Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

Yeah holy bananas 3rd parties with Mii Costumes in previous packs are back on the table now for sure! Heihachi came with Min Min but Kazuya came anyhow. Yet another "fan rule" broken.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So does anyone know what Kazuya's pallet swaps in Tekken are? Wait. Does Tekken have pallet swaps or is it like Pokkén Tournament where they only recolor your character in mirror matches?

Are we going to have the return of the aggressively muted and barely different pallet swaps again?

 

[3BitSaurus]

So, Kazuya was not someone I expected. Not that Tekken doesn't deserve it - it was one of the biggest japanese franchises that didn't have a playable rep yet - but I legitimately thought the Heihachi costume was a death sentence because it came with Min Min. That said, even if I'm not big on Tekken, I'm kinda excited!

And with this, I'm doubling down on Octoling being last. If Heihachi's returning costume wasn't a hit against Kazuya, neither should the Squid Sisters be a hit against Octoling.

Sadly, I think this is it for most western reps. I just can't see Smash ending with one, especially if they're from a huge franchise. I'd be glad to be wrong (see my signature), but I don't think it's happening.

Copied over from CET:

One notable thing that sticks out to me is Ubisoft, which as a company has often been met with skepticism thanks to the Miis. Now that Kazuya has chucked that idea off a cliff, I think we're open to talk about them freely.

So how about it. What Ubisoft characters would you like to see, what have they got going for them, and what can they bring?

Like I said before, I just don't see it, but if you put a gun to my head, I'd predict Ezio. I'd much rather have Rayman tbh, but with his status in Japan, I can't see him being revealed on his own, much less as the last character.

 

[Inferno7]

You know I said that I thought today was do or die for at least Shadow (Other Sonic characters could go either way I guess), and I was gonna give up even if there was Single reveal.

I change my mind though. As long as there's still one slot left, I'm not gonna give up on Shadow dream, and honestly I think today was perhaps for the better...maybe, I'm not sure

I would say Tails gets benefitted from today, but unlike with Tekken, Tails was one of the actual characters mii costumed. Of course it happened so early in FP1, it was always some sort of grey area, So I think he's open to suggestion

I know Rayman got a big boost today

I was honestly kinda skeptical at first about this, but damn does it make sense. I predicted a Namco rep in order to fit this theory and it happened to be the case. My other prediction was a Sega rep.

I still have a sliver of hope for Shadow as the last character, with all the stuff that has happened during this DLC watching an AT get promoted isn't that farfetched anymore, since he has been a popular request for more than a decade. Not to mention Sakurai seems to really like edgy characters from what I've seen lol.

Although, while it does make sense and Shadow fits this theory like a glove, it's also too good to be true for me which makes me wonder how much of it could be mere wishful thinking.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Incidentally I have to believe a Xenoblade Chronicles X port is coming at some point. It and Fatal Frame were essentially the last Nintendo published games that people have been clamoring to get off the Wii U, and given that the latter is now coming, it wouldn't not shock me in the least to see an announcement for a XCX Switch version as early as the Fall Direct.

 

[Ivander]

Incidentally I have to believe a Xenoblade Chronicles X port is coming at some point. It and Fatal Frame were essentially the last Nintendo published games that people have been clamoring to get off the Wii U, and given that the latter is now coming, it wouldn't not shock me in the least to see an announcement for a XCX Switch version as early as the Fall Direct.

cries in Nintendo Land

C'mon, some of the Nintendo Land games were legitimately fun.

 

[Guynamednelson]

So does anyone know what Kazuya's pallet swaps in Tekken are? Wait. Does Tekken have pallet swaps or is it like Pokkén Tournament where they only recolor your character in mirror matches?

Are we going to have the return of the aggressively muted and barely different pallet swaps again?

Originally, Tekken disregarded palette swaps completely, giving players 1 and 2 completely different outfits during mirror matches, but later games have palette swaps. And they shouldn't be Cloud-tier given Tekken 6 onward's customizability.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Incidentally I have to believe a Xenoblade Chronicles X port is coming at some point. It and Fatal Frame were essentially the last Nintendo published games that people have been clamoring to get off the Wii U, and given that the latter is now coming, it wouldn't not shock me in the least to see an announcement for a XCX Switch version as early as the Fall Direct.

What if Elma’s the last character… I am only HALF joking.

fr, Kazuya giving me hope like you wouldn’t BELIEVE

 

[Wigglerman]

So does anyone know what Kazuya's pallet swaps in Tekken are? Wait. Does Tekken have pallet swaps or is it like Pokkén Tournament where they only recolor your character in mirror matches?

Are we going to have the return of the aggressively muted and barely different pallet swaps again?

In Tekken characters have two costumes, sometimes each costume has a color swap. So '4' outfits. Then they started adding the custom items in Tag games and now they're in the mainline games so you can put some really dopey stuff to 'make your own costumes'.

 

[Technomage]

Kaz may have been revealed, but that doesn't mean speculation stops for him; for example, when do y'all think he'll be released?

 

[cashregister9]

So does anyone know what Kazuya's pallet swaps in Tekken are? Wait. Does Tekken have pallet swaps or is it like Pokkén Tournament where they only recolor your character in mirror matches?

Are we going to have the return of the aggressively muted and barely different pallet swaps again?

Tekken tends to have outfits instead of traditional palettes, but you can color them in some games,

Kazuya Mishima/Outfits

Kazuya is a fighter who has been in every Tekken game with the exception of Tekken 3. He has received many different outfits, with white gi pants primarily serving as his Player 1 outfit in each of his appearances. His other outfits usually have a formal/business theme. As a child (seen in Ling...

tekken.fandom.com

I'd expect recolors that represent other characters.

 

[Fluttershy64]

Literally any Zelda character that isn't a Triforce member would be met with overwhelmingly positive reception. Waluigi would have some naysayers but he too would ultimately be a hit.

I would also add Dixie Kong, Isaac, Krystal, and Bandana Waddle Dee to that list.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Kaz may have been revealed, but that doesn't mean speculation stops for him; for example, when do y'all think he'll be released?

Same day as his presentation?

 

[Guynamednelson]

Kaz may have been revealed, but that doesn't mean speculation stops for him; for example, when do y'all think he'll be released?

The day of or the day after his presentation. We always get fighters at least two weeks after they're revealed in FP2.

 

[Shroob]

I'm stealing this from some anon on /v/ but ya know what?

I've honestly REALLY enjoyed this game's newcomer selection.

 

[lady_sky skipper]

Honestly, I'm just glad a second Namco rep got in even if I never played Tekken. At least we're finally gonna get the Street Fighter X Tekken game we've always wanted.

 

[ROBnWatch]

I’m actually happy Kazuya got in simply because I heard basically nobody on here talk about/predict him. What does that mean? It means I’m not completely tired of the character before he even got revealed. It also means that we may not have as good an idea who the last character is as we thought we did.

Now Kayuza himself, like most of the DLC, isn’t particularly a character I know. I’m up to give him a shot but eh, if I don’t wind up liking him, there’s still all the other characters.

I do wonder, how do you all feel about the final character being a first/third party now? (In other words, which do you think is more likely?) Any change in thought or still relatively the same?

 

[DanganZilla5]

Copy and pasting my thoughts from RTC.

Oh boy this was one heck of a direct. Lots of surprises so here we go.

• First, Danganronpa FINALLY gets a Switch port. And with an expansion of V3's minigame. I don't think I'll buy this since I've already played through the games on PS4 (At the most I might pick up V3 by itself for the expanded minigame), but I'm just excited that Danganronpa got attention in a major direct and that more people are able to play it. Seriously people, play it. Danganronpa is one of my favorite series and there is nothing like it.
• New Mario Party? Didn't think about that at all. It looks good but I'm not a huge fan of Mario Party.
• It's nice to see Monkey Ball coming back. I love that Sega is resurrecting so many of their I.Ps. I've never been that interested in Monkey Ball but it has me kind of intrigued now.
• It's great to see another WarioWare game. I've been thinking about picking up a game from this series.
• ADVANCED WARS?? It's returned? And I don't have to track down expensive GBA copies to try this out? Sign me up. It's an instant purchase.
• SMTV looks interesting. I've been keeping an eye on this series for a while now. It's just a matter of when I'll be pushed to try it.
• Fatal Frame??? That was another pleasant surprise. I gotta check that out someday. It looks interesting.
• For general stuff, that was pretty much everything I cared about. Now onto the main topic: Kazuya
  • First, I was not expecting Tekken at all. I really thought it had zero chances due to Heihachi's Mii costume. It makes me wonder why didn't they just save that costume for Kazuya's wave? Because of that, that threw everyone off. Funny enough when I saw Ganondorf being carried to a volcano I actually was like "This reminds me of Tekken" and yet I did not actually register that it was Tekken until it was clear it was Kazuya.
  • Overall, I'm fine with Kazuya. Luckily even with Vergeben lying and getting me close to believing in a super hype character, I still had a level of hesitancy and I am glad. While Kazuya was never a character I actively wanted or even supported, I embrace him. Sure, he kills the chances of some of my most wanted (Nightmare, Agumon, and Klonoa) and I was hoping for other characters like Crash and Dragonborn. But you know what? I enjoy Tekken 7 a lot and I have respect for the franchise and its legacy. Plus I'm excited for the music as Tekken has a bangin' OST.
  • Plus I'm just happy that Bamco got another character after 7 years(!). Another great addition from their library.

Now let's take a look at my predictions:



I was correct on BOTW 2 getting a vague "2022" release date, a dead series being revived, and the fact that we got one reveal with the presentation being at the end of the month. Still a lot of misses though, but that's par for the course.

Overall, I'll give this Direct a 8/10. If they had announced a new Xenoblade title and one of my most wanted characters, that could have pushed it up to a 10. But yeah this is by far the best E3 presentation this year. So many pleasant surprises and my jaw dropped multiple times.

In terms of where my head is at when it comes to speculation:

• I no longer believe in many of the heavy hitters. Crash, Dragonborn, Eggman, Master Chief, Dante, Chun-Li, Ezio, etc. If they were in this pass, they would have been revealed today or earlier. Smash never ends on a high hope so I'm not expecting any of these anymore (Which is a huge shame).
• I still believe that we won't get double dips. That means I'm not expecting anyone from Square, Microsoft, and no one else from Bamco.
• For the last character, my gut still says Ayumi or Arle Nadja but now they just got even more competition which should spice up speculation for a while.
• For franchises with no real frontrunner that got a Mii costume earlier this pass, they are back on the table. An example would be Assassin's Creed getting the Altair costume but it could still get Ezio as a playable character (Although that was at the end of the last pass but it was still announced in the same presentation where Sakurai said that the fighters were already decided).

 

[zferolie]

I'm stealing this from some anon on /v/ but ya know what?

View attachment 319417



I've honestly REALLY enjoyed this game's newcomer selection.

Yeah this game has knocked it out of the park for new characters

 

[N3ON]

Three months, three more months

Great Direct though

Edit: Broken pic captures the feeling just as well tbh

 

[Shroob]

Oh yeah.


Capcom is 100% back on the table now that we see the whole "Saving Mii" thing is bunk.

 

[Megadoomer]

Between Advance Wars and Famicom Detective Club getting new remakes, it's great to see once abandoned Nintendo franchises given new life!

Golden Sun next please.

I could see StarTropics happening next; at the very least, there's interest:

Volunteering to help make a new StarTropics happen.

Plz, Daddy Nintendo.

— Devolver Digital (@devolverdigital) June 15, 2021

If WayForward can work on the new Advance Wars remake, it's possible! (though it would require Nintendo to acknowledge that StarTropics exists haha)

 

[Idon]

Nintendo revealing Kazuya despite the fact the Heihachi mii was released earlier with Min Min:

 

[Guynamednelson]

Tekken tends to have outfits instead of traditional palettes, but you can color them in some games,

Kazuya Mishima/Outfits

Kazuya is a fighter who has been in every Tekken game with the exception of Tekken 3. He has received many different outfits, with white gi pants primarily serving as his Player 1 outfit in each of his appearances. His other outfits usually have a formal/business theme. As a child (seen in Ling...

tekken.fandom.com

I'd expect recolors that represent other characters.

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/tekken/images/0/0f/Tekken5_Dark_Resurrection_Kazuya_Outfits.png/revision/latest?cb=20170801034322&path-prefix=en

Red pants and a white suit are definitely going to be 2 of his remaining color options. As for the remaining 4, I'd like them to be Jin, with 2 of them being his Tekken 3 outfit and 2 being his Tekken 4 hoodie.

 

[lady_sky skipper]

I’m actually happy Kazuya got in simply because I heard basically nobody on here talk about/predict him. What does that mean? It means I’m not completely tired of the character before he even got revealed. It also means that we may not have as good an idea who the last character is as we thought we did.

Now Kayuza himself, like most of the DLC, isn’t particularly a character I know. I’m up to give him a shot but eh, if I don’t wind up liking him, there’s still all the other characters.

I do wonder, how do you all feel about the final character being a first/third party now? (In other words, which do you think is more likely?) Any change in thought or still relatively the same?

I really don't have any theories because Sakurai has always found a way to surprise us and introduce a fighter that not many people have talked about as a potential newcomer and I kinda hope he keeps up with it. Admittedly I am kinda biased because I really wanted Terry as a fighter but not a lot of people considered him viable and then Sakurai put him in knowing how important he is to fighting games. I was pretty much ecstatic.

 

[zferolie]

I could see StarTropics happening next; at the very least, there's interest:

Volunteering to help make a new StarTropics happen.

Plz, Daddy Nintendo.

— Devolver Digital (@devolverdigital) June 15, 2021

If WayForward can work on the new Advance Wars remake, it's possible! (though it would require Nintendo to acknowledge that StarTropics exists haha)

I am all for Nintendo letting other companys work on their dormant series. Devolver digital would be great for star tropics.

Who would be good for Shin Onigashima and Golden sun?

 

[Ivander]

Three months, three more months

There's a reason three sounds the same as free.

 

[7NATOR]

I Know Epic Martin Color theory is interesting and got stuff right, but I don't know if i can get behind CP11 using a green color. Pyra/Mythra already use Green, and I think at least within pass, they would make colors more separate.

I want to say Purple is the way to go from here, or some other interesting color like Sephiroth's more gray color

So does anyone know what Kazuya's pallet swaps in Tekken are? Wait. Does Tekken have pallet swaps or is it like Pokkén Tournament where they only recolor your character in mirror matches?

Are we going to have the return of the aggressively muted and barely different pallet swaps again?

From Tekken 6 and onwards (and I think Tekken 5 maybe), you usually just customize the colors of the outfits to your liking

The previous games before usually was limited to alts, and like one Palette Swap. I wouldn't be worried about muted palettes since Namco allows the Tekken characters to already have crazy outfits and colors anyway in the home game

I was honestly kinda skeptical at first about this, but damn does it make sense. I predicted a Namco rep in order to fit this theory and it happened to be the case. My other prediction was a Sega rep.

I still have a sliver of hope for Shadow as the last character, with all the stuff that has happened during this DLC watching an AT get promoted isn't that farfetched anymore, since he has been a popular request for more than a decade. Not to mention Sakurai seems to really like edgy characters from what I've seen lol.

Although, while it does make sense and Shadow fits this theory like a glove, it's also too good to be true for me which makes me wonder how much of it could be mere wishful thinking.

I mean to be honest, at this point, riling for any character can be considered wishful thinking. CP11 Speculation is gonna be the most Freeform speculation of the DLC, because alot of perceived barriers are cut down, and since this is the last character, it's unknown what's gonna happen. You should go all in at this point

The reason I was thinking Shadow was in a do or die situation for today was because considering it's the Anniversary of not only Sonic, but Specifically SA2 in like 3 days, I would think that if Shadow was actually in the pass, he'd be revealed now.

Thinking about it further, Pyra/Mythra were revealed after Sakurai had posted the Anniversary pic anyway, and plus I think perhaps Nintendo and/or Sega might see more benefit for announcing Shadow later, maybe to better coincide with Sonic release near fall.

Sakurai does like Edgy characters though, and it seems This pass is him expressing his love of Edge.

 

[Animegamingnerd]

I'm stealing this from some anon on /v/ but ya know what?

View attachment 319417



I've honestly REALLY enjoyed this game's newcomer selection.

Best newcomers hands down. Amazing mix of Iconic characters, long requested fan favorites, out of nowhere surprises, retro and modern representation

I could see StarTropics happening next; at the very least, there's interest:

Volunteering to help make a new StarTropics happen.

Plz, Daddy Nintendo.

— Devolver Digital (@devolverdigital) June 15, 2021

If WayForward can work on the new Advance Wars remake, it's possible! (though it would require Nintendo to acknowledge that StarTropics exists haha)

Star Tropics never being released in Japan makes me doubt that Nintendo would ever green light a new one even outsourced,, hell I wouldn't be surprised if there is a fair number of developers at Nintendo who never heard of it. I think Golden Sun, Nintendogs, and F-Zero are more likely in terms of revivals and I can see one of those three being next.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Originally, Tekken disregarded palette swaps completely, giving players 1 and 2 completely different outfits during mirror matches, but later games have palette swaps. And they shouldn't be Cloud-tier given Tekken 6 onward's customizability.

That's good. I was looking at Kazuya's suit and thinking "oh no they're not going to do like Sephiroth and add a bunch of bland colors because edgy" so it's good to know that I can actually look forward to at least somewhat interesting colors.

 

[Inferno7]

I’m actually happy Kazuya got in simply because I heard basically nobody on here talk about/predict him. What does that mean? It means I’m not completely tired of the character before he even got revealed. It also means that we may not have as good an idea who the last character is as we thought we did.

Now Kayuza himself, like most of the DLC, isn’t particularly a character I know. I’m up to give him a shot but eh, if I don’t wind up liking him, there’s still all the other characters.

I do wonder, how do you all feel about the final character being a first/third party now? (In other words, which do you think is more likely?) Any change in thought or still relatively the same?

definitely third party, I can't think of any viable 1st party candidates that fit
Waluigi is a maybe, but what would his spirit board even look like? Personally, I dread Ayumi but I feel like she missed out, otherwise it would've been a bad business move for not using her to promote the new game earlier. Cinderace ain't happening imo, there's too much against Gen 8 atm.
Luigi's Mansion kind of makes sense but I don't see why they would add a character now, I feel like they decided that the base game spirits were enough. Sylux is a no given how much time we have waited for MP4 news, no point in shiling a game that will never come out. BOTW has no viable choices from what I've seen. Octoling makes sense, but that's the only one I feel has a chance in hell of happening.

 

[Deleted member]

Does anyone who plays or watches enough Tekken know if the janky looking animations are intentional? I feel like they are because of the limb system but I'm not entirely sure.

Like this timestamp in particular looks off to me but I think it's trying to be faithful.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Does anyone who plays or watches enough Tekken know if the janky looking animations are intentional?

As someone who has seen .1 seconds of Tekken tournament footage:

Y E S

EDIT: Tekken's movement systems often cause the game's neutral to look like characters just jittering in place.
EDIT EDIT: It's why I don't really like watching the game.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Does anyone who plays or watches enough Tekken know if the janky looking animations are intentional? I feel like they are because of the limb system but I'm not entirely sure.

Like this timestamp in particular looks off to me but I think it's trying to be faithful.

He definitely looks like a Tekken character copied into Smash. They even included wavedashing and Korean backdashing.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Does anyone who plays or watches enough Tekken know if the janky looking animations are intentional? I feel like they are because of the limb system but I'm not entirely sure.



Like this timestamp in particular looks off to me but I think it's trying to be faithful.

It looks like they pulled him straight out of Tekken.

 

[Deleted member]

It looks like they pulled him straight out of Tekken.

That's what I thought but it's nice to get confirmation. Gonna take a little bit to get used to though lol.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Just caught up with E3.

BRB, making an E.M.M.I. Smash thread.

 

[Technomage]

I feel like they are because of the limb system

That reminds me: If Kazuya were to implement the Tekken limb system, how complex would his controls be (such as command inputs)? Honestly, that might make me feel unsure about making him one of my casual mains (hopefully we won't get anything as complex as that Pretzel command input).

 

[Nekoo]

FSQLMHGMDLSGVSDFH-

KOREAN BACKDASH CANCEL- CROUCHDASHING THROUGHT STUFF- 10HIT COMBO KILL CONFIRM-
THE TEKKEN ANNOUNCED SAYING THAT KAZUYA WIN

GET READY FOR THE NEXT BATTLE ****ERS-

ONLY SMASH FANS TO BE SALTY ABOUT FIGHTING GAMES CHARACTERS ON TWITTER


Sorry not sorry for the caps.

Also anyone who call Kazuya a Shoto merrit death sentence, I don't make the rules.

 

[Inferno7]

I mean to be honest, at this point, riling for any character can be considered wishful thinking. CP11 Speculation is gonna be the most Freeform speculation of the DLC, because alot of perceived barriers are cut down, and since this is the last character, it's unknown what's gonna happen. You should go all in at this point

The reason I was thinking Shadow was in a do or die situation for today was because considering it's the Anniversary of not only Sonic, but Specifically SA2 in like 3 days, I would think that if Shadow was actually in the pass, he'd be revealed now.

Thinking about it further, Pyra/Mythra were revealed after Sakurai had posted the Anniversary pic anyway, and plus I think perhaps Nintendo and/or Sega might see more benefit for announcing Shadow later, maybe to better coincide with Sonic release near fall.

Sakurai does like Edgy characters though, and it seems This pass is him expressing his love of Edge.

fair enough. I think you're right, if this truly is the last character, it's better to go all out before speculation eventually dies.

However, I don't think anniversaries matter because of the timing & deadlines, which would be a nightmare to accomplish accordingly during such a long timeframe where a lot of developmental issues/hurdles can happen, even for Nintendo. We also have to consider Sakurai and his team have been working their hardest yet it seems like a lot was delayed because of Covid-19, especially Steve. Considering how mechanically intensive characters such as Kazuya & Steve seem to be, I wouldn't be surprised if this was the case.
Sonic is getting a new game in 2022 though so I wouldn't bother about timing.