Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

So, following your logic, Geralt of Rivia could be considered a video game characters as well.

Not really since he was originally designed as a book character before CD Projekt Red got the rights to make a game.

However, I've always had the belief that what form of media the character is most notable in was the real factor when it comes to what Sakurai sees as "gaming content".

Geralt is far more known from the Witcher games than the original book, so he'd qualify despite his non-gaming origins. The problem when be getting the rights for it since they'd need the approval of both Projekt and the original author, something Nintendo and/or Sakurai might not see as worth doing.

 

[Hinata]

So, following your logic, Geralt of Rivia could be considered a video game characters as well.

As for ROB, he's primarily a Nintendo gaming accessory, so he had the VIP treatment when it comes to become a playable character in smash, not a character originated from a different and completely unrelated thing to video games like books or mangas.

Geralt was a book character first, and only after reading the books did CD Projekt Red come up with the idea of making The Witcher games. In contrast, Strider Hiryu was always conceived as a multimedia character whose story was to be told through books and games, it just so happened that the book came out first.

Geralt is a book character who was adapted into a video game, Strider Hiryu is a game character who was adapted into a book that was co-developed with his game.

 

[SNEKeater]

So, following your logic, Geralt of Rivia could be considered a video game characters as well.

As for ROB, he's primarily a Nintendo gaming accessory, so he had the VIP treatment when it comes to become a playable character in smash, not a character originated from a different and completely unrelated thing to video games like books or mangas.

I don't think Geralt is in the same situation at all.

He was always conceived as a book character, without videogame/cinema/TV in mind, as far as I know.

 

[Wigglerman]

So, following your logic, Geralt of Rivia could be considered a video game characters as well.

As for ROB, he's primarily a Nintendo gaming accessory, so he had the VIP treatment when it comes to become a playable character in smash, not a character originated from a different and completely unrelated thing to video games like books or mangas.

No, because the Witcher series was originally a book series started in 1992. The first video game for Witcher wasn't until 2007.

 

[Pillow]

Unrelated to any of the current conversations, but which characters could you see being turned into "full" mii costumes like Sans and Cuphead? I really adore the mii costumes as a consolation prize for characters that are really cool but would never have been added to the game as full playable characters anyway.

 

[cothero]

Geralt is a book character who was adapted into a video game, Strider Hiryu is a game character who was adapted into a book that was co-developed with his game.

First appearance	Strider Hiryu manga (1988)
First game	Strider (arcade) (1989)

"The manga Strider Hiryu by Tatsumi Wada and Tetsuo Shiba was serialized in the monthly magazine Comic Computique from May to October 1988, spanning six issues. During this time, there were already two Strider games in development."

I can see your point of view, but although both things were produced at the same time, the different relase dates leaves things up for debate.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Unrelated to any of the current conversations, but which characters could you see being turned into "full" mii costumes like Sans and Cuphead? I really adore the mii costumes as a consolation prize for characters that are really cool but would never have been added to the game as full playable characters anyway.

Monokuma from Danganronpa, Ori from the Ori series, the Knight from Hollow Knight

all with their own music tracks to boot

 

[SKX31]

Is ROB not a video game character because his first appearance was as a toy in 1985? He didn't make an appearance on screen in a video game until 1997.

No. Thus, Goku confirmed.

His first Journey to the West (in playable form), baybee!

No, because the Witcher series was originally a book series started in 1992. The first video game for Witcher wasn't until 2007.

Seriously though, it's going to be a judgement call on Sakurai's end. Does Sakurai prioritize the book series in his decision, which (as far as I've seen anyhow) is mostly known in Eastern Europe - specifically in the author's home country Poland? Or does he instead prioritize the video game series that is known worldwide?

Edit: I'm leaning the latter, it's worth noting that Metro books' author argued about the Witcher games' impact:

Without the gaming franchise, the Witcher series would never get this crazy international readership that it has. And it's not just about the gamers but the gaming press and the buzz it creates, and just the feeling of something great and massive and impressive coming out. This got people hooked. He would remain a local Eastern European phenomenon without this, but he would never break into the West. And the same goes for my Metro books.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

First appearance	Strider Hiryu manga (1988)
First game	Strider (arcade) (1989)

"The manga Strider Hiryu by Tatsumi Wada and Tetsuo Shiba was serialized in the monthly magazine Comic Computique from May to October 1988, spanning six issues. During this time, there were already two Strider games in development."

I can see your point of view, but although both things were produced at the same time, the different relase dates leaves things up for debate.

You really think Sakurai would look only at the very first game and not how things played out in the long run?

Hiryu is very blatantly a video game character when you look at how the franchise went.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I can see your point of view, but although both things were produced at the same time, the different relase dates leaves things up for debate.

As was said, they were co-developed at the same time. The only reason the manga came out first is likely because it was finished first.

 

[cashregister9]

This conversation again...

Look at Lord Of The Rings, The movies are super popular but the franchise still started as a Book series, an Adaptation does not separate the IP. and with the case for Strider Hiryu, DarthEnderX is right, the manga came first because it was developed at the same time as the game and manga came out prematurely. Cars is not a videogame franchise because the Game came out a day before the movie.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This conversation again...

Look at Lord Of The Rings, The movies are super popular but the franchise still started as a Book series, an Adaptation does not separate the IP. and with the case for Strider Hiryu, DarthEnderX is right, the manga came first because it was developed at the same time as the game and manga came out prematurely. Cars is not a videogame franchise because the Game came out a day before the movie.

Would you say .hack falls into this category too?

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Cars is not a videogame franchise because the Game came out a day before the movie.

Yeah, it's a book series cuz the junior novelization came out even before the video game

 

[YoshiandToad]

Having watched the Resident Evil showcase I am once again saddened that the spirit event killed any chance for the likes of Chris Redfield and the gang to appear in Smash.

 

[Ivander]

Would you say .hack falls into this category too?

I'm not entirely sure with .hack. Because .hack definitely started as an anime and is in a similar case like with the Witcher, where the games do have a good following compared to the anime. Not to mention compared to Geralt, Kite did start as a video game character through the first .hack game. That was his first appearance. In the case for Hasuo, Hasuo the character started as a video game character, but the character playing Hasuo was in the anime before Hasuo's debut.

 

[cashregister9]

Would you say .hack falls into this category too?

I'm not sure because I'm not a historian on the Development history of .hack but from what I gather it would as the games were based directly off the manga. But the game was in development 2 years before the manga and anime came out.

 

[Hinata]

Cars is not a videogame franchise because the Game came out a day before the movie.

oh **** lightning mcqueen for smash y'all

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I'm not entirely sure with .hack. Because .hack definitely started as an anime, but it is a similar case like with the Witcher, where the games do have a good following and are more known compared to the anime. Not to mention compared to Geralt, Kite did start as a video game character through the first .hack game. That was his first appearance. In the case for Hasuo, Hasuo the character started as a video game character, but the character playing Hasuo was in the anime before Hasuo's debut.

.hack's anime came out like, a month or two before the game, so it's very likely a similar situation to Strider or Halo.

Yes, Halo is in that camp and you don't see people shut down Master Chief because "his franchise started as a novel"

 

[Hinata]

.hack's anime came out like, a month or two before the game, so it's very likely a similar situation to Strider or Halo.

Yes, Halo is in that camp and you don't see people shut down Master Chief because "his franchise started as a novel"

I feel like most people don't even know about the Halo novels. We can't all be Brian David Gilbert.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I feel like most people don't even know about the Halo novels. We can't all be Brian David Gilbert.

Not everyone would know about Strider manga either, to be fair.

Heck, most people in the general gaming audiences probably wouldn't know Strider at all if it wasn't for the Mahvel games.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

So no new Nintendo news this week. So I guess the unofficial direct for Q1 hasn't started yet. I guess the week of news will begin when the Zelda Anniversary Direct happens in February.

Next week will be the big question. If we get anything remotely significant it could be that this week was just the non-event in the cycle (perhaps reflecting that we got the 3D World and Pokemon Snap reveals in the same 1/10 -1/17 period and thus there wasn't anything they wanted to show for this one).

 

[Pillow]

.hack's anime came out like, a month or two before the game, so it's very likely a similar situation to Strider or Halo (yes, Halo is in that camp and you don't see people shut down Master Chief because "his franchise started as a novel")

I feel like .Hack is a weirder case though. It has a much stronger anime association than Strider had with the manga, or Halo with its books. .Hack anime wasn't just some promotional thing, it has several series tied to it. I could confidently call the Chief or Strider video game characters, but I wouldn't say the same for .Hack

It feels most similar to Digimon I think, which started as tamagotchi and also has very heavy anime association. It's kind of the reverse situation that Geralt has.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I feel like .Hack has a


I feel like .Hack is a weirder case though. It has a much stronger anime association than Strider had with the manga, or Halo with its books. .Hack anime wasn't just some promotional thing, it has several series tied to it. I could confidently call the Chief or Strider video game characters, but I wouldn't say the same for .Hack

It feels most similar to Digimon I think, which started as tamagotchi and also has very heavy anime association.

I don't know the franchise that much, so I'll just be an ignorant little **** and say Pokemon also has a strong anime presence.

At least I'm honest. That's gotta count for something, right? ^-^'

 

[Otoad64]

in my opinion it matters what the franchise is seen as by the general public, not neccesarily what it started as

geralt and strider are mainly known as videogame characters, whereas someone like goku is not.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I don't know the franchise that much, so I'll just be an ignorant little **** and say Pokemon also has a strong anime presence.

At least I'm honest. That's gotta count for something, right? ^-^'

I think the arguments come from people who argue that Tamagotchis aren't video games.

I believe as far as the dictionary is concerned, they are, albeit primitive ones. One could liken them to the Game & Watch systems.

 

[Pillow]

I don't know the franchise that much, so I'll just be an ignorant little **** and say Pokemon also has a strong anime presence.

At least I'm honest. That's gotta count for something, right? ^-^'

Yeah, Pokemon also has a strong anime presence. Arguably, the Pokemon anime also overshadows the games...but it's different from .Hack or Digimon because 1. It's (mostly) owned by Nintendo and 2. It's Pokemon the biggest multimedia franchise ever. I'm not so sure Nintendo/Sakurai would bend their video game only rule, assuming its a rule, for much smaller grey area franchises like Digimon or .Hack

I think the arguments come from people who argue that Tamagotchis aren't video games.

I believe as far as the dictionary is concerned, they are, albeit primitive ones. One could liken them to the Game & Watch systems.

I would also consider them games, but the main issue is that there's a case to be made that it's not. At any rate Digimon also has a far greater chance to get into Smash than .Hack, simply because it's the bigger name, though I wouldn't hold my breathe for either.

 

[cashregister9]

You don't need to dip into the whole "largest franchise" thing to justify why pokemon is in smash, It started as a game and it was popular, no mental gymnastics needed

 

[SNEKeater]

Having watched the Resident Evil showcase I am once again saddened that the spirit event killed any chance for the likes of Chris Redfield and the gang to appear in Smash.

We were completely robbed. I still remember the day they announced the RE spirit event...

 

[Ivander]

I guess it's hard to say what exactly counts, considering recently, FFVII: Advent Children, a movie, got 3 music tracks. Although those tracks were also remixes of tracks that were in the game. Not to mention Cloud's Advent Children costume.

 

[Firox]

I think it’s hard to compare Hayabusa to anyone in particular really? He’s like, I guess Lara, more than anyone. He’s a character that pretty much everyone knows and respects but is also a character not a lot of people have high affinity for. I mean I do because he’s been in a TON of stuff I’ve played over the years and I’ve fallen in love with him.

But it’s weird. Hayabusa probably won’t be very controversial of a choice because he just kind of makes sense but he also won’t blow peoples socks off like Dante or Crash. It’ll be a more of “oh hey that’s pretty cool” and they’ll move on.

It’s weird because I feel like altogether Hayabusa is just as recognizable as someone like Dante or Crash but he’s not as POPULAR as Dante or Crash. He’s in a very odd middle of the road appeal where pretty much everyone would be happy with him but he’s not going to be overly hype.

Personally, I’m fine with that as long as he gets in. I know he may not be the most hype choice for everyone but he is for me.

So the burning question:

If Hayabusa were to get into Smash, what would his character tile say on the character select screen? As in, what would the announcer say when you pick him? Would he be "RYU HAYABUSA!" or "HAYABUSA!" or "RYU H!" or just "RYU!" I know there's another Ryu in Smash, but I feel like the full "Ryu Hayabusa" is a bit of a mouthful and we already know that having two "Roys" isn't a problem, so would they just have two "Ryus"?

Either way, my Greninja eagerly awaits his chance to prove himself the superior ninja...

 

[Rie Sonomura]

So the burning question:

If Hayabusa were to get into Smash, what would his character tile say on the character select screen? As in, what would the announcer say when you pick him? Would he be "RYU HAYABUSA!" or "HAYABUSA!" or "RYU H!" or just "RYU!" I know there's another Ryu in Smash, but I feel like the full "Ryu Hayabusa" is a bit of a mouthful and we already know that having two "Roys" isn't a problem, so would they just have two "Ryus"?

To be fair one Roy is an alt of Bowser Jr

I feel like they’d just call him Hayabusa

 

[Pillow]

We were completely robbed. I still remember the day they announced the RE spirit event...

Capcom games in general should have a higher presence in Smash, there's so many great series that could be in. Though I'd prefer Jill to rep Resident Evil

So the burning question:

If Hayabusa were to get into Smash, what would his character tile say on the character select screen? As in, what would the announcer say when you pick him? Would he be "RYU HAYABUSA!" or "HAYABUSA!" or "RYU H!" or just "RYU!" I know there's another Ryu in Smash, but I feel like the full "Ryu Hayabusa" is a bit of a mouthful and we already know that having two "Roys" isn't a problem, so would they just have two "Ryus"?

Either way, my Greninja eagerly awaits his chance to prove himself the superior ninja...

Depends on how it's listed in the game screen. The two characters don't look similar at all so I doubt there would be confusion, but I could just see the announcer saying his full name. It's still less of a mouthful than G&W.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I maintain the notion that so long as the game being included has made a significant impact on gaming, it and the stuff important to it should be allowed.

So the burning question:

If Hayabusa were to get into Smash, what would his character tile say on the character select screen? As in, what would the announcer say when you pick him? Would he be "RYU HAYABUSA!" or "HAYABUSA!" or "RYU H!" or just "RYU!" I know there's another Ryu in Smash, but I feel like the full "Ryu Hayabusa" is a bit of a mouthful and we already know that having two "Roys" isn't a problem, so would they just have two "Ryus"?

Either way, my Greninja eagerly awaits his chance to prove himself the superior ninja...

Hopefully just Ryu. Duplicate names are allowed, and Ryu (Street Fighter) and Ryu (Ninja Gaiden) aren't pronounced the same anyway so there's not too much of an issue there I don't think.

They may just call him Hayabusa as he is in Dead or Alive though, which would bother me to no end.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

So the burning question:

If Hayabusa were to get into Smash, what would his character tile say on the character select screen? As in, what would the announcer say when you pick him? Would he be "RYU HAYABUSA!" or "HAYABUSA!" or "RYU H!" or just "RYU!" I know there's another Ryu in Smash, but I feel like the full "Ryu Hayabusa" is a bit of a mouthful and we already know that having two "Roys" isn't a problem, so would they just have two "Ryus"?

Either way, my Greninja eagerly awaits his chance to prove himself the superior ninja...

They go full SHAZAM and just call him the title of his games, leading to loads of new fans of his not quite getting his name.

"I think Ninja Gaiden is a pretty cool guy. He kills enemies and doesn't afraid of anything."

 

[cothero]

in my opinion it matters what the franchise is seen as by the general public, not neccesarily what it started as

Well, you can tell that to Sakurai.

 

[Firox]

Depends on how it's listed in the game screen. The two characters don't look similar at all so I doubt there would be confusion, but I could just see the announcer saying his full name. It's still less of a mouthful than G&W.

Interestingly, "MISTER GAME AND WATCH" is five syllables and "RYU HAYABUSA" is six which I believe is more than any other character currently in the game. I know it's not a huge deal, but just an observation.

(Honorable mention to Banjo-Kazooie which is also five syllables.)

 

[Megadoomer]

Interestingly, "MISTER GAME AND WATCH" is five syllables and "RYU HAYABUSA" is six which I believe is more than any other character currently in the game. I know it's not a huge deal, but just an observation.

Is Rosalina referred to as "Rosalina and Luma"? If that's the case, that's seven. (I think they were called that in one Smash game, but I can't remember if it was Smash 4, Ultimate, or both of them)

 

[Guynamednelson]

is six which I believe is more than any other character currently in the game

Ro-sa-li-na-and-lu-ma

I had to use what Smash insists on calling her instead of Rosalina, but that's still seven syllables for the announcer to say.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Interestingly, "MISTER GAME AND WATCH" is five syllables and "RYU HAYABUSA" is six which I believe is more than any other character currently in the game. I know it's not a huge deal, but just an observation.

To my knowledge, Ryu uses the correct pronunciation of his name ("roo"...but more Japanese sounding) so I think that would still be 5 syllables.

 

[Firox]

Is Rosalina referred to as "Rosalina and Luma"? If that's the case, that's seven. (I think they were called that in one Smash game, but I can't remember if it was Smash 4, Ultimate, or both of them)

Ro-sa-li-na-and-lu-ma

I had to use what Smash insists on calling her instead of Rosalina, but that's still seven syllables for the announcer to say.

LOL OK, you got me. "Rosalina and Luma" does take the cake, though to be fair, they're technically two separate people. Man, I never realized that that was Rosalina's official name in Smash Bros.