Minwu
Smash Journeyman
No, Ganon's has to do with whichever character plummets first. He will lose if he Ganoncides Jigglypuff. If he kills D3, however, he wins. Bowsercide is the only move ever determined by controller port.
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Delta_BP26
Smash Ace
Corneria
Distant Planet
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pirate Ship
Rainbow Cruise
Green Greens
Onett
Pokémon Stadium 2
Why are these banned? On the subject of Luigi's Mansion, you can't camp because of the pillars. The wall refreshing is for both characters and isn't random like items, so your opponent can refresh just like you and vice versa. Jab locking can be done, but you have two opportunities to tech there so that's just you being careless if anything. Also, if you're against a character who's jab lock is important (Link, for example) then break the mansion. It offers a lot of offensive and defensive capabilities. At the very very worst, it should be Counter/Ban.
As for the other stages, I don't get it.
Distant Planet
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pirate Ship
Rainbow Cruise
Green Greens
Onett
Pokémon Stadium 2
Why are these banned? On the subject of Luigi's Mansion, you can't camp because of the pillars. The wall refreshing is for both characters and isn't random like items, so your opponent can refresh just like you and vice versa. Jab locking can be done, but you have two opportunities to tech there so that's just you being careless if anything. Also, if you're against a character who's jab lock is important (Link, for example) then break the mansion. It offers a lot of offensive and defensive capabilities. At the very very worst, it should be Counter/Ban.
As for the other stages, I don't get it.
Mew2King
King of the Mews
lylat should be neutral
i don't mind norfair anymore, but i don't think it's a good stage still.
i don't mind norfair anymore, but i don't think it's a good stage still.
¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯
Smash Legend
I'm hosting a tourney tomorrow, this really helps, I love RC, Japes, and Mansion being banned! I hate those stages and they are super unfair. Norfair to. Nice job guys, I really like this, thanks.
Eternal Yoshi
I've covered ban wars, you know
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LOL WOW. That's a HUGE banned list. I think Ganoncide should be based on percentages because Ganondorf can do it on any percentage and he deserves to win if he has a percentage advantage over his victim and if they are both on their last stocks.
Eternal Yoshi
I've covered ban wars, you know
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This is not an official list Skyflyer.
It should be.
You and I think very alike my friend.
BIG C
Smash Master
this list is good other than a few stages, I think RC and norfair should be on, not because of them being good stages, but being necessary for some characters like Diddy and IC's. also, I do not understand the suicide thing why is it a loss for the person who gets it, even though it's gay and it sucks there is no reason for them to lose. I think pictochat should probably be a CP.
The sudden death rule doesn't seem too fair for heavy characters, so it is kind of dumb that a game and watch would more than likely always win against a snake or DDD in sudden death, with this rule.
The sudden death rule doesn't seem too fair for heavy characters, so it is kind of dumb that a game and watch would more than likely always win against a snake or DDD in sudden death, with this rule.
MachinegunNorm
Smash Lord
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- May 14, 2008
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- 1,319
10 bucks says you play IC or diddy.
10 bucks says you're wrong as hell. MK is my only main.
MachinegunNorm
Smash Lord
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lol i figured it was that if it wasn't diddy or ic
Good people don't have to rely on hazards like the crocodile screwing up their opponent. The reason why stages like japes are banned is because they don't support 100% RAW SKILL. It takes at lot less effort to use simple common sense to try to screw your opponent with hazards by doing things like tossing someone into the lava wave on Norfair than to practice having perfect reflexes.
The Real Inferno
Smash Hero
75% of all statistics are made up
Including yours
The Real Inferno
Smash Hero
Thanks Ted that was the joke.
MachinegunNorm
Smash Lord
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lol raw skill? try telling me this when you aren't using metaknight.
That's the best you can come up with? "try telling me this when you aren't using metaknight"
You can do better than that. Invalid argument is invalid.
Raw skill involves playing a game that isn't Brawl.
MachinegunNorm
Smash Lord
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haha this.
NeoCrono
Smash Ace
I bet diddy mains are happy with no rainbow cruise or norfair lol
MachinegunNorm
Smash Lord
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meh, at least the rules are up to the TO so its not like you have to follow this.
This counterpick list is no fun, even if it makes sense.
With Brinstar, I have to constantly worry about the acid that comes up, and then it becomes a scramble for the top platform.
Castle Siege, I can hide behind the platforms on the second area, get gimped by the ledges on the first, and get chaingrabbed to my death by Dedede on the second area. You can use the same argument for Delfino minus hiding behind platforms and add on wall infinites. Actually, you can wall infinite on Pokemon Stadium 1, as well, so why not ban that? Frigate Orpheon, I can just throw you off with a low-angle knockback move off the right side and watch you fall to your doom as the platform tilts upwards, keeping you from recovering. Halberd has hazards that can KO, so we can't have THAT. Support ghosts on Yoshi's Isle can save people from spikes. That's unfair, so we can't have that. Lylat tips and can gimp people under the stage, so we can't have that. That's unfair to people with poor, or linear recoveries.
That leaves us with:
Final Destination
Battlefield
Smashville
...BUT WAIT. Diddy completely dominates Final Destination and Smashville, as do Ice Climbers, and Falco on anyone who he can chainspike. Snake completely owns by platform camping on Battlefield, and can put a bomb anywhere on-stage by planting C-4 on the moving platform of Smashville. Also, Lucario is hurt by the lack of walls on the latter two stages, meaning he's at a slight disadvantage before the match even starts. And some characters are gimped by the freaking LEDGE of FD, so that's unfair, too!
So that leaves us with...
?
ALL stages are banned! :O
100% Raw skill? Explain to me the purpose of Brinstar and Castle Siege.
With Brinstar, I have to constantly worry about the acid that comes up, and then it becomes a scramble for the top platform.
Castle Siege, I can hide behind the platforms on the second area, get gimped by the ledges on the first, and get chaingrabbed to my death by Dedede on the second area. You can use the same argument for Delfino minus hiding behind platforms and add on wall infinites. Actually, you can wall infinite on Pokemon Stadium 1, as well, so why not ban that? Frigate Orpheon, I can just throw you off with a low-angle knockback move off the right side and watch you fall to your doom as the platform tilts upwards, keeping you from recovering. Halberd has hazards that can KO, so we can't have THAT. Support ghosts on Yoshi's Isle can save people from spikes. That's unfair, so we can't have that. Lylat tips and can gimp people under the stage, so we can't have that. That's unfair to people with poor, or linear recoveries.
That leaves us with:
Final Destination
Battlefield
Smashville
...BUT WAIT. Diddy completely dominates Final Destination and Smashville, as do Ice Climbers, and Falco on anyone who he can chainspike. Snake completely owns by platform camping on Battlefield, and can put a bomb anywhere on-stage by planting C-4 on the moving platform of Smashville. Also, Lucario is hurt by the lack of walls on the latter two stages, meaning he's at a slight disadvantage before the match even starts. And some characters are gimped by the freaking LEDGE of FD, so that's unfair, too!
So that leaves us with...
?
ALL stages are banned! :O
AKA this.
*cough
that is why they are called "COUNTER PICKS" and not called "neutral stages"
in the event that you lose, you can pick a stage you THINK will benefit your charecter or give you an advantage. but nothing is TOO extreme with the biohazards on them. otherwise they would be "banned"
its tourney edicate to counterpick sort of.
no duh jungle japes doesnt have "RAW SKILLLL!" otherwise it would be called a "neutral stage"
i, for one, am for counter picks. i think they require thought out strategies and knoledge of the game itself.
that is why they are called "COUNTER PICKS" and not called "neutral stages"
in the event that you lose, you can pick a stage you THINK will benefit your charecter or give you an advantage. but nothing is TOO extreme with the biohazards on them. otherwise they would be "banned"
its tourney edicate to counterpick sort of.
no duh jungle japes doesnt have "RAW SKILLLL!" otherwise it would be called a "neutral stage"
i, for one, am for counter picks. i think they require thought out strategies and knoledge of the game itself.
Honestly, though, if I could, I'd say we just ban DK from Japes, DDD from Siege/Eldin, and Fox from Spear Pillar, but sadly, that won't happen. I just wish we could simply ban stalling, and immediately half of the banned stages would suddenly become cool. :\
choknater
Smash Obsessed
Hey Ankoku you looked better as purple.
The main thing that sells this ruleset for me is Lylat as a counter pick instead of neutral.
PPPP
The main thing that sells this ruleset for me is Lylat as a counter pick instead of neutral.
PPPP
CaliburChamp
Smash Master
I find this funny. Most of the MK mains all like these rules and stages, because they all know MK does well on starter stages and it will increase their tournament winnings. I know this cause I play Metaknight, and most of his best stages are starter stages because he can edge guard and stage spike on these stages. Add Shadow Moses, and Pirate Ship and Metaknights won't be dominating the tournaments as much. I'm being totally unbiased here when I say this, unlike some people.
Mr.E
Smash Lord
The best justification for PictoChat seems to be that the stage's quirks are all presented in other legal stages as well. PS1 and Delfino randomly transform, Halberd contains equally lethal hazards. (Both stages have one semi-powerful hazard while the rest are mostly benign.) These three are all proposed as counterpicks, so what makes PC worse? It could be the combination of the two, but that's hardly fair considering Delfino has arguably worse transformations (Defino gives you water and walkoffs galore. PS1 transformations last the longest and give you the biggest walls, though all three do put up temporary ones. Picto also has the shortest transformations.) and Halberd's crane arm is the single most deadly hazard between both stages.
We could just as well follow the game's default ruling, giving Bowser a 50/50 victory or loss, just like every other suicide killer, based on whether his player "won" the lower port. That's silly, of course, but it's basically the same option you're forcing on Ganondorf players by allowing the game to unpredictably decide whether they lose or not.
Can that not be said for Bowser as well? The outcome of his suicide is always constant, dependent on who "wins" the lower controller port. It's stupid that the game uses this as its sole determinant for choosing a winner but it's not a mystery. The reason we choose to ignore the rules of the game in this case is precisely because the game does it in a really dumb way nobody likes. Could the same not be said for Ganon? Many people have voiced displeasure at how the game decides Ganon never wins, how it unpredictably chooses sudden death versus loss, and anything else that might go along with it. What is wrong with also deciding, "This is kinda stupid, why don't we just say Ganon wins?" such that there's consistency among the rules for suicide kills?
We could just as well follow the game's default ruling, giving Bowser a 50/50 victory or loss, just like every other suicide killer, based on whether his player "won" the lower port. That's silly, of course, but it's basically the same option you're forcing on Ganondorf players by allowing the game to unpredictably decide whether they lose or not.
No, it's not the same. If I select player 1, you cannot select player 1. You must select players 2, 3 or 4 who lose to player 1. If I select Ganon, you can select Ganon. It's completely different. If everyone could use the same controller port, I'd be arguing against the Bowser rule too (you should have picked p1, etc.).
Also, Bowser's isn't win/lose, it's win/tie. The only cases the rule for Bowser comes into effect are when it goes to sudden death; Bowser being declared the loser is never contradicted. The proposition for Ganon is wanting to directly contradict the game saying he loses which is really radical and way more extreme than the Bowser rule. I'm not sure why we should be going back and "redoing" gmae design to be "better" in this case; Ganon just has a worse suicide than Bowser. It's how the game was made, and it seems silly to contradict it.
Also, Bowser's isn't win/lose, it's win/tie. The only cases the rule for Bowser comes into effect are when it goes to sudden death; Bowser being declared the loser is never contradicted. The proposition for Ganon is wanting to directly contradict the game saying he loses which is really radical and way more extreme than the Bowser rule. I'm not sure why we should be going back and "redoing" gmae design to be "better" in this case; Ganon just has a worse suicide than Bowser. It's how the game was made, and it seems silly to contradict it.
The Real Inferno
Smash Hero
I assume the SBR will put out a new rule list as well either soon or in a month or two anyway. It's about due for an updating. I'm not sure what I'll be doing with my own tournaments in that time. The community down here would **** all over a stage list like this though as it leaves most of our players without any real counterpick options against certain people. The stage list is something I have to revise during this length of time my tournaments will be on hold for the holiday season, but going with a list of stages like this for me would hurt my players' satisfaction.
Wobby
Smash Apprentice
Great Nerf Ganon more, my guess is the people who made this list of rules are all MK users. Taking away the suicide win, and also taking away Pirate Ship ruined Brawl.
Levitas
the moon
You don't know umbreon, do you?
D
Deleted member
Guest
I don't like either wobbling or wobufett, so whichever you represent makes me angry.
Wobby
Smash Apprentice
Well fail are you then, for I represent neither, I represent Speech Impediments.
kupo15
Smash Hero
Wait, ganon still doesn't have the suicide rules on his side but Bowser does? Why is this?
The Real Inferno
Smash Hero
You have no soul. Wobbufett is very sad.
Wobby
Smash Apprentice
Because they like keeping low tier as low as possible, so they can say they were correct when they placed that said character that low.