Evolution is true? (macro evolution)

[Overswarm]

Did he just spell jesus with a z? lol ^_^

Now, I've lead a pretty good life. I've never done illegal drugs, never been in trouble with the police, I help people out whenever they ask, I donate to charities, that kind of thing. A few months ago, there was a priest discovered in England to be a pedophile. He had sexually abused a child who had attended his sermons frequently (somehow, the deluded parents let the priest take the child on holiday AFTER they had found out.) So, just because this priest believes in something even though he's done one of the most disgraceful things known to man, he has more of a right to be rewarded in the afterlife then me? This is some twisted logic. The guy can repent all he want, but the fact remains that he still ruined a young boy's life.

Zoom out. You're thinking on a human basis. Assuming God is real, do you really think he has the same value system as you do? Especially when a human's time on the planet is just a tiny speck in the history our planet already has?

 

[manhunter098]

Did he just spell jesus with a z? lol ^_^



Zoom out. You're thinking on a human basis. Assuming God is real, do you really think he has the same value system as you do? Especially when a human's time on the planet is just a tiny speck in the history our planet already has?

Its interesting the whole we dont understand what god is thinking type of thing. But people in the bible did converse with god did they not? They could understand what he meant too. I dont see why god would give us some cryptic bible to unravel when he quite clearly told Abraham what to do and Abraham had no problems understanding. You are of course assuming that we cant understand what god tells us, which would make god setting up rules to live by kind of pointless if we cant understand them.

 

[Tactical]

Zoom out. You're thinking on a human basis. Assuming God is real, do you really think he has the same value system as you do? Especially when a human's time on the planet is just a tiny speck in the history our planet already has?

"A different value system" sounds like a misleading cop-out. Obviously he has a "different value system," everyone does. The priest in the previous example had a different value system from the nice guy, that didn't make him anywhere close to right in what he did or accepted.

From what can be gathered God is *really* narcissistic, as exampled by the largest wrong you can possibly do is not blindly praising him according to Christian texts. Calling God "good" is laughable. (not saying you did, just putting it out there)

 

[RDK]

The whole "we don't know the mind of God" argument is complete and utter bull****.

So I guess then you can throw all reasoning and rationality out the window, because you yourself are using some type of reasoning, however idiotic, to rationalize the unbelievable and downright dicky things God does.

If God is unquestionable, as you assume he is, then just outright say so instead of pussyfooting around the matter. Admit to what you're actually trying to say.

And Jona, it'd be nice if you actually took the time to reply to some of our posts instead of jumping into the thread and muttering some random platitude.

 

[cj.Shark]

as long as there will be questions unanswerable by science there will be a god.
yeah that about sums it up

 

[ROOOOY!]

Zoom out. You're thinking on a human basis. Assuming God is real, do you really think he has the same value system as you do? Especially when a human's time on the planet is just a tiny speck in the history our planet already has?

If sexual abusement of children isn't on God's 'no-no' list, then religion is waaay more ****ed up than I thought.

Yes, I know it's a very cliched argument, but it's still valid. In the end, we're supposedly all judged, so there has to be some kind of 'value system.' What are the requirements of being allowed in?

 

[Crimson King]

god doesnt hate you.
god is not an imaginary, question: were you a real christian? did you believe with all your heart and accepted jesus christ in your life?
if so, if you really believe you should feel his presence and support, it will make you feel stronger when you want to give up.
if you want i can show you some sentences from the bible about it.

sorry for my bad english

What? I prayed every day. I went to church twice a week. I studied the bible, and I avoid sin. The reason I felt no presence is because there is no god. I was praying to an imaginary nothing, and in the end, it proved to be a waste of time.

 

[Tactical]

as long as people fear death there will be a god.
yeah that about sums it up

Fixed for ya

 

[taste_the_beast]

Inorite? And D: that murderer/rapist/sex-addict/drug-dealer/pedophile deserves to go to Heaven because he believes in God...[/sarcasm]

At any rate, seconded...I find it petty that God would send a perfectly good person doing good in the world to hell just because they don't believe in Him, and yet, He'd send a career criminal to heaven because they DO...

I also find that if God does indeed exist, that he's beyond sadistic...He "tests" His children by killing them in slow and painful ways? And don't forget the story of Job...God made the poor guy's life a living hell just to win a bet against Satan...

In all honesty, if God does exist, and the Bible does speak the truth about Him, I'd rather go to hell than praise such an egocentric and sadistic creature...

no, all those people doing bad things has to seek for forgiveness. and if they do and start living by the word of god and do what they are suspose to do then yes they will go to heaven. the perfect little people your tlking about that dont belive in him, well, there not so perfect if their not believing in god.

but what about the people who never hear about God?

Im pretty sure EVERYONE knows, or hears about god somehow. If your tlking about like toddlers or baby's then theyll go to heaven automatically if they die at that age because they do not know right from wrong.

 

[Transient]

I haven't read most of this thread ( was at smash tournaments) and plan to just visit this occasionally....


-Anyways-


There's a passage in Romans and a couple others that kind of explains that. It talks about how you can perceive God simply by looking at his creation. Kind of how you could look at a sword and say "Wow, this was made by a great blacksmith" or a painting and realize the painter's talent.... except on a grander, more personal scale. There could be other ways, I'm completely unsure.

This does, however, lead me to believe that the notion of "believing in God" isn't necessarily saying "I believe in you God", but something more complex. It is said repeatedly in the Bible though that good deeds alone do not get you into heaven. Besides, the "curing cancer" and "donating money" stuff is based off of your principles, not God's. You could put in overtime at your work and your boss might love you, but your wife won't.... so you have to pick who you'd want to impress. Are you trying to impress God, other humans, or yourself when you list off your "good deeds"?

It's stated pretty clearly that denying God is something that won't look good on the record books, but I do wonder about how those that are unable to speak about God in words would be judged since actions themselves are not the only way to get into heaven. Granted, speaking one of many languages isn't special... and thought processes, feelings, etc., could be considered another language... but I dunno. Haven't thought about it enough.

So OS, you're basically saying that God is too great of a concept for anyone to understand.

Just like the concept of keeping Metaknight in tournaments is too great of a concept for you to understand :D

Couldn't resist.

 

[Overswarm]

"A different value system" sounds like a misleading cop-out. Obviously he has a "different value system," everyone does. The priest in the previous example had a different value system from the nice guy, that didn't make him anywhere close to right in what he did or accepted.

From what can be gathered God is *really* narcissistic, as exampled by the largest wrong you can possibly do is not blindly praising him according to Christian texts. Calling God "good" is laughable. (not saying you did, just putting it out there)

The idea that people are inherently worth something and "equal" to one another is a new concept, and is ********. People are not equal. It is not a black mark on God for him to say "I'm prefect and you are beneath me".

 

[kataklysm336]

hmm you know what according to the Bible God doesnt listen to a sinners prayer.

only if the sinner repents and asks that Jesus come into his heart, then God wil begin to listen.

i hope all the "studies" the scientists did were with actualy devoted christians. if not then it was a waste of time.

my girlfriends dad had cancer before he came to our church. he could barely walk. he used like a cane or something to walk. after 2 years of being in church he has no cancer. coincidence?

another woman in my church had cancer. this was about a year ago. she took kimo and all her hair fell out. now she has no cancer and her hair is growing back. coincidence?

a preacher came to our church about a month ago, and prayed for the sick. he has the gift of healing i believe.

about 3 people had back problems, healed on the spot.

there were a few women with ovaries pain all the time, healed on the spot.

there were a few other people who were healed to right there. all coincidence?

the same preacher came yesterday and cast out demons from 2 people.

you should have seen it. demons are real. the womens body shaking on the floor as the demons were cast out. sounds crazy right? its Biblical. the 2 women are normal women, actually one is around 18 or 19 and she has come to church before but she started to leave slowly. she came back yesterday and every demon inside her was cast out. the other woman who is around 45ish instantly took off her necklaces or "chains" as it made her feel chained. she began to cry and accepted Jesus.

you see you need to pray to God to cast out demons, you must pray in the name of Jesus.

not anyone can do this. it is a gift from God. you have to be mentally and spiritually ready.

you cannot honestly believe that answered prayers are coincidences.

Things like this literally make me angry when I read them. I always thought it was a skill that humans had to connect LOGICAL things together, but apparently some people do not possess this skill.

The man had cancer and came to your church and was healed? Did he just stand up when he walked through the door and say "No more cancer!", or was he there for a while and then gradually got better. Hmm did it ever occur to you that maybe just maybe he was taking medicine and the cancer went away?

And she took chemo and her hair fell out...and then it grew back...what kind of miracle is that?! You know that happens anyway right? That reminds me of one time I had a bad haircut, but I prayed to God for it to come back and what do you know a few months later it had grown back! Coincidence? I think not.

And yes sometimes people do get cured of cancer, it depends on the type of cancer and how far along it is. And even sometimes if it is advanced there is still a chance. Chemotherapy and other forms of treatment can be applied to kill the cancerous cells.

I'm not even going to say anything about the demons. You must have been a fan of the Exorcist as a child.

If you preacher really has this "gift" from god, then please, take a video camera and video tape him regrowing someone's arm, or leg, or you know what just decapitate someone right there and then regrow their head.

 

[jellis186]

no, all those people doing bad things has to seek for forgiveness. and if they do and start living by the word of god and do what they are suspose to do then yes they will go to heaven. the perfect little people your tlking about that dont belive in him, well, there not so perfect if their not believing in god.





Im pretty sure EVERYONE knows, or hears about god somehow. If your tlking about like toddlers or baby's then theyll go to heaven automatically if they die at that age because they do not know right from wrong.

Stop right there, because when you say God you are referring to the Judeo Christian God. Of course people hear about Gods all of the time, every major culture has its own pantheon. But these people who never hear of Jehovah, yet live great and respectable lives do they get to go to heaven?

 

[taste_the_beast]

Things like this literally make me angry when I read them. I always thought it was a skill that humans had to connect LOGICAL things together, but apparently some people do not possess this skill.

The man had cancer and came to your church and was healed? Did he just stand up when he walked through the door and say "No more cancer!", or was he there for a while and then gradually got better. Hmm did it ever occur to you that maybe just maybe he was taking medicine and the cancer went away?

And she took chemo and her hair fell out...and then it grew back...what kind of miracle is that?! You know that happens anyway right? That reminds me of one time I had a bad haircut, but I prayed to God for it to come back and what do you know a few months later it had grown back! Coincidence? I think not.

And yes sometimes people do get cured of cancer, it depends on the type of cancer and how far along it is. And even sometimes if it is advanced there is still a chance. Chemotherapy and other forms of treatment can be applied to kill the cancerous cells.

I'm not even going to say anything about the demons. You must have been a fan of the Exorcist as a child.

If you preacher really has this "gift" from god, then please, take a video camera and video tape him regrowing someone's arm, or leg, or you know what just decapitate someone right there and then regrow their head.

your not gonna say anything about the demons cause you have nothing to back that up and you know its probably true, but for some reason to scared to belive it, like alot of people..

 

[RDK]

This is like a ******** version of the Debate Hall.

Honestly, not one of you in the last few pages has posted anything worth responding to.

 

[taste_the_beast]

This is like a ******** version of the Debate Hall.

Honestly, not one of you in the last few pages has posted anything worth responding to.

Are you a christian??

 

[RDK]

Are you a christian??

Most definetely not.

Forgive me, I should have pointed out that when I said "not one of you" in my post, I was referring to the people who continue to argue for the religious side.

 

[taste_the_beast]

Most definetely not.

Are you of any Religion?

 

[kataklysm336]

your not gonna say anything about the demons cause you have nothing to back that up and you know its probably true, but for some reason to scared to belive it, like alot of people..

This might get me a warning but... You MUST be ********. Seriously I cannot even believe the words I just read. If you are truly serious then I am just convinced that you must have some kind of mental disability that stop you from being intelligent in anyway at all.

With that said the reason I wasn't going to say anything was because any person with a logical mind would just have to read that statement and they would realize that it was stupid. So I was not going to waste the energy that it took to move my fingers across the keyboard to explain something everyone already knows.

I know its probably true? Actually I KNOW quite the opposite, its probably bull****.
I have nothing to back that up? Will you please explain to me what I need to back up? Last time I checked it was up to people to prove that something happened based on evidence. It is not up to people to prove that something did not happen, when the thing they are disproving has been stated with a lack of evidence.

 

[taste_the_beast]

This might get me a warning but... You MUST be ********. Seriously I cannot even believe the words I just read. If you are truly serious then I am just convinced that you must have some kind of mental disability that stop you from being intelligent in anyway at all.

With that said the reason I wasn't going to say anything was because any person with a logical mind would just have to read that statement and they would realize that it was stupid. So I was not going to waste the energy that it took to move my fingers across the keyboard to explain something everyone already knows.

I know its probably true? Actually I KNOW quite the opposite, its probably bull****.
I have nothing to back that up? Will you please explain to me what I need to back up? Last time I checked it was up to people to prove that something happened based on evidence. It is not up to people to prove that something did not happen, when the thing they are disproving has been stated with a lack of evidence.

You cant look at chrisianity with a so called "Logical mind". theres stuff in chrisianity thats unbelievable and its suppose to be that way. Thats the thing about believing in god, he gives you free will. Its suppose to be hard its not suppose to easy and thats where your FAITH comes in and OBVIOUSLY faith is something you dont have

 

[kataklysm336]

You cant look at chrisianity with a so called "Logical mind". theres stuff in chrisianity thats unbelievable and its suppose to be that way. Thats the thing about believing in god, he gives you free will. Its suppose to be hard its not suppose to easy and thats where your FAITH comes in and OBVIOUSLY faith is something you dont have

...Then why did God give us rational thought, deductive reasoning, and other forms of instincts that allow us to choose between right and wrong? Oh its because he works in mysterious ways right? Or maybe there isn't a God and he didn't do any of that, and all of that logical stuff allows us to see that.

What does free will have to do with anything?

and yes faith is something I do not possess. I cannot bring myself to be stupid. I could replace the word God with anything, such as the Great Cricket, Charlie Brown, or even M2K, and you would not believe it, why? because its not logical to be believe that. It doesn't make sense...are you seeing where I'm going with this?

 

[jellis186]

You cant look at chrisianity with a so called "Logical mind". theres stuff in chrisianity thats unbelievable and its suppose to be that way. Thats the thing about believing in god, he gives you free will. Its suppose to be hard its not suppose to easy and thats where your FAITH comes in and OBVIOUSLY faith is something you dont have

THERE IT IS I WAS WAITING FOR IT. The all powerful creator who controls everything in the universe gives us free will. A logical fallacy even within the writings of Jesus.

Its a cold ******* who sends his son to die for everyone, and then ****s a man (Judas) for fulfilling his role in the plan of God.

 

[taste_the_beast]

...Then why did God give us rational thought, deductive reasoning, and other forms of instincts that allow us to choose between right and wrong? Oh its because he works in mysterious ways right? Or maybe there isn't a God and he didn't do any of that, and all of that logical stuff allows us to see that.

What does free will have to do with anything?

and yes faith is something I do not possess. I cannot bring myself to be stupid. I could replace the word God with anything, such as the Great Cricket, Charlie Brown, or even M2K, and you would not believe it, why? because its not logical to be believe that. It doesn't make sense...are you seeing where I'm going with this?

I see where your going and i can understand i guess why you think this but faith comes in again and my faith is in God. If you dont wanna believe it then thats your FREE WILL, Gods not gonna strike you dead right now because you dont belive in him but youll see one day and thats pretty much all i can say...

 

[Crimson King]

your not gonna say anything about the demons cause you have nothing to back that up and you know its probably true, but for some reason to scared to belive it, like alot of people..

Nothing to back it up? Scared to believe? Dude, I hope there are demons. I'd love to be possessed just to do that crazy wall-climbing **** (FYI: the priest I mentioned before said the Exorcist was MILD compared to real life).

But again, only people who are religious become possessed.

 

[taste_the_beast]

Nothing to back it up? Scared to believe? Dude, I hope there are demons. I'd love to be possessed just to do that crazy wall-climbing **** (FYI: the priest I mentioned before said the Exorcist was MILD compared to real life).

But again, only people who are religious become possessed.

Aiightt

 

[kataklysm336]

I see where your going and i can understand i guess why you think this but faith comes in again and my faith is in God. If you dont wanna believe it then thats your FREE WILL, Gods not gonna strike you dead right now because you dont belive in him but youll see one day and thats pretty much all i can say...

There are so many things wrong with this. To name them all would just be going back and forth into cliche debates that everyone has been having since the dawn of modern science.

Why do you believe in god, but not Allah, Yahew, Buddah, Vishnu, and others? Are your parents christians? Probably. Do you go to a christian church? Probably. Have you ever read the teachings of other religions? Probably not. Have you studied the many theories that govern out world? Probably not.

Your faith parallels your ignorance.

 

[Crimson King]

First, don't post like an idiot, hence the warning.

Secondly, prove to me an instance where someone who had no faith was possessed by demons, recovered, and became religious.

 

[taste_the_beast]

I never said that did happen

There are so many things wrong with this. To name them all would just be going back and forth into cliche debates that everyone has been having since the dawn of modern science.

Why do you believe in god, but not Allah, Yahew, Buddah, Vishnu, and others? Are your parents christians? Probably. Do you go to a christian church? Probably. Have you ever read the teachings of other religions? Probably not. Have you studied the many theories that govern out world? Probably not.

Your faith parallels your ignorance.

I havent been to church in soooo long, and Alah wich is the muslim god is basically the same as chrisianity jus the same as jewish is. Let me ask you a question, are you even of any religion??

 

[taste_the_beast]

Sorry I Didnt Mean To Double Post Accident Accident

 

[GoldShadow]

But again, only people who are religious become possessed.

When it happens to an extremely religious person, it's a "demon" or "possession". When it happens to anybody else, it's a seizure. In either case, taking Klonopin helps

 

[Xsyven]

I will celebrate the day when Christians stop using the Bible to debate.

IT DOESN'T WORK. NOT ONE BIT.

 

[spyran356]

What? I prayed every day. I went to church twice a week. I studied the bible, and I avoid sin. The reason I felt no presence is because there is no god. I was praying to an imaginary nothing, and in the end, it proved to be a waste of time.

hi,

that wasen´t the question.
anyway, you dont need to answer it on the forum, because i know what you will say.
ask it yourself.
i hope that you understand what i mean.

greetings

 

[taste_the_beast]

I will celebrate the day when Christians stop using the Bible to debate.

IT DOESN'T WORK. NOT ONE BIT.

I dont see how it dosent work, but ok..

 

[GoldShadow]

I dont see how it dosent work, but ok..

Clearly, you haven't read this thread.

 

[taste_the_beast]

Clearly, you haven't read this thread.

you know what, i guess not.

 

[Crimson King]

hi,

that wasen´t the question.
anyway, you dont need to answer it on the forum, because i know what you will say.
ask it yourself.
i hope that you understand what i mean.

greetings

I answered your question, and I have no idea what else you are talking about.

 

[RDK]

Has it ever entered your little fundie minds that demons being cast out of people only happen in church settings, in front of hundreds of people, and are usually very dramatic and overblown? How can the thought not enter your mind that those people are either paid to do that, or are convinced that they're really possessed to the point where they actually have a siezure?

And you guys still haven't addressed our posts about how faith healing is 100% bullspit.

 

[Deleted member]

If a man ran up to you and said that an invisible all-powerful being created him and all of humanity would you believe him?

Woah! I summed up Christianity in one sentence!

 

[Tactical]

I'm back

The idea that people are inherently worth something and "equal" to one another is a new concept, and is ********. People are not equal.

Wow, you just managed to give the finger to the foundation of the American gouvernment. That's almost impressive, in a f**ktarted kind of way.

It is not a black mark on God for him to say "I'm prefect and you are beneath me".

Well isn't he a nice guy? Regardless, no matter how "prefect" God is he is still an ***hole and seeing as His Word (see the Bible) states that he is good and loving it seems he is also a liar. Doesn't seem all that perfect to me, what about you? (If you need me to point out all of the retarted moments in the Bible I'de be happy to)

 

[curiousthoughtsbear]

hmmmm......"God" is an entirely relative notion. That "we," as in humans, agree on anything to deal with that concept/idea/thing is entirely contained within our own modes of thinking and interactions among each other. To go and believe that something is more capable/adept/intelligent/powerful(in whatever way) in the entire plane of our realities seems rational. However, to go and suppose the details of what or whom is represented by that notion should be acknowledged as an entirely human development. After all, anything that may be that notion of "God" is at the very least an interpretation if not a complete fabrication by persons/people.

Moreover to deal with the good/bad concept of that notion of "God," who are we to denounce others beliefs regarding enlightenment ? It doesn't matter what one has done/believes/ is doing, only that in their mind they are gaining understanding/enlightenment/"peace of mind." Any code of ethics/morals, as far as see, only exists to further human intentions and is not of some "divine design."



just 2 cents !