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Controversial Tournament Ideas

GOD!

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 30, 2008
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778
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Rome, GA
I though striking first was pretty standard. Maybe I don't get what you're saying.



As for tactical pausing only use it if you're getting wobbled.
When you are playing a set, at the beginning each person can choose to bean a stage (neutral or counterpick) This stage cannot be used in the set at all. Then the stage is chosen from a short list of random neutrals.

After that, loser counterpicks anything except banned stages.. etc.

But with striking, each player strikes a stage until there is only one stage left to play on. This is only to choose the first stage.
 

solecalibur

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 29, 2008
Messages
3,330
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Cbus
CounterPicking and Stage Banning

Pausing
1. Some characters are good on certain stages stop whining and ban the one stage you dont like and deal with the rest not all characters have eight jumps two glides and every specail move to recover on the stage

2. NO
 

Oracle

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
Messages
3,471
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Dallas, TX
Melee doesn't need ISP as you cannot turn off the containers which are the main offender of items in Melee, which is why it isn't considered for Melee.

Brawl lets you turn them off.
Just play it safe and pretend they all explode if you hit them and don't hit them. Durr
 

Doomblaze

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Messages
412
Location
Shanghai, China
I don't think youve ever been wobbled sirrrr
Just dont get hit

Or do what everyone does against lain in brawl, scream in their ear while they chaingrab (wobble) you so they get surprised and mess up.
It works

although, considering that wobbling isnt all that hard to do <_<

Pausing = hell no
so much abuse with that , you could pause while they try to up-b then unpause it after they press the button so they die, thats effing ********.
 

lain

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
4,278
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Ann Arbor, MI
no one screams in my ear. In fact, I would punch anyone in the face you directly screamed in my ear. I have a HUGE peeve about it.
 

Rain(ame)

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
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I'll take a potato chip....and eat it!!!
No offense, but I just don't think these ideas work at all.

Set stages? Dude...forcing a person to change their main in general. Some people want to stay away from FD because of their character. Always FD, Always PS, snd so forth? I see a bad thing coming out of that already. There's....far more reasons for that. which have already been mentioned. It would simply make people not want to play.

Pausing? No...no...and furthermore, no. Tactical it wouldn't be. A person should just take the time to adjust during their KO period. I've noticed most players like to mess around while their waiting. Peach players tend to pull turnips looking for a good one. Foxes/Falcos shoot lazers or some other flashy tech stuff.

Charging an entry fee for someone that doesn't bring a setup?

Some people have packed cars. Some people, like myself, have a TV that way too effing heavy to just be lugging around. Unless YOU wanna come lug it around for me. OR, they bring a small behind TV they don't use with an old behind setup that requires using cable wires to connect through a VCR. Even then...there's no certainty that the picture will be clear. Still yet, others may have to take the bus. Let's see...I see a REAL great situation there. Need I remind you of Dark.Pch getting robbed on his way back from CoT4? A guy walking around with a T.V. in some areas is just begging to be robbed and/or injured/killed. Oh and the ones who have parents that say, "No..you can't take your system/TV with you." We also have those that don't own a system at all. Or those who are first time tournament goers and didn't know about such a thing. What about siblings who share a cube/wii? People who's system is actually owned by their parents? (Seen it.) It may come off as rude, but I think that's just a bad idea all together.


Hopefully I didn't come off as a jerk...I just don't think these rules would really apply. I also don't feel, in any way it would add "tactical" value to Smash at all. Smash in itself is a highly tactical/mindgamey fight. Pehaps it might work for a certain area....I'm not saying it's a total fail. I just think that in gerneral it wouldn't bode over well.
 

Yuna

BRoomer
BRoomer
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Why is this still alive and why did it reach Page #6? Not every thread needs to be replied to. Just let it die already.

Fixed stages? No, no. That's basically dictating what characters will be used during which rounds (matches) of a set. We'd see a sudden increase in people maining X, Y, Z characters for the first three matches and people who main single characters who hate one of those Neutrals would be screwed.

Seriously, 6 pages and almost 6 months and not a single post that describes how the Burst works in Guilty Gear and why it wouldn't work for Smash because of the different game mechanics?

The Burst move in Guilty Gear is a special move which can technically only be used once a round, at most. It takes time and other things to build back up (how much you are hit and much you hit the opponent, I think). In other words, it's a game mechanic. Just because it's a GG-game mechanic doesn't mean that we should incorporate it into Smash.

The thing about Bursts in GG is that not every combo can be bursted out of. Certain combos/chains/linked moves are literally impossible to Burst out of. And if a burst is blocked/"misses" (the opponent is nowhere near the burst' limited (but relatively large) blast area), the Bursting player is a sitting (or in GG's case: levitating) duck. This allows a player to actually bait a burst.

Player A playing as Character C can do combo D and stop it at point E. It is at this point that the combo stops being Burst-proof. If Player B bursts, Player A will be ready for it and block it and follow up with a new, now reset combo for maximum carnage (Reset: In most traditional fighting games, there is a Damage Reduction system. For each consecutive move in a combo, you will inflict less damage and less stun in order to prevent real infinites and allow for long flashy combos that don't literally shave off your entire health bar. A Reset means that the combo meter is reset. You will now inflict full damage and stun on your new combo. In other words: You're screwed if you "miss" with your Burst and the opponent re-combos you out of it). However, if Player B is smart, he will not spam Burst but instead wait. Player A, however, will know this so it will be a mindgame of when to Burst/Not Burst and when to expect the Burst.

As I've already said, in GG, the Burst is a special move. It has its own (invisible) meter that builds up. At the start of a match, both players have a full Burst Meter (i.e., One Burst). Once that has been used up, it takes time and other things to build up again.

In BlazBlu, you also have an invisible Burst Meter (IIRC), though you can use it more than once a round (I think. Don't kill me, I've only played the darn game twice). It comes with a penalty, however. Every time you use the Burst, for the rest of that round (I'm pretty sure it's the rest of the round, not the rest of the match), you will take double damage.

In Melty Blood, there is also a Burst (though it's called something else). However, it comes at a steep price. It costs a full Meter to perform (100%, 200%, 300%, I don't remember how much is needed, probably not 300% since you automatically go into Heat when you hit 300% IIRC). This Meter is primarily used for Special Combo Attacks or whatever they are called in MB (Final Smash/Ultra/Special Arts/Overdrive, etc.) and also for Heat (during Heat, you heal up and can perform special Special Attacks which can only be performed during Heat). In other words, it's pretty darn expensive.

With the proposed Smash Burst for Smash tournaments, you'd be able to pretty much use up your Bursts at any time you wish, possibly all during the same stock. For zero penalty. The only "penalty" you'll face is that maybe your opponent will be able to continue the combo despite your "Smash Burst".


There, now please just let the thread die. Because, really I've seen zero credible arguments supporting these "controversial" (more like "Supported by 3 people, opposed by everyone else.") ideas. Must everything turn into a 6-page debate?

See this man knows what hes talking about because who among wouldnt press pause when he is getting wobbled like *****
People who aren't... cats.

Take it like a man or stop playing Competitively.
 

Samochan

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 2, 2006
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3,450
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I'm in your house, dsmashing your tv
>_>

Just use stage strike (players strike out stages from 5/7 neutral stages in 1221/122112 or 122121 order, last stage left gets played first), make pausing on a critical spot a match forfeithing offence and next one disqualifying (aka in middle of a combo and gameplay things, not when you just got ko'ed or respawning and only when there is a real need for a pause liek phone ringing, but enforce keeping disturbances at minimum), ban wobbling if it sucks so much/200% should finish, otherwise considered as stalling.

Entry fee should also apply to all, unless you wanna give discounts to people who bring setups. But no forcing people to bring setups just so they can avoid entry fee, you do not force people to bring stuff but encourage it instead, there's a difference. Also one never runs 2 tournaments at the same time, that just spells disaster. You end up messing the brackets, pools and matches, tv's are not enough etc. You won't end up running tournaments efficently in that manner, resulting in lots of setbacks and thus wasting even more time if you had decided to run them separately. And what if a person wanted to play both brawl and melee? That person would be pretty screwed then, having to choose which game they wanted to play moar and then forfeithing the other, or messing up their gameplay really badly due to having to switch between games all the time. >_> Oh and no melee + brawl singles on a same day with 64 people attending lol, brawl singles itself can take a whole day if you do pools rofl.

Besides, what's so wrong banning someone's best stage? I think that's fairly strategic move. If the opponent did know this information but decided to forgone it anyway, then that person wouldn't make a smart move imo. It's like banning mute city against peach. People always do that against me cause I'm a peach main. Maybe green mario should get a second best stage. :p

But yea, set stages for the set is purely idiotic. You're basically forgoing the counterpick process entirely and it also so happens that chars are not equals on certain stages, you are basically giving someone a win right of the bat cause they happen to main a char good on those stages as opposed to say, peach against a marth, or forcing someone else to switch chars just cause of some set stage.

And sbr is not so laborious, seeing as I'm a member now myself, but one needs to always think through the rules before implementing them.
 

Ballistics

Smash Champion
Joined
Sep 14, 2006
Messages
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Tallahassee Florida State, what WHAT!
i love the sbr, they reccomend not to ban wobbling right??? sounds kind of like the vatican though, T.O.s should do whatever they want as long as its reasonable


it might be different in sweden or finland but its really hard to get tvs and setups for tournaments here in florida so its not forcing people to bring them its guranteeing that the tournament runs smoothly =D
 

Ballistics

Smash Champion
Joined
Sep 14, 2006
Messages
2,266
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Tallahassee Florida State, what WHAT!
all of the recent tournaments i've seen have banned wobbling.
its banned as a form of stalling always, ROM2 banned it, Pound4 its not banned, Genesis it wasn't banned

SBR says not to ban it

ROM2 banned it just cause Alukard the tournament host thinks its stupid

most people ban it just because they think its cheap or stupid

I don't agree with that
 

Yuna

BRoomer
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it might be different in sweden or finland but its really hard to get tvs and setups for tournaments here in florida so its not forcing people to bring them its guranteeing that the tournament runs smoothly =D
If it's a major tournament, the hosts can afford to rent TVs. If it's a minor tournament, you're not really expected to have 10+ setups.
 

Ballistics

Smash Champion
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Messages
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Tallahassee Florida State, what WHAT!
If it's a major tournament, the hosts can afford to rent TVs. If it's a minor tournament, you're not really expected to have 10+ setups.
yes this is true, but when you are a minor tournament and you have 0 tvs, by telling 20 people to bring tvs or they have pay a door fee, out of those 20 maybe 4 will actually do it

door fees are pretty standard these days anyway, its nice to get a discount
 

Jam Stunna

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I actually think the idea of strategic pausing is neat, kind of like how time-outs are used strategically in other sports (like icing the kicker in American football). I'm not saying it should be implemented, but it's not as terrible of an idea as some posters are making it out to be.
 

Ballistics

Smash Champion
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Tallahassee Florida State, what WHAT!
i let it go in our match cause i dont take melee seriously.

and i was high.
lol well at my tournaments its part of the rules, pete you shouldve paused right before i gimped you with a downair our first match, you wouldve survived. Embrace the pausing!

Pausing is a horrible idea and anyone who does it should get slapped with a fish.
Jason youll come around soon enough.
 

Trikrome

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
119
Location
Miami, Fl
I can't believe Derek is still going on about this. every time derek does that just knock his controller out of his hands. then proceed to **** him.
 
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