Brawl Information Compendium & Social

[1PokeMastr]

Bro bro bro, bro, yo bro

 

[pwnyclaus]

Hey, I'm looking to organize a Brawl crew battle between smashboards and fsmash regulars. I'm not a brawl guy, so I don't know any of the regulars here. Who are the best of the best Brawl players here?

link to fsmash: https://www.fsmash.org/

 

[CURRY]

So ledge attacking is generally a bad idea because it is easily punished with a spotdodge, shield, or whatever.

So I don't ledge attack. But people still pull off ledge attacks on me.
So I don't play with normal humans; no people locally that I can play with, and WiFi is laggy as heck, so I play against CPUs.
So how do I practice punishing ledge attacks?

Also, I'm guess that a shield is generally better; and then you can use an OoS option?or does it really just depend on the character, etc etc

 

[KAP22714]

React to it with shield imo. There are very few characters (DK comes to mind) whose under 100 (over 100 is trivially slow) get up attack is fast enough and big enough not to be able to react to as easily. Most of them have stupid ending lag so just beat them up after it idk

 

[PKBeam]

If you have someone like then maybe you can try to outspace them with an Fsmash or Ftilt.
If you have ICs then you probably try to run up close and try to shieldgrab.
Or you might try to Up-B OoS them back offstage

Sometimes they might do something like a ledgehop when you think they'll ledge attack so some characters' Dairs are a pretty reliable choice because they might beat quite a few of your opponent's options.

 

[Demna]

I want to record my brawl matches off my tv using avermedia, but avermedia doesn't have an AV output. If I buy an AV-HDMI and connect it to the avermedia box then connect it to the Wii, will it work?

I apologize for asking here, but I asked in the recording section of smashboards a month ago and they still didn't reply.

 

[-LzR-]

So ledge attacking is generally a bad idea because it is easily punished with a spotdodge, shield, or whatever.

So I don't ledge attack. But people still pull off ledge attacks on me.
So I don't play with normal humans; no people locally that I can play with, and WiFi is laggy as heck, so I play against CPUs.
So how do I practice punishing ledge attacks?

Also, I'm guess that a shield is generally better; and then you can use an OoS option?or does it really just depend on the character, etc etc

Learn the range of each characters below 100% ledge attacks. Try to stand outside of their range. Now if they still try to do it and whiff you have time to do almost anything to punish them.

 

[PKBeam]

why not try?
and if it doesn't work then buy an iPhone and hold it to your screen.

 

[Demna]

why not try?
and if it doesn't work then buy an iPhone and hold it to your screen.

I need to order it from amazon and I don't want to wait a week or two and find out it doesn't work. I want it to be as clear as possible in order to make a good combo video

 

[Phan7om]

@ CURRY Unless the character is Bowser, DK, or Peach (even tho Peach has a lot other ledge options), and under 100%, you could react to anyone else and sheildgrab/up-b oos/whatever to punish them. What I do is go into training mode and go a ledge attack with all characters to see their range and speed and I just remember that animation, though some over 100% animations look similar.
----
Here is my question tho.
Is there anywhere on the boards that lists the kill power of each move? For example, Strongest UpSmash: Ivysaur, Lucas, GnW,...ZSS, Diddy, Olimar(white pikmin). If you get what im saying. Basically are there lists somewhere on the boards where every character and the order of the strongest-weakest smashes/throws/etc. are?

 

[Jamwa]

@ CURRY Unless the character is Bowser, DK, or Peach (even tho Peach has a lot other ledge options), and under 100%, you could react to anyone else and sheildgrab/up-b oos/whatever to punish them. What I do is go into training mode and go a ledge attack with all characters to see their range and speed and I just remember that animation, though some over 100% animations look similar.
----
Here is my question tho.
Is there anywhere on the boards that lists the kill power of each move? For example, Strongest UpSmash: Ivysaur, Lucas, GnW,...ZSS, Diddy, Olimar(white pikmin). If you get what im saying. Basically are there lists somewhere on the boards where every character and the order of the strongest-weakest smashes/throws/etc. are?

http://smashboards.com/threads/the-superlatives-strongest-attacks-in-each-category.174342/
it seems like observation mostly and not 'proper' testing. you might have to look at each characters moves list to figure out which has the highest base knockback, and which ones scale the most.
for dairs, i know Ness' spike is second to luigis dtuant. Ganon's just kills of the top way sooner if you land it on a grounded foe

 

[infiniteV115]

This list seems to be better tested
http://smashboards.com/threads/proj...lings-character-usmash-uair-knockback.156908/

Also surprise, both this thread and the one Jamwa mentioned are in the OP of this thread. A lot of people seem to forget that the OP of this thread is full of links to other useful threads

Also Jamwa that's not correct, Luigi's dtaunt is not stronger than Ness' dair (and it's also not a dair, lol). Luigi's dtaunt is just the only 'true spike' in the game (ie it can't be meteor cancelled), but it's pathetically weak; a character with good vertical recovery like Pit or MK or something will live it for a fairly large percent interval. Ness' dair definitely has higher knockback lol.

Also (relevant to the whole 'strongest' thing) Ness' dair has the highest base knockback of all meteor smashes/spikes, meaning that at 0 it has higher knockback than any other. However other spikes/meteor smashes have better knockback growth (eg Ganon's dair, ZSS downB, probably Ike's dair, etc) so at higher percents they have better knockback.

 

[Phan7om]

This list seems to be better tested
http://smashboards.com/threads/proj...lings-character-usmash-uair-knockback.156908/

Also surprise, both this thread and the one Jamwa mentioned are in the OP of this thread. A lot of people seem to forget that the OP of this thread is full of links to other useful threads

Also Jamwa that's not correct, Luigi's dtaunt is not stronger than Ness' dair (and it's also not a dair, lol). Luigi's dtaunt is just the only 'true spike' in the game (ie it can't be meteor cancelled), but it's pathetically weak; a character with good vertical recovery like Pit or MK or something will live it for a fairly large percent interval. Ness' dair definitely has higher knockback lol.

Also (relevant to the whole 'strongest' thing) Ness' dair has the highest base knockback of all meteor smashes/spikes, meaning that at 0 it has higher knockback than any other. However other spikes/meteor smashes have better knockback growth (eg Ganon's dair, ZSS downB, probably Ike's dair, etc) so at higher percents they have better knockback.

Thanks man, just what I was looking for. And lol whoops my bad, probably shouldve looked a little harder for this, I just kinda looked at the first 6 for some reason and then asked.

 

[Jackson]

How can I perform hugging ( walking off the ledge and instantly grabbing it) easily and consistently?

 

[Heartstring]

How can I perform hugging ( walking off the ledge and instantly grabbing it) easily and consistently?

perform a half-circle back input on your control stick at the ledge of the stage (can also be done while running towards the ledge)

 

[Jackson]

perform a half-circle back input on your control stick at the ledge of the stage (can also be done while running towards the ledge)

thanks man, will try that.

 

[Demna]

How can I perform hugging ( walking off the ledge and instantly grabbing it) easily and consistently?

The moment you walk off the ledge, press the analog stick in the opposite direction, this is an easy and consistent method.

 

[Jackson]

The moment you walk off the ledge, press the analog stick in the opposite direction, this is an easy and consistent method.

that seems to make sense, but i feel sometimes i turn around on the stage instead of jumping off.

 

[NickRiddle]

Press it later...

 

[Jackson]

Press it later...

lol... yeah true , i just have trouble with it.

 

[CURRY]

Yeah, so the half circle.
You pretty much fastfall then grab ledge.
I mean, not fastfalling works too, but it's a lot better if you can; it's a great edgehog.

Once you get the fastfall+grab ledge down, it's a single, solid move.

 

[Demna]

Practice makes perfect

 

[Jackson]

Alright guys, thanks!

 

[Heartstring]

The moment you walk off the ledge, press the analog stick in the opposite direction, this is an easy and consistent method.

This works too, the other method works from running though too, which makes it a bit more useful, albeit requries a whole extra 5 minutes of practise :B

 

[Jackson]

This works too, the other method works from running though too, which makes it a bit more useful, albeit requries a whole extra 5 minutes of practise :B

Yeah, my main problem was that i would screw up when dashing.

 

[Demna]

albeit requries a whole extra 5 minutes of practise :B

Ohh damn, yeah yeah he shouldn't execute it then

Btw, you're the guy who plays Ike in most British tournaments, correct? Beta (the guy who Ike dittoed you) is a friend of mine who lives in the same country, how did the last set between you guys go?

 

[Heartstring]

Ohh damn, yeah yeah he shouldn't execute it then

Btw, you're the guy who plays Ike in most British tournaments, correct? Beta (the guy who Ike dittoed you) is a friend of mine who lives in the same country, how did the last set between you guys go?

Yeah, thats me. If beta is your friend, it explains why a guy who we have never seen before is suddenly good XD
We actually had 2 tournament sets last tournament, first time around I beat him 2-0, second time around I was relatively drunk by then, it was 2-1 to me that time around.

Like I said, i was drunk so my ability to give helpful advice at the time was limited. but tell him his methods of recovery need work. He's predictable with when he's gonna use his second jump and he uses aether too high

 

[Demna]

Yeah, thats me. If beta is your friend, it explains why a guy who we have never seen before is suddenly good XD
We actually had 2 tournament sets last tournament, first time around I beat him 2-0, second time around I was relatively drunk by then, it was 2-1 to me that time around.

Like I said, i was drunk so my ability to give helpful advice at the time was limited. but tell him his methods of recovery need work. He's predictable with when he's gonna use his second jump and he uses aether too high

I see, that's pretty good. In Kuwait we're the top two players but we only met recently (July 2013) and we played in one tournament only together which I won; however, it's more or less even between us two. There will be another tournament here in Kuwait next month at which we'll be able to Brawl again and see who wins . He plays using MK/Snake against me and he plays better with both characters than he plays with Ike. I guess he's going Ike against you to prove himself . He told us that you guys have a big tournament next week, if so, get ready for the rematch

 

[Heartstring]

I see, that's pretty good. In Kuwait we're the top two players but we only met recently (July 2013) and we played in one tournament only together which I won; however, it's more or less even between us two. There will be another tournament here in Kuwait next month at which we'll be able to Brawl again and see who wins . He plays using MK/Snake against me and he plays better with both characters than he plays with Ike. I guess he's going Ike against you to prove himself . He told us that you guys have a big tournament next week, if so, get ready for the rematch

Oh really? Tell him that I've beaten him 3 times now, he can prove himself with Ike once he's beaten me with his Mk/Snake!

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Stupid question.

How do you wall-jump.

 

[Shadow the Past]

Stupid question.

How do you wall-jump.

Only certain characters can wall jump. Off the top of my head, I know Wolf, Mario, and Squirtle can walljump, but there's at least a half dozen more that can.

When in the air and facing a wall, press X/Y (or whatever your jump button is), or press the direction opposite of the wall. (So if you're facing a wall that's on your left, press right, and vice versa).

 

[Deleted member 189823]

Thank you.

 

[Jackson]

What's the difference between B reversals and wavebouncing? Is it that b reversals just turn the direction that you're facing, and wavebouncing actually gives you a slide?

 

[yoshi8984]

Can someone clarify this for me?

Let's say someone is trying to grab release me and I want to slide towards the grabber (like if Marth grabbed me and tried going for the GR>F-Smash, I'd like to be released closer to him so I'm not hit by a tipper and possibly live lol).

If he's on the right of me as he attempts to grab release me, I hold my Control Stick towards the right (and flick C-Stick to the right too), do I? Cause I tried doing so but I slid further from him upon being grab released (and then got hit by a tipper F-Smash lol). Or is there some other factor indicating how far you slide?

 

[Heartstring]

What's the difference between B reversals and wavebouncing? Is it that b reversals just turn the direction that you're facing, and wavebouncing actually gives you a slide?

B-reversal changing what way you're facing, Wavebounce changes what was you face AND your momentum.
If you're flashy enough to do a b-reversed wavebounce, you can face the same way you were originally and totally change momentum too!

Can someone clarify this for me?

Let's say someone is trying to grab release me and I want to slide towards the grabber (like if Marth grabbed me and tried going for the GR>F-Smash, I'd like to be released closer to him so I'm not hit by a tipper and possibly live lol).

If he's on the right of me as he attempts to grab release me, I hold my Control Stick towards the right (and flick C-Stick to the right too), do I? Cause I tried doing so but I slid further from him upon being grab released (and then got hit by a tipper F-Smash lol). Or is there some other factor indicating how far you slide?

Direction held does not effect how you get released. There are 3 types of release. 'Air release, Side release and Down release' (i've most likely gotten the names wrong a bit). Sadly, I'm not sure exactly how to manipulate between side-release and down-release, But I know it's something to do with them pummeling you.

 

[yoshi8984]

Direction held does not effect how you get released. There are 3 types of release. 'Air release, Side release and Down release' (i've most likely gotten the names wrong a bit). Sadly, I'm not sure exactly how to manipulate between side-release and down-release, But I know it's something to do with them pummeling you.

Oh no, I may not have been clear. I know that more often than not I'll be grab released (and I'll be released on the ground). But sometimes I break out like RIGHT next to the grabber, and other times I slide far from them upon being grab released. I want to know about the factors to how far you slide upon being grab released, and if I'm doing something wrong since sometimes I want to be released right next to the grabber when they go for the KO move, but avoid the strongest part of the attack they'll try. But like I said in my example, I keep sliding far from the grabber for some reason... Even though I'm holding my control stick (and flicking my C-Stick) towards them. =P

 

[infiniteV115]

What's the difference between B reversals and wavebouncing? Is it that b reversals just turn the direction that you're facing, and wavebouncing actually gives you a slide?

B-reversal changing what way you're facing, Wavebounce changes what was you face AND your momentum.
If you're flashy enough to do a b-reversed wavebounce, you can face the same way you were originally and totally change momentum too!

Actually, you should both read this thread. I know it's kinda arbitrary which names we use for which terms but I think it's best if we go with the terms established in the Smash Lab Standard Terms List, because that way everybody can be on the same page. Kinda like a country picking which side of the road to drive on

 

[Jackson]

Thanks guys, you're always very helpful. I was just wondering because I'm picking up snake and wavebouncing aerial nade pulls is essential.

 

[infiniteV115]

Can someone clarify this for me?

Let's say someone is trying to grab release me and I want to slide towards the grabber (like if Marth grabbed me and tried going for the GR>F-Smash, I'd like to be released closer to him so I'm not hit by a tipper and possibly live lol).

If he's on the right of me as he attempts to grab release me, I hold my Control Stick towards the right (and flick C-Stick to the right too), do I? Cause I tried doing so but I slid further from him upon being grab released (and then got hit by a tipper F-Smash lol). Or is there some other factor indicating how far you slide?

There are 2 factors affecting how far away you release when you get ground released
- The frame of the pummel animation on which you broke out
- The direction you're holding on the analog stick

Just hold the analog and hope for the best, I guess. Or become really proficient in your mashing and break-out timing (like Shaky apparently is..?).

Side notes
1) Ground release --> tipper fsmash doesn't work. Marth (and most other chars) have an 11-frame advantage on ground release on the PKkids; Marth fsmash lasts from frames 10-12, with 10 being the frame where the tipper is directly above him and 12 is where the tipper is low enough to hit Ness. If you released far away from him and held shield, you'll either get hit by a non-tipper fsmash or you'll shield the tipper...assuming he fsmashes anyway.
2) In my experience with this MU (yes I play Ness in friendlies he's fun lol) your best bet is to hold up and away from Marth. A good Marth wants you to release close to him so that he can kill you with dsmash. Holding up and away allows you to release out of dsmash range (most of the time...depends on the pummel animation frame like I mentioned earlier) and if you get hit by an fsmash/dsmash, you still DI it fairly well...not to mention, falling further away from Marth means he has to walk before regrabbing you, making it harder for him to get the regrab (thus more likely that he'll mess it up) and it also means that the cg doesn't last as long cause you move closer to the edge with each release.

 

[Demna]

B-reversal changing what way you're facing, Wavebounce changes what was you face AND your momentum.
If you're flashy enough to do a b-reversed wavebounce, you can face the same way you were originally and totally change momentum too!

Actually B-reversal is changing the way you face + shift your momentum, similar to wavebounce but the only difference is that you face the same way while wavebouncing. I think the term you're looking for is TurnaroundB, which changes your direction when using a special without shifting momentum.