Bug Zapping: Current PAC Bugs

[shanus]

Biggest Bugs to zap:

Samus & ZSS cannot load in the same instance - Yeroc and I have isolated this problem to be the samus pac file ever since 8-25 after a large amount of magus edits. it is in current testing if the upsmash is the source of the problem. We need to get this fixed soon.

Edit:
Samus Usmash additional lines have been identified as the leading cause. Yeroc is attempting to remake them while preserving line count.


Yoshi DJC float during Draconic reverse: I have some ideas for this one, but I need to test it more as it's being very annoying.

Wolf upB connective hitboxes cause a large freeze/stun time on grounded opponents if the last hit does not connect: whatever weird refreshing hitboxes this has, it doesn't work well on grounded opponents

MK Whorenado: For some reason is way harder to SDI than before (according to others, i have not playtested it)

 

[JCaesar]

Ness can do the DJC float too btw. I think I have it saved on my Wii if you want me to record it. I don't know what I did to initiate it though.

 

[Revven]

AFAIK, both Kirby and DDD can SDI pretty well to get out of MK's nado while someone like Mario has a much harder time. I think this has to deal with our gravity settings + the new hitlag it has which it didn't have before.

We could do one of three things here:

1) Leave the SDIability, revert the hitlag.

2) Add more SDIability and see how it goes.

3) Revert the change entirely as 'nado didn't seem to pose as much of a problem before (only on shields did it actually do a whole lot to, which is a big deal, I'll admit that).

 

[shanus]

Ness can do the DJC float too btw. I think I have it saved on my Wii if you want me to record it. I don't know what I did to initiate it though.

Please do, as I've been playing Ness with DJC for what must be a month now and I've never seen it happen.

 

[Veril]

Yoshi DJC float during Draconic reverse: I have some ideas for this one, but I need to test it more as it's being very annoying.

DJC float? This sort of testing is what I'm good at, but I'm unfamiliar with that term (the "float" part, I obviously know what DJC is).

 

[Dantarion]

The floating thing doesn't happen to refer to getting Yoshi/Ness stuck floating in midair, does it?

 

[shanus]

It does.

Basically you need to activate the DJC around frames 1-3 upon entering your double jump with yoshi. Ness doesn't seem to get it much (ive played probably at least 100 matches and never had it happen)

 

[Shell]

Little known fact, if you press Bug Fix and then PK Fire one frame later, you'll do a Bug Zap.

Sorry.

Anyways, are we still going to do some slight polish tweaks to RC1 and get out RC2?

Some little things to consider:

-Moving up the SFX on Falco's blaster by a frame to reduce the frequency of silent lasers

-Moving the hitbox on Lucas Zair to 10 from 7 *testing*

-Tweaking Boozer physics to reduce combo-susceptibility and reduce recovery nerf:
*Testing Boozer with RC1 physics w/ weight at 112 from 120, Aerial mobility at .045 from .04*

-Make snake's fair have the added IASA only once per time in the air? Fair > DJ > Fair > Up-B sounded silly, but I still need to see it.

-Ryoko's transform GFX "tightening"

Other suggestions?

 

[Revven]

It won't be called RC2, it'll just be a patch.

 

[JCaesar]

Please do, as I've been playing Ness with DJC for what must be a month now and I've never seen it happen.

Apparently I accidentally deleted it or something, because it's gone. But Cape and Guy were both there I believe, so they should both be able to confirm that it happened with Ness. It might've had something to do with a platform, can't remember if it was on BF, Smashville, or Yoshi's though. And when I did a fair it ended and Ness fell like normal.

 

[CT Chia]

Wait, would these things be implemented soon? As not RC2? Releasing a patch regardless is another update, especially if there are things like moving lucas zair from 10 to 7 or snake fair iasa change as shell is testing.

what ever happened to no updates for a while. were gonna come across tons of bugs. might as well take the time and months to discover all of them then release RC2 in 3-6 months.

only make a patch if something is a HUGE problem, like a game freezing bug

 

[Veril]

only make a patch if something is a HUGE problem, like a game freezing bug

I'm very much inclined to agree.



The DJC float most likely does not occur at all in frame advance. Why? I'm not completely sure but having spoken to Naucitos (Yoshi main who is familiar with the glitch) at length, and having messed around a lot in frame advance... idk. I was able to DR normally outside of frame advance. The only thing is that I use the a button and Naucitos uses the c-stick. If this is somehow related to c-stick input that would explain why everything seems normal in frame advance.

 

[goodoldganon]

Wait, would these things be implemented soon? As not RC2? Releasing a patch regardless is another update, especially if there are things like moving lucas zair from 10 to 7 or snake fair iasa change as shell is testing.

what ever happened to no updates for a while. were gonna come across tons of bugs. might as well take the time and months to discover all of them then release RC2 in 3-6 months.

only make a patch if something is a HUGE problem, like a game freezing bug

Gamebreaking bugs (like Ness and Yoshi's DJC) need to be fixed right away. Falco's laser should have never been silent. But yes real changes to the moves should only be done under the most extreme circumstances.

 

[Veril]

Biggest Bugs to zap:

Samus & ZSS cannot load in the same instance

Yoshi DJC float during Draconic reverse

These are both fairly serious issues. I'm determined to (at least help) figure out this DR float mechanic.

 

[CT Chia]

ah i didnt realize the djc thing was a bad glitch

but yea samus and zamus cant load together is rly bad lol
so is a match with both of them at the same time impossible?

 

[RyokoYaksa]

For Samus and ZSS, one character gets screwed out of their modified pac file. Also, switching from Samus to ZSS or vice versa will not load the other other character's pac, either. No freezing, just a highly unpleasant surprise.

 

[CT Chia]

im sure a updated sd file code could be made to fix this right? there have been fixed before for things like music files, which at first needed to be iso hacked, but where later able to be done via sd replace.

 

[Yeroc]

The big issue with the Samus glitch is the size of the Samus pac. What we need to do is finalize her (I think from a changes standpoint she is pretty much done already actually?) and then make a fresh pac, using Magus' suggestion of hexing in all the little value changes that comprise the bulk of the samus changes. There are a ton of onesies value swaps that we can edit in hex to avoid the gay FADEF00D ****ups and keep the file size down. Fortunately, Samus doesn't have many changes besides those.

 

[Dantarion]

editing values should NOT cause PSA to relocate the action, so you SHOULD be fine.

 

[Yeroc]

But they do actually continue to increase the file size, at least the time I've tried to do it they have.

 

[VietGeek]

random note:

The Tornado SDI problem isn't really notable since the gravity nerf pretty much also nerfed how reliably Tornado connects...for MK.

Now Kirby's on the other hand...seems a lot more troublesome.

 

[Veril]

Now Kirby's on the other hand...seems a lot more troublesome.

This isn't exactly a game-****** glitch or major bug like the ZSS/Samus issue or the DJC float.

Speaking of which... I was messing around with Ness and I believe I've found a glitch involving the DJC and psim (which always canceled normal momentum) which made Ness ignore Wario's entire d-air (not SA, no effect at all). I honestly was just bored with trying to induce the DJC float and was messing around, so I'm not sure the exact frame I input psim. + I was burnt out from the double labs ;_; I have on wednesdays so I was hesitant about even posting on this. If this did indeed occur however, it is a serious problem. Leafgreen has informed me that the DJC should NOT be creating invincibility frames. If I can replicate it I'll put up footage, otherwise idk wtf happened.

 

[shanus]

This isn't exactly a game-****** glitch or major bug like the ZSS/Samus issue or the DJC float.

Speaking of which... I was messing around with Ness and I believe I've found a glitch involving the DJC and psim (which always canceled normal momentum) which made Ness ignore Wario's entire d-air (not SA, no effect at all). I honestly was just bored with trying to induce the DJC float and was messing around, so I'm not sure the exact frame I input psim. + I was burnt out from the double labs ;_; I have on wednesdays so I was hesitant about even posting on this. If this did indeed occur however, it is a serious problem. Leafgreen has informed me that the DJC should NOT be creating invincibility frames. If I can replicate it I'll put up footage, otherwise idk wtf happened.

the current DJC -cannot- create invuln frames.

however, i have had freak bugs with psi mag where it absorbed (yes absorbed) physicial damage and healed ness (~2% dmg from a full aerial). Im thinking you may have witnessed such a phenomenon. They are very rare, and I have no idea why it happens.

Also, just to note, this happened pre-DJCing as well. Not a common link.

 

[Veril]

the current DJC -cannot- create invuln frames.

however, i have had freak bugs with psi mag where it absorbed (yes absorbed) physicial damage and healed ness (~2% dmg from a full aerial). Im thinking you may have witnessed such a phenomenon. They are very rare, and I have no idea why it happens.

Also, just to note, this happened pre-DJCing as well. Not a common link.

OK, so instead of being immune to an attack he gets healed by it... that seems worse to me. Well if its that rare I won't look into it yet.

Any luck with the DJC glitch. I swear, by the time I get a good idea of how this works I'll have crazy Yoshi tech skill I'll never need (I can DR consistently now lol).