Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Dinoman96]

Glad this old post of mine aged well

 

[3BitSaurus]

Isn't the Sephiroth challenge a date thing? Or was it exclusive to a specific patch? I know some people have found a way to replay it but it may involve hacking.

I think it was date-exclusive, from Sephiroth's presentation up to his release. Meaning you can't really beat it with Pyra/Mythra, Kazuya or Sora.

 

[DarthEnderX]

How though? The 3rd parties would require licencing issues and just think how hard it probably was to get Sora.

I have a theory about that...

WHAT IF...Nintendo actually accounted for that during it's negotiations for Ultimate. What if part of the deal for getting a character into Smash Ultimate, is that there is an option for Nintendo to use any of the content they obtained for Ultimate in future Smash games, provided they pay the royalties again. So that there is no work or negotiation involved(unless they want to obtain new, additional content), it simply becomes a matter of "do we want to pay for this character again, or not?".

It's not a COMPLETELY unheard of deal. For example, Fox's rights to make X-Men/Fantastic Four movies, or Sony with Spider-Man movies. The deal was basically that as long as they keep making movies, Marvel doesn't have the power to KEEP them from making those movies.

And if anyone has the kind of leverage to dictate that kind of deal, it's Nintendo with Smash Bros. Everyone is so desperate to get their character into Smash, they might actually agree to that kind of deal(except maybe Disney).

I could see this as the kind of thing Sakurai might try and do in order to future proof the Smash series from widespread roster cuts.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Yo another 8-Player Smash.

vs.vs.vs.vs.vs.vs.vs.

Closest we'll ever get to PSASBR in Smash.

 

[Shroob]

I think it was date-exclusive, from Sephiroth's presentation up to his release. Meaning you can't really beat it with Pyra/Mythra, Kazuya or Sora.

Iirc, you can just roll back the Switch's clock and it works.

Either that or it's locked to that date on a specific patch.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Iirc, you can just roll back the Switch's clock and it works.

Either that or it's locked to that date on a specific patch.

What date range was the challenge? I might try screwing with the Switch clock later

 

[SKX31]

Oh, definitely. It's incredibly fun to land smash attacks as Mac. In fact, it's perhaps the only fun part of his gameplay.

So when they play as Mac against someone who understands the air game... yeah, that's when Mac stop being appealing.

TLDR - if you like Mac, just stick to playing your friends and hope they never get better than you.

I mean, as much as I've ragged on the character design too (really think it was taken too far in one direction - going for stray hits on the ground) he's also got some niché aerial stuff: N-Air is the quickest aerial in the game and D-Air can aid his recovery (even if that's more or less advanced tech territory). Peanut's used Mac's aerials to create tech chases and what not, and that might be a good use of them regardless of skill level.

That said, he was considered decent in Smash 4 (mid tier). It's just that he was nerfed where IMHO they didn't need to in the transition to Ultimate (a lot of his confirms were removed) and he's one of the characters that really got hammered by Ultimate's engine (removal of microspacing options, universal landing lag reduction benefiting most others, etc.)

Still though, I'm not convinced he really works beyond a casual level due to him being extremely volatile and I'd be for reworking.

Isn't the Sephiroth challenge a date thing? Or was it exclusive to a specific patch? I know some people have found a way to replay it but it may involve hacking.

I think it was date-exclusive, from Sephiroth's presentation up to his release. Meaning you can't really beat it with Pyra/Mythra, Kazuya or Sora.

It was officially exclusive to the 10.0.0 patch (with the "proper" patch being 10.1.0 which removed the Challenge but added the rest of the content). Edit: Kinda think the best bet to re-access it requires hacking it in offline - partly since I dunno if most people would want to roll back the patches.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Cmon everyone - no roster cuts? Do we really want a game with a character select screen of over 120 characters?

Yes. I unironically want a roster on par with Super Smash Brother Infinite.

Give me this but official.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Does it still count as bypassing the filter if the Japanese S-word's vulgarity can range anywhere from our S-word to "crud"?

 

[Noipoi]

I don’t wanna think about cuts cuz I know half my favorites will be gone.

So I’m gonna enjoy ultimate for the next six or whatever years and save the freaking out for when the time comes

 

[N3ON]

Does it still count as bypassing the filter if the Japanese S-word's vulgarity can range anywhere from our S-word to "crud"?

Why you snitching

 

[GilTheGreat19]

I’m probably alone in this but I’ve never had an issue with non video game characters in Smash. I’d love to play as Predator, Venom, The TMNT, Edward Elric, the Undertaker or tons of other random characters.

My body would leave my soul if Venom got in

 

[Dukefire]

Something to move the topic a bit, Nintendo has posted a video about the history of the 2D metroid games. For the fans to prepare for Dread's arrival tomorrow.

 

[ryuryunonoroi]

It's sad to think that Super Smash Bros. Ultimate is the last game in the series and that no other future Super Smash Bros. will be released, because Masahiro Sakurai said that he will stop the series after the last character which is Sora. But I hope someone else is found to continue.

Is this about Sakurai's "life's work" comment in the Kazuya presentation. Because that wouldn't imply anything concrete. He could come in and continue to develop and build upon Smash with the next entry and that wouldn't negate such a statement.

He hasn't said anything concrete for the time being. Have some patience and at least give him a few months before jumping on certain assumptions.

How though? The 3rd parties would require licencing issues and just think how hard it probably was to get Sora.

There is one way I could potentially see this happening feasibly. If perhaps during the agreements with the third parties finalized there was a clause included with most of them that they could also be used in future Smash titles. But there would obviously need to be some benefit to the third parties as well beyond simple exposure for their products.

Then again, the announcement for the KH Trilogy on the Switch and the one music track being tied to save data of Memory of Melodies certainly moved units, especially the latter causing Best Buy and Gamestop's online storefronts to crash. Who knows maybe that exposure alone is worth it.

 

[3BitSaurus]

My body would leave my soul if Venom got in

I love that it's your body that leaves.

Does it go on autopilot or something?

 

[Warumian]

Something to move the topic a bit, Nintendo has posted a video about the history of the 2D metroid games. For the fans to prepare for Dread's arrival tomorrow.

Nintendo marketing the hell out of Metroid, more than Pokemon BDSP or Mario Party, in what reality are we living.

 

[Momotsuki]

Maybe I'm just crazy but I think the issue with Little Mac, design-wise, isn't that they went too far, but rather that they didn't go far enough. He's supposed to be a character of extremes, and most reworks I've seen raised completely clash with that. I don't think the solution is to improve his air game, but to make his ground game absolutely ****ing ridiculous. A weight buff here, some armor there, a considerable increase in fall speed, all while hitting even more like a truck than he already does.

I've had people respond to me saying that he'd be too much of a noobstomper, but like... is that an actual concern if he's not truly busted? (Which I still don't think he would be - the Little Mac of my dreams is probably mid-tier at best.) K. Rool is a low tier but he'll reign terror over any friend group.

 

[SilverSoul24]

I don’t wanna think about cuts cuz I know half my favorites will be gone.

So I’m gonna enjoy ultimate for the next six or whatever years and save the freaking out for when the time comes

Saaaame. I guess I shouldn't be surprised that everyone is thinking about the next game before Sora even drops. Since we don't know what form the next Smash game will take, or if Sakurai will even return, I'm 100% fine with just enjoying Ultimate for the absolute miracle that it is. Speculation is fun and all, but you will be much happier appreciating what you have instead of pining over something you might have in the future.

 

[Royalty1702]

Now, which assist trophy characters may have a shot in the next future Smash Bros game?

Waluigi is going to be introduced along with Smash 6 the same way Inkling was revealed with Ultimate.

 

[Noipoi]

Nintendo marketing the hell out of Metroid, more than Pokemon BDSP or Mario Party, in what reality are we living.

Well TPC handles the Pokémon marketing, so Y’know.

But yea, they clearly realize Metroid needs a push so they’re doing their best. It’s rad to see.

 

[Dukefire]

Nintendo marketing the hell out of Metroid, more than Pokemon BDSP or Mario Party, in what reality are we living.

I bet the fans that only played the 3D and/or spin off metroid games will start to get into the games. I just hope the past metroid titles may be easy for the people to try them out. (Well, the Wii U can help with that situation.)

 

[JOJONumber691]

Alright, who's getting cut next time?

 

[Momotsuki]

Alright, who's getting cut next time?

Got Ultimate for a least a good few years, don't care.
(Can't tell if this is a joke based off of recent talks, sorry.)

 

[HYRULESHERO42]

Alright, who's getting cut next time?

We could make that a game. 1 cut per franchise (franchises with 1 rep are spared)

 

[Noipoi]

Alright, who's getting cut next time?

Luigi

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Maybe I'm just crazy but I think the issue with Little Mac, design-wise, isn't that they went too far, but rather that they didn't go far enough. He's supposed to be a character of extremes, and most reworks I've seen raised completely clash with that. I don't think the solution is to improve his air game, but to make his ground game absolutely ****ing ridiculous. A weight buff here, some armor there, a considerable increase in fall speed, all while hitting even more like a truck than he already does.

I've had people respond to me saying that he'd be too much of a noobstomper, but like... is that an actual concern if he's not truly busted? K. Rool is a low tier but he'll reign terror over any friend group.

I uhhhh gotta be honest, I don't think I've seen any rework suggestions that do this, not any that are longer than a single sentence at least. My personal suggestion is give him a grab game and replace his counter with a Dandy Step stance so players can have a nice mobility tool for characters who try to zone him and multiple counterattack options that allow Mac to respond to specific situations.


Sidenote I gotta say, Sora should have had Reaction Commands for his counter instead that give him 4 to 5 options when he actually procs the counter based on the direction held. This kid's from an action game where he slashes skyscrapers in half

 

[Dukefire]

I think the inklings may get a rework in the next game to reflect how far splatoon has come since 2018 of Splatoon 1 was for Ultimate.

 

[Momotsuki]

Luigi

"He's never been here-
in any Smash game."

 

[N3ON]

Maybe I'm just crazy but I think the issue with Little Mac, design-wise, isn't that they went too far, but rather that they didn't go far enough. He's supposed to be a character of extremes, and most reworks I've seen raised completely clash with that. I don't think the solution is to improve his air game, but to make his ground game absolutely ****ing ridiculous. A weight buff here, some armor there, a considerable increase in fall speed, all while hitting even more like a truck than he already does.

I've had people respond to me saying that he'd be too much of a noobstomper, but like... is that an actual concern if he's not truly busted? K. Rool is a low tier but he'll reign terror over any friend group.

I don't know, I actually do think if he was too OP at low-level play, that would give Sakurai and the dev team pause. Truthfully, they care about that demo more than they care about top-level play, because in truth, it is much larger.

I think the inklings may get a rework in the next game to reflect how far splatoon has come since 2018 of Splatoon 1 was for Ultimate.

Hasn't done much for the original eight franchises, who have all progressed since the 90s, and now have comparatively rudimentary movesets.

 

[JOJONumber691]

I think the inklings may get a rework in the next game to reflect how far splatoon has come since 2018 of Splatoon 1 was for Ultimate.

Splatoon is legit the worst represented First Party Series so they ABSOLUTELY need a Revamp.

 

[Momotsuki]

Honestly, Inkling themselves are completely fine as they are. To better bolster Splatoon's representation - specifically beyond the first installment - adding Octoling is probably how I'd do it, as they'd have plenty of excuse to borrow largely from the second game over the first. Splatoon 3 can have a stage, or something... It'd certainly be out by then. Or maybe they could change four of Inkling's alts to be more based on... whatever Splatoon 3 ends up being about.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Splatoon is legit the worst represented First Party Series so they ABSOLUTELY need a Revamp.

I'm pretty sure you need at least 2 hands to count how many Nintendo franchises have it worse than Splatoon, especially as Dukefire's comment can easily be fixed by **** like Octolings who focus on Splatoon 2.

 

[Theguy123]

Nintendo marketing the hell out of Metroid, more than Pokemon BDSP or Mario Party, in what reality are we living.

because Metroid needs it more than pokemon and Mario. Mario and Pokémon games always sell well because they’re Mario and Pokémon.

2D Metroid is kinda on life support. Swear the last 2D Metroid game was over a decade ago. They’re trying to promote the hell out of dread Probably because if it fails it’ll go back into hibernation for a while.

Can’t afford to put unnecessary promotion into Mario party when it could go into a game that actually needs it

 

[spicynun]

With almost all of my most wanted characters getting in Ultimate, I really don't know how active I'll be in Smash 6 speculation. I really do enjoy the arguments, theories, and debating of it all but the stakes just feel less now for me personally. I will definitely be pulling for Goemon and Phoenix Wright predominantly if Smash 6 is announced but after getting Banjo, Ridley, Sephiroth, and Sora all in the same game, I'm not sure any future reveal could beat those for me. I absolutely love Ultimate's final roster and the only thing I'm a little disappointed about is Capcom not getting any DLC character.

 

[Noipoi]

Splatoon’s representation is great, especially for a new IP.

All it really needs in the next game is a new stage, music, and perhaps Octoling.

 

[spicynun]

because Metroid needs it more than pokemon and Mario. Mario and Pokémon games always sell well because they’re Mario and Pokémon.

2D Metroid is kinda on life support. Swear the last 2D Metroid game was over a decade ago. They’re trying to promote the hell out of dread Probably because if it fails it’ll go back into hibernation for a while.

Can’t afford to put unnecessary promotion into Mario party when it could go into a game that actually needs it

If you count remakes, Samus Returns was 2017

 

[JOJONumber691]

I'm pretty sure you need at least 2 hands to count how many Nintendo franchises have it worse than Splatoon, especially as Dukefire's comment can easily be fixed by **** like Octolings who focus on Splatoon 2.

Eh? I think you could argue a couple of others, but at the same time, they have one of the worst stages in the game, barely anything from 2 (something that Post-Launch Content could've done just by adding some more stuff from it, especially through an Event or Mii's. Not the worst, definitely an exaggeration there, but I still feel there are a lot of issues, especially the Stage. I really dislike Moray Towers.

 

[Momotsuki]

This is just barely related but...
For the love of god give Doc his own victory theme, the default Mario series victory theme doesn't suit him at all.

 

[Royalty1702]

Alright, who's getting cut next time?

Possible unpopular take coming through.

• Half the FE roster.
• Half or almost half the Mario roster.
• Half or almost half the Pokemon roster.
• Maybe Min-Min, if ARMS doesn't get a sequel. Yeah, I know "muh relevancy argument" but I can't see Min-Min being a strong contender to remain a veteran for Smash 6.
• I think Echo Fighters will stop existing conceptually and some current Echoes will have moveset revamps to differentiate them from their non-Echo counterparts.
• Current echoes that I think are gone: Daisy, Dark Samus, Richter
• Pokemon Trainer
• ZSS will return to being apart of Samus but as a Down-Special, same as Sheik with Zelda
• Dr. Mario
• Wolf
• Toon Link
• Terry
• Joker
• Steve
• I think every SE rep is a lock except Sephiroth because Cloud works as a solo FF rep.
• Villager
• Wii Fit Trainer

 

[Cutie Gwen]

because Metroid needs it more than pokemon and Mario. Mario and Pokémon games always sell well because they’re Mario and Pokémon.

2D Metroid is kinda on life support. Swear the last 2D Metroid game was over a decade ago. They’re trying to promote the hell out of dread Probably because if it fails it’ll go back into hibernation for a while.

Can’t afford to put unnecessary promotion into Mario party when it could go into a game that actually needs it

That's not how marketing works, you don't have a single marketing budget to split between every game, you have different budgets for different games and Nintendo finally remembered that you should market smaller titles and went incredibly aggressive, like, Fire Emblem would not be alive if they didn't aggresively market Awakening yet they did and now Fire Emblem is a major IP that since the 3ds has the average FE game sell better than say, Kirby