Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[OptimisticStrifer]

With them focusing primarily on current gens, I find it unfortunate we may never get characters like Meowth or Evee, who are very iconic mons.

 

[PeridotGX]

I doubt it'd be Mimikyu, but I do believe your statement to be correct.

Here's why I think it'll be Mimikyu

i have my problems with the way that poll was run, but it still stands that Mimikyu is officially the most popular Pokemon not yet in Smash.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

It's really wild to me to think about how we only have three characters left, and then Ultimate is most likely done.

It's both sad and relieving: I'm gonna miss speculation, but I've also been at Ultimate speculation for like, 3 years now: Even if we got a third pass, I don't think I have it in me for another year+ more of this after next year, lol.

As someone who only joined this site during Ultimate's lifecycle, I am a little out of the loop, do all the support threads and the newcomer thread just shut down as soon as Nintendo says the DLC is finished or something? Do people have to start "intergame" character support threads that aren't for Ultimate, but just for the hypothetical next game for each character, or we don't even have that and there's only just a social thread and competitive metagame discussion? This site did luck out in that the time period between Smash 4 and Ultimate was relatively short due to the Wii U and the Switch's timing in release cycles., I can't imagine a Melee/Brawl timeskip or Brawl/Smash 4 timeskip would do to this site in terms of dead speculation.

This question ain't directed at you specifically since you joined after me, rather anyone who was here long enough during the Smash 4/Ultimate interperiod or Brawl/Smash 4 interperiod.

 

[Perkilator]

bold prediction: we get a Pokemon, but it won't be from the latest generation.
View attachment 296799

...Were that only the case (at least) in the base game...

 

[Powerman293]

Wow. They shut down the Geno thread. I actually can't believe it.

here's a spicy take: One day, there will be a non-video game character in Smash. It won't be this game, it probably won't be the next game, but eventually the director (probably not Sakurai) will look at Goku or something and say "yes, I can do that".

I dunno if it'll be Goku specifically since Sakurai has talked about how much of a pain in the ass HE specifically would be. But in like 10-13 years it wouldn't surprise me if we got a nongaming character but is still somehow related to games in some way.

 

[Louie G.]

I just can't bring myself to anticipate Reimu in any capacity. The most frequent point in her favor seems to be her mass appeal in Japan, which is not exclusive to her and arguably rivaled by several other series that have more accessible and widespread success outside of the east - like Monster Hunter or Puyo Puyo, both of which are also promoted a lot more directly through Nintendo. So if they wanted to specifically appeal to their Japanese audience, there are other series that would do this just as well and end up being a sort of 'best of both worlds' that wouldn't leave western audiences in the dark.

The Touhou fanbase is extremely dedicated and respectable in how they've done so much to make these games available for western audiences, but I feel like pointing people toward fan translations and having to rummage through what's 'official' Touhou content and what isn't is a greater barrier than I see people acknowledge. Considering how Nintendo treats their own fan content, I highly doubt this is something they want to endorse. And accessibility is big for more obscure characters - like Terry for example, who Sakurai knew people would be unfamiliar with and directed people toward several of his games available on Switch.

As for KOS-MOS, I'd actually love to see her out of our Namco pool - never played a Xenosaga game but she seems like she would be a ton of fun. Unfortunately though, unless Nintendo was looking to give the nod to Monolith Soft directly, it's hard to imagine her being chosen over various other Namco characters who are not only more well known and relevant, but also more popular within the Smash community.

And then Crash, I personally doubt he's coming but there isn't much more to say about it.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Besides in an marketing point of view Shantae would make a lot more sense as the Indie rep.

 

[Opossum]

bold prediction: we get a Pokemon, but it won't be from the latest generation.
View attachment 296799

If they, for one reason or another, went back to Alola instead of Galar for a new Mon, I think it'd definitely be Decidueye. Decidueye's the only one we know was considered besides Incineroar, and it came down to those two.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

I just can't bring myself to anticipate Reimu in any capacity. The most frequent point in her favor seems to be her mass appeal in Japan, which is not exclusive to her and arguably rivaled by several other series that have more accessible and widespread success outside of the east - like Monster Hunter or Puyo Puyo, both of which are also promoted a lot more directly through Nintendo. So if they wanted to specifically appeal to their Japanese audience, there are other series that would do this just as well and end up being a sort of 'best of both worlds' that wouldn't leave western audiences in the dark.

The Touhou fanbase is extremely dedicated and respectable in how they've done so much to make these games available for western audiences, but I feel like pointing people toward fan translations and having to rummage through what's 'official' Touhou content and what isn't is a greater barrier than I see people acknowledge. Considering how Nintendo treats their own fan content, I highly doubt this is something they want to endorse. And accessibility is big for more obscure characters - like Terry for example, who Sakurai knew people would be unfamiliar with and directed people toward several of his games available on Switch.

As for KOS-MOS, I'd actually love to see her out of our Namco pool - never played a Xenosaga game but she seems like she would be a ton of fun. Unfortunately though, unless Nintendo was looking to give the nod to Monolith Soft directly, it's hard to imagine her being chosen over various other Namco characters who are not only more well known and relevant, but also more popular within the Smash community.

Yeah, but possibly meme skeleton aside (and even then) the issue is that you could make the same exact argument for... literally every indie, I think, in that there's going to be somebody bigger than they are. The issue lies more with whether or not indie characters are going to come as DLC at all, which is... unlikely, in my view. But if you think that an indie in some shape or form is coming, well, meme skeleton and Cuphead are gone, and the whole (not at all unwarranted) Japan centric thing going on, it's not hard to see why some people land on Reimu as likely indie.

also I don't think Nintendo gives too much of a damn about what other companies do with their IPs. Sonic is literally fangame paradise.

 

[Paraster]

Here's why I think it'll be Mimikyu
View attachment 296800
i have my problems with the way that poll was run, but it still stands that Mimikyu is officially the most popular Pokemon not yet in Smash.

Geez, I forgot that my favorite Eeveelution got #5 of all Pokemon.

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Small correction: It does have one in Culex. I believe he's a secret boss. Definitely nothing major though.

While Culex is inspired by your typical FF final boss, he isn't actually from any of them. He's original to SMRPG.

 

[TwiceEXE]

Besides in an marketing point of view Shantae would make a lot more sense as the Indie rep.

I don't know much about Touhou but I'm 90% sure it's a bigger series than Shantae, so I'm not sure how the marketing would be better with Shantae.

 

[PeridotGX]

If they, for one reason or another, went back to Alola instead of Galar for a new Mon, I think it'd definitely be Decidueye. Decidueye's the only one we know was considered besides Incineroar, and it came down to those two.

I'd love Decidueye, it's my favorite Alola Pokemon and in my top 3 in total. If I had to choose between it and Mimikyu I'd choose it a thousand times over, but I can't think of a good reason to add it. Decidueye's done... pretty much nothing since Incineroar was added, other than getting beat up by it's baby form in the anime. Mimikyu was top 3 in the google poll, and number one for pokemon not in Smash.

And do we know if Decidueye and Incineroar were the only choices Sakurai considered?

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Here's why I think it'll be Mimikyu
View attachment 296800
i have my problems with the way that poll was run, but it still stands that Mimikyu is officially the most popular Pokemon not yet in Smash.

Mimikyu is already in Smash Bros though, unless you believe Assist Trophies and Poke Ball assists have a chance at being promoted.

 

[Perkilator]

Mimikyu is already in Smash Bros though, unless you believe Assist Trophies and Poke Ball assists have a chance at being promoted.

View attachment 296802

It's not enough; I just wish it was playable instead of . Just imagine the detail on Mimikyu's rag if it were a playable character.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

The FP2 ch5 leak has in favour that is something I would say “realistic” lineup of fighters with 3 big picks (Steve/Sephiroth/Crash) and 3 niche picks (Min Min/Reimu/Kos-Mos).

To give the benefit of the doubt Reimu may be niche in the west but she (and Touhou as a whole) are FREAKIN HUGE in Japan. They have Comiket, a YEARLY convention with doujin circles and remixers and stuff

AND I **** YOU NOT WHEN I SAY TOUHOU HAD A CROSSOVER WITH HELLO FRIGGIN KITTY. ITS. THAT. BIG. OF. A. DEAL.

 

[PeridotGX]

Mimikyu is already in Smash Bros though, unless you believe Assist Trophies and Poke Ball assists have a chance at being promoted.

View attachment 296802

i belive they do. Everything in the base game, including ATs, are fair game.

ironic that the guy who ran the graveyard thread is so uncaring about disconfirmation.

 

[CroonerMike]

I had this terrible scenario thought:
What if after pass 2 they decided to do a pass 3 with 3 characters only BUT you have to vote for which assist trophies they will upgrade into playable characters. I can’t even imagine how this stupid scenario would play out.

before anyone says: I do not believe we are getting a 3rd pass. This was just a silly thought I had during break between teaching. Edit* also I do believe assist trophies will not be upgraded*

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

I'm a bit sad that we're having a discussion about indie characters yet no one's mentioned Cave Story.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

To give the benefit of the doubt Reimu may be niche in the west but she (and Touhou as a whole) are FREAKIN HUGE in Japan. They have Comiket, a YEARLY convention with doujin circles and remixers and stuff

Touhou is (still) very big at comiket, but that's a more general Doujin event. Reitaisai is the largest Touhou specific event.
Its pretty consistently gotten about 50000 attendees during the summer event and 20000 during the winter one for several years now
and there's plenty of other events too, Meikasai was fairly recent (with actual physical attendees because Japan hasn't completely botched their Coronavirus response)

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If they, for one reason or another, went back to Alola instead of Galar for a new Mon, I think it'd definitely be Decidueye. Decidueye's the only one we know was considered besides Incineroar, and it came down to those two.

To be fair Mimikyu may not have existed at the time of considerations, and the fact that the Pokémon was added for promotional reasons might have made the starters the only available picks (or they were just the safest since they and the legendaries were the only ones guaranteed to have anyone with knowledge of the games know them, and the legendaries probably don't get picked for the same reasons as the three house leaders, except each one represents its own game). Either situation might have changed by now.

I highly doubt they'd go with another Gen 6 character though. It's far more likely to be someone who's front and center for the series's anniversary, which is unlikely to be anything like Mimikyu or Decidueye.

 

[Perkilator]

I personally think the legalities for KH might be a little easier to go through than people claim;

• For the general KH license, you go to Disney
• For the characters and locations, you go to Nomura
• For music (well, most of it, anyways), you go to Yoko Shimomura (who's been on board for Smash since Brawl)

From my point of view, it's certainly easier to go through than Dragon Quest.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

I'm a bit sad that we're having a discussion about indie characters yet no one's mentioned Cave Story.

Quote would be great
its just

Nicalis

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Quote would be great
its just

Nicalis

Oh yeah.

Nicalis.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

It's not enough; I just wish it was playable instead of . Just imagine the detail on Mimikyu's rag if it were a playable character.

It hurts me as a Decidueye fan to find out it was almost going to be chosen but then Incineroar happened.

i belive they do. Everything in the base game, including ATs, are fair game.

Fair enough. I'm more on the line that Assist Trophies and Poke ball assists are good enough for Nintendo and there wouldn't be a need to upgrade them until next game.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Quote and Curly Brace were both in Blade Strangers, so I don't think Nicalis would be a problem when it comes to acquiring the rights.

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Quote and Curly Brace were both in Blade Strangers, so I don't think Nicalis would be a problem when it comes to acquiring the rights.

It's less about acquiring the rights and more about the company's very poor reputation as of late.

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

While we're on the topic of Pokémon and a giant list of Miis and who they came out with was dumped, it made me think if a Pokemon rep was coming that the Team Rocket costume would have come out with it. Then again Banjo was a pretty early character in terms of the greater DLC and I don't know if looking at Miis has ever done anything for predicting a character.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

It's less about acquiring the rights and more about the company's very poor reputation as of late.

May the gaming gods have mercy on anyone who friggin ghosts Sakurai

cuz let’s face it that’s what the Nicalis CEO would do without a moment’s hesitation

 

[Momotsuki]

ZUN playing nicely with Touhou fan content will not hurt Reimu's chances. Nintendo is a bunch of zealous, trashy freaks, but they still only care about that stuff with their IPs. If they think Reimu will help sell the pass, that's what will matter to them.

Steve was just a bit over two months ago. Minecraft has a flourishing modding scene that the developers of Minecraft are quite friendly with. Former Minecraft modders are at Mojang, for crying out loud, and that didn't peeve the screaming, wallowing infant that is Nintendo.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

May the gaming gods have mercy on anyone who friggin ghosts Sakurai

you would think that Nicalis management would have enough braincells to rub together to figure out that ghosting Sakurai would be a stupid ass decision.

the issue is that good old Japanese corporate Nintendo would likely rather not take that risk when
you know
they could just nab another character whose company doesn't have a history of ghosting

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

May the gaming gods have mercy on anyone who friggin ghosts Sakurai

cuz let’s face it that’s what the Nicalis CEO would do without a moment’s hesitation

Lol yeah. Jokes aside, ghosting is only one of the CEO's issues.

 

[Technomage]

Hey guys, what would be the chances of Nintendo adding a joke character as one of the DLC fighters? I'm thinking Slippy, Tingle, Bubsy, or maybe even Lester the Unlikely (the latter of whom would be a very big surprise as the Final DLC char).

 

[7NATOR]

While we're on the topic of Pokémon and a giant list of Miis and who they came out with was dumped, it made me think if a Pokemon rep was coming that the Team Rocket costume would have come out with it. Then again Banjo was a pretty early character in terms of the greater DLC and I don't know if looking at Miis has ever done anything for predicting a character.

It was said that FP2 was greenlit around E3 of 2019, so before Hero's Mii costume wave. There's also the High likihood of why Geno and chocobo did not come with Hero, because at that point it was decided to come with Sephiroth

With that in mind, I do think the Team Rocket costume could be implicated in suggesting no Pokemon Character. The only Mii wave I say might have question of it's effect on the Greater DLC is Joker, since Joker came out in April (and was also presentation was recorded Earlier)

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Hey guys, what would be the chances of Nintendo adding a joke character as one of the DLC fighters? I'm thinking Slippy, Tingle, Bubsy, or maybe even Lester the Unlikely (the latter of whom would be a very big surprise as the Final DLC char).

For those characters specifically, I'm gonna give it a big fat 0% chance.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

Bubsy

we need the patron saint of games so bad they're still not good but really funny to point and laugh at
do this sakurai

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Eh, I still think Quote would be a worthwhile addition. Especially if the lost puppies are somehow a benign stage hazard that allows you to stack them on your head.

Just imagine it: Sephiroth, Kirby, and Piranha Plans with puppies on their heads.

While we're on the topic of Pokémon and a giant list of Miis and who they came out with was dumped, it made me think if a Pokemon rep was coming that the Team Rocket costume would have come out with it. Then again Banjo was a pretty early character in terms of the greater DLC and I don't know if looking at Miis has ever done anything for predicting a character.

I think if the passes were decided at two different times, then one doesn't really affect the other. Why would you not hold off if your plans changed? Because that requires a lot of work and can disrupt the production line.

Hey guys, what would be the chances of Nintendo adding a joke character as one of the DLC fighters? I'm thinking Slippy, Tingle, Bubsy, or maybe even Lester the Unlikely (the latter of whom would be a very big surprise as the Final DLC char).

I don't think it'd be a good idea. Even disregarding the requirement of being comically undertuned, characters that are picked because it would be funny seem to amuse people less and less as time goes on, and if the joke doesn't land, they just get angry.

 

[Louie G.]

ZUN playing nicely with Touhou fan content will not hurt Reimu's chances. Nintendo is a bunch of zealous, trashy freaks, but they still only care about that stuff with their IPs. If they think Reimu will help sell the pass, that's what will matter to them.

Steve was just a bit over two months ago. Minecraft has a flourishing modding scene that the developers of Minecraft are quite friendly with. Former Minecraft modders are at Mojang, for crying out loud, and that didn't peeve the screaming, wallowing infant that is Nintendo.

That isn't exactly what I meant, I was moreso referring to the fact that many Touhou games get dumped untranslated on Steam and that fans need to pick up that slack. For Nintendo the fan contributions would likely be as good as nonexistent (no way they'd let Sakurai acknowledge that on stream), so they'd be directing people toward various untranslated games on PC which... I just don't see any motivation for? There are Touhou games on Switch, most of them unofficial, but considering the most Nintendo has ever done for them is post one trailer for Gensou Skydrift on their YouTube (iirc, at least) I don't think there's any real initiative here.

It's not about whether or not these games are modded or how many of them are developed by fans, and whether or not that's endorsed by the creators. It's about how Touhou's accessibility in the west lies dominantly in the hands of fans. You can play official Minecraft or Sonic games all over the world, in all different languages, without needing to mod a single thing. I'm not knocking Touhou's approach to game development and localization - it works well enough for them, but it makes things dicey for Smash and makes it a bit difficult to imagine what motivation Nintendo would have to randomly hone in on Touhou.

 

[MrMcNuts]

Speaking of Rayman. Know that ice that appears to look like Rayman inside? Assuming Rayman is among the final three think that might have something to do with his reveal trailer like him breaking out as characters in his supposed trailer duals it out on the Battlefield?

I think the ice texture is just a coincidence but I would adore it if the smash team knew of the meme behind it and decided to base his reveal trailer on it!

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

Sitting down and realizing that Joker's wave was probably done before plans for pass 2 was finalized now fills me with grief knowing that any mention of Altus' own mascot Jack Frost truly was forgotten. Not even a Mii costume, grief! But hey if Square and Microsoft got two reps, then perhaps... I am being too hopeful.