Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Pillow]

You know they all have the option to say "I'd love that" or "that would be nice to see" instead of saying no, right? Like the SNK guy did.

Interviews meaning nothing exist in a reality where yes and no are the only possible answers.

We’re discussing Hayabusa right? I believe a vague tweet falls within that spectrum between yes and no...

 

[Brother AJ]

Personalities isn’t much of an issue. The actual issue is they have very different body shapes....

I mean I agree about body types, but I wouldn't say personality isn't an issue. They're both important. Coco just isn't as unhinged as Crash. It wouldn't make sense.

 

[Golden Icarus]

Different personalities, yet they do the exact same moves as each other so I'm not exactly seeing the issue.

An alt means that they'd have the same taunts, victory screens, attack animations, etc. To make that work, you'd either have to really tone down Crash's insanity, or really exaggerate Coco's insanity and I don't think either of those options are great.

 

[Louie G.]

From where it used to be? It absolutely has. Go back and look at 2019 discourse.

Well yeah, because Doom Slayer had a very definitive statement that divided his massive support base. I'm not saying that the interview did nothing for his status within speculation, because it did take a significant hit - just that it didn't "crumple". It still exists, far greater than you would imagine from a character who was given such a long-winded response about why he will not be in the game. Which is generally going to be accepted as more definitive than "I'm waiting for an invitation". It's not a great comparison.

All four of those characters have indelibly sunk in terms of attention and discussion from where they used to reside. And in the case of 2B and Doom Slayer, it happened post their statements, not later with content from their companies showing up. People around here used to think the KT rep could go either between Ryu or Ryza. Go back and check. Can't say that's how people look at it now, is it?

Ryza was literally only taken seriously because of a 4chan text leak. She was a fad that came and gone within a couple months. Not to demean anyone who did anticipate her or genuinely wanted her, but it was not an equal competition. Most people understood that Hayabusa was still the go-to.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Probably but it's such an iconic part of the series, god bless Janet Hsu, a legend of localization

Maybe they could have had her ask for hamburgers and then be disappointed when it was ramen instead, or considering we're still getting rice balls called things that they aren't, they could have just committed (though ramen is way more common in America than rice balls are so that might make the viewer feel like their intelligence has been insulted).

Actually, come to think of it, Vess's design is very obviously inspired by old anime aesthetics, so her rice balls being called dumplings might have been a throwback, which actually does make the joke kind of funny.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Female and Male Byleth have different Taunts right? Body Shape definitely seems to be the prevailing issue for character like Coco and Crash being lumped into 1 fighter.

Though they managed to make it work decently well for the Koopalings, so maybe? (That’s obviously a different scenario though as the Clown Car did most of the job, but it does show the Smash team is willing to mess with proportions for alts)

 

[Rie Sonomura]

An alt means that they'd have the same taunts, victory screens, attack animations, etc. To make that work, you'd either have to really tone down Crash's insanity, or really exaggerate Coco's insanity and I don't think either of those options are great.

Plus, Coco actually speaks full sentences. Crash’s “vocabulary” is just yelps and grunts

 

[Pillow]

I mean I agree about body types, but I wouldn't say personality isn't an issue. They're both important. Coco just isn't as unhinged as Crash. It wouldn't make sense.

Olimar, Bowser Jr, and the Luminary all have very different personalities from their alternate skins. The sad fact is that characters in Smash really don’t convey their actual personalities that well, it’s usually entirely in the taunts. I don’t think personality is ever going to be a deciding factor on whether characters can slot in as alternate colors.

 

[dream1ng]

That is the same as a vague answer/non-answer.
They have the option of saying anything, it doesn't mean anything no matter what they answer though.

To invalidate the interview requires ignoring the precedent that 90-something percent of the time they're being honest, and requires believing they are subject to an NDA, which means believing the character is actually in.

Just because they could be bound by NDA doesn't mean the chances of that being the case are as good as the chances of them simply being honest. So I'm not going to act like each outcome is worth as much as the other and on that basis completely invalidate the statement we've been presented with.

 

[ahemtoday]

I think we could all use a break, so let's talk XCOM. It's 100% not happening, but I recently got XCOM 2 for 70% off and I think it would be neat.

Mainly, I think it would be funny if there were several soldier designs and each time you lose a stock, the soldier in question changes to a different one: Referencing the permadeath in the series. It would be too much work, but I'd love it.

If it happened, I could see the fighter doing some interesting stuff, like an overwatch mechanic of some kind (ranged counter? idk) or creating cover to act as an in-between as you try to zone people out.

I haven't played 2 yet, so I couldn't tell you what specifically could be pulled from that game. I think I've read that some soldiers have knives, though, so that's something.

Honestly, yeah, an XCOM character would be pretty cool to see.

An XCOM Soldier could have maybe a laser or plasma assault rifle. Cover and Overwatch are vital to the reboot's gameplay, so of course there could be something for those. You could also give them stuff like the Arc Thrower, or the GREMLIN. I mean, part of XCOM's appeal is that you go from "military men with machine guns" to "superhero psions with spazers" - and if we can only pick one of those, I know which one's more exciting.

Speaking of psions, maybe a Psi Operative, specifically, would be best. I guess in XCOM 1 they're just "Psionics", but whatever. Their moveset could include most of the same stuff a regular soldier's could (they are, after all, a subtype thereof), but you could also get Sectoid-like psionic abilities that are even more specifically XCOM.

Though I wonder if this is one of those situations where the character pick is somewhat up-in-the-air. XCOM is about aliens invading Earth, so maybe a Sectoid would be a better pick...

I dunno, this is an interesting rabbit hole to go down.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Honestly, yeah, an XCOM character would be pretty cool to see.

An XCOM Soldier could have maybe a laser or plasma assault rifle. Cover and Overwatch are vital to the reboot's gameplay, so of course there could be something for those. You could also give them stuff like the Arc Thrower, or the GREMLIN. I mean, part of XCOM's appeal is that you go from "military men with machine guns" to "superhero psions with spazers" - and if we can only pick one of those, I know which one's more exciting.

Speaking of psions, maybe a Psi Operative, specifically, would be best. I guess in XCOM 1 they're just "Psionics", but whatever. Their moveset could include most of the same stuff a regular soldier's could (they are, after all, a subtype thereof), but you could also get Sectoid-like psionic abilities that are even more specifically XCOM.

Though I wonder if this is one of those situations where the character pick is somewhat up-in-the-air. XCOM is about aliens invading Earth, so maybe a Sectoid would be a better pick...

I dunno, this is an interesting rabbit hole to go down.

I’m down for an Xcom rep so long as they have a move with BS percentages that manages to miss with 90% accuracy. Gives Smash players the true Xcom experience.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Female and Male Byleth have different Taunts right?

The difference is mostly in their wrists, so their hitboxes still match up.

Though they managed to make it work decently well for the Koopalings, so maybe?

Igore Coco would be super cursed.

Alternatively, we'd have something more akin to Skylanders Crash, which is...less cursed.

 

[Pillow]

Honestly, yeah, an XCOM character would be pretty cool to see.

An XCOM Soldier could have maybe a laser or plasma assault rifle. Cover and Overwatch are vital to the reboot's gameplay, so of course there could be something for those. You could also give them stuff like the Arc Thrower, or the GREMLIN. I mean, part of XCOM's appeal is that you go from "military men with machine guns" to "superhero psions with spazers" - and if we can only pick one of those, I know which one's more exciting.

Speaking of psions, maybe a Psi Operative, specifically, would be best. I guess in XCOM 1 they're just "Psionics", but whatever. Their moveset could include most of the same stuff a regular soldier's could (they are, after all, a subtype thereof), but you could also get Sectoid-like psionic abilities that are even more specifically XCOM.

Though I wonder if this is one of those situations where the character pick is somewhat up-in-the-air. XCOM is about aliens invading Earth, so maybe a Sectoid would be a better pick...

I dunno, this is an interesting rabbit hole to go down.

What we want - XCOM
What we’ll get - Rabbid with a gun

 

[Deleted member]

I don't think Yasuda is being deliberately vague, as if he's trying to avoid breaking an NDA without lying about it.

He's just saying he'd like an invitation from Nintendo to let Hayabusa join Smash. It's not really all that deep.

Or is it?!

 

[Golden Icarus]

All of the Heroes are pretty much blank slates, the Koopalings moveset is basically a "koopa clown car" moveset, and Olimar and Alph also have pretty similar personalities (in the grand scheme of things). Coco and Crash are radically different. Also, the Smash team is a lot more careful when portraying third party characters, so I'm not sure that they'd want to add Coco if it meant screwing up her personality.

 

[Louie G.]

Olimar, Bowser Jr, and the Luminary all have very different personalities from their alternate skins. The sad fact is that characters in Smash really don’t convey their actual personalities that well, it’s usually entirely in the taunts. I don’t think personality is ever going to be a deciding factor on whether characters can slot in as alternate colors.

It already was a deciding factor. Sakurai has acknowledged Daisy's personality and new animations as precedent for making her an echo fighter.

I think what matters more is the context of the characters we're talking about. Olimar... I think could have been handled a lot better. But the focus of this character is clearly the Pikmin. Olimar and Alph are a vessel for the Pikmin, who are technically the ones doing the fighting. Similarly, Bowser Jr and the Koopalings are all fighting within the Clown Car. Even though they're all treated as their own characters, we're really playing as the Clown Car in the end.

Luminary was likely handled the way he was because the Heroes are all effectively silent protagonists with the same functions in their respective games. I'm not an expert on DQ but I've never really seen anyone take issue with this. I don't think any of them are particularly known for their dynamic personalities, though.

Coco, and the "ARMS situation" before her, work less through this lens because they aren't a "vessel" for something like Pikmin or the Clown Car, and are distinctly their own characters with dynamic personalities that play a prominent role in their games. Having Coco act like she's the Tasmanian Devil would be offputting - obviously the other, more prominent factor here is her skeleton, but hopefully you understand where I'm coming from.

It was even more ridiculous with ARMS, because the variety between fighters is the bread and butter of any fighting game. It would be a piss poor way to showcase how fun and interesting your diverse cast of characters is by squishing them all into the same moveset through Smash. I still can't believe people were arguing this so genuinely at the time.

 

[ZephyrZ]

If Crash got in, he'd have to be zany and overanimated. It's not an option. It's an important part of his character and appeal.

If you muted it down just to make Coco work as an alt, you won't be doing him justice. Maybe Coco could work as a Dark Samus style echo who has tweeked animations, but not as an alt.

It's not the same as the DQ protagonists who are silent, or the Koopalings who are one note, all have a similar brand of silly and are often lumped together anyway. This is more like Banjo and K.Rool who chew the scenery and are overanimated in everything they do.

Female and Male Byleth have different Taunts right? Body Shape definitely seems to be the prevailing issue for character like Coco and Crash being lumped into 1 fighter.

Though they managed to make it work decently well for the Koopalings, so maybe? (That’s obviously a different scenario though as the Clown did most of the job, but it does show the Smash team is willing to mess with proportions for alts)

When alts have different taunts or victory screens, they tend to be very minor tweaks rather then complete animation overhauls.

I think this is the main reason Daisy is an echo and not an alt despite playing exactly the same as her counterpart.

 

[dream1ng]

Well yeah, because Doom Slayer had a very definitive statement that divided his massive support base. I'm not saying that the interview did nothing for his status within speculation, because it did take a significant hit - just that it didn't "crumple". It still exists, far greater than you would imagine from a character who was given such a long-winded response about why he will not be in the game. Which is generally going to be accepted as more definitive than "I'm waiting for an invitation". It's not a great comparison.

It being significantly less than it was beforehand is crumpling. Like I said, I'm comparing it pre and post statement.

To say there's zero mention of Doom Slayer these days or something is putting words in my mouth. I'm saying after that statement there was far far less expectation, and thus discussion. Sure there was still Cacomallow nonsense and diehards, but overall it took a huge hit.

Ryza was literally only taken seriously because of a 4chan text leak. She was a fad that came and gone within a couple months. Not to demean anyone who did anticipate her or genuinely wanted her, but it was not an equal competition. Most people understood that Hayabusa was still the go-to.

Well it's very interesting that when she went just happened to coincide with when that statement came out, isn't it? My point has nothing to do with her actual likeliness, just how she was treated within discussion.

And here are some more. Frank O'Connor and Suda51 indicated Master Chief and Travis respectively weren't in the game at around the beginning of FP1, and you can go back and check how discourse of both of those characters dried up until additional characters were announced.

These statements do affect the volume of discussion surrounding the character.

 

[Golden Icarus]

Well it's very interesting that when she went just happened to coincide with when that statement came out, isn't it? My point has nothing to do with her actual likeliness, just how she was treated within discussion.

And here are some more. Frank O'Connor and Suda51 indicated Master Chief and Travis respectively weren't in the game at around the beginning of FP1, and you can go back and check how discourse of both of those characters dried up until additional characters were announced.

These statements do affect the volume of discussion surrounding the character.

Regarding Master Chief, discussion for him has been very steady despite everything. From what I remember, he was discussed about just as often as Steve during early FP2 speculation and he's still one of the most commonly discussed characters even after Steve.

 

[Peripuff]

I really hope they would add Coco. I don’t really care about much of the Crash series right now but I’ve played several of the games as a child and I grew really attached to Coco.

An alt would most certainly not work, I can only hope she gets in as a bonus echo fighter or something. Perhaps in Smash 6 or something.

Question for Crash fans: is there a situation with Coco that is similar to the Simon/Richter situation where adding some moves that she uses could be used as justification of her inclusion as an echo or is there no such example?

With all that being said the one decision made in Smash that I will forever dislike is having characters with different personalities like Alph be alts. I just can’t get behind that, especially now that echoes are a thing

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Similarly, Bowser Jr and the Koopalings are all fighting within the Clown Car. Even though they're all treated as their own characters, we're really playing as the Clown Car in the end.

I personally think this is a problem. Because the Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings are sharing animations, they're forced into their New Super Mario Bros. personality and can't really show of their quirks beyond voice clips. That, and all of their fighting styles are different, and none of them get their quirks represented here either.

This is made more in support of your argument than against it: If you're to be an alternate costume of a character, you pretty much have to be the base character or one or both of their characters will lose what makes them special.

 

[dream1ng]

Regarding Master Chief, discussion for him has been very steady despite everything. From what I remember, he was discussed about just as often as Steve during early FP2 speculation and he's still one of the most commonly discussed characters even after Steve.

Right... I said it dried up until there was the announcement of more characters. Your examples come from that following period.

 

[Inue Houji]

To invalidate the interview requires ignoring the precedent that 90-something percent of the time they're being honest, and requires believing they are subject to an NDA, which means believing the character is actually in.

Just because they could be bound by NDA doesn't mean the chances of that being the case are as good as the chances of them simply being honest. So I'm not going to act like each outcome is worth as much as the other and on that basis completely invalidate the statement we've been presented with.

I don't know if you're being deliberately obtuse.
It does not indicate anything either way.
No matter which company you ask, you'll always get the same answer. It isn't actual information.

Let's say there's 10 people, you know one of them has stolen your apple.
You ask 9 of them if they stole it, all of them say no.
Does that mean the remaining person is the most likely to have stolen it?
No, because none of them would admit it either way.

 

[Eldrake]

XCOM Operative talks?

If we ever get a XCOM rep, their reveal trailer better be based on the intro of the original game, X-COM: UFO Defense, or I will be severely disappointed.

 

[ahemtoday]

I’m down for an Xcom rep so long as they have a move with BS percentages that manages to miss with 90% accuracy. Gives Smash players the true Xcom experience.

I feel like you could give them a grenade that bounces "randomly", sort of like Banjo's Grenade Egg except you can't grab it. The catch is that the grenade's trajectory is secretly not random, but actively malevolent, making a concerted effort to bounce into the least helpful location more often than not. It does a lot of damage, but if you want it to hit you need to plan for the absolute worst-case scenario.

Ironically, this is the exact opposite of the original, where grenades are you one safe haven for guaranteed damage. I just think it'd feel bizarre in the context of a fighting game for gunfire to not go where you expect.

 

[warubyun]

In the event of XCOM representation, I feel like some reference to/content from Civilization should be included, and vice versa. Were it to happen, it is doubtful that Firaxis would get more than one shot at representation.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Let's say there's 10 people, you know one of them has stolen your apple.
You ask 9 of them if they stole it, all of them say no.
Does that mean the remaining person is the most likely to have stolen it?
No, because none of them would admit it either way.

But if 5 of those people gave you a clear cut "no", and the other 5 gave you some vague non-answer, then it is extremely likely that the people who said no actually meant no. Since it means that they didn't feel the need to be coy or bend over backwards to avoid lying.

 

[Louie G.]

These statements do affect the volume of discussion surrounding the character.

Okay, believe what you like then. Hayabusa has been one of the most frequently and prominently discussed characters since practically the beginning of DLC. To believe that support and speculation will fade away so easily, from a very simple and vague PR answer to a trap question (unlike "I don't think Sakurai wants it" or "there were talks but nothing came of it"), is just ignoring the full context of the situation. This doesn't exactly invalidate what you said about the other characters but obviously this is where the conversation stemmed from.

People will continue to talk about him about as much as they did before up until DLC formally ends or we get a more direct confirmation - only now every time he comes up the conversation will drift into how the interview should be interpreted. It probably killed all interesting discussion that could be had, but the discussion will still occur either way.

9/10 times it boils down to like... if people want this to disconfirm it will for them, if they don't then it won't. Of course that isn't always going to be the case (some people like to err on the side of caution, many judge things as objectively as they can) but people will interpret information how they like. It's just an unproductive point of conversation to scour over such a short statement.

I personally think this is a problem. Because the Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings are sharing animations, they're forced into their New Super Mario Bros. personality and can't really show of their quirks beyond voice clips. That, and all of their fighting styles are different, and none of them get their quirks represented here either.

I am always an advocate for strong character over anything else. I do think it's a shame that the Clown Car and by extension the Koopaling alts prevent Bowser Jr from being a real "character". I do think their moveset is very fun and creative, but at the expense of their distinct personalities which they are all filled to the brim with. My personal values toward fighting game characters lie in the idea that one character is worth realizing in their fullest capacity than sacrificing their originality for the sake of artificially adding more.

...Don't take this as a statement against echo fighters, I think that's a different thing altogether. At least Daisy and Dark Samus are still their own characters and convey that very well, even if they have to make some accommodations moveset wise. Personality is probably what I value most about the cast so as long as that can be properly expressed I will be pretty much satisfied.

 

[Slime Master]

This discussion is silly because regardless of whether or not personality matters, having different bones is a killing blow to alt costume potential. But since people seem to want an opinion on the DQ heroes: them being silent protagonists does make it largely not an issue, but they are usually depicted with different expressions that insert some personality. Eight in particular usually leans towards goofier expressions. I do think he loses a bit by having to share animations with the other heroes but it's not a huge loss.

I do take issue with calling Olimar and Alph basically the same character though. Olimar's great, Alph is boring and generic.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

An alt means that they'd have the same taunts, victory screens, attack animations, etc. To make that work, you'd either have to really tone down Crash's insanity, or really exaggerate Coco's insanity and I don't think either of those options are great.

That's not a problem because Coco does the exact same things that Crash does. Even if they do it a little differently both Male and Female Byleth's have different animations to their taunts and victories. The N.Sane trilogy makes Coco nearly as insane as her brother so all they need to do is fix up their models so they're sort of similar and there you go.

 

[MooMew64]

In the event of XCOM representation, I feel like some reference to/content from Civilization should be included, and vice versa. Were it to happen, it is doubtful that Firaxis would get more than one shot at representation.

Forget XCOM, gimme a Civ rep.

Gimme Gandhi.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

When alts have different taunts or victory screens, they tend to be very minor tweaks rather then complete animation overhauls.

I think this is the main reason Daisy is an echo and not an alt despite playing exactly the same as her counterpart.

There are slight differences in hurtboxes of Peach and Daisy’s idle stances and running animations so there is some very tiny gameplay differences. But yes, otherwise it is Daisy’s personality difference as showcased in her idle animations and taunts that separated her from all the alt costume characters.

 

[Inue Houji]

But if 5 of those people gave you a clear cut "no", and the other 5 gave you some vague non-answer, then it is extremely likely that the people who said no actually meant no. Since it means that they didn't feel the need to be coy or bend over backwards to avoid lying.

Lying is literally part of their job. All it says anything about, is the interviewees personality.

 

[DarthEnderX]

How would this affect Speculation for Ryu in Smash?

I think the Answer, if that is the correct translation, Doesn't delve deep into the Status of Ryu. Technically it could be worded that Ryu hasn't received his invitation because he hasn't been announced yet, if he was playable

The answer is what someone who's character hasn't been invited to Smash yet would say.

But there's no way to tell if he's being coy or being sincere.

I’d say that that technically a character doesn’t get their Invitation until their reveal trailer. So this is a major non-answer IMO.

I'd agree. A character that's been greenlighted is still "waiting for their invitation" until their reveal trailer.

Alright, I have a question for everybody. Now that Hyabusa is supposedly out of the running, who do you think is the most likely retro rep we could possibly get. I think Bill Rizer is likely the biggest NES rep left but might have issues with his play style due to being purely a gunner.

This is correct.

Two other frontrunners I would have said were Arthur and Kunio. But they've already been Mii'd and Spirit'd.

Maybe Billy and Jimmy Lee, but they did show up, I wouldn't be surprised if it was as Brawlers.

If he was in though, I doubt they'd even be allowed to hint at that.

Yeah, I'm sure Nintendo would have much preferred it if he'd responded with "I'm not allowed to respond to that question due to an NDA I'm currently under." That definitely wouldn't have been suspicious or anything...

 

[Peripuff]

Speaking of echo fighters, I just realized is the only instance of an echo fighter happening without a unique newcomer from the same series being introduced in the same game. Like the others had , , , , and

Chun-Li confirmed?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I feel like you could give them a grenade that bounces "randomly", sort of like Banjo's Grenade Egg except you can't grab it. The catch is that the grenade's trajectory is secretly not random, but actively malevolent, making a concerted effort to bounce into the least helpful location more often than not. It does a lot of damage, but if you want it to hit you need to plan for the absolute worst-case scenario.

Ironically, this is the exact opposite of the original, where grenades are you one safe haven for guaranteed damage. I just think it'd feel bizarre in the context of a fighting game for gunfire to not go where you expect.

Even more ironically, the attack would probably still be unpredictable enough to be an amazing stage control tool, and would likely catch a ton of players trying to avoid it off guard, causing them to get hit anyway.

EDIT: Unless the bouncing caused the speed to go up or down rather than causing the grenade to bounce significantly higher or lower as well.

...Don't take this as a statement against echo fighters, I think that's a different thing altogether. At least Daisy and Dark Samus are still their own characters and convey that very well, even if they have to make some accommodations moveset wise.

I agree with that. More should be done with most of them even if for no other reason that as separate characters, they are expected to add something gameplay wise, but they are all at least a step above the characters that were squished into the same slot.

Lying is literally part of their job.

Call me naive if you want but I don't believe you.

 

[ALongWistfulSquiggle]

I feel like you could give them a grenade that bounces "randomly", sort of like Banjo's Grenade Egg except you can't grab it. The catch is that the grenade's trajectory is secretly not random, but actively malevolent, making a concerted effort to bounce into the least helpful location more often than not. It does a lot of damage, but if you want it to hit you need to plan for the absolute worst-case scenario.

Ironically, this is the exact opposite of the original, where grenades are you one safe haven for guaranteed damage. I just think it'd feel bizarre in the context of a fighting game for gunfire to not go where you expect.

I feel like the gunfire could have random range instead of trajectory, and you'd get a somewhat similar feel. You're a long-ranged fighter that might not hit from too far away, so you have to be closer than comfortable to have a guaranteed hit. So from 50% of the way across the stage, you could hit, but you also might get the short distance shot that doesn't help you in that situation, leaving you open if the other guy is fast enough.

 

[SKX31]

I feel like you could give them a grenade that bounces "randomly", sort of like Banjo's Grenade Egg except you can't grab it. The catch is that the grenade's trajectory is secretly not random, but actively malevolent, making a concerted effort to bounce into the least helpful location more often than not. It does a lot of damage, but if you want it to hit you need to plan for the absolute worst-case scenario.

Ironically, this is the exact opposite of the original, where grenades are you one safe haven for guaranteed damage. I just think it'd feel bizarre in the context of a fighting game for gunfire to not go where you expect.

You know, that might be more helpful than it sounds. Assuming it doesn't bounce instantly that is.

Most adept Snake players (those I face off against regularily on Elite Smash and above that level) will usually pull a Grenade when they've recently been sent to the air. The reason they do it is to ensure that if the opponent hits him, both take damage from the grenade and thus it break up many combo / juggle attempts. Adept B-K players will sometimes do something similar with their Grenades, especially if the opponent's close by. Although it isn't as common with B-K since B-K have to drift back to catch their grenade, while Snake has his Grenade ready pretty much instantly after pushing B.

Likewise, it'd be fully possible for the X-COM player to pull the grenade just as they're about to get hit, so any way it'd still be a potentially good combo-breaker.

Forget XCOM, gimme a Civ rep.

Gimme Gandhi.

Bottom Text.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I feel like the gunfire could have random range instead of trajectory, and you'd get a somewhat similar feel. You're a long-ranged fighter that might not hit from too far away, so you have to be closer than comfortable to have a guaranteed hit. So from 50% of the way across the stage, you could hit, but you also might get the short distance shot that doesn't help you in that situation, leaving you open if the other guy is fast enough.

So single shot attacks are risky zoning tools and multi-shot attacks are risk-reward damage racking tools? That sounds neat.

Can't wait to see the play where the soldier makes a shot, the opponent tries to reflect it, but it doesn't go far enough to hit so the soldier gets a free punish.

 

[2006ToyotaTacoma]

Bottom Text.

Ah, the theme of Nuclear Armageddon.