slightly above falco. so we should use it when our opponents are in that position instead of always using nair.

    your responses were ilke.

    "but nair is faster"

    "but nair is harder to shieldgrab" which shows a special lack of comprehension

    "it's not as good as you think it is" when i hadnt said anything except that we should use fair.

    i never said to replace all nairs with fairs or something insane like that. it has a really good hitbox at that point, combos well sometimes, and we should use it. but then i dont give a **** what y'all do, i've been working on implementing it into my game and you can go on about the numbers not being there if you like.
     
    Krax_ likes this.
  16. SSBM_or_GTFO

    SSBM_or_GTFO
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Apprentice

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2011
    Messages:
    92
    Go to Youtube.

    Find a match with PPs Falco.

    Watch how he uses Fair.

    Learn.
     
    Krax_ likes this.
  17. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    Dunno what you’re on about, fair is already used in those situations by a decent amount of falco players, some of the more old school influenced falco's don’t use it but I see it plenty.



    Seeing as you don’t care what we all do, it probably is why you don't realize that a decent amount of falco players already use it in the situations as you describe.

    You have to realize everyone has their own style, if you think the move is better then use it, there will always be haters for any style. Use what is best for you, not for someone else.



    With your first post in mind... am I supposed to magically know you mean in CERTAIN situations we should use fair instead of nair?

    When someone says "A is blatantly better than B, why don’t we use A?" I'm pretty sure everyone will assume that the person wants to completely replace B with A.



    But long story short, your posts were poorly explained and thus we could only assume you meant to completely replace nair with fair, which would be silly.

    Please explain your posts next time before you say I lack comprehension.
     
    oboeotaku likes this.
  18. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    i hate all of you
     
    Krax_ and 210stuna like this.
  19. Dr Peepee

    Dr Peepee
    Expand Collapse
    Building Drive....

    • Moderator
    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2007
    Messages:
    26,161
    Location:
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Ha cool I was thinking about approaching with Fair more today.
     
  20. Bones0

    Bones0
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2005
    Messages:
    11,052
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Real men approach with reverse bairs. The look on your opponent's face alone makes it worthwhile. :awesome:
     
  21. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    Ran out of time to do much testing (took me so long to get it all figured out and working)

    but Fair creates 6 frames of block stun (this is after the hitstun has finished) then takes 11 frames to recover

    11-6 = 5

    when done dead set perfectly, there is a gap of 5 frames for the opponent to punish from sheild

    some characters can punish it even when done perfectly

    you'll probably just get grabbed by everyone though (7 frame gap), or up+b OoS'd


    I don't really advise you try to approach with fair, get blocked once and unless you get it perfect you'll get grabbed
     
  22. Strong Bad

    Strong Bad
    Expand Collapse
     

    • Moderator
    • Premium
    • Back Roomer
    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    24,183
    Location:
    Oakland, CA

    I can calculate shieldstun based on the damage, so don't bother.

    LOL @ FoxLisk failing to make a point then going the route of insulting anyone who responds in disagreement.
     
  23. Mogwai

    Mogwai
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Gizmo

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    10,449
    Location:
    I want to expect better of you, but I know not to

    This thread rapes, I'm probably gonna sticky it for prosperity.
     
  24. FoxLisk

    FoxLisk
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,851
    i didnt fail to make a point. all i was saying was that people should look into using fair, because dr pp is pretty much the only one who uses it at all that i've ever seen. they then wildly misinterpreted my post and told me fair sucks,t hen when i said i think it has its uses they did a 180 and told me everyone already uses fair.... if anyone had said something like "why do you think that?" or even "i hope you dont mean just replacing nair with fair, but yeah, it has some uses" that would have been fine, i got attacked first though.

    anyway, already been warned for this, no need to get infracted. thanks a ton for the images/data, this is cool stuff.
     
  25. Dr Peepee

    Dr Peepee
    Expand Collapse
    Building Drive....

    • Moderator
    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2007
    Messages:
    26,161
    Location:
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Who said they'd be shielding?
     
  26. Bones0

    Bones0
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2005
    Messages:
    11,052
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    I wonder if you can auto-cancel a fair onto the top plat of any stages... >.>
     
  27. Mogwai

    Mogwai
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Gizmo

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    10,449
    Location:
    I want to expect better of you, but I know not to

    na, but fullhop fair onto top plats is sexy as hell.
     
  28. Redact

    Redact
    Expand Collapse
    Professional Nice Guy

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,812
    Location:
    Amazing Land
    Can you please do that then? i really want to see it all personally
     
  29. Mogwai

    Mogwai
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Gizmo

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    10,449
    Location:
    I want to expect better of you, but I know not to

    It technically depends on move staleness as well.
     
  30. Bones0

    Bones0
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2005
    Messages:
    11,052
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Do moves stale on shields, or only when they actually hit and do damage?
     
  31. Mogwai

    Mogwai
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Gizmo

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    10,449
    Location:
    I want to expect better of you, but I know not to

    i actually don't know, I've never really concerned myself with moves staling.
     
  32. theunabletable

    theunabletable
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Lord

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,796
    Location:
    SoCal
    if you don't do the fair perfectly, your opponent will shieldgrab it at their own frame-perfect opportunity and then you'll be grabbed.
     
  33. MasterC

    MasterC
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Ace

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    692
    Location:
    Seattle
    this thread is disgustingly sexy
     
  34. Walt

    Walt
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Ace

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2007
    Messages:
    894
    Location:
    Concord, CA
    Just a notice from the Falcon Forums: **** YOU FALCOS BAIR
     
  35. Vex Kasrani

    Vex Kasrani
    Expand Collapse
    Brawl Backroom Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,824
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Great thread!
     
  36. Wenbobular

    Wenbobular
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Hero

    Joined:
    May 26, 2006
    Messages:
    5,744
    Short hop pivot Bair approach
     
  37. Bones0

    Bones0
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2005
    Messages:
    11,052
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    Pivoting into bairs feels weird. I think I'm the only Falco on the planet who shine-turn-around sh bairs for approaches sometimes. :|
     
  38. Beautiful Death

    Beautiful Death
    Expand Collapse
    Smash Journeyman

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2010
    Messages:
    238
    Location:
    Dudechorage, AK
    Hello yellow!

    I looooovvveeee frame data! Mmmmmmm......yeah. Frame data. I don't know why more people don't dig this stuff. Just a measurement of time, really. I think.

    Anyway. Question. It's about shield stun. Well actually, I'm really just looking for frame advantage/disadvantage. Yeah yeah. I've looked at Super Doodle Dude's data sheets and stuff a billion times, but I don't see any pluses or minuses, see. And I suppose I could just get a "feel" for it or whatever, but if I just had the numbers I could call it a day and get to the real meat and potatoes since I like never play against people in this game nowadays and Smash doesn't really have a good training mode for testing stuff. Compared to traditional fighting games like SF, Blaz, GG, etc.

    So.

    1. Is there anyone that could tell me the frame disadvantage of his attacks? Aerials are the important thing here, of course. I suppose just knowing shield stun would be fine. Of course, I am just calling it frame DISadvantage because well, I highly doubt Falco or many characters at all have frame advantage on their moves. That would just be CRAZY, man. Although, I think Peach might. So Peachy.

    2. If not, how might I look into it myself? I think I read someone saying they can find shield stun from the damage the attack deals. Is this so?

    And so on and so on. I dunno man. I hate doing weird stuff like holding down shield on a second controller with my toe or something and stuff and stuff. And I don't have AR.

    HALP
     
  39. GimR

    GimR
    Expand Collapse
    GimR, Co-Founder of VGBootCamp

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2006
    Messages:
    5,634
    Location:
    Maryland
    NNID:
    VGBC_GimR
    I need some help with frame Data!

    Could any one tell me Falco's frame advantage on hit and shield after he perfectly short hop fast falls a laser?(He lands a soon as the laser comes out)
    I have no way of going through melee frame by frame.

    For hit just have falco and the opponent shield and see how long it takes for the opponent to put their shield up after falco

    For shield, have Falco shield and see how long it takes for opponent to be able to spot dodge

    Please help, thanks
     
  40. Strong Bad

    Strong Bad
    Expand Collapse
     

    • Moderator
    • Premium
    • Back Roomer
    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    24,183
    Location:
    Oakland, CA

    If the move goes into hitlag, it stales. Hitting shields, hitting a turnip, Boomerang, those 3 parts of Brinstar, etc. all stale moves.
    [collapse=Shieldstun by damage]Damage . Melee
    --------------------------------------------
    00 ......... 1
    01 ......... 2
    02 ......... 2
    03 ......... 3
    04 ......... 3
    05 ......... 4
    06 ......... 4
    07 ......... 5
    08 ......... 5
    09 ......... 6
    10 ......... 6
    11 ......... 6
    12 ......... 7
    13 ......... 7
    14 ......... 8
    15 ......... 8
    16 ......... 9
    17 ......... 9
    18 ......... 10
    19 ......... 10
    20 ......... 10
    21 ......... 11
    22 ......... 11
    23 ......... 12
    24 ......... 12
    25 ......... 13
    26 ......... 13
    27 ......... 14
    28 ......... 14
    29 ......... 14
    30 ......... 15
    31 ......... 15
    32 ......... 16
    33 ......... 16
    34 ......... 17
    35 ......... 17[/collapse]

    If the attack is Electric, you'll need to do some math for the hitlag frame advantage (shine I'll just tell you that it gets 2 extra frames of frame advantage from electric hitlag, add that to the 3-5 frames of shieldstun based on how stale it is to figure that out). You should be able to use SDM's frame data for the rest of the work.
    Information courtesy of Magus420.


    Assuming fresh:
    On shield:
    3 frames of shieldstun, 4 frames of hitlag. +7
    Falco lands. -4
    On shield: +3.

    On hit:
    4 frames of hitlag. +4
    Falco lands. -4
    On hit: 0.
     

Share This Page

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)

We know you don't like ads
Why not buy Premium?