Character Competitive Impressions

[TriTails]

I'll never get why Sheik didn't get hit hard by the nerfhammer. Look at that needles and you'll see there's definitely something wrong with this character.

 

[Yonder]

I'll never get why Sheik didn't get hit hard by the nerfhammer. Look at that needles and you'll see there's definitely something wrong with this character.

My friend who mains sheik agrees she could take a minor nerf in the form of more endlag on needles and fair, that would be perfect. I personally think the same except fair should gain more knockback to gain a kill move in exchange for...a pretty much broken move that gives you absolutely 0 breathing room.

Against Sheik, nair and hoping to score an earlier kill are my only hopes against my friend. Otherwise my friend decimates me with sheer speed, needles, and fair. I think Sheik is easily #1 followed by Rosalina and the rest is up in the air. The gap may actually grow bigger and bigger as Zero dominates more with Sheik. Thought Zero was deadly before? He's like Frieza, only destroying planets [competition] in his base form. Now that Concon finally managed to beat his base, he transformed to his 2nd form and unleashed a new world of hurt as Sheik. Personally, I think he's gonna ditch Diddy pretty soon for Sheik...does Sheik have any bad matchups actually?I can only really vouch for Pikachu as being close to even, as evidence by my friendly taking a beating from one in a local tournament [both my friend and the opposition are very good players too]

 

[TriTails]

And then when Sheik gets nerfed, ZeRo transforms into his 3rd form and brings a world of hurt with Pika...

Oh, who am I kidding. This is ZeRo we're talking about. He can be good with about any character (That is at least competitively viable of course).

 

[meleebrawler]

ZELDA. She has no aerial game whatsoever.

Ma'am, you can't rag on your character's aerials without running into the proverbial elephant in the room
that is Little Mac, whose aerials not only lag just as much as Zelda's but are also always hideously weak and lack range.
Zelda has an aerial game, just very limited and consisting mostly of Nair.

Now, more about bad jabs... Ganon's jab isn't bad in of itself, it's just that he personally would like a faster one
to counteract his sluggishness, and Samus's first hit is really fast so it does work as a panic move. A real contender
for worst is probably Diddy's, you can't cancel it into anything without accidentally continuing the jab combo and the
mulit-hit is very easy to escape.

Someone mentioned the heavies as having bad defensive games, but they can defend themselves pretty well
with good-ranged, powerful moves in general, it's when they're disadvantaged that they become bad.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Sheik got totally nerfed the wrong way. Needles are the only move that really needed fixing, crippling her KO power more and more with every patch doesn't actually make her "balanced" because needles are still dumb.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Let's nerf this characters kill power that was never intended or indeed designed around kill power. In fact she has all the tools in the world to negate not having kill power, but let's keep nerfing those kill moves anyway, and never ever touch her neutral game tools. That will DEFINITELY make her more balanced.

Nintendo wtf

 

[bc1910]

Anyone else think D throw to cyclone is kind of like a new, weaker version of the hoo hah? It definitely kills earlier off the top and is almost as easy to land. I kill with it as early at 80ish on light characters [it wrecks Mewtwo, Kirby, slow fallers, other light weights]. Mrconcon used that and up smash the most in his set for kill moves. As a fellow Luigi main, D throw to tornado is by far his best kill set up. For fast fallers who this is harder to set up on, I find immediately fast falling a nair right after they slip out helps secure the kill.

I agree with you but it's not new, Luigi players have been doing it for months now.

With regards to Sheik, I haven't used her as much as Greninja since she's a secondary for me but I've always found her worst MU to be Pikachu. And that's not to say she loses. Pika can match her in mobility (QA), edgeguarding and recovery, also has a fantastic neutral and a fantastic projectile. He just seems to match her specs better than anyone else.

I've also found Sonic bothersome. I don't believe Sheik beats Sonic hard at all, and I read a post by Seagull saying that of Sonic's worst MUs Sheik is the least bothersome. Sonic probably has the most versatility in the game in terms of the ability to punish needles in a variety of situations, and he can punish them hard as well. It's a very reactive MU for Sonic though, he can't just approach through them.

 

[outfoxd]

Let's nerf this characters kill power that was never intended or indeed designed around kill power. In fact she has all the tools in the world to negate not having kill power, but let's keep nerfing those kill moves anyway, and never ever touch her neutral game tools. That will DEFINITELY make her more balanced.

Nintendo wtf

Casual gaming nerf, maybe? Casual players get less mad when they die quicker?

Or maybt since Diddy needed a KO nerf, that's all they needed to even out the top 2.

 

[Smog Frog]

patch 1.0.8

-needles and penetrating needles removed, sheik forced into stunning needle

 

[HeroMystic]

They mainly nerfed B-air to get rid of ledge-trump B-air kills and make it more difficult for Sheik to kill. Problem is Sheik was never top tier for her kill options. In fact she was top tier because she doesn't have to kill you. She can literally annoy you to death with needles and f-air.

What happened to Mr.ConCon is exactly what happened to me at TGC2. Safe F-air walling dumps on the majority of the cast, and there's not much any character can do about it except maybe Ness, Lucario, and Pikachu.

 

[Project Quarantine]

They mainly nerfed B-air to get rid of ledge-trump B-air kills and make it more difficult for Sheik to kill. Problem is Sheik was never top tier for her kill options. In fact she was top tier because she doesn't have to kill you. She can literally annoy you to death with needles and f-air.

What happened to Mr.ConCon is exactly what happened to me at TGC2. Safe F-air walling dumps on the majority of the cast, and there's not much any character can do about it except maybe Ness, Lucario, and Pikachu.

Remember that ledge trumping doesn't actually exist if you buffer get up options. I think the bair nerf was uncalled for because bair is often used as a surprise kill option, not needing a nerf. What actually is far more unhealthy for the tier list is needles.

Take pre-patch for example. Most of us would agree thst diddy was better than sheik. However, diddy just had the tools to be a good amount better than everyone. Sheik, on the other hand, had more dominating matchups (still remaining post-patch) that shut down a large portion of the cast. This portion simply lacks the neutral game or frame data to beat sheik in any way. For these reasons, diddy being number 1 was overbearing and hard to deal with, but now that sheiks are being picked up and placing in tournament, it is more unhealthy for the cast to have sheik in the top spot. IMO

 

[Shaya]

ZSS is in my opinion -very- good against Sheik (not necessarily an advantage)
She's going to take chip damage from needles still, but that back air nerf was very a significant curtail to how Sheik routinely punishes ZSS and is the only gtfo tool she otherwise has that ZSS doesn't outrange or generally outpace due to her better mobility specs. When ZSS is looking for kills on Sheik as low as 60%, Sheik lost the ability to do the same at 120%? Now looking at like 160%? Whole different ball game. It's pretty boring to play as the Sheik in it now, it was close to even pre-patch now it's just... Sheik working a lot harder against a character with a lot of tools as strong as hers dealing 3x the damage and dies from power shields; lest I crouch and needle indefinitely and hopefully gimp her by first taking her flip jump and then timing the tether gimp as well (it only required just the one before due to bair's strength).

Diddy is likely a better pick against ZSS, unlike Sheik's bair which ZSS trades with, Diddy Fair still competently walls her and gets consistent strong grab rewards. A lack of a normal grab makes dealing with Bananas daunting still.

Anyway on the point of undisputed #1; my thoughts right now are things are too close at the top to really know for certain. If ZeRo drops diddy completely it'll probably seem undoubtable she's the best if he still maintains his dominance, but ehhh, let's see every event being won in a whitewash fashion by Sheiks all over first.
Also are we going to be getting mad that Sheik didn't get as nerfed as Diddy when Sheik still isn't causing the same problems as Diddy did? (...yet)
Is it going to be the same for every new #1 after patch drops? "Blast you nintendo! You should've nerfed diddy less so I didn't have to deal with SHEIK @_@".
Another needle nerf would've been appropriate, but the Back Air change does hurt her for sure.

 

[Quickhero]

Agreeing with @ Shaya . This is starting to get too qq for me. The way I see it, Luigi's size and weight just really hurts him for the match-up. Sheik hasn't really won many grand finals over the span of Smash Wii-U, and I don't suddenly think that ZeRo (the guy who manages to win every single tournament he's been to <.<) playing Sheik playing against a Luigi that wasn't on-point towards the end (not too insult the Luigi player, I would be really demotivated too after the first match post-reset) and Sheik just was able to abuse that and really get f-airs off and those annoying Bouncing Fishes, but it's not something we can say flat-out that Sheik can win a match that easily. Remember Bouncing Fish is read based, even against Luigi.

 

[Firefoxx]

Anyway on the point of undisputed #1; my thoughts right now are things are too close at the top to really know for certain. If ZeRo drops diddy completely it'll probably seem undoubtable she's the best if he still maintains his dominance, but ehhh, let's see every event being won in a whitewash fashion by Sheiks all over first.
Also are we going to be getting mad that Sheik didn't get as nerfed as Diddy when Sheik still isn't causing the same problems as Diddy did? (...yet)
Is it going to be the same for every new #1 after patch drops? "Blast you nintendo! You should've nerfed diddy less so I didn't have to deal with SHEIK @_@".

This. Like, Luigi has always had a problem with Shiek so when a really amazing Shiek beats an amazing Luigi, we shouldn't overreact to the outcome. This is ZeRo we are talking about, this is what he does and Shiek plays well into his "preemptively react to everything you do" strategy.

Edit: the real takeaway from that particular match is that Luigi really needs a secondary that can handle Sheik

 

[~ Gheb ~]

What happened to Mr.ConCon is exactly what happened to me at TGC2. Safe F-air walling dumps on the majority of the cast, and there's not much any character can do about it except maybe Ness, Lucario, and Pikachu.

A lot of characters have an aerial that can at least trade with her fair actually. Once you start getting stuck in your shield, that's when her fair becomes really ugly.

 

[HeroMystic]

Its worth noting that even though Sheik has more dominant MUs in this meta, her weaknesses are still clear. Its just people could switch to Diddy and make her explode with U-throw > U-air.

So despite her noteworthy performance, I'm willing to pull out the "let the metagame develop" card, even if Sheik dumps on characters harder than Diddy did pre-patch.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Is it going to be the same for every new #1 after patch drops? "Blast you nintendo! You should've nerfed diddy less so I didn't have to deal with SHEIK @_@".
Another needle nerf would've been appropriate, but the Back Air change does hurt her for sure.

After hearing the complaints about Brawl MK, Melee Fox and 64 Pikachu, it was obvious it was going to happen.

I remember someone on the latest Japan Time podcast (can't remember who) said that when the best character gets nerfed post-patch, people are just going to find the next best thing to complain about.


Its going too keep on going and going until we stop getting patches for this game.

 

[Asdioh]

ZSS is in my opinion -very- good against Sheik (not necessarily an advantage)
She's going to take chip damage from needles still, but that back air nerf was very a significant curtail to how Sheik routinely punishes ZSS and is the only gtfo tool she otherwise has that ZSS doesn't outrange or generally outpace due to her better mobility specs. When ZSS is looking for kills on Sheik as low as 60%, Sheik lost the ability to do the same at 120%? Now looking at like 160%? Whole different ball game. It's pretty boring to play as the Sheik in it now, it was close to even pre-patch now it's just... Sheik working a lot harder against a character with a lot of tools as strong as hers dealing 3x the damage and dies from power shields; lest I crouch and needle indefinitely and hopefully gimp her by first taking her flip jump and then timing the tether gimp as well (it only required just the one before due to bair's strength).

That's what I was trying to say last night, it wasn't until fairly recently that I started to see ZSS for how strong she really is. She may not run circles around everybody in neutral like Sheik does, but her neutral is still quite safe, with safe on shield paralyzers, downsmash, nairs, idk what else. Her tether grab is slow, yeah, but the rewards she gets off landing a grab are huge, and grab is guaranteed after landing a paralyzer or downsmash. Her KO power is so drastically better than Sheik's that I think it makes up for her inferior neutral. Her Dair also spikes the entire way down, whatever that counts for!
Doesn't she have better out of shield options than Sheik as well?
Also frame ONE jab
(I just realized her uptilt is frame 3? holy balls)

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Never stop moving.

 

[Gunla]

Is it going to be the same for every new #1 after patch drops? "Blast you nintendo! You should've nerfed diddy less so I didn't have to deal with SHEIK @_@".
Another needle nerf would've been appropriate, but the Back Air change does hurt her for sure.

I'm going to agree with this one absolutely. The Bair nerf might seem like something so minimal, but it's not, really. Pre-Patch, I often had the ability to back on Bair for early KOs, but all I can do at higher %s to KO off of it is mostly just Bouncing Fish, a move that can be rather difficult to pull off against certain characters. I wind up recovering with it more than using it for offense.

Needles and Fair walls are still just as gorgeous to use and terrifyingly annoying to go against as they were before.

 

[Quickhero]

After hearing the complaints about Brawl MK, Melee Fox and 64 Pikachu, it was obvious it was going to happen.

I remember someone on the latest Japan Time podcast (can't remember who) said that when the best character gets nerfed post-patch, people are just going to find the next best thing to complain about.

It's going too keep on going and going until we stop getting patches for this game.

I'm surprised there are people out there who didn't understand this will happen. Spoil a fighting game community with the chance of having patch notes and you will get people blaming the game much more than blaming themselves.

Wish this wasn't the case, but it just is. :\

 

[TheReflexWonder]

It doesn't really matter, though--People win and lose all the same. People are welcome to spread their salt while I clean up in bracket; I'll take my losses and work on counterplay, not excuses.

 

[LiteralGrill]

Well everyone I managed to get the results of the monthly voted tier list! This month things went down a bit differently to try and provide some more accuracy (based on feedback). Players were able to rank 1-14 this month, and each number was associated with a general tier on the list. Each area with the letters were also given some definitions to try and keep things more accurate as well:

(S) - Best For Tournament Play
(A) - Solo Tournament Viable
(B) - Tournament Viable With Secondaries
(C) - Niche Use
(D) - Not Tournament Viable
(F) - Never Use

Below I do have splits into + and - tiers, and while I don't think they need to be split up THAT much, that's what the numbers showed in comparison for the vote, so just consider them the characters people think are a bit better or worse than the others in their respective categories.

I also included some other questions this month in the miscellaneous category that have been suggested a bunch in the poll feedback section which should be a bit interesting. So with patch 1.0.6 and Mewtwo recently added to the mix, let's see what the average Smash thinks of the new list! Remember this assumes that customs are off:

Monthly /r/smashbros Tier List Results May 2015​

(S) (13.35)
(A+) (12.7) - (12.6) - (12.32) - (12.19)
(A) (11.9) - (11.84) - (11.59) - (11.55) - (11.15)
(A-) / (Tie: 10.92) - (10.81) - (10.59)
(B+) (9.98) - (9.85) - (9.77) - (9.65) - (9.63) - (9.6) - (9.55) - (9.36) - (9.19)
(B) (8.93) - (8.84) - (8.8) - (8.69) - (8.64) - (8)
(B-) (7.73) - (7.72) - (7.69) - (7.56) - (7.44) - (7.4) - (7.32) - (7.21)
(C+) (6.84) - (6.69) - (6.65) - (6.63) - (6.34) - (6.26) - (6.22) (6.17) - (6.05)
(C) (5.96) - (5.67) - (5.64) - (5.54) - (5.29)
(C-) (4.79)

Here Is The April Tier List For Those Who Want To Compare
---​

Here are the Miscellaneous Questions!​

Spoiler

Which character do you think has the most hidden potential?
1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you think is the most overrated?

1.
2. /
3.

Which character do you think is easiest to use?

1.
2.
3.

Which character do you think is hardest to use?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you hate to fight the most?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you love to fight the most?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you play as as most?

1.
2.
3.

What about the matchup chart?​

Well unfortunately there were just a lot of characters that didn't get any responses other than pure "I Don't Know". While at least it's good to know folks were trying to be honest, but there wasn't enough to fill in a full matchup chart. I've got plans to try to split up the poll a bunch and try to hit up all characters boards as well as reddit for the next attempt. Yes the results may be dubious, but at least it should be interesting to look at.

So here you go everyone, what do you all think?​

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Who the heck enjoys fighting against Captain Falcon?

 

[Firefoxx]

Who the heck enjoys fighting against Captain Falcon?

Pikachu mains and FG players who hate "spammers" and "campy play"

Also, given the placement of Brawler im gonna assume that many voters did not realize this was a customs off list.

 

[Macchiato]

Well everyone I managed to get the results of the monthly voted tier list! This month things went down a bit differently to try and provide some more accuracy (based on feedback). Players were able to rank 1-14 this month, and each number was associated with a general tier on the list. Each area with the letters were also given some definitions to try and keep things more accurate as well:

(S) - Best For Tournament Play
(A) - Solo Tournament Viable
(B) - Tournament Viable With Secondaries
(C) - Niche Use
(D) - Not Tournament Viable
(F) - Never Use

Below I do have splits into + and - tiers, and while I don't think they need to be split up THAT much, that's what the numbers showed in comparison for the vote, so just consider them the characters people think are a bit better or worse than the others in their respective categories.

I also included some other questions this month in the miscellaneous category that have been suggested a bunch in the poll feedback section which should be a bit interesting. So with patch 1.0.6 and Mewtwo recently added to the mix, let's see what the average Smash thinks of the new list! Remember this assumes that customs are off:

Monthly /r/smashbros Tier List Results May 2015​

(S) (13.35)
(A+) (12.7) - (12.6) - (12.32) - (12.19)
(A) (11.9) - (11.84) - (11.59) - (11.55) - (11.15)
(A-) / (Tie: 10.92) - (10.81) - (10.59)
(B+) (9.98) - (9.85) - (9.77) - (9.65) - (9.63) - (9.6) - (9.55) - (9.36) - (9.19)
(B) (8.93) - (8.84) - (8.8) - (8.69) - (8.64) - (8)
(B-) (7.73) - (7.72) - (7.69) - (7.56) - (7.44) - (7.4) - (7.32) - (7.21)
(C+) (6.84) - (6.69) - (6.65) - (6.63) - (6.34) - (6.26) - (6.22) (6.17) - (6.05)
(C) (5.96) - (5.67) - (5.64) - (5.54) - (5.29)
(C-) (4.79)

Here Is The April Tier List For Those Who Want To Compare
---​

Here are the Miscellaneous Questions!​

Spoiler

Which character do you think has the most hidden potential?
1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you think is the most overrated?

1.
2. /
3.

Which character do you think is easiest to use?

1.
2.
3.

Which character do you think is hardest to use?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you hate to fight the most?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you love to fight the most?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you play as as most?

1.
2.
3.

What about the matchup chart?​

Well unfortunately there were just a lot of characters that didn't get any responses other than pure "I Don't Know". While at least it's good to know folks were trying to be honest, but there wasn't enough to fill in a full matchup chart. I've got plans to try to split up the poll a bunch and try to hit up all characters boards as well as reddit for the next attempt. Yes the results may be dubious, but at least it should be interesting to look at.

So here you go everyone, what do you all think?​

I would comment on it but it's community voted to id rather not

 

[Smog Frog]

so from what i've read its a bad idea to utilize defensive options against sheik?

 

[Asdioh]

Who the heck enjoys fighting against Captain Falcon?

Kirby mains that also enjoy Falcn dittos?!

so from what i've read its a bad idea to utilize defensive options against sheik?

If your defensive option is "duck under needles so she's forced to approach, also you have an uptilt with sword properties so you can beat her approach" then nah it's not a bad idea. If your defensive option is "shield" and you don't have an amazing out of shield option, yeah it's kinda bad.

Btw one thing I forgot to mention in the ZSS:Sheik comparison, is that Sheik's faster fall speed makes her get absolutely wrecked by certain combos, while ZSS gets out of them really easily.

 

[Nu~]

Who the heck enjoys fighting against Captain Falcon?

*Raises hand*

I don't like his jab tho

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Who the heck enjoys fighting against Captain Falcon?

Only when he doesn't run in and tele-grab me.

Smooth Criminal

 

[warionumbah2]

People think falcon is fun to fight because he usually brings 'hype'. Reality is that he plays like a ******.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Falcon's a pretty polarizing character. Almost absurdly powerful when in an advantaged position, pretty awful when in a disdavantaged position. It's his neutral game that makes him a legitimately good character. I'm curious to see how far a really skilled player can take him.

 

[Mr. Johan]

The walking meme machine also doesn't really have "tricks", so to speak. Everything he's got is laid out in front of you, no secrets, no surprises, no over-reliance on any one thing.

In a sense, he's one of the most "honest" characters, for lack of a word, so people like fighting him. His kit just happens to be very good at the same time.

 

[AceStarThe3rd]

Well everyone I managed to get the results of the monthly voted tier list! This month things went down a bit differently to try and provide some more accuracy (based on feedback). Players were able to rank 1-14 this month, and each number was associated with a general tier on the list. Each area with the letters were also given some definitions to try and keep things more accurate as well:

(S) - Best For Tournament Play
(A) - Solo Tournament Viable
(B) - Tournament Viable With Secondaries
(C) - Niche Use
(D) - Not Tournament Viable
(F) - Never Use

Below I do have splits into + and - tiers, and while I don't think they need to be split up THAT much, that's what the numbers showed in comparison for the vote, so just consider them the characters people think are a bit better or worse than the others in their respective categories.

I also included some other questions this month in the miscellaneous category that have been suggested a bunch in the poll feedback section which should be a bit interesting. So with patch 1.0.6 and Mewtwo recently added to the mix, let's see what the average Smash thinks of the new list! Remember this assumes that customs are off:

Monthly /r/smashbros Tier List Results May 2015​

(S) (13.35)
(A+) (12.7) - (12.6) - (12.32) - (12.19)
(A) (11.9) - (11.84) - (11.59) - (11.55) - (11.15)
(A-) / (Tie: 10.92) - (10.81) - (10.59)
(B+) (9.98) - (9.85) - (9.77) - (9.65) - (9.63) - (9.6) - (9.55) - (9.36) - (9.19)
(B) (8.93) - (8.84) - (8.8) - (8.69) - (8.64) - (8)
(B-) (7.73) - (7.72) - (7.69) - (7.56) - (7.44) - (7.4) - (7.32) - (7.21)
(C+) (6.84) - (6.69) - (6.65) - (6.63) - (6.34) - (6.26) - (6.22) (6.17) - (6.05)
(C) (5.96) - (5.67) - (5.64) - (5.54) - (5.29)
(C-) (4.79)

Here Is The April Tier List For Those Who Want To Compare
---​

Here are the Miscellaneous Questions!​

Spoiler

Which character do you think has the most hidden potential?
1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you think is the most overrated?

1.
2. /
3.

Which character do you think is easiest to use?

1.
2.
3.

Which character do you think is hardest to use?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you hate to fight the most?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you love to fight the most?

1.
2.
3. /

Which character do you play as as most?

1.
2.
3.

What about the matchup chart?​

Well unfortunately there were just a lot of characters that didn't get any responses other than pure "I Don't Know". While at least it's good to know folks were trying to be honest, but there wasn't enough to fill in a full matchup chart. I've got plans to try to split up the poll a bunch and try to hit up all characters boards as well as reddit for the next attempt. Yes the results may be dubious, but at least it should be interesting to look at.

So here you go everyone, what do you all think?​

Is this assuming custom moves?

 

[ElectricBlade]

Is this assuming custom moves?

This is a customs off tier list, they decided to not do a customs on one this month!

 

[LiteralGrill]

This is a customs off tier list, they decided to not do a customs on one this month!

Yeah, basically because last months was so insanely inaccurate and had LOADS less voters. This list may not be perfectly accurate, but last month's custom list was basically a waste for how bad it was. Maybe Evo when more people know whats up it'll be better.

 

[Deathcarter]

Pikachu mains and FG players who hate "spammers" and "campy play"

Also, given the placement of Brawler im gonna assume that many voters did not realize this was a customs off list.

Why exactly were Mii Fighters on a customs off lists to begin with? Aren't they banned in customs off?

 

[The pig-keeper]

This is a customs off tier list, they decided to not do a customs on one this month!

And to be honest, I quiet think that those Tier Lists are uninteresting for now.
Given that a clear S tier is hard to define...

 

[ChronoPenguin]

A sheik dominated meta works better for Kirby then a Diddy infested game.
Sheik isn't abusing Kirby when he has faster tilts, given both of their tilt range, crouch evading needles, the possibility to throw needles himself at a lower height and a small stature that makes it a lot easier to force a whiff punish on aerial approaches, with pivot Fsmash being on the table. Kirby is much more suited for Sheik fights then Diddy.

 

[RetroGamersGuru]

Why exactly were Mii Fighters on a customs off lists to begin with? Aren't they banned in customs off?

Some non-custom tournaments allow Miis with the 1111 sets.