Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SKX31]

Yeah I understand this, and it works just fine in a vacuum but I find it extremely hard to imagine Nintendo acknowledging this when pointing new fans in Touhou's direction. When working with a relatively lesser known series in Smash (in a particular part of the world, at least), like Fatal Fury / King of Fighters, it's important to be able to let people know how they can familiarize themselves with the characters and world being introduced IMO.

That's going to be a particularly important point going forward, especially with Nintendo's current expansion plans in mind. Now, I don't think that said expansion will happen overnight: Furukawa pointed out in an interview that they don't expect Nintendo to become mega-popular overnight in China, partly because Nintendo built up their JP / NA / EU fanbases over the course of 30 years. That goes for any other country / region really.

Still, consoles are slowly but surely growing elsewhere - partly because online shopping has made it easier to get consoles in the first place (even in a few countries where consoles are practically banned), and partly because the three console companies have established local offices and / or partnered with local corps in a lot of regions and countries.

I find it amusing that it's come back and it's now actually covering current gen content which the original mod expressly tried to avoid doing for then current generations.

Yet they don't care that someone remade Pokémon Red in Minecraft just without sound, or the fact someone made an actual fangame using Minecraft.

Yeah a map is different from a mod but still it's so weird. Maybe some of the mod's item assets were just minor edits to official assets, like cleaned up resizes? Idk, I don't think they used any official voices or music...and there's no story, either...

They never took down Pokécube, though. I guess they just take things down once they get popular enough.

I'm going to guess that Nintendo and NoA specifically realized that they can't prosecute every single mod that gets a lot of attention. Partly because there are a lot of such mods - Mario 64 turned into an FPS as a recent example. and partly because the negative PR is slowly stacking up with other **** and exposing a side of Nintendo they don't want to be openly in the public.

For example, they haven't prosecuted Slippi yet AFAIK, but they've certainly tried to shut down Nintendo-partnered tournaments that think about running it. The blowback surrounding that was in the long run kinda minor (outside of a very notable Youtuber amplifying the complaints), but it's worth repeating that it's slowly stacking up with other ****, so that might be a main reason why they're "scaling back" at least an inch.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

For example, they haven't prosecuted Slippi yet AFAIK, but they've certainly tried to shut down Nintendo-partnered tournaments that think about running it. The blowback surrounding that was in the long run kinda minor (outside of a very notable Youtuber amplifying the complaints), but it's worth repeating that it's slowly stacking up with other ****, so that might be a main reason why they're "scaling back" at least an inch.

As much as I disagree with Nintendo's practices here, it was pretty funny to watch Leffen go "aw man Sephiroth is so cool! Now let's talk about how poop Nintendo is for their actions against the Smash community".

 

[Guynamednelson]

You say that but Megalovania got into the game, and Megalovania came from an Earthbound ROM Hack.

To be fair, it's more well known as a song from something that ISN'T a romhack. I doubt Nintendo/Sakurai knew all that much about Dr. Andonuts wanting homosexuals to consume feces.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

To be fair, it's more well known as a song from something that ISN'T a romhack. I doubt Nintendo/Sakurai knew all that much about Dr. Andonuts wanting homosexuals to consume feces.

If I had a nickle for every time a Toby Fox song that was originally used for something weird got in an official Nintendo game I'd have two nickles, which isn't much, but it's weird that it happened twice, no?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

As much as I disagree with Nintendo's practices here, it was pretty funny to watch Leffen go "aw man Sephiroth is so cool! Now let's talk about how poop Nintendo is for their actions against the Smash community".

A friend of mine who used to watch El Grande Padre di Jenos told me he'd no longer watch him because apparantly PapaGenos was speculating on Eggman's chances midtrailer because that's apparantly more interesting than seeing Mario getting stabbed. Surprised how common it is to talk about other stuff during trailers, it's like talking during movies, why would you do that?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

A friend of mine who used to watch El Grande Padre di Jenos told me he'd no longer watch him because apparantly PapaGenos was speculating on Eggman's chances midtrailer because that's apparantly more interesting than seeing Mario getting stabbed. Surprised how common it is to talk about other stuff during trailers, it's like talking during movies, why would you do that?

I think Leffen's tangent came after watching the Sakurai Presents in full, but yeah, going from "oh cool Sephiroth!" to "Wait, that could mean Eggman!" before the 1-3 minute long trailer is over is quite strange.

 

[MBRedboy31]

The funny thing is that the original Pixelmon mod actually did get taken down because of legal threats from Nintendo

The funnier thing is that it didn’t even stay taken down; they rebooted it sometime later and Nintendo hasn’t bothered to try to take it down again.

I’ve seen people theorize that they initially took it down due to Pokemon Quest being in the works at the time and also having a blocky aesthetic (which is kinda funny on Nintendo’s part, assuming that’s true, because the models in Pixelmon aren’t blocky; how would consumers confuse the two?)

 

[Lyncario]

Hard Facts: Reimu's chances of being in Smash Bros are better than Mima's chances of being featured in a new Touhou game.

To be fair, there's a possibility that she does come back in Cheating Detective Satori. Though it's also very possible that ZUN is just bambolizing us, in which case I would be like that for quite some time

 

[Otoad64]

The funnier thing is that it didn’t even stay taken down; they rebooted it sometime later and Nintendo hasn’t bothered to try to take it down again.

I’ve seen people theorize that they initially took it down due to Pokemon Quest being in the works at the time and also having a blocky aesthetic (which is kinda funny on Nintendo’s part, assuming that’s true, because the models in Pixelmon aren’t blocky; how would consumers confuse the two?)

I'm not sure why they would think consumers would get a fangmame but not the real deal

most of the time in order to get fangames you have to go out of your way to look for them and fangames are usually only played by fans of the original product.

because fangames usually don't have any marketing and only exist on random websites instead of a storefront

 

[Pillow]

IMO still incredibly unlikely on account of no particular incentive or interest from Nintendo (as of now, at least) to promote the series as it has never been in a single Nintendo presentation. In general the series is not in a great, accessible place for a worldwide audience who, outside of a small underground group, is not familiar with the series outside of a few songs they've probably heard in meme videos. Translations are mostly handled by fan patches among its western fans rather than official localizations - which would go a long way.

If it comes down to new series / characters that would appeal dominantly to a Japanese audience, Nintendo seems to have a lot more stock in Monster Hunter and Puyo Puyo, which both have a more notable and more properly supported presence overseas to boot. There's "isn't that big in the west", like Terry, and then there's "you need to hunt down fan translations to patch onto your game" which is a whole other ballpark IMO. Once Touhou sees more consistent, official western support and starts getting pushed by Nintendo as this "hot in Japan series that you gotta check out" (which is what they've done with Puyo, for example) then I'm really not seeing it at all.

This pretty much mirrors my thoughts on Reimu, except for one thing. I actually think Tohou as a series, even if not specifically Reimu, has a bigger worldwide audience than Terry ever did. Tohou literally took over the internet during its prime. I saw fanart of the characters everywhere online. Yes, it only caters to a very specific non-Japanese audience (basically weebs), but it caters to them all the same.

I agree that her biggest hurdle is lack of official support by Nintendo (or anyone willing to translate their game to other languages), outside of simple recognition. The inconsistency of things like the varying art styles the characters are drawn in throughout various fan games may also be a turn off for Smash (then again, look at Ken). That, and while she is not unknown outside of Japan, she's not exactly popular either next to other potential characters like Master Chief or Chun Li or whatever.

 

[RileyXY1]

This pretty much mirrors my thoughts on Reimu, except for one thing. I actually think Tohou as a series, even if not specifically Reimu, has a bigger worldwide audience than Terry ever did. Tohou literally took over the internet during its prime. I saw fanart of the characters everywhere online. Yes, it only caters to a very specific non-Japanese audience (basically weebs), but it caters to them all the same.

I agree that her biggest hurdle is lack of official support by Nintendo, outside of simple recognition. The inconsistency of things like the varying art styles the characters are drawn in throughout various fan games may also be a turn off for Smash (then again, look at Ken). That, and while she is not unknown outside of Japan, she's not exactly popular either next to other potential characters like Master Chief or Chun Li or whatever.

I agree that a lack of recognition and support from Nintendo is a detriment to her chances. It's one of the reasons why I think that the Reimu/Crash/KOS-MOS leak is fake.

 

[SharkLord]

This pretty much mirrors my thoughts on Reimu, except for one thing. I actually think Tohou as a series, even if not specifically Reimu, has a bigger worldwide audience than Terry ever did. Tohou literally took over the internet during its prime. I saw fanart of the characters everywhere online. Yes, it only caters to a very specific non-Japanese audience (basically weebs), but it caters to them all the same.

I agree that her biggest hurdle is lack of official support by Nintendo (or anyone willing to translate their game to other languages), outside of simple recognition. The inconsistency of things like the varying art styles the characters are drawn in throughout various fan games may also be a turn off for Smash (then again, look at Ken). That, and while she is not unknown outside of Japan, she's not exactly popular either next to other potential characters like Master Chief or Chun Li or whatever.

While lack of official support is a bit of an issue, varying art styles and such is just a weird way to judge things. Art styles are never really consistent, and can change on a whim. Heck, a lot of characters in Smash have had weird art style shifts; Just look at the Simon we have an compare him to the one from Judgement.
I'd also like to point out that Smash doesn't necessarily aim for the absolute biggest characters. King of Fighters is arguably less known than Tekken, Resident Evil was Spirited despite being Capcom's best-selling series, Persona is a lot smaller than Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy, as well as multiple Sega titles, etc. Just because someone isn't as popular as another doesn't necessarily mean they aren't popular, or at least, not popular enough.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

People always tell me how popular Touhou is. Only problem is I wasn’t ever even aware of the word Touhou until it popped up in this very specific speculation cycle so I’ve never seen it’s popularity for myself. Not even in Brawl, Smash 4, Smash 4 DLC, or even Base Ultimate had I ever heard of Touhou. I was at least slightly aware of Terry through KoF tournaments at EVO and the like, which actually got me into my first KoF, KoFXIII. Even smaller games like Disgaea, Ys, and Trails I’ve heard of before hand. So I have a very hard time seeing a Touhou character making it in all things considered.

I can’t really see a Touhou character happening to be honest. And I usually don’t have that problem because a lot of more niche stuff I’m rather familiar with. If it happens cool but just me personally I don’t see it happening.

 

[N3ON]

I remember when Touhou had to be explained to a lot of the Smash audience a couple years back and I think that is emblematic of the biggest reason why it won't get in. Despite a western sect familiar with it, the internet has done was the internet does and skewed perspective on how prolific the series is outside Japan, which is... not prolific.

And yes, I know some songs have become memes, but that does not inherently translate to familiarity with the actual series. Do you think everyone who has heard an Initial D song has watched Initial D?

I know some of the fanbase also had to be told "what an SNK was" (though in the history of Smash spec, those pages seem to have been ripped out), but people have already touched on those contrasts. What I'll add to it is that one character overcoming a hurdle is not evidence another will do the same. Usually that argument is invoked in terms of irrelevance, using K. Rool and Banjo to justify other characters (and look how that worked out), but the principle works for characters of a lesser global visibility too.

Edit: Good timing with above post, lol.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Edit: Good timing with above post, lol.

You’re welcome.

Sincerely,
NSG’s ignorance

 

[SharkLord]

People always tell me how popular Touhou is. Only problem is I wasn’t ever even aware of the word Touhou until it popped up in this very specific speculation cycle so I’ve never seen it’s popularity for myself. Not even in Brawl, Smash 4, Smash 4 DLC, or even Base Ultimate had I ever heard of Touhou. I was at least slightly aware of Terry through KoF tournaments at EVO and the like, which actually got me into my first KoF, KoFXIII. Even smaller games like Disgaea, Ys, and Trails I’ve heard of before hand. So I have a very hard time seeing a Touhou character making it in all things considered.

I can’t really see a Touhou character happening to be honest. And I usually don’t have that problem because a lot of more niche stuff I’m rather familiar with. If it happens cool but just me personally I don’t see it happening.

To be fair, I don't think many people really thought Touhou stood a chance back then. Reimu only started gaining steam after ZUN said "I'd like to see Touhou characters in Smash," which was made known around the September-November range (I'll have to double-check the exact date), plus the increase of indie content and Joker making people think games without much Nintendo connection were possible. Until then, Touhou didn't have much overlap with the Nintendo playerbase, since it was almost entirely on the PC. Brawl was extremely Nintendo-centric, and 4 stayed that way. I hear that threads would be closed down for trolling back in the day when all they wanted to do was support Master Chief, so I don't think Touhou was on the radar for Smash spec back then.

 

[Goombaic]

I've been on a bit of a ninja obsession since Cyber Shadow and I would love to talk about some ninjas.

Hayabusa will always be a great candidate until the day he gets in. His games give him enough moveset potential that he could either solely be a swordfighter or implement a couple of other weapons into his moveset. Point is, Hayabusa would be a perfect Smash character.

Shadow from Cyber Shadow has a nice expansive moveset with clear inspirations from Ninja Gaiden and other NES classics. The Messenger, another indie ninja, also has a neat moveset that opens up as you progress through the game similar to Cyber Shadow.

Katana Zero's main mechanic is its time travelling stuff with not a lot of other abilities, but Zero would still be a neat character to play as.

There's a couple of fighting game ninjas I could mention. Scorpion and Sub-Zero among Mortal Kombat's other ninjas are all unique and great candidates for Smash and probably the most important ninjas from fighting games. Taki from Soul Calibur is a pretty major character for the series, but with the existence of Nightmare, Mitsurugi, Sophitia, and others, she has a lot going against her.

Finally, while I'm not too familiar with the series, Strider Hiryu can't go without mention. He's always a neat character whenever he shows up in crossovers.

Every single Reimu disscussion in a nuthsell:

How's Ed Edd and Eddy making people disgusted lol.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Omg please y’all if you gotta quote that post REMOVE THE VIDEO

 

[chocolatejr9]

I've been on a bit of a ninja obsession since Cyber Shadow and I would love to talk about some ninjas.

Hayabusa will always be a great candidate until the day he gets in. His games give him enough moveset potential that he could either solely be a swordfighter or implement a couple of other weapons into his moveset. Point is, Hayabusa would be a perfect Smash character.

Shadow from Cyber Shadow has a nice expansive moveset with clear inspirations from Ninja Gaiden and other NES classics. The Messenger, another indie ninja, also has a neat moveset that opens up as you progress through the game similar to Cyber Shadow.

Katana Zero's main mechanic is its time travelling stuff with not a lot of other abilities, but Zero would still be a neat character to play as.

There's a couple of fighting game ninjas I could mention. Scorpion and Sub-Zero among Mortal Kombat's other ninjas are all unique and great candidates for Smash and probably the most important ninjas from fighting games. Taki from Soul Calibur is a pretty major character for the series, but with the existence of Nightmare, Mitsurugi, Sophitia, and others, she has a lot going against her.

Finally, while I'm not too familiar with the series, Strider Hiryu can't go without mention. He's always a neat character whenever he shows up in crossovers.


How's Ed Edd and Eddy making people disgusted lol.

How's Ed Edd and Eddy NOT making people disgusted?

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

I'm probably gonna make an enemy here but I'll say my thoughts on the Reimu thing.

Reimu is one of those names that the MINUTE I see it in an internet rumor, I IMMEDIATELY assume it's fake based on that and that alone.

Seems to me like this whole Reimu thing started as a joke on 4chan that spiraled out of control and turned from a 4chan joke into something 4chan is trying to will into existence.

Never even HEARD of Touhou prior to this whole thing. I've heard of TOHO aka the company behind Godzilla and his much more frightening lawyers, but not Touhou.

 

[SharkLord]

I'm probably gonna make an enemy here but I'll say my thoughts on the Reimu thing.

Reimu is one of those names that the MINUTE I see it in an internet rumor, I IMMEDIATELY assume it's fake based on that and that alone.

Seems to me like this whole Reimu thing started as a joke on 4chan that spiraled out of control and turned from a 4chan joke into something 4chan is trying to will into existence.

Never even HEARD of Touhou prior to this whole thing. I've heard of TOHO aka the company behind Godzilla and his much more frightening lawyers, but not Touhou.

Actually, I think started with this

ZUN: In addition, I would like characters from Touhou to appear in other games so Touhou can become more recognized. Naturally, I want them to appear in Smash Bros. (laughs) But that's something that I can't make happen by just thinking about it.

Via: @ReimuForSmash pic.twitter.com/u2l4uBKQAn

— Will (PushDustIn) (@PushDustIn) October 13, 2019

ZUN admitted he wanted Touhou characters to appear in Smash. People had thought that he wouldn't want them to happen, due to his preference for a more independent way of making games, and so that interview was spread around a lot. As always, this got people talking about Reimu because of the hot new thing that was being passed down, and Reimu supporters started having more hope.

In other news, I found this image from an old post on Reimu's thread while trying to find the interview and uh

Yeah, I don't know either

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Omg please y’all if you gotta quote that post REMOVE THE VIDEO

Here’s an adorable cat to take your mind off. It has nothing to do with this thread, but why not?

 

[Louie G.]

At this point I assume by default that anyone with half a brain would love to have their characters in the most prestigious video game crossover handled by one of the most acclaimed and creative developers out there. It's always cool to hear someone chime in on it but I've grown numb to it a long time ago.

The hangup is usually "does Nintendo want it" and in cases like Sora (or Crash, I guess) the company's price tag. The latter which I doubt is even an issue in the first place since Nintendo is pumping so much money in Smash as is.

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

Actually, I think started with this

ZUN: In addition, I would like characters from Touhou to appear in other games so Touhou can become more recognized. Naturally, I want them to appear in Smash Bros. (laughs) But that's something that I can't make happen by just thinking about it.

Via: @ReimuForSmash pic.twitter.com/u2l4uBKQAn

— Will (PushDustIn) (@PushDustIn) October 13, 2019

ZUN admitted he wanted Touhou characters to appear in Smash. People had thought that he wouldn't want them to happen, due to his preference for a more independent way of making games, and so that interview was spread around a lot. As always, this got people talking about Reimu because of the hot new thing that was being passed down, and Reimu supporters started having more hope.

Well, not to start a big bad fight but I know I've seen people go on about Reimu prior to October 2019. If my memory serves correctly, I remember 4chan bringing her up prior to Ultimate's launch/really early on in Fighter pass 1. It's been floating around for a while.

At this point I assume by default that anyone with half a brain would love to have their characters in the most prestigious video game crossover handled by one of the most acclaimed and creative developers out there. It's always cool to hear someone chime in on it but I've grown numb to it a long time ago.

I'd honestly love to see an interview where someone goes "Ehhhhh I don't knooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow. I don't really FEEEEEEEEL like it.

 

[Pillow]

While lack of official support is a bit of an issue, varying art styles and such is just a weird way to judge things. Art styles are never really consistent, and can change on a whim. Heck, a lot of characters in Smash have had weird art style shifts; Just look at the Simon we have an compare him to the one from Judgement.
I'd also like to point out that Smash doesn't necessarily aim for the absolute biggest characters. King of Fighters is arguably less known than Tekken, Resident Evil was Spirited despite being Capcom's best-selling series, Persona is a lot smaller than Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy, as well as multiple Sega titles, etc. Just because someone isn't as popular as another doesn't necessarily mean they aren't popular, or at least, not popular enough.

Art was just one example. I was mostly speaking to how wildly varying depiction of 2hu characters can be. Out of pretty much all of the series that may be potentially included in Smash, 2hu is the one most heavily steeped in its fanbase. A large selection of its games and music are essentially fan games of varying quality. This factor is at odds with how clean cut everything currently in Smash is.

And yeah, Smash doesn't always aim for the absolute biggest characters. I never claimed Reimu had no chance, and in fact she's one of the few character I'm actively hoping for. But being a large, recognizable franchise is always a pretty big point in favor of a character's inclusion. I just don't want to be grasping at straws trying to find reasons for a character I like to be included, only to be disappointed because when looking at all the factors objectively, their chances weren't very high to begin with.

 

[SharkLord]

Art was just one example. I was mostly speaking to how wildly varying depiction of 2hu characters can be. Out of pretty much all of the series that may be potentially included in Smash, 2hu is the one most heavily steeped in its fanbase. A large selection of its games and music are essentially fan games of varying quality. This factor is at odds with how clean cut everything currently in Smash is.

And yeah, Smash doesn't always aim for the absolute biggest characters. I never claimed Reimu had no chance, and in fact she's one of the few character I'm actively hoping for. But being a large, recognizable franchise is always a pretty big point in favor of a character's inclusion. I just don't want to be grasping at straws trying to find reasons for a character I like to be included, only to be disappointed because when looking at all the factors objectively, their chances weren't very high to begin with.

About how "clean cut" are we going for? There's been a lot of instances where a character's depiction varies depending on who's writing them; Heck, some characters like Mario and Bowser act differently from their canon selves. Even then, there's enough official content for Touhou to draw from and piece something together; Just because the fanworks are a big part of Touhou doesn't mean it's the only part.

 

[N3ON]

To be fair, I don't think many people really thought Touhou stood a chance back then. Reimu only started gaining steam after ZUN said "I'd like to see Touhou characters in Smash," which was made known around the September-November range (I'll have to double-check the exact date), plus the increase of indie content and Joker making people think games without much Nintendo connection were possible. Until then, Touhou didn't have much overlap with the Nintendo playerbase, since it was almost entirely on the PC. Brawl was extremely Nintendo-centric, and 4 stayed that way. I hear that threads would be closed down for trolling back in the day when all they wanted to do was support Master Chief, so I don't think Touhou was on the radar for Smash spec back then.

But consider that the typical response when the fanbase is first presented with a character of minimal Nintendo presence isn't "who is this?". Most people didn't ask who Joker was, they didn't ask who Kiryu was, they didn't ask who 2B was, or Dante, Kat, Gordon Freeman, Sol, Heavy, Yuri, Tracer, Solaire, y'know... take your pick.

Whether your point is true or not, the Smash fanbase is not so insular as to only be familiar with game characters people think stand a chance. Many people knew who the aforementioned characters were prior to them entering the discussion.

People used to disregard characters that didn't have a strong association with Nintendo because they didn't think those were the characters Nintendo went for, not because they inherently weren't familiar with them. Obviously the fanbase does skew towards Nintendo-centrism, but, especially by the time Ultimate rolled around with Cloud and Ryu already being there, the ignorance isn't to the extent that what goes on past the confines on a Nintendo platform will be inherently unfamiliar to wide swaths of the fanbase until it seems possible Smash comes calling.

 

[ALongWistfulSquiggle]

Touhou is one of those series where either a lot of people know what it is and just never talk about it, or most everyone who knows about it got curious enough to dig up a bunch of info. From a total outsider's perspective, I think both are partly true.

There's clearly a community of sorts surrounding the thing. But I think it's more isolated than people inside realize. There's a high bar to get into the series beyond just listening to music or looking at a piece of art. You have to learn where to go. You have to learn how to apply patches. Once you're in, you'll find there's a good amount of people in there, but they were all interested enough to go through the effort. Most everyone else either never heard of Touhou, never cared enough to look into it, or took a look and passed. I have a hard time imagining there being many casual fans of Touhou games outside of Japan. Most are going to be more dedicated because they had to be to even become a fan in the first place.

I know I heard the name Touhou when I was watching SuperJeenius on Youtube back in my college days, but I never knew anything about what it is until about a year ago, and all I know now is that most of the games are bullet hell and the characters are really nutty. I learned that on this thread.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

I had at least a vague idea of Touhou before Smash. Maybe this is just because I love to do deep dives or because I know that some of the songs do kind of escape Touhou (UN Owen was Her? and Bad Apple come to mind). But at the very least, Touhou was always something that I had a vague idea of.

I think part of the reason Reimu speculation really took off this game is just because Smash had become far more than just Nintendo's all stars. I know that a lot of people love to point to Melee's box art and claim that this is Smash's modus operandi. The problem is that stopped being the case in 2006. Snake getting into Smash was the first sign that Smash was slowly evolving into more of a gaming cross over. This belief really took the community over though with Cloud in 4 and Joker and Terry in Ultimate. In many's eyes, this basically cemented Smash as a gaming crossover rather than just a Nintendo one. I think that this coincides well with when Reimu speculation took off: after Smash 4. While there was the rare ****post that Reimu would win the ballot, that was not what was talked about then. People would float Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Rayman as the third party frontrunners specifically because of their Nintendo connections. Now, characters that have less of a Nintendo connection (or in some cases not at all) are being speculated on. I think this really came about at the right time to really help out Reimu. Combine that with her overall positives and you have a character that honestly has become much more of a name in speculation. Is she going to get in? Heck if I know. While there are two rumors that still hold water that do say she is coming, we do not know for sure.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So basically, as far as I know:

• The Touhou Project is huge in Japan.
  • It also has a dedicated community elsewhere.
• Everyone else might recognize the mess of bullets all over the screen as one of those games, but know literally nothing about the actual series.
• The series has yet to have a single official localization.
• Indie series have yet to get an actual character, with the biggest of them only getting Mii Costumes.

If the Tower of Druaga Mii Costume is any indication, it could get a Mii Costume, but that's all it could get at present.

 

[SharkLord]

So basically, as far as I know:

• The Touhou Project is huge in Japan.
  • It also has a dedicated community elsewhere.
• Everyone else might recognize the mess of bullets all over the screen as one of those games, but know literally nothing about the actual series.
• The series has yet to have a single official localization.
• Indie series have yet to get an actual character, with the biggest of them only getting Mii Costumes.

If the Tower of Druaga Mii Costume is any indication, it could get a Mii Costume, but that's all it could get at present.

Actually, it does have an official localization: 15.5 on Steam (Funnily enough, the very game we were discussing earlier today). Granted, it's not the best, but it's not 100% untranslated beyond the fans.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Actually, it does have an official localization: 15.5 on Steam (Funnily enough, the very game we were discussing earlier today). Granted, it's not the best, but it's not 100% untranslated beyond the fans.

If 15.5 Switch got localized, would it use that translation as well?

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

There's definitely potential for grown in the Western market for Touhou, but I think a lot of its potential future presence is dependent on a high profile, officially released localization, and finding its way within some sort of company marketing infrastructure, especially one like Nintendo's. Getting exposed in even a Partner Direct would be significant and if it caught on with audiences (which is not guaranteed to be fair) then that's a base point for the series and fans to work off.

Until that happens though there's going to be some struggles to gain a stronger foothold given the time and financial investment involved. Even in a era where translations and mods are being utilized more than ever there's still a large contingent of people who simply see the work involved in getting a fan translation as too much to do, doubly so for a series they have no familiarity with.

To some degree Touhou in the West feels a bit like an independent musician in the heyday of physical music media; its acclaimed and talked about among the proverbial underground, but until it gets the official album/single and finds itself within the reach of a record company, there's only so far it can go.



(Well either all of that or some popular streamer plays it and loads of tween fans start bombarding Nintendo, Sony, & Steam to start releasing Touhou games)

 

[SharkLord]

If 15.5 Switch got localized, would it use that translation as well?

It might, though I'd hope they took the time to fix it. It was overly literal and has some moments of broken English, and it was just subtitles. Dunno if Phoenixx does translations or just the publishing, but if it's the former, I hope they can manage something a bit better.

 

[Phoenix Douchebag]

How's Ed Edd and Eddy making people disgusted lol.

People nowadays have no taste. Smh

At this point I assume by default that anyone with half a brain would love to have their characters in the most prestigious video game crossover handled by one of the most acclaimed and creative developers out there. It's always cool to hear someone chime in on it but I've grown numb to it a long time ago.

The hangup is usually "does Nintendo want it" and in cases like Sora (or Crash, I guess) the company's price tag. The latter which I doubt is even an issue in the first place since Nintendo is pumping so much money in Smash as is.

Honestly, i find it FAR more interesting when people don't want their characters in Smash, if that has ever happened, but it would be interesting if someone was asked that question and went "HELL NO, I DON'T WANT MY CHARACTERS IN THAT GODDAMN GAME".

 

[Louie G.]

Honestly, i find it FAR more interesting when people don't want their characters in Smash, if that has ever happened, but it would be interesting if someone was asked that question and went "HELL NO, I DON'T WANT MY CHARACTERS IN THAT GODDAMN GAME".

Funny enough, Kamiya acted like this before Bayonetta got in the game LOL... so maybe this is the key to figuring out who makes it!

https://twitter.com/pg_kamiya/status/342659881695858689?s=21

 

[Koopaul]

People nowadays have no taste. Smh


Honestly, i find it FAR more interesting when people don't want their characters in Smash, if that has ever happened, but it would be interesting if someone was asked that question and went "HELL NO, I DON'T WANT MY CHARACTERS IN THAT GODDAMN GAME".

If I recall there were a few devs who said they didn't want their character in Smash because they don't want to depict them being violent.

 

[PeridotGX]

People nowadays have no taste. Smh


Honestly, i find it FAR more interesting when people don't want their characters in Smash, if that has ever happened, but it would be interesting if someone was asked that question and went "HELL NO, I DON'T WANT MY CHARACTERS IN THAT GODDAMN GAME".

"mr. itsuno, how would you feel about dante in smash:
"JESUS CHRIST NO. **** YOU. HOW DARE YOU. NO. NEVER. DANTE WILL NEVER BE IN SMASH. SHUT UP. GO AWAY"
"how about vergil"
"sure, why not"

 

[Will]

Y'all wanna know the last time you guys tried to make something out of Smash-related topics in developer interviews?

This is the opposite scenario, but it's still fitting.

 

[SharkLord]

Funny enough, Kamiya acted like this before Bayonetta got in the game LOL... so maybe this is the key to figuring out who makes it!

https://twitter.com/pg_kamiya/status/342659881695858689?s=21

To be fair, I think he was just sick of hearing the requests over and over again. It happens with him a lot, from what I can gather.