Brawlers hate us-What can we do?-READ FIRST POST!

[Miharu]

The reason why Brawlers are coming to dislike you guys is because you guys tend to be immature over the whole thing.

And where does making sweeping generalizations leave you?

Just because Brawl places more emphasis and gives slower characters a chance at becoming high tiers or least useable does not make it worse or any less deep.

Too bad Snake + MK >>>>>>> the rest of the cast

It's also no less deep just because it isn't Melee 2.0 - which people have been warning you about since the first demos came out - also Brawl has not been out enough time to find as many techniques. I'm sure people complained about the same things you have when Melee first came out as well.

For the last time, no they didn't. Please do some reading/research/whatever before you decide to blindly compare Brawl versus Melee to Melee versus 64.

The Brawlers when they argue for Brawl are more open minded and say "well, let's give it a chance.

That's just bull****. Blindly saying that a new game is better than its predecessor doesn't qualify as being "open minded." I prefer the term "dim-witted."

I mean, as a new game that isn't Melee 2.0 clearly the gap between competitive and casuals are smaller..." and so on, there's more logic.
Meanwhile a good deal of you here just realized that it wasn't Melee 2.0 and just screamed "OMG HOW DARE U SAKURAI RUIN UR OWN SERIES EVEN IF THIS WAS ALWAYS HOW YOU WANTED IT TO BE AND COMPETITIVE PLAYING WAS AN INVENTION BY THE FANS TO BEGIN WITH. OMG A NOOB BEAT ME EVEN IF RIGHT NOW I'M ALSO A NOOB AS WE'VE BEEN PLAYING ABOUT EXACTLY THE SAME TIME *bawl bawl bawl*" (Ironically, you're also the ones that go PLAY TO WIN PLAY TO WIN PLAY TO WIN, and yet now you're complaining about cheapness and noob tactics)

You speak of maturity, and yet you decide to take the actions of a small minority and project them upon the larger majority? This ****ing joke got old quite a few months ago.

We've tried dealing with you guys but sorry, we kinda got sick of putting up with your "BRAWL SUCKS COMPARED TO MELEE."

And the rest of us are tired of ****ing scrubs that decide to waltz in here, state their stale opinion that's been kindly given a few thousand times, and then act hurt when they're arguably rightfully flamed for making such blatantly stupid and inflammatory comments.

Again, please use facts + logic when trying to back up argumentation, instead of biased opinions and hearsay.

 

[Zodiac]

The reason why Brawlers are coming to dislike you guys is because you guys tend to be immature over the whole thing. Just because Brawl places more emphasis and gives slower characters a chance at becoming high tiers or least useable does not make it worse or any less deep. It's also no less deep just because it isn't Melee 2.0 - which people have been warning you about since the first demos came out - also Brawl has not been out enough time to find as many techniques. I'm sure people complained about the same things you have when Melee first came out as well.

The Brawlers when they argue for Brawl are more open minded and say "well, let's give it a chance. I mean, as a new game that isn't Melee 2.0 clearly the gap between competitive and casuals are smaller..." and so on, there's more logic.
Meanwhile a good deal of you here just realized that it wasn't Melee 2.0 and just screamed "OMG HOW DARE U SAKURAI RUIN UR OWN SERIES EVEN IF THIS WAS ALWAYS HOW YOU WANTED IT TO BE AND COMPETITIVE PLAYING WAS AN INVENTION BY THE FANS TO BEGIN WITH. OMG A NOOB BEAT ME EVEN IF RIGHT NOW I'M ALSO A NOOB AS WE'VE BEEN PLAYING ABOUT EXACTLY THE SAME TIME *bawl bawl bawl*" (Ironically, you're also the ones that go PLAY TO WIN PLAY TO WIN PLAY TO WIN, and yet now you're complaining about cheapness and noob tactics)

We've tried dealing with you guys but sorry, we kinda got sick of putting up with your "BRAWL SUCKS COMPARED TO MELEE."

You didn't even read the first post did you?

 

[BlueBlood]

The reason why Brawlers are coming to dislike you guys is because you guys tend to be immature over the whole thing. Just because Brawl places more emphasis and gives slower characters a chance at becoming high tiers or least useable does not make it worse or any less deep. It's also no less deep just because it isn't Melee 2.0 - which people have been warning you about since the first demos came out - also Brawl has not been out enough time to find as many techniques. I'm sure people complained about the same things you have when Melee first came out as well.

The Brawlers when they argue for Brawl are more open minded and say "well, let's give it a chance. I mean, as a new game that isn't Melee 2.0 clearly the gap between competitive and casuals are smaller..." and so on, there's more logic.
Meanwhile a good deal of you here just realized that it wasn't Melee 2.0 and just screamed "OMG HOW DARE U SAKURAI RUIN UR OWN SERIES EVEN IF THIS WAS ALWAYS HOW YOU WANTED IT TO BE AND COMPETITIVE PLAYING WAS AN INVENTION BY THE FANS TO BEGIN WITH. OMG A NOOB BEAT ME EVEN IF RIGHT NOW I'M ALSO A NOOB AS WE'VE BEEN PLAYING ABOUT EXACTLY THE SAME TIME *bawl bawl bawl*" (Ironically, you're also the ones that go PLAY TO WIN PLAY TO WIN PLAY TO WIN, and yet now you're complaining about cheapness and noob tactics)

We've tried dealing with you guys but sorry, we kinda got sick of putting up with your "BRAWL SUCKS COMPARED TO MELEE."

Well i cant honestly say this is the most intelligent way to argue. Making the people your trying to reason with seem like morons doesnt exactly get them to listen.

 

[otg]

God I love the Melee boards.

 

[dudutsai]

I'm getting really sick of reading the same old arguements for Brawl... They have all been answered thousands of times, but you still see the same arguements, both back and forth again and again whenever a newbie shows up and thinks he knows what he is talking about

please Brawlers... say something new

 

[CFMV]

One thing all brawl lovers have in common - none of them were ANY good at Melee. I haven't met anyone who was halfway good at Melee that didn't think Brawl was a huge letdown.

 

[otg]

One thing all brawl lovers have in common - none of them were ANY good at Melee. I haven't met anyone who was halfway good at Melee that didn't think Brawl was a huge letdown.

True, most people who indeed were not "good" at Melee do indeed like Brawl better. But "good" is subjective and typically relates to technical skill. These are people who know what wavedashing and L-cancelling are (most likely from coming to these boards) but don't know how to apply them and instantly assume that they are "cheap" or made the game lack strategy. We all know how completely full of crap this statement is, but people run with it anyway.

Yes, most people who were "good" at Melee look at Brawl as a huge let down... and with good reason. To say it's a different game is an understatement, and it seems that people have jumped ship blindly in the idea that since it's a new game, they can become a top player at it. Once again, this is BS. The things that made professional melee players better than everyone else have become easier to perform, and as a result they will continue to dominate the Brawl scene.

Advanced tech separated the Pro from the scrub; imagine if you will that I have no prior experience in tennis, but play with a friend for a few days only to beat Pete Sampras in a tournament. This is Brawl.

And no Brawl fans, we aren't not saying "Stop playing this game, you are wasting your time". The game is fun, but does NOT constitute as a game worth being played competitively. So have your fun and sure, do what you can to make this game have competitive merit, but stop acting like this game will EVER live up to Melee and acknowledge the fact that the only reason Brawl's tournament scene exists is because of the Melee.

We say "Brawl Sucks, Melee is the ****" for a reason.

 

[SirNegroJuice]

One thing all brawl lovers have in common - none of them were ANY good at Melee. I haven't met anyone who was halfway good at Melee that didn't think Brawl was a huge letdown.

That's because Brawl is a ****ing piece of cake compared to Melee. Did a lot of the 64 pros dislike Melee?

 

[BlueBlood]

actually otg has a point though he may have been a little aggressive with it. Alot of brawl players seem to be lacking in skill in melee. Its seems (to me at least) that brawl players cling to their game because if melee were to make a comeback they would lose the "skill" they have obtained through brawl. Dont get me wrong though im not assuming everyone is like this (in other words pro melee or godly melee players that play brawl) though it seems now that more people are trying to be in the spotlight.

 

[Pink Reaper]

actually otg has a point though he may have been a little aggressive with it. Alot of brawl players seem to be lacking in skill in melee. Its seems (to me at least) that brawl players cling to their game because if melee were to make a comeback they would lose the "skill" they have obtained through brawl. Dont get me wrong though im not assuming everyone is like this (in other words pro melee or godly melee players that play brawl) though it seems now that more people are trying to be in the spotlight.

This is mostly true due to the fact that the majority of players who joined SWF did it just before or just after Brawl was released. They lack any real knowledge of competitive smash before Brawl. This is probably the major reason the two sides cant seem to co-operate because even if a newbie to the forum were to come here and read everything there is to know about Melee, they would still lack the experience it takes to actually understand most of it. Which is why you see so many newbies misusing information and such, because they don't really understand it. This is sad to me because its highly likely that they may NEVER understand it because they may never actually play Melee again

 

[TheGlitchMaster]

One thing all brawl lovers have in common - none of them were ANY good at Melee. I haven't met anyone who was halfway good at Melee that didn't think Brawl was a huge letdown.

This is me...written in SWF font.

 

[Zodiac]

This is mostly true due to the fact that the majority of players who joined SWF did it just before or just after Brawl was released. They lack any real knowledge of competitive smash before Brawl. This is probably the major reason the two sides cant seem to co-operate because even if a newbie to the forum were to come here and read everything there is to know about Melee, they would still lack the experience it takes to actually understand most of it. Which is why you see so many newbies misusing information and such, because they don't really understand it. This is sad to me because its highly likely that they may NEVER understand it because they may never actually play Melee again

thats definitely true, thats the huge reason that no one between the melee boards and brawl boards get along.

 

[TheGlitchMaster]

I played Melee for 3 years before Brawl was annouced. I switched to Brawl because i suck at Melee.

 

[Pink Reaper]

lol, do you still suck at Brawl?

 

[TheGlitchMaster]

Not as bad, but i'm like...semi-pro. i don't sheild that much and i know notsing on ATs

 

[BlueBlood]

I played Melee for 3 years before Brawl was annouced. I switched to Brawl because i suck at Melee.

Not to be a jerk or anything but this is generally the situation with brawl players.

 

[TheGlitchMaster]

exactly

 

[kirbyownz26]

i have brawl like i said it has alot of the same stuff for the people who only played brawl you can't judge melee so stop (to does ppls i said before)

 

[Evil Eye]

Here's something you can all do.

Stop complaining about how Brawl doesn't have wavedashing and how that makes it a "scrub game".

CALL ME CRAZY, but rampant and condescending elitism doesn't sit too well with most people.

 

[Zodiac]

Here's something you can all do.

Stop complaining about how Brawl doesn't have wavedashing and how that makes it a "scrub game".

CALL ME CRAZY, but rampant and condescending elitism doesn't sit too well with most people.

Shame on you mod, I would flame your more but you can ban me, ah hell with it. I dont think one person in this thread has *****ed about the Wavedashing/l-cancel debate yet. they have *****ed about the technical debate and how it could change. and amazingly, did you read the first page or so. if you did you would not have posted that.

Im guessing you didnt or did, and if you did you're probably just thining "hell doesnt matter what side im on or what I say, I'll get flamed to hell by one side!" ...

oops...

 

[Evil Eye]

I'm not on any side. I'm just saying that the different game mechanics are the big cause of war, even if you guys in this topic are too mature for it, which you appear to be.

That doesn't change that it is a prevalent paradigm among Melee loyalists, and you have to get THEM to stop being arrogant jerks before Brawlers stop seeing you all as such.

 

[TheGlitchMaster]

I think that maybe they should be considered two games in the smae series. For example, in Mario Kart, Double Dash!! is VERY different from Wii. Do people still play DD? yes. Did people move on to Wii? Yes again. Just because people wanted DD 2.0 doesn't mean it's a given. Stick with Melee because, like DD and Wii, they are SEPERATE.

 

[NoobCake]

I'm sure has been said already but wouldn't the easiest way to solve this is to let everybody play what they want? And to host tournaments that have both games, or simply retain Melee tournaments. As well, I seem to remember Gimpyfish was very good at Melee, hmmm? But he plays brawl as well, so I would hope that you would refrain from making the blanket assumption that all Brawl players suck at Melee.

Personally, I like both games, they both have their merits. In fact, I sometimes miss Melee.

In the end though, is it so hard to just play both? Opinionated on Brawl or Melee you may be, throwing hissy fits over either one, which I seem rather often, is not really gonna solve anything, and it won't make anyone happy. Can't we just...you know, play smash?

 

[Zodiac]

I'm sure has been said already but wouldn't the easiest way to solve this is to let everybody play what they want? And to host tournaments that have both games, or simply retain Melee tournaments. As well, I seem to remember Gimpyfish was very good at Melee, hmmm? But he plays brawl as well, so I would hope that you would refrain from making the blanket assumption that all Brawl players suck at Melee.

Personally, I like both games, they both have their merits. In fact, I sometimes miss Melee.

In the end though, is it so hard to just play both? Opinionated on Brawl or Melee you may be, throwing hissy fits over either one, which I seem rather often, is not really gonna solve anything, and it won't make anyone happy. Can't we just...you know, play smash?

No, we cant. because brawl may as well have had a different and characters its so different, be friends. yea we can do that though.

 

[dudutsai]

I feel like the Brawl community may be badly represented by the random people who come here to post about how Brawl is awesome without knowing what they are doing. Even before Brawl came out, there were tons of people who thought they were the **** in Melee, and still think so.

As soon as these kinds of people start fading out and going off to another game, I'm sure we will all be able to get along much better.

 

[NoobCake]

No, we cant. because brawl may as well have had a different and characters its so different, be friends. yea we can do that though.

I'm sorry but...i don't quite understand what you're trying to say here

 

[Zodiac]

I'm sorry but...i don't quite understand what you're trying to say here

Sorry, I mean we can just play smash, but as two different communities since brawl and its community are so different.

 

[Skler]

As well, I seem to remember Gimpyfish was very good at Melee, hmmm? But he plays brawl as well, so I would hope that you would refrain from making the blanket assumption that all Brawl players suck at Melee.

Gimpyfish likes Melee more, ask him. He plays an inferior game because it's where everyone is right now. A lot of people I talk to tell me they moved to Brawl because everyone else did. I'm sure if all those people went back to Melee the scene would be very much alive, but they like the free money from brawl people.

 

[SirNegroJuice]

Sorry, I mean we can just play smash, but as two different communities since brawl and its community are so different.

What's wrong with that? Are you worried that melee will die because people fail to see it in the way we do?

 

[BlueBlood]

I'm not on any side. I'm just saying that the different game mechanics are the big cause of war, even if you guys in this topic are too mature for it, which you appear to be.

That doesn't change that it is a prevalent paradigm among Melee loyalists, and you have to get THEM to stop being arrogant jerks before Brawlers stop seeing you all as such.

This seems to be where a big part of the argument comes from because no matter how much either side wants to admit it there are many people (brawlers and melee players alike) that dont exactly represent their sides in the best way.

 

[Zodiac]

What's wrong with that? Are you worried that melee will die because people fail to see it in the way we do?

No, im not. I worried that staying one big community will though.

 

[Teczer0]

Gimpyfish likes Melee more, ask him. He plays an inferior game because it's where everyone is right now. A lot of people I talk to tell me they moved to Brawl because everyone else did. I'm sure if all those people went back to Melee the scene would be very much alive, but they like the free money from brawl people.

QFT

My friend Spammerer says he is basically in the game for the money and the second he can't gain money from playing the game he would quit.

Brawl attracts tons of new players.

New players = Larger Pots.

Basically thats even more of a reason players like Gimpy/Spammerer are playing the game.

 

[BlueBlood]

If you think about it what motivation do NEW smash players have really when they could just go with the game where they dont have to learn as much to be competitive. That seems like one of the problems melee seems to be facing

 

[Teczer0]

I think its less about the technical skill than it is about "newness"

Brawl is still an infant fighting game it hasn't been out for even a year yet.

A new game is exciting and it also gives players a sense that they can accomplish something because everyone is still at a low level of gameplay.

Melee is a great game with seemingly infinite depth but its not new and players considering playing the game won't be playing the game for competitive reasons.

Especially if they look at top players who move their characters with unbelievable precision and execute death combos etc etc.

Its probably scares them away from the idea of playing the game competitively.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I'm not on any side. I'm just saying that the different game mechanics are the big cause of war, even if you guys in this topic are too mature for it, which you appear to be.

That doesn't change that it is a prevalent paradigm among Melee loyalists, and you have to get THEM to stop being arrogant jerks before Brawlers stop seeing you all as such.

Then I guess we're arrogant jerks for talking about opinions and observations on an internet forum, O Great Moderator. If you think the Brawl boards are bad, you ought to moderate the Debate Hall and the Pool Room sometime. Things get nasty in there. Oh wait...

You'll be surprised at how few "Melee elitists" there are running rampant through the community. Usually those that blindly throw insults at Brawl are scolded universally and by both sides of the argument (not just by pro Brawlers). Take a look at some of the debate threads that are erupting throughout the Brawl boards and you'll see this occurring more often than a blue moon sighting. Also, some pro Brawlers think that some of the things that we Melee players point out about the game's "noob friendliness" (ease of powershielding, no hitstun, tripping, etc) are inflammatory. It shouldn't be taken that way.

I may not like Brawl that much, but I'm not about to flame people for adoring the game (hell, I'll admit to enjoying the game on occasions---just not as much as Melee). But if I have to, I will illustrate my opinion if asked or if I feel like I can contribute something to the topic.

If I may close by saying this: I agree with you, BlueBlood, about the representatives on each side of the community---we just don't have them. However, the ones that we have are all absolutely phenomenal and are (pretty much) indicative to the sum of their respective parts. AlphaZealot, SamuraiPanda, and Anther---just to name a few---are great reps to the cause of vouching for Brawl's viability in a competitive atmosphere. Some of their posts are very compelling. The Melee enthusiasts---Scar, Ankoku, and Pink Reaper; again, to just name a few---are also good representatives on the opposite side of the spectrum.

Discuss.

Smooth Criminal

 

[jayrocs]

Its probably scares them away from the idea of playing the game competitively.

I don't think that is a reason, and if it is then it's not a good reason. I, for one, was attracted to melee so many years ago because of combo videos I found, and 1v1 videos. I yearn for competition, and once I found out smash was a highly competetive game I indulged myself with video after video and began practicing. Now, is wanting to play a new game a good reason, yes. But, don't make silly statements like Brawl has more promise than melee or that I will be missing out on ATs, and tournaments. I could care less, I tracked Brawl ATs for several months before I gave up on the game. There are no game breaking ATs and the skill gap, regardless how much you argue about this, is very small. I mean I see random names playing established players in Finals of tournaments. This may be the noob dream finally getting to play known players, but it also goes to show that anyone can be good at this game. Meaning anyone, not people who practice everyday, not people trying to get better at fundamentals and understand of the game. ANYONE can be good at brawl, its so simple in comparison to the previous smash titles.

With the lack of hit-stun, it doesn't matter how many ATs you find for brawl it will remain non competetive. Unless some amazing AT comes out that allows for hit stuns. In about a year brawl will be forgotten. Quote it and remember it, I'm sure people have said it before but I'll say it again. Brawl will eventually die, soon, and before melee dies. This is just like the counter strike community when source came out. Even with big corporations and leagues backing source, everyone knows 1.6 takes more skill, and at an international level 1.6 is still bigger than source. The same will happen with brawl. Soon people will give up defending it because they themselves finally realize brawl is inferior, and melee will be respected by the players, the real players who matter. Not the random kid who bought brawl on release, found smash boards on a whim, and self proclaimed himself as a smash expert. Which most of you brawlers are. This may be ignorant for me to say, but so far it's working out for me, people who joined smashboards Feb 2008 and beyond don't know what they are talking about. So, I don't listen to them. Feel free to reply, just know if your join date is past feb 2008 I skipped your post.

tl;dr melee>brawl

 

[Teczer0]

Well every person is different I'm not saying EVERYONE who decided to not playing melee never tried because they may have been intimidated by top players.

But I think its very possible especially if you decide to play the game for money.

 

[BlueBlood]

people who joined smashboards Feb 2008 and beyond don't know what they are talking about. So, I don't listen to them. Feel free to reply, just know if your join date is past feb 2008 I skipped your post.

tl;dr melee>brawl

Well while i can honestly say i agree with most of your post it is still things like this that get to me. So the time someone joins the site dictates how much knowledge they have of smash? Sure my join date says Feb but thats because i hadnt bothered looking for it and stumbled across it. I may like melee better but judging a brawl player or new member based on when they joined a website is naive.

 

[Blea Gelo]

u know hwat? just let em hate us.. We wont be affected because of that hate, we know elee is better and we know we ARE right, so just let em be wrong..

 

[kirbyownz26]

nobody should care what people play may it be ssbb or ssbm or even ssb64. If no one cared what people played none of this would be happning. So play what ever you want who cares. so stop flaming people you don't play the same game as you.