RGFS
Smash Journeyman
Don't forget Ice-T made it into Smash at the same time...
I actually can't believe they went with him considering songs like this:
Ice-T- 6 'N The Mornin'
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Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II
- Thread starter Cyn
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I actually can't believe they went with him considering songs like this:
www.youtube.com
Shroob
Sup?
I think this "Banjo isn't popular in Japan" thing is some of the worst misinfo I've ever seen.The thing that makes Halo unlikely to me is that Master Chief is not popular at all in Japan. I don't see him in as a fighter to begin with. He doesn't really appeal to the Nintend-ish crowd to be part of the second line of characters for E3.
: Big Boyes (that are also well received in Japan)
My assumptions are big phat speculation too though so I have to stress that. So far though, that's where my confidence lies in how characters get chosen at E3. I'm not confident that we'll see two characters at E3 time that aren't that big in Japan. I'm not even confident we'll get two western characters next. I'm not even that confident that we'll get more than one character by E3 time. I'm not even confident Smash Ultimate is actually a thing...
Was Banjo "big" in Japan? Compared to Hero, no.
Did I see a ****ton of Japanese reaction channels screaming "BANJO-KAZOOIE?!!!!" on NND? Absolutely. The game is the best selling non-Japanese N64 game iirc.
CapitaineCrash
Smash Champion
Byleth isn't actually a demon, he just gained the name "Ashen demons" because as a mercenary, he use to kill his enemies with no remorse and no emotions.
That being said, fun fact: the name Byleth comes from the demon Beleth. It's a demon king who have other demons in his commands. Byleth is loosely based on this, because as a teacher he have the students on his commands.
RGFS
Smash Journeyman
Yeah I know, I was purely trying to go for speculating patterns for E3.me when i statisically prove what characters can or cant get into smash bros by loosely "researching" their popularity levels right before they get into smash bros
happens every time
I want Scorpion and Chief a lot. I'm just not confident in speculating they would be chosen over more popular or worldwide characters.
It is important to note Fallout got a Mii Costume. There is hope at least.
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ALongWistfulSquiggle
Smash Lord
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Professor Pumpkaboo
Lady Layton| Trap Queen♥
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I still think hoes mad was acceptable for Byleth and Hero personally. Hero because of "more sword users? Really? RNG?Hero sucks" and Byleth because " no one even likes him. No one even wants him" salt
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Dan Quixote
Smash Lord
Hero INVENTED hoes mad baby 
CapitaineCrash
Smash Champion
From what I can found Banjo-Kazooie is the 22 best selling N64 games in Japan with more than 400,000 sales. So while you could argue that he's a bit less popular there, most big Nintendo fans would still probably know him.
SpectreJordan
Smash Lord
You guys are weird about the Pac-Man reveal. It wasn’t during the E3 direct, but it was still a part of the E3 news cycle. Thus, he was an E3 reveal.
If I remember correctly, it was only a couple hours after the Direct too.
If I remember correctly, it was only a couple hours after the Direct too.
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Lamperouge
Drifting Soul
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Nah, I definitely remember the Direct happening in the afternoon while Pac Man's trailer wasn't uploaded until sometime that night.
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MooMew64
sometimes here, sometimes there
Honestly, I was surprised at how little anger I saw over Pyra and Mythra. Places I've seen were either hyped or just a little disappointed.
As for me personally, I was meh on 'em at first, but the improved Smash Bros. designs and music have won me over. I think it was a solid choice, and I'm happy for Xenoblade fans that they're getting what they want.
As for me personally, I was meh on 'em at first, but the improved Smash Bros. designs and music have won me over. I think it was a solid choice, and I'm happy for Xenoblade fans that they're getting what they want.
Shroob
Sup?
The fact that we learned of Pac Man's existence not from E3 itself, but from random game journalists losing their mind over Twitter
We live(d) in a society.
Al-kīmiyā'
Smash the State
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I wonder if they modelled the
That's why it irritates me that people pronounce their name with an "ai" sound. What the **** was the localization team thinking?
Cosmic77
Smash Hero
This upcoming E3 is sort of in a weird position for a Smash reveal. Yeah, it's E3, and while that's usually when we get the "big" stuff, it's also the end of the pass. Smash reveals that are toward the end have historically received either mixed or neutral reactions from fans (which makes sense because it's wise to show your best stuff first).
We'll see though. I'm sure it's more than likely a third-party, but I don't think it'll be anyone who can meet the high expectations people are putting on the reveal.
We'll see though. I'm sure it's more than likely a third-party, but I don't think it'll be anyone who can meet the high expectations people are putting on the reveal.
Pillow
Smash Lord
If you're going for worldwide appeal, I doubt there's a single character left that can top Chief as he's one of the few western characters whose series was semi-popular in Japan.
RGFS
Smash Journeyman
You misunderstand me. I'm not saying he isn't popular. I'm saying he's not that popular especially when compared to Hero. My attempt was to analyze Smash E3 reveals that we recently got. BK sold pretty well but it really isn't the same as Dragon Quest's size is exactly the point I'm getting across.
Banjo-Kazooie did fine in Japan, from what I can tell the main two games sold around 700,000 in Japan. But that one character just didn't appeal to Japan as hard as Hero. The same went for Steve and Min Min. Minecraft sold incredibly well in Japan at around 4 million while the immediate numbers from Arms were considered better than expected in Japan at around 100,000, even assuming Arms sold 10 times as much after, Minecraft still is more popular.
Again, Banjo still being decently popular in Japan, and Nintend-ish is why I think he got in and why I wouldn't bet on Master Chief for now.
That's what I mean by the two categories for predicting E3. It is not full proof, it's a stretch, it won't predict the characters, but it's the closest thing I could think about as a pattern. This is why my crackpot theory took a shot at saying Crash and a GTA rep were gonna be the E3 duo despite it being a hard stretch.
Shroob
Sup?
I mean, let's say it's Monster Hunter. Is that a "big" reveal?
Tbh yeah, maybe not as big as say Banjo was, but Japan would be losing it hard, and it's not even like MonHun is unpopular here either.
Not that much of an issue to me.
Al-kīmiyā'
Smash the State
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How do you figure?
Shroob
Sup?
D
Deleted member
Guest
Prefiero el atuendo de Smash para Mythra sobre el tbh original.
Leggings, hombre.
Leggings, hombre.
MooMew64
sometimes here, sometimes there
Lamperouge
Drifting Soul
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There's never going to be a Smash newcomer more curiously timed than Pac Man.
Al-kīmiyā'
Smash the State
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Why do you think they look nicer?
Shroob
Sup?
No one gonna bring up the random person who copied my post entirely in Spanish?
No?
Ok
No?
Ok
TwiceEXE
Smash Ace
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I prefer Mythra's new outfit because the black provides a nice contrast against the white and gold. The cream color of her legs doesn't stand out nearly as well.
Guybrush20X6
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Rea
It's like that perpetually grumpy uncle putting on a forced smile for holiday pictures and making everyone wish he hadn't.
D
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¿Nadie va a mencionar a la persona al azar que copió mi publicación completamente en español?
Lamperouge
Drifting Soul
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He's got a point tho.
MooMew64
sometimes here, sometimes there
I prefer character designs that aren't super sexualized.
The new Smash designs tone 'em down a bit, so I like that.
That's pretty much it.
Speed Weed
Smash Master
SnowClaws
Smash Apprentice
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Does Joker's personal Persona Arsène count as a demon? You know like how the whole concept behind Persona is the manifestation of one own inner demon.
Nekoo
Smash Master
Sakurai: "We tried to make Byleth the best Distant Demon"
Min-min Releasing right after, and Sephiroth releasing two fighter after:
There wasn't any character having such a long lived unique archetype as Byleth, lmao, even worth when you see that he did that concept much better with Min-min and Sephiroth.
Min-min Releasing right after, and Sephiroth releasing two fighter after:
There wasn't any character having such a long lived unique archetype as Byleth, lmao, even worth when you see that he did that concept much better with Min-min and Sephiroth.
Lamperouge
Drifting Soul
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I still think Pyra's change was a bit pointless but Mythra isI prefer character designs that aren't super sexualized.
The new Smash designs tone 'em down a bit, so I like that.
That's pretty much it.
.
Shroob
Sup?
MooMew64
sometimes here, sometimes there
NGL Mythra might be my favorite design in Smash right now next to Inklings. She looks pretty cool!I still think Pyra's change was a bit pointless but Mythra is
3BitSaurus
Smash Master
If I'm not mistaken, the original Banjo-Kazooie also sold better in Japan than most of... anything Microsoft, really. Even most Halo games, if I remember correctly.
EDIT: According to a few articles I found, Halo sells an average of 30K per game in Japan, while Banjo Kazooie is listed in N64 rankings as selling almost 406K copies.
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It was like Nintendo tried to control the flow of information, but didn't fully account for said journalists losing their minds over it and spreading the info further.
It's those kinds of missteps that dot Nintendo's history and present-day actions here and there.
Prepare yourself:
kylexv
Smash Master
Gonna post something that's been on my mind in the days since Pyra/Mythra's reveal, and that is my general first impressions of every newcomer that was added in Smash 4 and Ultimate. I've been on this website since right before Smash 4's reveal (I lurked for several months before making an account), so I'd thought it would be cool to give what my thoughts were on these characters back in the day. This post is limited to the Smash 4 newcomers, and I'll probably talk about my impressions of the Ultimate newcomers once the second Fighters Pass is finished.
...Whew, that was a doozy. If you're looking for a bit of a time capsule back to the Smash 4 days, well, here you go.
Believe it or not, Villager was not a popular pick for Smash 4, and this is for one singular reason: a comment Sakurai had made back before Smash 4's development was announced. Sakurai stated that Villager was a character not suited for battle, that they couldn't fight. After all, Animal Crossing is one of the most peaceful games that Nintendo has made. Because of this, myself and others on this board in 2013 were surprised to see Villager show up in Smash 4's first trailer. In retrospect, we all seem really stupid, but speculation was much different back in the day (by the end of DLC, more than half of Ultimate's characters would have debuted in either Smash 4 or Ultimate). All in all, despite not really being an Animal Crossing fan at that point in time, I was happy to see Villager make his debut into Smash, as Animal Crossing was getting too big to ignore. [6.5/10]
For those who are not aware, Mega Man was the most requested character for Smash 4. Brawl was notable in opening up the door to third party characters with Solid Snake and Sonic the Hedgehog, but what new third party character(s) would we get? Snake's return seemed very unlikely due to circumstances with Konami occurring at the time, so who would join the blue blur in his inevitable return to the Smash Bros. series. Many people on these boards thought we would get 1 or 2 new third party characters in Smash 4, and the obvious answer for most would be Mega Man's inclusion along with possibly another third party. As the third ever third party introduced into the Smash series (for perspective, we now have 16 third party characters in Ultimate), Mega Man was quite possibly the most notable and most hype reveal for the base roster of the game, including for myself. My personal thought at the time was that we would get two third party characters: Mega Man and Pac-Man, and that's because I thought both deserved to be in Smash the most. Of course, you know that was what ended up happening. In that first ever E3 Nintendo direct, I remember jumping out of my seat and screaming a bit despite never touching a Mega Man game in my life. I was very happy to see him there. If only I knew the third party characters we would end up getting years later. [9/10]
One of the strangest Smash Bros. inclusions of all time, Wii Fit Trainer was revealed in a bit of a strange way as well. Instead of being revealed in the E3 Direct like Villager and Mega Man, Wii Fit Trainer's trailer was dropped by Sakurai after a short demo he gave of the game on the E3 showfloor. Because of this, I found out about this character from social media, and I believed nobody. I mean, if somebody told me that were adding the trainer from Wii Fit into Smash Bros. as a playable character, I would probably laugh at the absurdity of it. And yet, this was the character staring in my face as I browsed these boards on the afternoon of June 11th, 2013. The salt was real, but I couldn't help but laugh at this whole predicament. We knew 12 characters in this game, and one of the them was Wii Fit Trainer. However, despite the weirdness of this inclusion, a certain plant in the future would tell me... [6.5/10]
Not the most expected Mario character to join the roster, but here Rosalina was. Since Rosalina only appeared in a few games prior to this reveal (Galaxy 1 & 2, Mario Kart Wii, and Mario Kart 7), she had nowhere near the notoriety that she has today. But as Rosalina was revealed to be playable in 3D World and Mario Kart 8, the reveal made sense in retrospect. Of course, my dumb ass thought this was another Mario Kart trailer at first since we saw Rainbow Road, but it ended up being Rosalina instead (the first Smash reveal to fake me out: I don't think another one did again). My most wanted Mario character was Bowser Jr., and I thought that Rosalina's reveal meant that Bowser Jr. wouldn't be playable. Little did I know... [7.5/10]
After the E3 reveal, a little leak called the Gematsu Leak surfaced. A leak that correctly guessed both Villager (referred to as "Animal Crossing Guy") and Wii Fit Trainer? This source knows something. The source also listed Little Mac, Pac-Man, and Miis as newcomers to the series, but incorrectly stated that they would be revealed at E3 2013. Of course, since this leak was able to guess Wii Fit Trainer of all characters, most people were willing to believe it. It also helped that Little Mac was a popular choice to begin with (one of the "Elites" of Smash 4 speculation along with Mewtwo, K. Rool, Ridley, Mega Man, Palutena, and Chrom) and the fact that the series got a reboot in 2009, so most were expecting his inclusion in the game. However, this didn't detract from the hype his reveal brought in the west. Japan didn't like this reveal very much, but I didn't learn this until years later. A common theme across reveals I liked was that I thought they deserved to be in the game, and this was no different. However, the way Mac was implemented depresses me, making his inclusion feel lackluster in retrospect. However, the score that you have probably noticed at the end of the write-ups is based on my initial thoughts, not what I think now. [8.5/10]
I thought this was Mewtwo. I wished it was Mewtwo. But, instead, we got the Ninja Frog Pokemon Greninja as an entirely new Pokemon added to the game. This was also the direct that confirmed that transformation characters were no more for this game, with Charizard flying solo this time around. I had played Pokemon X in the winter before this reveal and started with Froakie, so I was was unexpectedly psyched by this reveal. Don't get me wrong, I still really, really wanted Mewtwo to show up, but Greninja was a Pokemon inclusion that I was perfectly OK with. However, something else happened this reveal that impacted the speculation scene drastically. The Gematsu leak was back with a vengeance, and by vengeance I mean with new information. Pac-Man and the Miis were still on the leak's list of new fighters, but added to the list were Palutena, Chrom, Shulk, the Chorus Men from Rhythm Heaven, and a Generation 6 Pokemon. Of course, this leak was not entirely true and likely stemmed from an early design document at the very start of development, but getting a Generation 6 Pokemon correct added a substantial amount of credibility to the leak, since many thought a Generation 6 Pokemon wouldn't happen because X and Y came out after development on Smash 4 started. [8/10]
E3 2014 added further fuel to the Gematsu fire, and one of the ways was through revealing the Mii Fighters. Luckily, this was a very boring and predictable reveal that was given a step up by how good their reveal trailer was. Seeing Reggie and Iwata fight anime-style is something I will always remember. Not much else to say here. [6/10]
Another predictable inclusion perpetuated by the Gematsu leak and the fact that Sakurai directed Kid Icarus: Uprising immediately prior to starting development on Smash 4. Cool reveal trailer and character overall, but I don't remember getting too excited for the reveal because of the predictability of it all. [7/10]
Dark Pit shows up at the end of Palutena's reveal trailer, but practically everyone, including myself, thought nothing of it and thought it was just a cute exchange between the characters of Kid Icarus. However, a certain leak (which I will talk about more later) set his inclusion in stone for the roster. Sorry to all the Dark Pit fans (I don't know how many of you there are), but Dark Pit was my least favorite inclusion in the entirety of the base roster, and it wasn't because I didn't understand the development process behind clone characters. I fully understood that Dark Pit and the other clones took much less development time than any of the other newcomers, but I thought there were so many better options for clones and that Dark Pit should have stayed as an alternate costume for regular Pit. Of course, my opinion has changed a decent amount with the advent of Echo Fighters and enjoying what makes him different than Pit, but this inclusion soured my opinion of the base roster overall. [2/10]
This inclusion should have been obvious, but, for whatever reason, it wasn't. Pac-Man is quite possibly the most iconic video game character ever and, with Bandai Namco assisting Sakurai with development, everything seemed right for Pac-Man. But it wasn't until Gematsu that people started thinking he would be in the game, and that is something I still don't understand to this day. Maybe it was because people were scared that Sakurai would use the Ghostly Adventures design as opposed to the classic design. Maybe it was because Sakurai said he thought about it for Brawl and dismissed it. All in all, good character inclusion, bad reveal trailer, ugly discourse at the time. [7.5/10]
The first clone character revealed for Smash 4 and the only one properly revealed prior to launch. She was revealed with Robin, and both managed to completely change speculation for the game. Why? Neither of these characters were Chrom. Everybody, and I mean everybody expected Chrom to be the new Fire Emblem character included in Smash 4, and yet not only did we not get Chrom but we got two new Fire Emblem characters. I remember when people thought that four FE characters was a lot. My have times changes. People were confused at first one whether or not Lucina was a costume for Marth or a separate clone character, but Sakurai quickly cleared that up in a Famitsu column. Hadn't played Awakening yet at the time, but Lucina was an overall solid inclusion into the game. [6/10]
My was I glad to see a Fire Emblem character that didn't primarily use a sword. Despite never touching a Fire Emblem game at that point in my life, I knew that there was much more to the series than swords. Plus, to see another character using magic was cool. However, with Chrom destined to get his chance another day, Gematsu was dead. Suddenly, there was doubt on whether or not Shulk and the Chorus Men would be included as playable characters. Suddenly, speculation was no longer rigidly set to a handful of characters, but that bliss would only last a month... [7/10]
With Gematsu dead, Shulk was no longer a lock for the base roster and would be a small surprise for the game. However, the biggest Smash Bros. leak of all time, the ESRB leak, would ruin any hope of a surprise until DLC started development for the game. Suddenly, we knew the entire base roster for the game a full month before release. Any of my talk about the turmoil these boards went through would be an understatement, but that is a discussion for another time. However, Shulk's inclusion was more impactful in that it 100% confirmed the ESRB leak as real, so, it's hard to pinpoint my reaction to Shulk inclusion himself. I did think he deserved to be there, but he wasn't that interesting to me. [6/10]
There he was. Sitting next to Rosalina on the roster for the ESRB leak was the Mario character I was most wanting: Bowser Jr. was a playable character in Super Smash Bros. for the Nintendo 3DS and Wii U. However, there was something I and many others did not anticipate: he was sitting in his clown car. Of course, the Clown Car is now heavily associated with Bowser Jr. (I'd argue to a fault), but that wasn't the case back then. I moreso envisioned him as a semi-clone of sorts of Bowser, using his Paintbrush from Mario Sunshine to attack. However, I thought the idea of putting Jr. in the Clown Car was a very good one, and I was very excited to try him out once I got my hands on the game. [9/10]
Whenever I think of Duck Hunt's unexpected appearance in the ESRB leak, I can't help but think about
Arcadenik
. Duck Hunt seemed like a really good choice as the retro character of the game, but I couldn't help but be happy for Arcadenik when Duck Hunt was revealed. Even when the odds were stacked against him, this user ended up getting the character they wanted in the end, which I couldn't help but be happy about. But as to what I thought of him, well, he was...an OK inclusion. I guess you could say... [6.5/10]
Arcadenik
. Duck Hunt seemed like a really good choice as the retro character of the game, but I couldn't help but be happy for Arcadenik when Duck Hunt was revealed. Even when the odds were stacked against him, this user ended up getting the character they wanted in the end, which I couldn't help but be happy about. But as to what I thought of him, well, he was...an OK inclusion. I guess you could say... [6.5/10]
This is it. My favorite Smash reveal ever. And it was just a 3D model. After the ESRB leak was dropped unexpectedly online, the most disappointing thing to me was the lack of Mewtwo. His absence never made sense to me in Brawl and his absence here was baffling. How could Sakurai forget Mewtwo again? For a multitude of reasons (I think this being one of them), Mewtwo is my favorite Pokemon of all time. Luckily, despite my sheer disappointment, Sakurai didn't forget about Mewtwo. There he was. He was where he belonged for years. Not only that, but character speculation was no longer dead for the game. Post-launch characters were confirmed to be on the way, but we didn't know if it was Mewtwo or if other characters would follow. Luckily for us, more came after. [11/10]
With Mewtwo, Lucas returns too! And, with him, the announcement of a Smash Ballot. The fans could now influence the character inclusions of the game and, with it, speculation was rejuvenated. Many characters would later thank their inclusion into Smash due to the ballot for better or for worse. As for Lucas, he was unfortunately overshadowed by the announcement of the Ballot, but I was still excited for his inclusion nonetheless. [7/10]
Mewtwo and Roy had been paired together a lot in speculation. Probably because they both were added into Project M, but I digress. "Maybe, if we got Mewtwo..." the people thought, "...we could get Roy back too." Lo and behold, that is exactly what happened, but it was a shame that it got leaked beforehand. If that weren't the case, I would have probably been much more excited for the reveal. There was a reason why a lot of the popular picks were returning veterans, after all. It's why Ultimate did what it did. [7/10]
First Point: I have Ryu's inclusion in Smash to thank for getting me watching Maximillian Dood on Youtube and becoming more of a fighting game fan in general. Second Point: This is yet another case of a good reveal getting ruined by being leaked beforehand. Just like Roy, I would have been more excited to see him if I didn't know he was in the game beforehand. [7/10]
Cloud's inclusion into Smash Bros. marked a paradigm shift in the world of Smash. Nobody could believe it. Cloud Strife, seen by many as one of the faces of the Playstation and not having his game on a Nintendo console, somehow managed his way into Smash. Heck, I still can't wrap my head around how it happened to this day. Suddenly, it felt that mostly any video character was possible for Smash. We wouldn't see the full effects of this until Ultimate, but the ramifications of this inclusion are incredibly influential. As with many others, I was in complete shock. I never played a Final Fantasy game, but this was a character I never knew I wanted. Incredible reveal. Bravo. [10/10]
If there's any juxtaposition to me writing my thoughts about Mewtwo in glee, it's this. I apologize for this Corrin fans, but Corrin is my least favorite inclusion in the entire history of the Smash Bros. series. This isn't because I dislike Corrin or their playstyle, but because of the ramifications that came with it. Let me explain:
- This is an instance of a character added to the game solely to promote a new/upcoming title. Unlike other characters that fit under this umbrella, Corrin was added into Smash before Fates even came out in the US. We didn't quite know that it would be the most mixed-opinion Fire Emblem game in recent memory. I'm a firm believer in giving characters time to establish an impression in players around the world before they are included into Smash.
- Corrin started all the hate for Fire Emblem and anime swordsmen as a whole. Having recently gotten into Fire Emblem and beaten Awakening and Three Houses, this just hurts more to me now than it did back then. It made Byleth, a character I have come to really like, leave a sour impression on Smash fans than when they didn't deserve. I mean, no character deserves it, but I blame Corrin for starting this trend that I have come to hate
Bayonetta was not a character I got excited for, but I was able to brush her and Corrin's inclusions to the side because I got Mewtwo back and Cloud managed to show up...somehow. I was simply more happy for all the fans that wanted her that I didn't really care about my own thoughts about the character. Little did I know, Bayonetta would become the character I hated fighting against the most. [5/10]
Smash 4's character inclusions feel like a mixed bag to me in retrospect, and I feel that Ultimate's inclusions have been better overall. But, seeing as this game takes me back to my first years here on these boards and the speculation and turmoil that came from trying to predict the impossible, I can't help but feel nostalgic for everything. However, I didn't really jive with the playstyle of most of the newcomers, as I felt that they were either too odd or too gimmicky. Regardless, Smash 4 brought with it many great inclusions in to the series and made the roster feel more complete as a whole.
...Whew, that was a doozy. If you're looking for a bit of a time capsule back to the Smash 4 days, well, here you go.
Al-kīmiyā'
Smash the State
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That's because people are just relieved it wasn't Rex.
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