Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[cothero]

I don't think such a rule exists, as Sakurai sees a Nintendo console appearance as a courtesy, not a requirement.

He said that before.

 

[Garteam]

Here is game idea I came up with.
Write pro-con for your most wanted. You can put iffy part in the middle

Master Chief

Pro

• Microsoft and Nintendo are in good term as Banjo and Steve are in Smash. MS also published games on Nintendo platform even before Minecraft.
• Credible leaker, King Zell hinted Halo content on Switch not only once, but twice later. Other leaker like Sabi also backed him.
• Despite what the internet describes, Halo 5 was still success on par with previous entry. It's still juggernaut, especially in US. Putting Chief in Smash will boost Smash's popularity even further. Characters with much worse situation got in. With Halo Infinite coming next year, it would be good marketing for that game.
• Halo is one of the most influential series as it paved ways for modern FPS. So, it definitely deserves place in Smasg.
• Lots of moveset potential with new gimmick. Possibly the most diverse moveset potential among FPS rep.
• FPS genre definitely can use rep in Smash.
• Sakurai played and praised Halo 2 along with Half Life 2. So, he is definitely acquainted with Halo series.

Iffy

• There is firearm issue, but Bayonetta and Joker proved this point moot. Even then, UNSC firearm look less realistic than Joker.
• It may be difficult to balance him out due to nature of zoner. But, I believe in Sakurai's ability to make him fun.
• Xbox France account posted tweet, saying that Master Chief is waitiny invitation. It can be seen as soft deconfirmation, but the guy would most likely be out of loop. Because the deal would've been made among higher up, not some random guy running official twitter account.

Con

• Steve's inclusion makes him less likely as there hasn't been a case of 3rd party company double dipping in the same pass.
• Halo's popularity in Japan may be roadblock. But, About 4 million out of 20 millions of Ultimate sales came from Japan. While it's impressive number, but it's not as damning as people make it out to be. Halo anime was sold decently in Japan. Japanese anime studio wouldn't simply accept check if Halo was totally obscure in Japan. There are still Halo merch made Japanese coming in.
• Lack of games on Nintendo platform hurts, but Chief made appearance on Nintendo platform via Minecraft and Fortnite.

Alrighty, here's one for Bandana Waddle Dee:

Yay!

• He's the last major candidate of the ballot era who hasn't already joined the fight (Ridley, K. Rool, Banjo, etc.) or been given another significant role (Issac, Geno, etc.). We still have yet to receive a character that fulfills this niche for the second Fighter's Pass, leaving things open for Bandana Waddle Dee.
• He's the next most logical choice for a Kirby rep. While people have argued that BWD's little more than Kirby's Toad; a generic face there to fill a fourth-player role when there aren't enough important, named characters to fill out the roster. However, recent games like Rainbow Curse, Battle Royale, and Fighters 2 have put him in a role closer to Tails; the main hero's number two and most consistent ally who appears either in a playable or supporting role. Star Allies was even going to give him his own mode before that was expanded to include as many allies as possible! Beyond BWD, there's really only Kirby's one-off friends who appeared in their original game and Star Allies. I would say these guys are unlikely, given that Sakurai seems to avoid one-off characters in games with some returning cast.
• According to HAL, numerous Kirby games and products are launching throughout 2021. According to Fighters 2's data, one of these games seems to be a full 3-D Kirby, a first for the series. If this is a major game of Nintendo's 2021, they may want to add another Kirby fighter to represent this entry.
• Min Min and Sephiroth show that you don't need to be your game and/or series' posterchild to get a full pack in Smash Ultimate. Likewise, Sephiroth shows that major supporting characters can get into Smash, provided their game's main character has already joined the battle.
• His small frame and unique weapon of a spear would create an interesting character that breaks away from many tenants of his archetype, similar to King K. Rool. While most small characters are focused around strong movement, air-speed, and combos, Bandana Waddle Dee would be lackluster in these categories in exchange for having above-average range and kill power for his size and weight.
• He's pretty cute.

Uhhh...

• It may be difficult to put together a music selection or spirit board with a coherent theme beyond "Kirby" (a stage would presumably be easy, seeing how we have no stage for the era in which he appears). This problem could be circumvented if he's added to represent this upcoming 3-D Kirby game or Sakurai builds a spirit board around so sort of unique gimmick for him (perhaps a board that's just filled with Waddle Dees?). Similarly, we don't know how much of a deal-breaker this really is. For example, proponents of this argument have been relatively silent about it in the context of Chun-Li, another character who wouldn't have much of a unique, unifying theme behind her pack.
• He doesn't have a big, obvious flashy gimmick. However, neither did Banjo, Byleth, or Sephiroth, with Sakurai bringing up a single move, their character's general theme, and a minor passive when explaining what made their inclusion as DLC fighters unique. Perhaps being Smash's first spear user could be enough to justify BWD?
• Some people have claimed that Bandana Waddle Dee "feels" like a base game addition. However, I haven't really heard any argument for why this is the case, so it's kinda tough to factor it into any sort of analysis as a definitive positive or negative. However, I have seen this sentiment enough to where I couldn't leave it out in good faith. I guess my best response is to note that many people had similar thoughts about an ARMS character initially.

(Wet Fart Noise)

• Sakurai has been notoriously neglectful when it's come to modern Kirby in Smash. No stages, minimal spirits, and minimal music. Hell, it took until Ultimate for Bandana Waddle Dee to get anything in Smash, and that's just a jpeg! Given that Kirby's representation revolves almost entirely around Dream Land, Adventure, and Super Star throughout every Smash entry to date, I honestly think Sakurai is most comfortable working with what he's personally done for the series. However, stuff getting Dragon Quest or Minecraft into Smash has taken him out of his comfort zone recently, but it's difficult to see if this will translate to the way he treats his baby.
• DLC skews heavily towards third-parties. There have been thirteen unique DLC characters added throughout Smash's history and nine of them have been third parties. Granted, this gap shrinks slightly when you counter in Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy in Smash for Wii U/3DS, but it's still not a great ratio. It's entirely possible, and I'd even argue likely, that we see another Nintendo character in the second Fighter's Pass, but it's clear BWD has a lot more an uphill battle as a DLC character than a base game one.

 

[MagnesD3]

He said that before.

Good thing he’s in Minecraft and fortnight then..

 

[Dinoman96]

Honestly I think there's an argument to be made that there just aren't really that many characters without a game on Nintendo that feel like they'd even be in Smash, anyways.

2B and Master Chief are the only ones that feel like they're in the realm of possibility to me because they're both popular marketable characters owned by companies that Nintendo actually have a working relationship with and thus already have presence in Smash. Stuff like Sony and Valve characters feel like complete non-starters because, well, their respective companies don't really have any real relationship with Nintendo whatsoever.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

He said that before.

Yes he's said it's a courtesy before, but he's never said it was a hard rule

He's the last major candidate of the ballot era who hasn't already joined the fight (Ridley, K. Rool, Banjo, etc.) or been given another role (Issac, Geno, etc.).

This feels a bit dishonest, he got a Spirit in Ultimate. Sure, it's nothing fancy or anything, but it's something when he had literally nothing in 4, thus, a role. I get what you mean though, just think the wording's off

 

[Garteam]

This feels a bit dishonest, he got a Spirit in Ultimate. Sure, it's nothing fancy or anything, but it's something when he had literally nothing in 4, thus, a role. I get what you mean though, just think the wording's off

Fair enough, I changed role to significant role. Either way, I don't think the spirit means too much anymore in a post-Min Min world.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Mr. Sakurai has released a special New Year's Message!

あけましておめでとうございます！
このご時世ですが、みなさまも健康でありますように。

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) December 31, 2020

Translated from Google:

Happy New Year! In this age, I hope you are all in good health.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

He said that before.

He actually said exactly what Riley said though.

Because honestly, people who use KH: Chain of Memories/Theathrhythm or Persona Q2 to justify Cloud and Joker are REALLY stretching things.

 

[cothero]

I think speculation for Crash does feel like its lost some momentum if only because there's likely some who think that such a significant character feels like one that would have gotten in after two years of DLC. Rationally there's no reason he can't be any of the fighters releasing in 2021 but instinctually there probably is a sense that he feels less likely now than he did a year ago, especially when a Sephiroth gets the big Game Awards reveal instead of him.

That's something i commented before. I don't see Crash being one of the remaing fighters unless negotiations for him being added in the game were made way early than N' Sane Trilogy release. Also, why would Nintendo want him if a character like Rayman was much more requested back in 2015, for exemple?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

That's something i commented before. I don't see Crash being one of the remaing fighters unless negotiations for him being added in the game were made way early than N' Sane Trilogy release. Also, why would Nintendo want him if a character like Rayman was much more requested back in 2015, for exemple?

By that logic, why add the Belmonts when Alucard is way more popular than that entire family bloodline?

 

[Dinoman96]

Cloud is a grey area because Final Fantasy itself has a lot of history on Nintendo. It's just that, well, by far the most popular game in the series happens to be associated with Playstation.

Persona is definitely the one series stretching the "Nintendo courtesy" thing to the absolute limit, though.

 

[Perkilator]

Here is game idea I came up with.
Write pro-con for your most wanted. You can put iffy part in the middle

Master Chief

Pro

• Microsoft and Nintendo are in good term as Banjo and Steve are in Smash. MS also published games on Nintendo platform even before Minecraft.
• Credible leaker, King Zell hinted Halo content on Switch not only once, but twice later. Other leaker like Sabi also backed him.
• Despite what the internet describes, Halo 5 was still success on par with previous entry. It's still juggernaut, especially in US. Putting Chief in Smash will boost Smash's popularity even further. Characters with much worse situation got in. With Halo Infinite coming next year, it would be good marketing for that game.
• Halo is one of the most influential series as it paved ways for modern FPS. So, it definitely deserves place in Smasg.
• Lots of moveset potential with new gimmick. Possibly the most diverse moveset potential among FPS rep.
• FPS genre definitely can use rep in Smash.
• Sakurai played and praised Halo 2 along with Half Life 2. So, he is definitely acquainted with Halo series.

Iffy

• There is firearm issue, but Bayonetta and Joker proved this point moot. Even then, UNSC firearm look less realistic than Joker.
• It may be difficult to balance him out due to nature of zoner. But, I believe in Sakurai's ability to make him fun.
• Xbox France account posted tweet, saying that Master Chief is waitiny invitation. It can be seen as soft deconfirmation, but the guy would most likely be out of loop. Because the deal would've been made among higher up, not some random guy running official twitter account.

Con

• Steve's inclusion makes him less likely as there hasn't been a case of 3rd party company double dipping in the same pass.
• Halo's popularity in Japan may be roadblock. But, About 4 million out of 20 millions of Ultimate sales came from Japan. While it's impressive number, but it's not as damning as people make it out to be. Halo anime was sold decently in Japan. Japanese anime studio wouldn't simply accept check if Halo was totally obscure in Japan. There are still Halo merch made Japanese coming in.
• Lack of games on Nintendo platform hurts, but Chief made appearance on Nintendo platform via Minecraft and Fortnite.

Sora
Pros

• Disney actually shills out the Kingdom Hearts license to anyone willing to take it, with KH-related merch seeping out of every possible crevice in recent years for better or worse
• Sora himself has plenty of original material that make a full Challenger Pack with no Disney presence
  • Original special attacks
  • Original characters for a Spirit Board
• Kingdom Hearts is all about going to different worlds in general, so Sora would fit like a glove in Smash
• 5 KH games came out on Nintendo consoles:
  • The original Chain of Memories (GBA)
  • 358/2 Days (DS)
  • Re:Coded (DS)
  • Dream Drop Distance (3DS)
  • Melody of Memory (Switch)
• Sora has crossed over in other Square Enix and Disney games
  • World of Final Fantasy
  • Disney Emoji Blitz
  • Final Fantasy Brave Exvius
  • Final Fantasy Record Keeper

Iffy

• Sora's Kingdom Key has a Mickey Mouse emblem on it; it can easily be replaced, but it's such a miniscule detail that it's hard to notice even in gameplay
• Would Donald and Goofy, at the very least, be Spirits? Or will they not appear at all? The KH versions are wildly different from how everyone knows them in their normal portrayals; so wildly that one could technically see them as KH original characters
• Would Sora's Smash appearance somehow be canon to the KH storyline? Nomura is known for making everything canon in KH, but the crossover appearances he has made weren't canon at all

Cons

• Sora is a wildly divisive character; both within and outside the KH fanbase
• Sora was a limited-time DLC in WoFF, and then removed after the chance to get him passed by
  • Furthermore, he makes no appearance in WoFF Maxima whatsoever
• Being owned by Disney, he's...bound to be slammed by arguments against him that mention controversial things Disney has done despite most of it being completely irrelevant to Kingdom Hearts, let alone Sora
• Possible backlash would flow in about a Disney crossover character featuring none of Disney's characters with him
• Haley Joel Osment, Sora's English voice actor, is a high-profile celebrity, so Nintendo of America might not want to pay the needed royalities to have him reprise his role for Sora in English

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I mean Nintendo is a business, if they've determined within the past two years there's more significant value in Crash as a fighter than Rayman (ballot requests be damned) they'll go with him.

 

[Mr. Robotto]

I already can see people jumping on for Arcueid and Shiki in Smash from now on.

TSUKIHIME REMAKE IS INDEED REAL AND HAPPENING, WHAT THE ****

Now waiting for the next Melty Blood... That'll eventually happen, right?

 

[Guynamednelson]

By that logic, why add the Belmonts when Alucard is way more popular than that entire family bloodline?

Simon was probably the most voted-for Castlevania character on the ballot. Sakurai only said that Castlevania got favorable ballot votes, not Simon, but I mainly remember people wanting him to be the Castlevania rep.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Some people have claimed that Bandana Waddle Dee "feels" like a base game addition. However, I haven't really heard any argument for why this is the case, so it's kinda tough to factor it into any sort of analysis as a definitive positive or negative. However, I have seen this sentiment enough to where I couldn't leave it out in good faith. I guess my best response is to note that many people had similar thoughts about an ARMS character initially.

This is likely the opinion that while they would be happy to have the character, they wouldn't buy them, or the perception that this is what most people feel about the character.

In other words, they're not hype, as subjective as that is.

 

[PeridotGX]

Nintendo: hey sakurai, we got everything all approved with sony. kratos can be in smash.
Sakurai: no! he's never appeared on a ninendo system!
(a few months later, Kratos joins Fortnite)
Sakurai: ok kratos is good now

 

[Guynamednelson]

This is likely the opinion that while they would be happy to have the character, they wouldn't buy them, or the perception that this is what most people feel about the character.

In other words, they're not hype, as subjective as that is.

To me, when Cloud is a base game fighter, things like FFVII's main theme and an Aerith spirit scream "base game content". I still added Sephiroth to the roster, mainly because I bought the entire pass under the assumption that I would need my Switch to be tournament-ready.

 

[SharkLord]

Here is game idea I came up with.
Write pro-con for your most wanted. You can put iffy part in the middle

Master Chief

Pro

• Microsoft and Nintendo are in good term as Banjo and Steve are in Smash. MS also published games on Nintendo platform even before Minecraft.
• Credible leaker, King Zell hinted Halo content on Switch not only once, but twice later. Other leaker like Sabi also backed him.
• Despite what the internet describes, Halo 5 was still success on par with previous entry. It's still juggernaut, especially in US. Putting Chief in Smash will boost Smash's popularity even further. Characters with much worse situation got in. With Halo Infinite coming next year, it would be good marketing for that game.
• Halo is one of the most influential series as it paved ways for modern FPS. So, it definitely deserves place in Smasg.
• Lots of moveset potential with new gimmick. Possibly the most diverse moveset potential among FPS rep.
• FPS genre definitely can use rep in Smash.
• Sakurai played and praised Halo 2 along with Half Life 2. So, he is definitely acquainted with Halo series.

Iffy

• There is firearm issue, but Bayonetta and Joker proved this point moot. Even then, UNSC firearm look less realistic than Joker.
• It may be difficult to balance him out due to nature of zoner. But, I believe in Sakurai's ability to make him fun.
• Xbox France account posted tweet, saying that Master Chief is waitiny invitation. It can be seen as soft deconfirmation, but the guy would most likely be out of loop. Because the deal would've been made among higher up, not some random guy running official twitter account.

Con

• Steve's inclusion makes him less likely as there hasn't been a case of 3rd party company double dipping in the same pass.
• Halo's popularity in Japan may be roadblock. But, About 4 million out of 20 millions of Ultimate sales came from Japan. While it's impressive number, but it's not as damning as people make it out to be. Halo anime was sold decently in Japan. Japanese anime studio wouldn't simply accept check if Halo was totally obscure in Japan. There are still Halo merch made Japanese coming in.
• Lack of games on Nintendo platform hurts, but Chief made appearance on Nintendo platform via Minecraft and Fortnite.

Adol Christin
Yes!

• Legacy - Adol's got a lot of it, being from one of the first action RPGs and arguably the longest-running one. In fact, he's actually older than ERDRICK, who was defended as the original swordboi (Granted, Dragon Quest itself came out before Ys, but Erdrick's game released a year later).
• Ease of Access - Much like SNK, Falcom is a pretty small company despite their legacy. If Nintendo feels the need for a cheaper character, especially after the whoppers that were Steve and Sephiroth, Falcom would be a good place to go. Bonus point for having their OST made by a single sound team, potentially allowing for another Terry situation with the songs.
• Nintendo Ports - As of recent, a couple of Falcom games have been ported to the Switch, such as Ys VIII, Trails of Cold Steel 3 and 4, and Ys Origin. Adol in Smash could help secure Falcom and Nintendo's recent partnership.

Maybe?

• Sakurai Familiarity - In an interview, Sakurai stated that Ys I & II were among his Virtual Console selection. Nintendo's the one choosing the characters and not Sakurai and the guy's played a frickton of games, but it's a fun little thing to note.
• Falcom's Getting Bigger - In a recent interview, Kondo, the head of Falcom, has stated that the company will aim to get bigger next year (Which is their 40th anniversay, for the record). Obviously nothing inclusive, but getting the publicity of a Smash rep could help aid Falcom in their expansion.
• Falcom Leak - That old leak's probably fake, but there are a couple things lining up with it. It also makes a good point about Falcom games not requiring powerful hardware, which allows them to be ported to Nintendo systems more easily. Granted, it could always mean Rean or Estelle, but still.
• Kondo (Semi-)Favoritism - Kondo has stated that if he had to choose, he'd put Adol in Smash. Though, he did follow up by admitting he had no idea how he'd play (Presumably due to just how much stuff he's gained and lost over the course of his career), and chose Rean instead. While Nintendo's choosing the characters, if it's another Min Min situation where Sakurai goes to the director to see who to choose, he'd most likely take Adol as a challenge
• Swordboi - Admittedly, Adol is pretty much an anime swordboi, though like Hero he has the excuse of being one of the first swordbois. It's possible he could be deemed not original enough, though with Nintendo at the wheel I doubt they'd care very much.

OOF

• Niche Status - Despite it's legacy and impact, Ys and Falcom as a whole is still pretty niche. If Nintendo doesn't want another smaller company like SNK, it could be game over for the company in terms of a Smash rep.
• Competition from Trails - Adol's biggest problem, aside from just not being big enough, is that Falcom =/= Ys. They also have Trails, which is arguably more popular than Ys (Though it doesn't have quite as much legacy), and Rean and Estelle could be chosen instead. The upcoming Kuro no Kiseki could be a hit to Rean due to it relieving him of his status as most recent protagonist, but Cold Steel is still the best-selling game in the series and either way Estelle is still there too. Adol isn't Mr. Falcom like how Terry is Mr. SNK, and he could easily be passed over.

 

[Faso115]

Isn't Kratos only available in the PS4 version tho?

Btw, are we really limiting speculation to pre 2016 stuff? Because that sure as hell didn't stop Hero and Min Min. This isn't base folks nor is it about the Ballot.

The ballot was a mistake

 

[ROBnWatch]

Hey Banjo fans lost hope and then he happened.

So the trick is to lose expectations and then Crash will happen

This is how all of my most wanted characters can still win. Because none of you would expect any of them.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Nintendo: hey sakurai, we got everything all approved with sony. kratos can be in smash.
Sakurai: no! he's never appeared on a ninendo system!
(a few months later, Kratos joins Fortnite)
Sakurai: ok kratos is good now

I think Nintendo would be the one that would care more about Nintendo system appearances than Sakurai.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I already can see people jumping on for Arcueid and Shiki in Smash from now on.

You make it sound like they'd be bad additions for Smash.

I'd totally pop off if we got Arc, but I personally don't see it happening.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Btw, are we really limiting speculation to pre 2016 stuff?

No, it's just what we happen to be talking about at the moment.

The ballot was a mistake

Considering we have no idea what the heck it even did, I don't think anyone can confirm or deny this. lol

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Considering we have no idea what the heck it even did, I don't think anyone can confirm or deny this. lol

The fact that they're not sharing results means they're probably ashamed of what people picked, so yes it is.

 

[PeridotGX]

I think Nintendo would be the one that would care more about Nintendo system appearances than Sakurai.

some of the dlc fighters in ultimate are...

• guy from series that only releases main entries on Playstation
• two characters from rival console manufacturer
• second character from the Final Fantasy that betrayed nintendo, instead of one from a Nintendo one

I don't think they care that much

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The fact that they're not sharing results means they're probably ashamed of what people picked, so yes it is.

Nintendo: "I'll tell you when you stop caring. Get off my back!"

 

[Mushroomguy12]

some of the dlc fighters in ultimate are...

• guy from series that only releases main entries on Playstation
• two characters from rival console manufacturer
• second character from the Final Fantasy that betrayed nintendo, instead of one from a Nintendo one

I don't think they care that much

I was saying that Nintendo would be the ones that would be more concerned with that, and Sakurai was the one that didn't mind it. He was the one that convinced Nintendo to let him put Snake in Brawl, not the other way around, and he was the one specifically wanted Cloud. The way you framed your conversation was that Sakurai was the one that cared the most about Nintendo console appearances and Nintendo had to convince him.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Considering we have no idea what the heck it even did, I don't think anyone can confirm or deny this. lol

It gave a reliable amount of data showing like 10 entirely new characters to add, how can that be denied?

 

[Dinoman96]

Isn't Kratos only available in the PS4 version tho?

Nope.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If they ever add The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild's Zelda, they had better add her mine cart move from Hyrule Warriors: Age of Calamity. It is the single most fun move I have had the pleasure of using in recent memory to the point where I go "wheeeee!" like, every time.

If we must add a 3rd Zelda, this is non-negotiable.

 

[SKX31]

Left 4 Dead wouldn't have gotten a Japanese arcade game if it didn't have a decently-sized Japanese fandom, although Japan is still a nation where PC gaming is niche.

Oh, didn't know about that. Huh. TIL. Knew about the Half-Life arcade game though.

It's honestly really difficult to say why PC gaming's niche in Japan: PC gaming in the neighboring countries - China, South Korea, Southeast Asia - is certainly a major thing in those countries. Partly because Internet cafés are still pretty major (although the pandemic did deliver a severe blow to them). The South Korean "PC Bangs" are a main reason why StarCraft and LoL took off in that country. Also, South Korea absolutely has similar space issues as Japan - Seoul is more crammed than Tokyo (16000 vs. 6300 per square kilometre, if Wiki's right - and I have reason to believe that since they link to the cities' respective data). It could still be a major reason, granted, since Japanese homes are seemingly crowded too.

Another factor might be that Nintendo effectively set the terms for what to expect when it comes to games, and the 80s gaming PCs like the MSX might've followed (although I could be wrong here, granted). Something which didn't really happen elsewhere.

I was about to speculate that maybe Japan didn't have many Internet cafés...but I was wrong. Oh so very wrong. Stumbled upon the Cyber-Homeless / Net café refugees existing. Oof.

Nope.

Starts praying for Kratos and Master Chief at the nearest Sakurai altar. ( )

 

[Guynamednelson]

The fact that they're not sharing results means they're probably ashamed of what people picked, so yes it is.

Too many people probably voted for a certain swamp-dwelling, onion-like, Fat *******-voiced ogre for them to want to reveal the results.

 

[Paraster]

Here is game idea I came up with.
Write pro-con for your most wanted. You can put iffy part in the middle

Master Chief

Pro

• Microsoft and Nintendo are in good term as Banjo and Steve are in Smash. MS also published games on Nintendo platform even before Minecraft.
• Credible leaker, King Zell hinted Halo content on Switch not only once, but twice later. Other leaker like Sabi also backed him.
• Despite what the internet describes, Halo 5 was still success on par with previous entry. It's still juggernaut, especially in US. Putting Chief in Smash will boost Smash's popularity even further. Characters with much worse situation got in. With Halo Infinite coming next year, it would be good marketing for that game.
• Halo is one of the most influential series as it paved ways for modern FPS. So, it definitely deserves place in Smasg.
• Lots of moveset potential with new gimmick. Possibly the most diverse moveset potential among FPS rep.
• FPS genre definitely can use rep in Smash.
• Sakurai played and praised Halo 2 along with Half Life 2. So, he is definitely acquainted with Halo series.

Iffy

• There is firearm issue, but Bayonetta and Joker proved this point moot. Even then, UNSC firearm look less realistic than Joker.
• It may be difficult to balance him out due to nature of zoner. But, I believe in Sakurai's ability to make him fun.
• Xbox France account posted tweet, saying that Master Chief is waitiny invitation. It can be seen as soft deconfirmation, but the guy would most likely be out of loop. Because the deal would've been made among higher up, not some random guy running official twitter account.

Con

• Steve's inclusion makes him less likely as there hasn't been a case of 3rd party company double dipping in the same pass.
• Halo's popularity in Japan may be roadblock. But, About 4 million out of 20 millions of Ultimate sales came from Japan. While it's impressive number, but it's not as damning as people make it out to be. Halo anime was sold decently in Japan. Japanese anime studio wouldn't simply accept check if Halo was totally obscure in Japan. There are still Halo merch made Japanese coming in.
• Lack of games on Nintendo platform hurts, but Chief made appearance on Nintendo platform via Minecraft and Fortnite.

Quote (Cave Story)
Pro

• Iconic status: While it's not hugely popular currently (although it's still getting releases, with the most recent being on Switch in 2017), it is generally regarded as a classic indie game and even the primary force behind the rise of modern indies.
• Ease of inclusion: Nicalis, who currently hold the rights, actively encouraged voting for Quote in the Smash 4 ballot, and they already like to put Cave Story content into crossovers.
• Association with Nintendo: All of CS's "official" ports that have not been put on computers were on Nintendo consoles, with the 3DS in particular getting two different versions (one of which was a full 3D remake).

Iffy

• Indie rep: I've been much more optimistic about an indie rep getting in than others, but the fact remains that it's uncharted territory as of now.

Con

• Nicalis: They have a really bad reputation right now, and I fully admit that it's mostly deserved. In particular, while I don't believe they would attempt to ghost Nintendo of all companies like they have certain indie devs, I fully expect that Nintendo would consider that possibility. (I'm tempted to say Konami getting more characters in Ultimate after everything they did over the decade indicates this wouldn't AS big a deal as some say, though.)
• Lack of modern relevancy: While I stand by calling Cave Story iconic and important, it just isn't that widely popular in general consciousness nowadays. (Then again, I'd argue Terry was in a similar position before his reveal.)

 

[Garteam]

The ballot got us Ridley, K. Rool, Castlevania in Smash, and (judging by Sakurai's "This what the fans wanted" comments from E3 2018) all veterans returning.

If y'all want to go to a timeline where the ballot never happened to own the Smash Bros fanbase, be my guest. But, I'm staying right here lmao.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Honestly this narrative of 'lol people voted Shrek which is why they refuse to share results' is a lot better than what the actual reason likely is, that being to prevent a massive ****show. "STOP SUPPORTING X LMAO THEY BARELY GOT ANY VOTES GO VOTE FOR MY FAV", "THIS IS BULL**** SORA'S CLEARLY NUMBER 1 WHY ISN'T HE IN YET?" "CLEARLY THIS IS RIGGED NO WAY DID THE HEAVY FROM TF2 GET IN THE TOP 10" and many, many more examples of pissbabies throwing a fit

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

Nintendo decides to finish off 2020 with a bang.

One more to close out 2020. pic.twitter.com/udP0AGfQpK

— Nintendo of America (@NintendoAmerica) December 31, 2020

 

[ahemtoday]

The ballot got us Ridley, K. Rool, Castlevania in Smash, and (judging by Sakurai's "This what the fans wanted" comments from E3 2018) all veterans returning.

If y'all want to go to a timeline where the ballot never happened to own the Smash Bros fanbase, be my guest. But, I'm staying right here lmao.

Man, now I'm curious what Ultimate would be like in that timeline. We'd probably have a lot more newcomers, considering it doesn't seem like they would bring all the characters back in that timeline.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Man, now I'm curious what Ultimate would be like in that timeline. We'd probably have a lot more newcomers, considering it doesn't seem like they would bring all the characters back in that timeline.

Assuming planning was finalized around the same time, Sakurai would still need to look to the past for first-party newcomers instead of giving us another wave of modern Nintendo characters like Smash 4, since Spring Man and Rex would still be too new for the base game. Inkling, Isabelle, and Incineroar would most likely still be there though.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Nintendo decides to finish off 2020 with a bang.

One more to close out 2020. pic.twitter.com/udP0AGfQpK

— Nintendo of America (@NintendoAmerica) December 31, 2020

wipes tears away there he is. Over there