Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Cosmic77]

I honestly didn't like the reveal for this character tbh and I think know why:

The trailer has a weak set-up to me. It's banking on the gag for the whole duration, while basically every other Ultimate trailer are like mini cartoons (with a mini plot). This trailer is literally just this guy throwing peeps off a cliff. There is almost zero "tension" in this trailer.

If you have no prior knowledge on Tekken, the trailer might really miss the mark.

The music selection was also kind of meh (a first for a Smash trailer for me).

I think the main problem was that the reveal was too fast. When they first showed Kazuya, I was like, "Oh, so there might be an Echo or something," and then the trailer went on and I realized that he was all they had. They just jumped to the reveal faster than I expected.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly I kinda liked the trailer. Even though I've never played it, I knew it was Tekken as soon as I realized Ganondorf was being carried by a buff shirtless dude, because who hasn't seen the clip of Heihachi being thrown off a cliff? Felt like Sephiroth's trailer with One Winged Angel in that sense. It didn't linger on the smash cliffs very long which was really helpful.

As for what this means for speculation? Mii costumes mean next to nothing. And I'm 99% sure Sakurai recently posted a pic of the day parodying the volcano scene which is really funny looking back on it.

 

[Nightguything]

Ngl, I was kind of hoping the character pass would end today but oh well.

Anyway

 

[RileyXY1]

So, uh, if Mii Costumes don't disconfirm characters, what about Spirit Events? Could something like Resident Evil still happen?

Tekken never got a Spirit Event, so I believe that they still deconfirm. Also, I believe that Mii Fighter costumes are still deconfirmations, but they don't deconfirm other characters from their franchise.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If you have no prior knowledge on Tekken, the trailer might really miss the mark.

Anecdotally, if this were Heihachi, I would be pumped because I see him as an icon. Since it's Kazuya, who I'm not familiar at all with since I'm not familiar with Tekken in general, I can't really bring myself to care, and the trailer didn't really amend that (very unlike Sephiroth's trailer, which probably got everyone hyped regardless).

also Kazuya fits Thirst Theory...

Uh...Steve isn't apart of this theory is he?

 

[volbound1700]

I am expecting the last pick to be a First Party Representative. Likely LOZ, Pokemon, or Mario representative.

It will be a downer for most people.

 

[Momotsuki]

This E3 has been so surreal. Nintendo came in and knocked it out of the park, took it home by a huge margin. With what? With a very solid but ultimately standard-form direct. Because nobody else felt like trying this year, for some reason. The bar was so low they punted it on their way through.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

So, provided CP11 is the end of Smash Ultimate, what’s the chance our final character will be someone from Smash Bros. itself, like Master Hand or Tabuu?

That would be a great wildcard

Kazuya opened up sone doors I thought had been locked and closed. Tails, X, and Octoling are back on the menu, plus I feel even more comfortable in Undertale.

I don't see how they weren't off to begin with. They still have chances regardless of the situation

?... Three Houses just came out. Why would they flip another game out so soon?

Becuase Fire Emblem is famous for three reasons

1. Cash cow
2. Popular series
3. CP11's fighter to be another Marth clone

 

[RileyXY1]

I am expecting the last pick to be a First Party Representative. Likely LOZ, Pokemon, or Mario representative.

It will be a downer for most people.

Or a minor third party character. I don't think that it will be a big hype bringing character at all.

 

[AreJay25]

Copied over from CET:

One notable thing that sticks out to me is Ubisoft, which as a company has often been met with skepticism thanks to the Miis. Now that Kazuya has chucked that idea off a cliff, I think we're open to talk about them freely.

So how about it. What Ubisoft characters would you like to see, what have they got going for them, and what can they bring?

Man if Ultimate somehow closes out with Kazuya and Rayman I'll just feel like Sakurai is trying to appeal to me specifically. And you know what, I'll allow it.

 

[PacificFun]

Thbf the “throwing people off of cliffs“ I think ties to his Devil Trigger mechanic where he gets stronger the more opponents he defeats. Normally if such a mechanic exists they let the character be curbstomped first but that wouldn’t fit Kazuya imo.

It definitely ties into his mechanic, but as a person who has never touched a Tekken game, I had absolutely no idea what was going on.

"I-I think I'm suopose to be laughing?"

This was the first Smash trailer where I felt a little "alienated"

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

epicmartin7 has gotten colour theory twice in a row and the next colour is green. Any more characters that would fit a green background? I know DMC3’s box art in some regions was a light green.

 

[rychu_supadude]

Since Ultimate was revealed, the only presentations that didn't open with a character reveal were Isabelle's (Luigi's Mansion 3), Terry's (Overwatch), and the "Joker is still coming" one (Super Mario Maker 2). It is a bit hard to gauge since 2020 gave us so many standalone reveals, though. If they do have a new game, that'll take precedence as the lead in.

So I guess I was dead wrong about that one

 

[volbound1700]

This E3 has been so surreal. Nintendo came in and knocked it out of the park, took it home by a huge margin? With what? With a very solid but ultimately standard-form direct. Because nobody else felt like trying this year, for some reason. The bar was so low they punted it on their way through.

Nintendo did win it but to say it was the best thing ever is crazy. Go back to Nintendo's 2019 E3 if you want to see knocking out of the park. Two Smash Characters Hero/Banjo, tons of new games, and the LOZ BOTW2 tease at the end. 2018 E3 was great to with the Smash stuff.

 

[Honest Slug]

Nintendo's E3 was like a 5 or 6/10 at best to me, but considering how lame the rest of this year's conferences were, Nintendo still ended up being the best by default on the basis there were at least some announcements that made me excited.

 

[Ivander]

Vergeben

Hand in your license to leak

Yer done, son.

#VergebenIsOverParty

And what happens if Master Chief, one of the characters they vouched for, is the last character?

C'mon, you know if there's anything side-by-side with speculation, it's back-tracking.

That aside, speaking of back-tracking....the Heihachi costume didn't stop Kazuya as people were thinking(and compared to the Rex costume which was last pass, the Heihachi costume was with Min-Min, in the same pass as Kazuya). Think Ezio may still have a chance?

 

[PacificFun]

Honestly I kinda liked the trailer. Even though I've never played it, I knew it was Tekken as soon as I realized Ganondorf was being carried by a buff shirtless dude, because who hasn't seen the clip of Heihachi being thrown off a cliff? Felt like Sephiroth's trailer with One Winged Angel in that sense. It didn't linger on the smash cliffs very long which was really helpful.

As for what this means for speculation? Mii costumes mean next to nothing. And I'm 99% sure Sakurai recently posted a pic of the day parodying the volcano scene which is really funny looking back on it.

I had absolutely no idea who it was until the face reveal.

 

[Momotsuki]

Nintendo did win it but to say it was the best thing ever is crazy. Go back to Nintendo's 2019 E3 if you want to see knocking out of the park. Two Smash Characters Hero/Banjo, tons of new games, and the LOZ BOTW2 tease at the end. 2018 E3 was great to with the Smash stuff.

It wasn't the best thing ever, that's my point. Nintendo came in with a solid direct that was really good. But it was only just that; really good. But it hit so much harder thanks to everyone else cutting class.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Copied over from CET:

One notable thing that sticks out to me is Ubisoft, which as a company has often been met with skepticism thanks to the Miis. Now that Kazuya has chucked that idea off a cliff, I think we're open to talk about them freely.

So how about it. What Ubisoft characters would you like to see, what have they got going for them, and what can they bring?

Rabbid Peach, Ray-Man and Ezio would all be cool. Ezio being absent in Mii Costumes in favor (?) of Altair has become a bit more noteworthy.
With Mii Costumes not really deconfirmimg as strictly, I think Capcom should make its way back to speculation soon enough.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Everyone who expected a double reveal today and thought this thread was going to be closed:

 

[Perkilator]

Oh, yeah; what's this week's Tuesday event announcement gonna be?

 

[Wigglerman]

Nintendo just doing what they do. Having a lot of stuff to show to garner various audiences. Good stuff.

 

[volbound1700]

That would be a great wildcard

I don't see how they weren't off to begin with. They still have chances regardless of the situation

Becuase Fire Emblem is famous for three reasons

1. Cash cow
2. Popular series
3. CP11's fighter to be another Marth clone

Anyone expecting a Fire Emblem game to be announced at this year's E3 was kidding themselves.

Also Fire Emblem pales in comparison to most other Nintendo IP in sales/profit. If Nintendo went off your logic, they would be making Mario Odyssey 2 and would be on BOTW 3 by now. Mario (anything Mario), LOZ, and Pokemon are Nintendo's biggest cash cows. Heck, Animal Crossing is probably in 4th after those 3.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Oh, yeah; what's this week's Tuesday event announcement gonna be?

Watch as it’s Ninja Gaiden

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I think they're going to combine his Devil form with Tekken's rage system. His Devil form was a Rage Art in Tekken 7 anyway.

It kind of looked like his devil stuff was his Special Moves, and everything else was a normal or command normal, but that's pretty speculative on my part (and probably doesn't have much accuracy since I've never played Tekken).

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I am expecting the last pick to be a First Party Representative. Likely LOZ, Pokemon, or Mario representative.

It will be a downer for most people.

You do realise toms of people have been wanting a new Zelda character for years and Waluigi is a character tons of people want?

 

[Speed Weed]

OK so so

With the reveal of Kazuya, we can now conclude that Miis aren't necessarily a death sentence for related characters, so long as they're not, like, the exact character that's been Mii'd.

Now, this has a variety of implications, but most relevant to here is the fact that the load of Capcom costumes we got with Aegis might not actually be the death of Capcom!

So if Capcom's possibly back on the table...

You know what that means.

AMINGO. LIVES.

 

[cashregister9]

So about that reveal amirite?

 

[7NATOR]

So I know this isn't the Speculation thread, but I think with Kazuya being the reveal, it does change some things about speculation and such


-Whether it was a troll at the advice of Harada, or just a way of filling Costume packs, Heihachi being a Costume in Min-Min's Pack gave false suggestion of Tekken being snubbed for FP2, when that turned out not to be the case

With this in mind, This leaves franchises or Companies that already got costumes in FP2, still open to being in FP2. this includes the following

Sonic
Pokemon
Capcom
Undertale
Rayman (and Ubisoft in general)
Bethesda
Legend of Zelda
Splatoon
Geno...somehow

These Characters/Franchises were considered less likely due to getting DLC Mii Costumes, however thanks to Kazuya, the argument is now in these franchises favor

-Tourney Theory took a big hit today. Pyra/Mythra's Tourney was about Characters that change appearances, and since this was their DLC Tournament, it could have suggested that no other character further on would have Alt Costumes, but then Kazuya just threw that Suggestion off a Cliff

I wouldn't say the tourneys should be outright ignored, but I don't think it's as set in stone

-My Vergeben Deconfirm Theory took an L, as Bandai Namco was on the list. I personally found it to be an interesting theory, but it is dead

-Vergeben himself took a big L today. While I still think he is credible, he is not infallible, and I don't think his word should be taken as Gospel anymore, when it pertains to Smash (that's not even getting into other games)

-Master Chief might be dead, Any other Namco character might be dead, Another Fighting game character could be dead, but we have to see Mii Wave,

-Second Chance theory got a Boost, as a Tekken character was considered in the Past back in Smash 4. 4 out of 5 FP2 characters were confirmed to have been considered in the past before getting in, with Sephiroth being speculative

-So Far, every character has had some sort of Global appeal, and this continues with Kazuya.

-Epic Martins Color theory has gotten a color right again. Good job!


In general, I think Kazuya breaks the structure of Smash speculation even further, in terms of who's suggested to be in, and not to be in. Franchises or Companies affected by Spirit Events or Mii Costumes are gonna get a bigger limelight now.

Characters who are the actual Mii Costumes might still be met with Skepticism, Characters who are considered deconfirmed thanks to interviews are still gonna be counted as so, and Assist Trophies, Pokeballs, and Boss characters will still be met with heavy skepticism or outright denial, but I think otherwise it's free reign for the Speculation on CP11

 

[BlazGreen]

Man FP2 has been an absolute treat for me. As someone who's first home console was a PS1, seeing Sephiroth and Kazuya in the same pass has been mindblowing and on top of that, my favourite Switch game (Xenoblade 2) also got a character. Although I don't play Minecraft, I can appreciate the effort that went into Steve's moveset as well as the impact his game has made on the industry. So really Min Min has been the only dud for me so far this pass.

 

[volbound1700]

You do realise toms of people have been wanting a new Zelda character for years and Waluigi is a character tons of people want?

True. I would be happy to end on a LOZ character. I am just trying to say it won't be a hype character like a Masterchief or Crash Bandicoot style pick. I think both are dead and frankly were very unlikely to begin with. Perhaps if there is a FP #3, they might have a chance.

Where is the MCC coming to Switch that everyone keeps talking about? I have been hearing about that for years.

 

[Pokechao]

copying this from the Lloyd thread but

aight I'll admit Lloyd is kill

but
Kazuya's inclusion gives me hope for a different Tales character because it shows even if a series got an earlier mii costume(Heihachi), a different character from that series can still be in

therefore, I'm jumping on the Yuri Lowell train

if capcom, konami, and sega can get 3 characters so can namco.


that being said, Kazuya is ****in dope AF, Tekken was my first fighting game so I'm glad to see a Tekken char make it in.

 

[Deleted member]

Here's the stuff I was talking about earlier:

pic.twitter.com/XcaXVK9uAI

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) May 14, 2021

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Oh, yeah; what's this week's Tuesday event announcement gonna be?

Advance Wars maybe?

 

[RileyXY1]

I think that the next event might be a tournament themed after traditional fighting games, where only Ryu, Ken, Terry, Min Min, and Kazuya are allowed.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Last fighter is gonna be a 1st party because Smash always ends on a low note.

Probably gonna be a Pokemon like Cinderace.

 

[RileyXY1]

Last fighter is gonna be a 1st party because Smash always ends on a low note.

Probably gonna be a Pokemon like Cinderace.

Pokemon's out because of the Spirit Event.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Last fighter is gonna be a 1st party because Smash always ends on a low note.

You do realize you conveniently forgot this when predicting Master Chief right?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I do think the last character will be a 2010s and/or first party character

 

[Shroob]

About 5 hours after the presentation and we're already starting on CP11 before Kazuya's even out.


Tbh that's actually a new record for us.