"Echo Characters"

[DarthEnderX]

And? There are a plethora of available weapons in Uprising, and he could've had a distinct moveset. But Sakurai opted to make him a quick clone instead. I'm not upset about it or anything, but he could have been a more interesting character if they'd dipped into the source material a bit more. Just like Ganon.

That is hardly the same thing. Dark Pit is, again, a literal clone of Pit. Even if he could have been given different weapons, he still looks and moves just like Pit.

Ganondorf is nothing like Captain Falcon. He's never had any moves like Captain Falcon. He's not even from the same FRANCHISE as Captain Falcon. And Sakurai has never done THAT, again.

 

[Dragon lord]

Well, they weren't afraid in brawl to Give Wolf like, every bloody move possible, they even put some of Links moves on Wolf, i really wanna know the guy that thought "yeah Sonic's Up Air would make a really good up smash too"

 

[AnOkayDM]

That is hardly the same thing. Dark Pit is, again, a literal clone of Pit. Even if he could have been given different weapons, he still looks and moves just like Pit.

Ganondorf is nothing like Captain Falcon. He's never had any moves like Captain Falcon. He's not even from the same FRANCHISE as Captain Falcon. And Sakurai has never done THAT, again.

Okay, while you're right, that wasn't my point. Ganon is the most extreme example, but there have been plenty of times a character could've been unique and was a clone instead. There have even been times he decided to add another variation on the same moveset. For goodness' sake, we now have four versions of Marth's moveset.

My point is that sometimes, what a character can or can't do (even if Shadow can roll into a ball) has no bearing on what ends up being done with them in these games.

 

[Dragon lord]

i think it's more about having the bear minimum, every clone has had there signature weaponry in some way (Yes even ganondorf seeing as he clearly uses Magic/The triforce of Power to enhance attacks), if someone like shadow became a echo he'd probably follow that rule, by most likely having a teleport up special as chaos control, possibly even chaos spear as a FS/Side Sepacial thats a Pesudo reskin of PK Fire

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

I think something important about clones and echoes is "archetype".

The two best examples are and . Every Link can be unique with various equipements, and they get more differences now, but they follow one thing, that I would call the "hero of time" archetype. Bow, Boomerang, Bombs and Spin Attack are all staples to the Zelda franchise.

Same goes for the space animals. While they have their own moves (Fox is faster, Falco is aerial, Wolf is more brutal), they all follow an archetype of Blaster, Reflector, Dash and "charge and go" recovery.

Even and were under the "PK family" according to Brawl's dojo.

Therefore you could say that go all under the "one-handed lord" archetype. Ike isn't that far from it too, with his chargeable Neutral-B and counter. Don't forget that echoes are bonuses, too. Lucina was one at least.

is a special case, an exception and not a rule. His popularity, build similar to Falcon and Spaceworld model allowed him to be in Smash. Maybe if he didn't punched the ground in OoT, the situation could be different.

Anyway, that's why characters such as Shadow, Dixie or Impa are considered as echoes. Thematically it works. For example, / Shadow would be the "hedgehog" archetype, / Impa as the Sheikah archetype, as the Mario Princess archetype, / Medusa as the Goddess archetype, and such.

 

[GoRa]

Uh, Shadow's always been able to roll into a ball, from his very first appearance:

View attachment 158777
To his latest playable appearance:
View attachment 158775

Lol I guess I'm just an idiot. I haven't played too many Sonic games, admittedly, but I didn't recall ever seeing him in a ball. I just remember playing as him in Sonic '06 and being weirded out by his moveset, and recall a similar experience in Shadow the Hedgehog. My bad.

 

[Blackwolf666]

I never enjoyed the idea of Funky Kong as DK's echo fighter but, it'd be worth it if they use "new funky mode" to advertise his inclusion.

 

[Camc10]

Lol I guess I'm just an idiot. I haven't played too many Sonic games, admittedly, but I didn't recall ever seeing him in a ball. I just remember playing as him in Sonic '06 and being weirded out by his moveset, and recall a similar experience in Shadow the Hedgehog. My bad.

Okay, you weren't wrong about 06 technically. Sonic can Shadow only every go into a ball for the Homing Attack, Spin Dash, and Bounce Attack (the latter 2 may have been Sonic exclusive in 06)

 

[JohannFKNFaust]

I'd agree, excluding characters who already have clones. I feel like we don't need echoes of both Mario and Dr. Mario, y'know?

I totally agree, I have seen a lot of noise for Dr. Luigi. I think that'd be quite unnecessary as Dr. Mario is a stand-in for Mario's moveset before FLUDD was turned into the

 

[GolisoPower]

So Vergeben said that Square-Enix is getting another character. As to whether it’s a unique character or an Echo, I’m not sure. So here’s my idea:

Tifa Lockhart: Echo Fighter for Little Mac!

Differences:
Neutral B is Beat Rush. Acts as a kind of Rekka. Goes the distance of a quarter-charged Straight Lunge, but can be mashed to punch four times to go the full distance. Limit Beat Rush has Tifa going the full distance.
Side B is Somersault. Only different in terms of animation. Limit Somersault tracks the position of the closest opponent within range and deals more damage on hit.
Up B is Dolphin Blow. Works similarly to rising uppercut, but summons a dolphin as a sort of projectile. Limit Dolphin Blow causes the dolphin to go in an arc and spike.
Down B is Limit Charge. Works similarly to Cloud’s, but instead of Finishing Touch, Tifa gains access to Meteor Strike, which grabs the opponent and throws them downwards, creating an explosion about the size of a Bomber.
Final Smash is Final Heaven. A straight-lunge that creates a giant Entei-style explosion that acts like a vertical Zero Laser spawning from the person hit.

 

[Blackwolf666]

How would everyone feel if the hero of twilight came in as Link's echo fighter?

 

[AnOkayDM]

How would everyone feel if the hero of twilight came in as Link's echo fighter?

There are already three versions of Link's moveset in this game, and we don't need a fourth.

But if we have to get one, then it should be the Hero's Shade. That gives TP some playable representation and he makes perfect sense as an echo, considering he's literally just a different Link.

 

[Fane]

A list of plausible Echoes on the base roster imo would be:

Shadow (Sonic)
Impa (Sheik)
Dixie Kong (Diddy Kong)
Isabelle (Villager)
Ninten (Ness)
Blood Falcon/Black Shadow (Captain Falcon)
Ken (Ryu)
Medusa (Palutena)
Louie (Olimar)

Other than them, I don't know if any others are in the realm of possibility.

 

[MrElectroG64]

Hey Guys, I was thinking about making another echo schematic (well actually two). I'm going to make one for Louie from the Pikmin series, which I'm no stranger to making if you've seen my previous moveset lol.

But for another one, I wanted to try my hand at Magnus from the Kid Icarus series. I originally thought he would be a perfect Ike echo, with a different recovery (which he would be, of course), but since I already really want Black Knight from the FE series to be the Ike echo, I decided to try and see who else he could echo reasonably. Which is where I thought of the idea that he could maybe be a Cloud echo instead! Now, this will obviously need some brainstorming, as there is a lot of stuff that Cloud can do that Magnus most likely can't (I don't know for sure yet, as I haven't played KI:U in a while, nor have I looked up all of the things Magnus can do yet). I figure the giant sword on Cloud would translated over really well with Magnus' Club/sword.
So what do you guys think? Could it work? Do you have any ideas for it? As I'd really like to go through with this, due to how interesting it would be. I figure that right from the getgo, a differing running animation and down special are needed, but what else could he have, do you think?

 

[plasmabeam]

So Vergeben said that Square-Enix is getting another character. As to whether it’s a unique character or an Echo, I’m not sure. So here’s my idea:

Tifa Lockhart: Echo Fighter for Little Mac!

Differences:
Neutral B is Beat Rush. Acts as a kind of Rekka. Goes the distance of a quarter-charged Straight Lunge, but can be mashed to punch four times to go the full distance. Limit Beat Rush has Tifa going the full distance.
Side B is Somersault. Only different in terms of animation. Limit Somersault tracks the position of the closest opponent within range and deals more damage on hit.
Up B is Dolphin Blow. Works similarly to rising uppercut, but summons a dolphin as a sort of projectile. Limit Dolphin Blow causes the dolphin to go in an arc and spike.
Down B is Limit Charge. Works similarly to Cloud’s, but instead of Finishing Touch, Tifa gains access to Meteor Strike, which grabs the opponent and throws them downwards, creating an explosion about the size of a Bomber.
Final Smash is Final Heaven. A straight-lunge that creates a giant Entei-style explosion that acts like a vertical Zero Laser spawning from the person hit.

Though I'm pulling for Squall, I love your idea of Tifa as a Mac Echo

 

[The Legendary Beast]

There are already three versions of Link's moveset in this game, and we don't need a fourth.

But if we have to get one, then it should be the Hero's Shade. That gives TP some playable representation and he makes perfect sense as an echo, considering he's literally just a different Link.

Don't play with my heart, I wanted him for Hyrule Warriors. even would've accepted a costume for Link in that game, heck I'd take a costume for Link in Smash at this point. Never going to happen unfortunately. But if it did?

Spoiler

Man, if Impa got in with her SS design (which I so so so want, please Sakurai!), I'd feel a bit bummed that TP isn't represented at all with a character. We went from all of them being TP reps to none at all. Don't get me wrong I'm SO happy with what they did, but it does feel like TP is missing, even weirder with it having a stage.

Still praying for costumes in this game. Please!

 

[fogbadge]

There are already three versions of Link's moveset in this game, and we don't need a fourth.

But if we have to get one, then it should be the Hero's Shade. That gives TP some playable representation and he makes perfect sense as an echo, considering he's literally just a different Link.

hes technically playable in 64 and melee

 

[Questionmark222]

Just dropping my expectations for the remaining echoes:

/Dixie - There's probably a considerable amount of Ballot support backing her up. Also, the fact that Chrom shares his Up B has put aside my biggest concern about Dixie's chances, being the assumption (that was destroyed by the August direct) that "an echo fighter has to be 1-to-1 to the original". This means that DK's Up B can easily be pasted on to Dixie's Hair Spin ability: then, give her the Gumball Popgun as a Neutral B and she's good to go.
/Isabelle - Her Assist is currently MIA, and she's arguably the most important Nintendo character that hasn't gotten into Smash as of right now (Toad aside). As for the "pacifist" argument, her facial expressions would just need a slight touch-up to make her look like she's dropping Villager's attacks by accident.
/Shadow - Obviously, his Assist is MIA as well. And since Richter broke the "3rd parties can't get echoes" fan rule...
/Ken - The OG echo. Historical significance right there.Also, Capcom seems very collaborative with Ultimate (given the Mega Man, Street Fighter and Monster Hunter content already in the game).

I know, I'm playing it pretty safe, but these four just seem to make the most sense ATM.

 

[Captain Shades]

Here’s some echos going from most likely to least

Most Likely
Shadow (Sonic echo)
Isabelle (Villager echo)
Black Knight (Ike echo)
Dixie Kong (Diddy Kong echo)
Mrs. Pac-Man (Pac-Man echo)
Ken (Ryu echo)

Medium/ Lower
Funky Kong (Donkey Kong echo)
Black Shadow (Captain Falcon echo)
Ninten (Ness echo)

 

[GoodGrief741]

I don’t think Black Knight and Mrs. Pac-Man are likelier than Dark Shadow and Ninten. With the latter two, you actually saw support during the ballot era and up until before E3. Mrs. Pac-Man showed up after Echoes were revealed to be a thing, and Black Knight after the last Direct when people started latching onto the ‘Heroes vs. Villains’ thing.

Black Knight could still potentially show up, being a decently popular character with the FE fandom, but it’s pretty far fetched to imagine him as an Ike Echo.

Mrs. Pac-Man would probably be so similar to Pac-Man she should probably just be a palette swap for him. The only reason people are considering her semi-seriously is because of how famous and influential her game was, but as a character she doesn’t offer anything.

 

[Aetheri]

As unlikely as it seems ideally I'd want Twili Midna as an echo for Zelda.

For a playable rep from TP it just has to be the Twilight Princess herself. Her assist trophy may be problematic but since its a different form she could still have a slight shot.

I know a lot of people have been wanting Hilda as a Zelda echo, but I find her to be far less interesting.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

As unlikely as it seems ideally I'd want Twili Midna as an echo for Zelda.

For a playable rep from TP it just has to be the Twilight Princess herself. Her assist trophy may be problematic but since its a different form she could still have a slight shot.

I know a lot of people have been wanting Hilda as a Zelda echo, but I find her to be far less interesting.

Absolutely!

Twilights Princess was one of my favorites, and I’m sad that there’s no representation for that game anymore. Midna’s incredibly popular for a one-off, and she had both forms playable in Hyrule Warriors. Plus then it could work with the imp as an assist.

All she’d need are darkness effects in the attacks, and then a Twilight creature summon. She could even use a sol in place of Din’s Fire.

 

[fogbadge]

As unlikely as it seems ideally I'd want Twili Midna as an echo for Zelda.

For a playable rep from TP it just has to be the Twilight Princess herself. Her assist trophy may be problematic but since its a different form she could still have a slight shot.

I know a lot of people have been wanting Hilda as a Zelda echo, but I find her to be far less interesting.

itd be simple enough, give all the specials the twilight magic effect and have the twilight mirror in place of the triforce of wisdom, not sure whod be instead of a phantom

personally i like them both

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Black Knight
Medusa
Shadow
Ken
Isabelle
Dixie Kong
Masked Man
Felix

These are the echos I am confident in right now, some much more than others.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I thought this topic would be distinct enough to warrant its own thread, but I guess I will discuss here.

When it comes to recent echo speculation, people point out echo ideas for currently revealed fighters like Shadow with Sonic, Isabelle with Villager, and Impa with Sheik. But what I do not see speculated frequently are echos of potential newcomers. Simon and his echo counterpart, Richter, opens the gate for these kinds of echos to happen. The discussion is starting to open with recent leaks of Isaac having a Felix echo and technically with Octolings to Inklings, but what about ideas like:

- Jill Valentine as an echo of Leon Kennedy. (Resident Evil)
- Prince Richard as Prince Sable's echo. (For the Frog the Bell Tolls)
- Alice being an echo of Balloon Fighter. (Balloon Trip)

It is a part of speculation I feel needs more discussion, which is why I made a thread about it earlier. What ideas do you have for echo fighters of potential newcomers?

 

[PeridotGX]

I thought this topic would be distinct enough to warrant its own thread, but I guess I will discuss here.

When it comes to recent echo speculation, people point out echo ideas for currently revealed fighters like Shadow with Sonic, Isabelle with Villager, and Impa with Sheik. But what I do not see speculated frequently are echos of potential newcomers. Simon and his echo counterpart, Richter, opens the gate for these kinds of echos to happen. The discussion is starting to open with recent leaks of Isaac having a Felix echo and technically with Octolings to Inklings, but what about ideas like:

- Jill Valentine as an echo of Leon Kennedy. (Resident Evil)
- Prince Richard as Prince Sable's echo. (For the Frog the Bell Tolls)
- Alice being an echo of Balloon Fighter. (Balloon Trip)

It is a part of speculation I feel needs more discussion, which is why I made this thread. What ideas do you have for echo fighters of potential newcomers?

Jammerjab for Bandana Dee
Zygarde for Lycanroc
Ashley for Kamek (or vice versa)
Lily for Maxwell (Scribblenauts)

 

[Aetheri]

I thought this topic would be distinct enough to warrant its own thread, but I guess I will discuss here.

When it comes to recent echo speculation, people point out echo ideas for currently revealed fighters like Shadow with Sonic, Isabelle with Villager, and Impa with Sheik. But what I do not see speculated frequently are echos of potential newcomers. Simon and his echo counterpart, Richter, opens the gate for these kinds of echos to happen. The discussion is starting to open with recent leaks of Isaac having a Felix echo and technically with Octolings to Inklings, but what about ideas like:

- Jill Valentine as an echo of Leon Kennedy. (Resident Evil)
- Prince Richard as Prince Sable's echo. (For the Frog the Bell Tolls)
- Alice being an echo of Balloon Fighter. (Balloon Trip)

It is a part of speculation I feel needs more discussion, which is why I made this thread. What ideas do you have for echo fighters of potential newcomers?

I believe it was talked about at least once in this thread...

I brought up Ribbon Girl as an echo of Spring Man coming in for DLC.

As for other newcomers I currently don't see any other feasible candidates who'd fit as echo fighters. But we could get a couple surprises so who knows.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

It is a part of speculation I feel needs more discussion, which is why I made this thread. What ideas do you have for echo fighters of potential newcomers?

Siegfried for Nightmare (Soul Calibur) would be a natural choice for me, considering they do have the whole light/dark side of the same person gimmick, but have evolved different styles since SCIII

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I thought this topic would be distinct enough to warrant its own thread, but I guess I will discuss here.

When it comes to recent echo speculation, people point out echo ideas for currently revealed fighters like Shadow with Sonic, Isabelle with Villager, and Impa with Sheik. But what I do not see speculated frequently are echos of potential newcomers. Simon and his echo counterpart, Richter, opens the gate for these kinds of echos to happen. The discussion is starting to open with recent leaks of Isaac having a Felix echo and technically with Octolings to Inklings, but what about ideas like:

- Jill Valentine as an echo of Leon Kennedy. (Resident Evil)
- Prince Richard as Prince Sable's echo. (For the Frog the Bell Tolls)
- Alice being an echo of Balloon Fighter. (Balloon Trip)

It is a part of speculation I feel needs more discussion, which is why I made this thread. What ideas do you have for echo fighters of potential newcomers?

Phoenix Wright with a Edgeworth echo would be amazing.

Even if ARMS content is only DLC, I think Ribbon Girl makes too much sense for a Springman echo. The marketing of ARMS made a real effort towards making Ribbon Girl have almost as much prominence as SpringMan.

Also i would love the idea of having Slippy as a unique character and Peppy as an echo, something about having the whole Star Fox team would be satisfying.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Phoenix Wright with a Edgeworth echo would be amazing.

I want this so badly right now. If we get that alongside Layton with a Descole echo, that would be the greatest!

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

I don't understand the need for so many damn echo fighters. It's bloating the roster size. At least make them semi-clones to make things more interesting. Dark samus could use some phazon attacks for her smash attacks for example. Or dark pit (or pit) should have pits brawl moveset.

And how many more are we gona get? Dial it back please. I get they take a bit less man power to make, but it still takes quite a lot of time and energy. You have to make a model, rig it, make custom animations, make slight coding changes. Take that time to make a new character instead of 4 echos. Unless the echos have significant changes like a Ryu and Ken situation, they're kinda a waste of space.

 

[SonicMario]

Phoenix Wright with a Edgeworth echo would be amazing.

Even if ARMS content is only DLC, I think Ribbon Girl makes too much sense for a Springman echo. The marketing of ARMS made a real effort towards making Ribbon Girl have almost as much prominence as SpringMan.

Also i would love the idea of having Slippy as a unique character and Peppy as an echo, something about having the whole Star Fox team would be satisfying.

Spring Man with Ribbon Girl coming in as an Echo is why I think it's possible DLC will include character packs that are related in some way in either they're from the same series, echo of the newcomer, and/or a theme of the pack. Spring Man could come with Ribbon Girl to make a "2 fighters for the price of one!" kind of deal. I could see them being the first DLC character to kind of set the tone for how DLC will go and there may be future character packs like it.

My absolute dream scenario is we get a unique or semi-clone Tails packaged with Shadow who would be Sonic's echo. But I know Shadow fans would rather he's in the base game. But I'm just thinking it'd make both fans of whichever they prefer happy (Well ok, maybe some Shadow fans would be unhappy he's an echo while Tails gets the better treatment. But either way it's 3 Sonic characters in one Smash game. Hardly anything for Sonic fans to complain about). And those who don't like the thought of having Sonic having 3 characters in their game can just choose not to buy the Tails + Shadow pack.

If they do character packs, what would you guys like? The echo does not have to be of the newcomer you choose in the pack as I showed with my example of my most wanted potential character pack. And they don't have to be from the same series if you can find a common theme among them.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

Spring Man with Ribbon Girl coming in as an Echo is why I think it's possible DLC will include character packs that are related in some way in either they're from the same series, echo of the newcomer, and/or a theme of the pack. Spring Man could come with Ribbon Girl to make a "2 fighters for the price of one!" kind of deal. I could see them being the first DLC character to kind of set the tone for how DLC will go and there may be future character packs like it.

My absolute dream scenario is we get a unique or semi-clone Tails packaged with Shadow who would be Sonic's echo. But I know Shadow fans would rather he's in the base game. But I'm just thinking it'd make both fans of whichever they prefer happy (Well ok, maybe some Shadow fans would be unhappy he's an echo while Tails gets the better treatment. But either way it's 3 Sonic characters in one Smash game. Hardly anything for Sonic fans to complain about). And those who don't like the thought of having Sonic having 3 characters in their game can just choose not to buy the Tails + Shadow pack.

If they do character packs, what would you guys like? The echo does not have to be of the newcomer you choose in the pack as I showed with my example of my most wanted potential character pack. And they don't have to be from the same series if you can find a common theme among them.

"The Shady Smashers" Echo Pack:

 

[Blackwolf666]

=

=

 

[GoodGrief741]

=

=

How would Paper Mario work as an Echo of anyone?

 

[AnOkayDM]

How would Paper Mario work as an Echo of anyone?

Poorly. Paper Mario would absolutely need to be his own character. I've resigned myself to never seeing him in the game though.

 

[AlphaSSB]

The only 'Echo' characters I have any real interest in are James McCloud for Fox, Shadow for Sonic, and Impa for Sheik. Though I would be more that okay for an Isabelle clone of Villager, I feel her getting in could go either way, being either unique or a clone.

Also i would love the idea of having Slippy as a unique character and Peppy as an echo, something about having the whole Star Fox team would be satisfying.

I never considered this. You'd have to adjust their body structures a bit, but I can see this working. Now I want it.

Unfortunately, the only way I really see this happening would be if Slippy was the 'Sakurai surprise' character, and just decided to add in Peppy so we'd have the whole team. Which in itself if pretty unlikely, since the Star Fox series hasn't gotten anything new outside of redesigns and maybe three music tracks. (14 in Smash 4, at least 17 in Smash Ultimate.)

 

[GoRa]

I thought this topic would be distinct enough to warrant its own thread, but I guess I will discuss here.

When it comes to recent echo speculation, people point out echo ideas for currently revealed fighters like Shadow with Sonic, Isabelle with Villager, and Impa with Sheik. But what I do not see speculated frequently are echos of potential newcomers. Simon and his echo counterpart, Richter, opens the gate for these kinds of echos to happen. The discussion is starting to open with recent leaks of Isaac having a Felix echo and technically with Octolings to Inklings, but what about ideas like:

- Jill Valentine as an echo of Leon Kennedy. (Resident Evil)
- Prince Richard as Prince Sable's echo. (For the Frog the Bell Tolls)
- Alice being an echo of Balloon Fighter. (Balloon Trip)

It is a part of speculation I feel needs more discussion, which is why I made a thread about it earlier. What ideas do you have for echo fighters of potential newcomers?

Nero for Dante (Devil May Cry) lol

 

[praline]

The only echo fighters I can think of are mostly for characters that aren’t yet playable. Black Knight would be great for Ike though.

 

[BonafideFella]

Tatanga as a Bowser Jr. Echo. It's possibly the last choice for an Echo anyone has on their mind, but it would fit the clown car archetype.