Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Ramen Tengoku]

My main issue with a gen 8 mon at this point is that I think they would've capitalized on SwSh as soon as they possibly could.

Byleth (1 year anniversary of that reveal today btw) happened not even half a year after TH launched. Corrin only took about 8 months or so after fate's japanese debut.

Meanwhile with SwSh, it's been over a year and still no smash inclusion in sight. If they planned a gen 8 mon, Id assume we would've gotten it by this point. Idk man, I think the ship has sailed on that front.

 

[BritishGuy54]

In the same vein as what 7NATOR did a bit ago, how would you feel if these were the new DLC?
Phoenix Wright
Lloyd Irving or Yuri
A promotional pick from Pokemon
Similarly, these are my predictions.

Phoenix - I’d be happy enough. Phoenix is a character I would like in Smash and would prefer him over Chun Li.
Lloyd - Not too keen on this one. Here in Europe, Tales is a really niche franchise. And I never really saw the appeal. Just my opinion speaking.
Pokemon - Please no. There’s other first party reps like Rex, Paper Mario, Zelda rep, Kirby rep. I love Pokemon, but I don’t want to see another Pokemon rep unless we get FP3.

 

[chocolatejr9]

The UK sorted that out in its own way



If this applies to Pokemon then it applies to other games and franchises that got hit with spirit events like Resident Evil btw.
Otherwise you're just making an exception.

To be fair, Pokemon is the exception for a lot of things in Smash.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

In the same vein as what 7NATOR did a bit ago, how would you feel if these were the new DLC?
Phoenix Wright
Lloyd Irving or Yuri
A promotional pick from Pokemon
Similarly, these are my predictions.

Phoenix Wright - Really Happy
Lloyd Irving or Yuri - Really Happy
A promotional pick from Pokemon - Ew

 

[SharkLord]

Y'know the whole Euden/Europe thing becomes funny when you realize Euden's name literally starts out with EU

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

This is still confusing me what you're saying.

The games come out over here, but the English fanbase is so small the creator doesn't think it's worth translating them...and this is somehow evidence that it's English fanbase ISN'T insignificant?

What she's saying is that ZUN doesn't think it's worth hiring official translators because the fans do it themselves for free.

It DOES feel like a huge missed opportunity to create a fully decloned Ganondorf. It's weird how that game decides to remain slavish to Smash at times(like deciding to add Pichu...)

I don't think they're going for "Everyone is here!" so I'd imagine Pichu's only there because someone liked the idea. That being said though, Simon and Mega Man are both super clunky, and I suspect it's because they had an original idea for the character, and changed it to be more like the official thing in both cases.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Anyone who thinks Pokemon is still in play because only 7 Pokemon were in the Spirit Event has completely missed the point of why DLC Spirits disconfirm.

Leon Kennedy isn't disconfirmed because there's a png of him. That's an absurd notion. You could still totally make a pack out of him, there's clearly other Spirits that he could bring. And that applies to every game or series that had a Spirit Event.

It's not a matter of being on the Spirit Event, it's a matter of the Spirit Event existing at all. Think of the timeline here. Fighters have been decided a while ago, while Spirit Events are probably worked on shortly before they release. Therefore Spirit Events are decided knowing what fighters are going to be in the pass. And so, comes the question. If the Spirit team knows that, say, Officer Howard is coming down the line, then why would they make a Spirit Event? It's redundant, it makes the actual pack feel less fresh, and from a promotional perspective it makes no sense, a Spirit Event won't make a dent sales-wise compared to the fighter that they know they're making down the line. If timing was that big a deal then the fighter would, y'know, release when they need it to.

I find it pretty astonishing when people miss that, because it means that someone just went "oh it's a Spirit? Guess it's not playable now" without considering why that makes sense. Makes about as much sense as thinking that Heihachi can't be a fighter purely because he's a Mii Costume and not, you know, when that Mii Costume was made.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Honestly the argument is pointless at this point. If we are getting a Pokémon, it's going to be for something from the anniversary, not Pokémon Sword and Pokémon Shield specifically.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I’d be super ok with a Gen 4 Pokémon like that Gen is full of bad ass Pokémon.

 

[RileyXY1]

Honestly the argument is pointless at this point. If we are getting a Pokémon, it's going to be for something from the anniversary, not Pokémon Sword and Pokémon Shield specifically.

I can't see them putting in any Pokemon not from the newest gen anymore.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I’d be super ok with a Gen 4 Pokémon like that Gen is full of bad ass Pokémon.

Including the Pikaclone that won the world championship that one time!

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I can't see them putting in any Pokemon not from the newest gen anymore.

Well the whole reason for it is that Pokémon are pretty much just tied to the current big game at the time, so if the current big game is from a different generation or has a Pokémon from a different generation at the forefront, it could happen.

Of course, it could also be a current gen Pokémon anyway, but the reason for addition won't be the current generation's first titles imo.

 

[ALongWistfulSquiggle]

Including the Pikaclone that won the world championship that one time!

Pachirisu did that? I thought it was Emolga.

Edit: I guess it was. huh. Nevermind then.

 

[DarthEnderX]

What she's saying is that ZUN doesn't think it's worth hiring official translators because the fans do it themselves for free.

That...that still screams "niche" to me. Like, do you know the kind obscure **** that has to actually RELY on fansubs on the intetnet?

It seriously feels like a literal argument AGAINST their point is being used as though it supported it. And I just don't get it.

"Dog poop smells bad." "If dog poop smells bad, then why do we make them poop outside, huh?"

 

[True Blue Warrior]

If this applies to Pokemon then it applies to other games and franchises that got hit with spirit events like Resident Evil btw.
Otherwise you're just making an exception.

Plot twist, Nemesis is the last DLC character.

 

[SharkLord]

That...that still screams "niche" to me. Like, do you know the kind obscure **** that has to actually RELY on fansubs on the intetnet?

It seriously feels like a literal argument AGAINST their point is being used as though it supported it. And I just don't get it.

"Dog poop smells bad." "If dog poop smells bad, then why do we make them poop outside, huh?"

I don't think Touhou necessarily relies on the fan translation so much as ZUN just knows he can use them, so he just goes with it. It's worked for a decade or two; Why stop now?

 

[Goombaic]

Toxtricity is in.

To segue to a less controversial topic, is there really no doubt that Nightmare would be the Soul Calibur character if one were to be chosen when Mitsurugi and others exist?

 

[RileyXY1]

Well the whole reason for it is that Pokémon are pretty much just tied to the current big game at the time, so if the current big game is from a different generation or has a Pokémon from a different generation at the forefront, it could happen.

Of course, it could also be a current gen Pokémon anyway, but the reason for addition won't be the current generation's first titles imo.

I can't see Smash promoting a remake with a character. Besides, Lucario is already playable.

 

[BritishGuy54]

I’d be super ok with a Gen 4 Pokémon like that Gen is full of bad ass Pokémon.

But we have a badass Pokemon from Gen 4. Lucario.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I can't see Smash promoting a remake with a character. Besides, Lucario is already playable.

Just because they don't normally doesn't mean they absolutely won't, and Lucario has been in for three games now, if they wanted to hype up the games with a character they're not going to stop because he exists. They'll add another one because new stuff is much more effective for that purpose.

 

[RileyXY1]

Just because they don't normally doesn't mean they absolutely won't, and Lucario has been in for three games now, if they wanted to hype up the games with a character they're not going to stop because he exists. They'll add another one because new stuff is much more effective for that purpose.

Lucario is literally the most popular Gen 4 Pokemon and I think that Nintendo would instead promote something else in Smash.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Toxtricity is in.

To segue to a less controversial topic, is there really no doubt that Nightmare would be the Soul Calibur character if one were to be chosen when Mitsurugi and others exist?

Imagine a hypothetical “Sakurai Presents Nightmare” video.

”By the way, you may have noticed that a very important character from the Soul Calibur series was not included. Yes, Ivy Valentine. Super Smash Brothers is for good boys and girls of many different ages, so we decided not to feature her. Please forgive us.”

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

I’d love a gen 4 pokemon, either Garchamp or Darkrai would be my choice (Yes I know Darkrai is a pokeball pokemon)

 

[7NATOR]

In the same vein as what 7NATOR did a bit ago, how would you feel if these were the new DLC?
Phoenix Wright
Lloyd Irving or Yuri
A promotional pick from Pokemon
Similarly, these are my predictions.

Okay I guess. I'm not super excited, but I'm interested how they do the movesets, Especially Phoenix

and if the Character is Lloyd, I hope he's voiced by his OLD VA because that means we have Robin in Spirit

 

[Goombaic]

Imagine a hypothetical “Sakurai Presents Nightmare” video.

”By the way, you may have noticed that a very important character from the Soul Calibur series was not included. Yes, Ivy Valentine. Super Smash Brothers is for good boys and girls of many different ages, so we decided not to feature her. Please forgive us.”

That'd be a coward's move.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Lucario is literally the most popular Gen 4 Pokemon and I think that Nintendo would instead promote something else in Smash.

Like I said, if they wanted to promote the game with a character, they wouldn't see Lucario and go "oh wait! Hold everything! They've already got one!". They'll add another one because new stuff is much more effective for that purpose. Also, Gen 4 probably has the highest concentration of fan favorite Pokémon so Lucario being the most popular of the bunch (if he even is that) isn't an issue. And honestly, if he is the most popular, it's probably not by much considering how much people love Garchomp.

 

[MBRedboy31]

It DOES feel like a huge missed opportunity to create a fully decloned Ganondorf. It's weird how that game decides to remain slavish to Smash at times(like deciding to add Pichu...)

...Maybe because they might like the playstyles and would thus want to put their own spins on them without drastically altering them?

In a more practical sense, though, it’s a lot easier to draw sprite animations of official animations instead of brand new ones since official animations allow you to use the in-game animations as reference. IIRC, the person who made Sonic‘s and Tails’ current sprites said that it was far easier to make Sonic’s sprites than Tails’ sprites for this reason.

 

[7NATOR]

Regarding Pokemon, It's not just the Spirit event that might suggest no Pokemon is happening

There was also the Team Rocket Mii Costume, that was completely brand new and put in Banjo's Pack, when they announced Extra DLC. I would think they'd save a brand new Pokemon costume for Pokemon Character

--------------------

Also while it's not related to Smash speculation specfcially, here is some hope for people wanting to see Bayonetta 3 this year

PlatinumGames hopes to give an update on Bayonetta 3 and more in 2021 - Nintendo Everything

 

[DarthEnderX]

...Maybe because they might like the playstyles and would thus want to put their own spins on them without drastically altering them?

I'm sure that's it. But it doesn't make it feel like any less of a missed opportunity.

 

[Arcanir]

If that's the case, why would there be new Pokeball summons every smash game if the Pokemon company would be fine without them? Pokeball summons are an item exclusive to that series that summon different kinds of Pokemon so wouldn't they want new Pokemon to come along with their new Pokemon character? Pokemon are the main highlights of the series.

Maybe a Gen 8 Pokemon will be released without new Pokeball summons but it seems traditional to add a new batch of Pokeball summons along with a new Pokemon character.

Because they were added with a base game character which adds new items and thus they could add them alongside one. Again, we only have two rounds of DLC to go with, the previous one of which didn't come when an entirely new Generation of Pokemon were released, and one that's currently running and thus we don't have the finalized data for. We can't use the absence of evidence here to prove that TCPi would be so stingy that they wouldn't allow a character to happen without Pokeball summons as it's only at best one instance in terms of DLC. They may be completely fine with it since all in all, a playable character does still greatly promote and sell the game they're making.

Personally I have my doubts on a Gen 8 Pokemon as well (promotional timing slipping away, the Spirit Event, etc.), but I don't think the lack of Pokeball summons is what's going to hold it back. If it doesn't happen, it's because of other reasons that they passed on a character, not because TCPi hates money.

 

[SharkLord]

Toxtricity is in.

To segue to a less controversial topic, is there really no doubt that Nightmare would be the Soul Calibur character if one were to be chosen when Mitsurugi and others exist?

I think Nightmare's the most likely by virtue of being Project Soul's logo, which would say a lot about his status in the games. Still, after Min Min I think some other characters might have a chance.

 

[ALongWistfulSquiggle]

I do think we'll see a fighter from something coming out this year, probably from the first half. Not knowing what games are coming makes the guesswork more difficult, but that's the only real prediction I have. It might be interesting to make a list of long-running Nintendo series that seem due for a release soon.

What I've got:
Kirby - It hasn't seen a lot of activity lately other than the little fighting game.
2D Metroid - We got a remake on 3DS and the developer of that game hasn't released anything since that year.
something Monolith Soft - They have multiple studios, some of which have been working on projects for a while. It could be Zelda, it could be that new IP.
Pokemon - Their last mainline title was late 2019, so we could see something this year, though personally I'd guess later in the year if it happens.
Mario - There's always more Mario. Also, Cat World rerelease.
Zelda - Already touched on it, but it's been almost 4 years since BotW, so BotW 2 should be soonish. Also the series has been annual in some fashion for a bit.
Fire Emblem - If and only if it's a remake.

Any thoughts? Anything I missed? Is there something there you'd really like to see get some Smash content?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I do think we'll see a fighter from something coming out this year, probably from the first half. Not knowing what games are coming makes the guesswork more difficult, but that's the only real prediction I have. It might be interesting to make a list of long-running Nintendo series that seem due for a release soon.

What I've got:
Kirby - It hasn't seen a lot of activity lately other than the little fighting game.
2D Metroid - We got a remake on 3DS and the developer of that game hasn't released anything since that year.
something Monolith Soft - They have multiple studios, some of which have been working on projects for a while. It could be Zelda, it could be that new IP.
Pokemon - Their last mainline title was late 2019, so we could see something this year, though personally I'd guess later in the year if it happens.
Mario - There's always more Mario. Also, Cat World rerelease.
Zelda - Already touched on it, but it's been almost 4 years since BotW, so BotW 2 should be soonish. Also the series has been annual in some fashion for a bit.
Fire Emblem - If and only if it's a remake.

Any thoughts? Anything I missed? Is there something there you'd really like to see get some Smash content?

I’m lowkey hoping Monolith puts out Xenoblade X Definitive, for obvious reasons

And that I want more people to experience this masterpiece. YOU HAVENT LIVED UNTIL A LEVEL 65 TYRANT INTERRUPTS YOUR NORMAL BATTLE AND WIPES THE FLOOR WITH YOU IN .5 SECONDS FLAT. also, Skells.

 

[ALongWistfulSquiggle]

I’m lowkey hoping Monolith puts out Xenoblade X Definitive, for obvious reasons

And that I want more people to experience this masterpiece. YOU HAVENT LIVED UNTIL A LEVEL 65 TYRANT INTERRUPTS YOUR NORMAL BATTLE AND WIPES THE FLOOR WITH YOU IN .5 SECONDS FLAT. also, Skells.

That would be nice. It's not like the assets need to be remade or anything. It just needs a UI overhaul and some quality of life changes.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

That would be nice. It's not like the assets need to be remade or anything. It just needs a UI overhaul and some quality of life changes.

Maybe some new content... previously cut content perhaps like with XCDE?

 

[Cosmic77]

My main issue with a gen 8 mon at this point is that I think they would've capitalized on SwSh as soon as they possibly could.

Byleth (1 year anniversary of that reveal today btw) happened not even half a year after TH launched. Corrin only took about 8 months or so after fate's japanese debut.

Meanwhile with SwSh, it's been over a year and still no smash inclusion in sight. If they planned a gen 8 mon, Id assume we would've gotten it by this point. Idk man, I think the ship has sailed on that front.

To be fair, it's not like ARMS was at it's peak when they added Min Min. I know it's a little different considering how ARMS was a new franchise that wasn't on the roster, but still, three years later isn't the ideal time to promote a new game.

I don't really think there's a rush. Byleth could've been released as F2 so he lined up perfectly with 3H's launch, but they allowed Sakurai to make him last. If Sakurai wanted some time to consider which Pokémon he'd add, I'm sure Nintendo would allow him to hold off on the character.

Anyone who thinks Pokemon is still in play because only 7 Pokemon were in the Spirit Event has completely missed the point of why DLC Spirits disconfirm.

Leon Kennedy isn't disconfirmed because there's a png of him. That's an absurd notion. You could still totally make a pack out of him, there's clearly other Spirits that he could bring. And that applies to every game or series that had a Spirit Event.

It's not a matter of being on the Spirit Event, it's a matter of the Spirit Event existing at all. Think of the timeline here. Fighters have been decided a while ago, while Spirit Events are probably worked on shortly before they release. Therefore Spirit Events are decided knowing what fighters are going to be in the pass. And so, comes the question. If the Spirit team knows that, say, Officer Howard is coming down the line, then why would they make a Spirit Event? It's redundant, it makes the actual pack feel less fresh, and from a promotional perspective it makes no sense, a Spirit Event won't make a dent sales-wise compared to the fighter that they know they're making down the line. If timing was that big a deal then the fighter would, y'know, release when they need it to.

I find it pretty astonishing when people miss that, because it means that someone just went "oh it's a Spirit? Guess it's not playable now" without considering why that makes sense. Makes about as much sense as thinking that Heihachi can't be a fighter purely because he's a Mii Costume and not, you know, when that Mii Costume was made.

In SwSh's case, the Spirit event could've been made for the sole purpose of promoting the launch of the games so they didn't have to wait a long time before the relevant content was ready. Even if they waited until the release of the character, June would've been the absolute earliest they could've released them. Realistically though, it probably would've much later.

Plus, there's nothing stopping them from recycling the existing Spirits like they did with some of ARMS' Spirits.

 

[Dinoman96]

You know as far as Mario characters are concerned, I always thought that online tourney they did last month was a bad omen.

I dunno, I just think if a Mario character really was in the cards for this pass, they would of been one of the first characters prioritised, to get them out in time for Mario's 35th anniversary and thus in time for the online tourney above.

Geno kinda had the argument that he's obscure and divorced enough from the usual Mario fare, but then he got bodied. So I don't think it's a good sign for the more "mainstream" Mario characters like Waluigi or King Boo.

 

[UltimateCyborgOverlord]

I’d be super ok with a Gen 4 Pokémon like that Gen is full of bad ass Pokémon.

I didn't know there were bad ass Pokemon in Gen 4... badass Pokemon yes, but not bad ass Pokemon.

There is a couple ass Pokemon, but they're in Gen 7, and I'm not super sure that I'd consider them to be bad




But... in any situation... if we do get a Gen 4 Pokemon, I vote Croagunk. Delightfull little creeper sittin there lookin at his reflection, occasionally poisoning his own trainer but mainly just creepin everyone out by sitting there

 

[StarBot]

Now that this thread is on the subject of a potential Pokémon rep for the 34543th time, let me get something off of my chest for a bit regarding Pokémon in Smash...

Man!! I would have really liked it if there were more Human characters from Pokémon represented in Smash. Like seriously, where the hell are all the iconic professors, rivals, villains and champions from each game? I guess it's already something that some of those characters are represented through the music somehow, but at least not one of them being a Spirit seriously confuses me. Red... Oh wait I mean "Pokémon Trainer"... is the only kind of representation we have on this matter, and he doesn't even have a proper spirit.

It's just a bummer really.

That's probably because, up until recently, most of the mainstream audience who likes Pokemon, never cared about the human characters in the game, with the expectation of a few (that was in the anime also lmao)

Which the expectation of Japan and the hardcore Pokemon (of the games) fans of course

Now that anime and otaku culture is mainstream, now westerns are going back and appreciating them as characters and "wafui-ing" / "husbando-ing" them up

 

[Idon]

Toxtricity is in.

To segue to a less controversial topic, is there really no doubt that Nightmare would be the Soul Calibur character if one were to be chosen when Mitsurugi and others exist?

I'd bet money on it. The first thing I think about when I think "Soul Calibur" is Nightmare and his giant meat sword.
Plus he comes with the bonus of being a heavy but nimble villain character with an unconventional fighting style so from a variety perspective he's all the more enticing.

I would personally place Ivy and her whip-sword as a close second for being the likely Soul Calibur rep, though I feel she's got a few "issues" going against her.