BloodBowler Presents: AR2: August 11th!

[Cpt.Zeppo]

Even if you're only seeding the bracket by position in the last pool,you cant put say me and Davemans on the same side of the bracket,that'd be balls.

PHIL-Can we get a lift to this?

 

[grayfox]

Fairer way to do it would be leave it the tried and tested old 16 man bracket.

This way essentially is letting more less able players into the bracket, thus making some matches easier than others in these important later rounds. While also strongly benefiting people who have already proven themselves to be better players by getting to the top of their pools.

1 bye in winners bracket is essentially worth 2 in losers. Getting ahead of other players from the off without even playing a game is by no means fair.

With less skilled players through now we will have easier games in the bracket. Who plays who in the bracket is integral to fair and accurate results as skill level is varied greatly amongst the competitors. Adding more people who would've been, excuse me sounding rude, weeded by the pools in previous system, will just add to this variation in skill and give some people far easier games than others. This would be fine if we had a lot of players or even a decent number players around the same level of skill, but we don't.

With this system the top players will breeze through and decent players will be subject to disadvantages due to them not getting a bye from the off.

 

[Mr P]

Fairer way to do it would be leave it the tried and tested old 16 man bracket.

This way essentially is letting more less able players into the bracket, thus making some matches easier than others in these important later rounds. While also strongly benefiting people who have already proven themselves to be better players by getting to the top of their pools.

1 bye in winners bracket is essentially worth 2 in losers. Getting ahead of other players from the off without even playing a game is by no means fair.

With less skilled players through now we will have easier games in the bracket. Who plays who in the bracket is integral to fair and accurate results as skill level is varied greatly amongst the competitors. Adding more people who would've been, excuse me sounding rude, weeded by the pools in previous system, will just add to this variation in skill and give some people far easier games than others. This would be fine if we had a lot of players or even a decent number players around the same level of skill, but we don't.

With this system the top players will breeze through and decent players will be subject to disadvantages due to them not getting a bye from the off.

I dont see why you have such a big issue with a 24 man bracket ? All this does is allow the people who placed third in their pool an opportunity to play a couple more games .... beating those 3rd seeds shouldn't be hard for the top seeds to win so it's all going to work out fair in the end. And what is your problem with the top seeds getting a bye in the first round ? They deserve it for finishing top of their pool and they would have won their first round match anyway so whats the difference. You're making a much bigger deal out of this as it is, all a 24 man bracket is going do is allow for a few more players an opportunity to play big matches.... if you cant be bothered playing maybe one or two extra matches in the tournie then whats the point in entering in the first place ?

 

[grayfox]

My problem with it is it is allowing less skilled players into the bracket thus making some matches easier than others.

The uks scene is not large enough to accommodate letting more people into this stage and also by the same reasoning not big enough to allow some players a free match.

The purpose of pools is to remove less able players so when it comes down to a bracket the better players can fight it out amoungst themselves as to who deserves the place. If you allow more and more people to come from the pools it defeats the purpose of it completely.

Might be an extreme case but just to show my point:

m2k vs pc, ken vs roy scrub from 3rd place in pools. I know thats blown out of proportion but none the less the skill level in the uk is not close enough for there not to be absolute scrubs who would just be as good as byes in the bracket with this method. It makes it unfair on the players who aren't getting byes and easy matches.

If you wanted such a system the only way to make it fair is to skip pools all together which is practically whats going on anyways

 

[FoulPlay]

Wow, thats a bit... harsh.

 

[grayfox]

What is ?

>_> ill assume your saying because i think it's unfair to have more scrubs in the bracket. Well maybe a bit harsh looking but i don't have a problem with them having more games, but it's still a competition. Everyone can't get to the next round just to be nice and have people play more or it wouldn't be a competition. Want more games then win your matches = S It ain't fair on people who are trying to get far and prove themselves if scrubs are going through

 

[FoulPlay]

Yeah I see what you mean I just meant you put it past quite harsh, like, the way you stated it was quite harsh in your original post. But you said that yourself looking at it could be harsh.

 

[grayfox]

Yeah i didn't mean it to come across as harsh, my apologies if anyone was offended by it

 

[BloodBowler]

Allowing 8 extra players to advance does mean more of the less skilled players at the bracket stage, but it does mean the bracket rankings are dropped. If they are that unworthy of advancing, they will get a double loss and out. I'm pretty sure there's a compromise here, I understand what you're trying to say. What do you think would be an ideal number that would warrant expanding the brackets?

No offence taken, you're just trying to defend your point.

 

[Cpt.Zeppo]

"It ain't fair on people who are trying to get far and prove themselves if scrubs are going through"

I dont really get this statement.Some of the people you consider scrubs are the ones trying to prove themselves.There is a very narrow line determining what the high seeds are and who is not being seeded and I think a 24-man bracket could tell us alot.I think the idea of having them seeded with each other in pools was better,but that doesnt matter anymore.

Im pretty positive no scrubs will go through to the bracket.

"The uks scene is not large enough to accommodate letting more people into this stage and also by the same reasoning not big enough to allow some players a free match.

The purpose of pools is to remove less able players so when it comes down to a bracket the better players can fight it out amoungst themselves as to who deserves the place. If you allow more and more people to come from the pools it defeats the purpose of it completely."

That is a point.To expand the bracket we'd have to be doing that under the intention of having more tournaments with a 24-man bracket,so I'd like to see some reasons as to why there would be a point in that.The only good reason I see in it is for other players to prove they are better than some of the high seeds,which should be sorted out in pools.

Also BB stop being so weak-minded,you dont have to compromise for everyone.

 

[grayfox]

It is not to do with them being unworthy of advancing and losing 2 times but rather that these 2 losses are 2 wins for people who perhaps wouldn't have won a match otherwise. I'd be happy for them to go through and lose or win as much as they want but these losses advantage some players over others.

I couldn't say precisely but if we get around 40 which is a good turn out for the uk and 24 get through then that is where lies a problem. maybe between 60 to 80. Then the players that have gotten through will have had to beaten a lot of people to deserve their place in the elite 24 lol. I can't see that happening in the uk though

To be honest i am not that fussed, just wanted to make my point clear. If no one has a problem with it then may aswell go ahead with it

 

[COEY]

Im pretty positive no scrubs will go through to the bracket.

That rules Joe's chances out then :D Sorry to get off point just trying to add a little humor here and there....

Although seriously if there is a 24 man bracket i can almost guarantee Joe will make the cut, and without i wouldn't be any way near as confident. I use this as an example as the fact that your letting 8 more players through is that 8 more players will suddenly get experience past pools, but as Ryan has pointed out will mean top seeds get a bye. Imo this affects 2nd place in pools most severely as they will have the same number of games as a third pool and no advantages to this system. Making 2nd and 3rd place not really important except as 2nd place will play a 3rd place in their first game. A solution could be to possibly make it so 3rd place only gets single elimination in brackets or something i haven't thought of please suggest just my thoughts as much as they matter to anybody.

 

[ac_anon]

im not quite sure what the problem is, if anything this gives a better indication of who the top 16 are, if one of the high seeds gets through then loses to a third seed they probably deserved to be seeded in the first place. It makes it less likely someone will lose out on going through because of one unlucky game or a bad pool.

 

[BloodBowler]

This affects a lot more players outside of J03.

A 24 man bracket Allows a lot more than just the advance of random scrubs. With 40 people entering the tournament it means at least 5 player per pool. You must still be one of the best in your pool to advance.

Not only will the top seeds get a bye, but everyone who loses round 1 also gets a bye. After round 1 of Losers Bracket is complete, there are no more byes. It doesn't elevate anybody particularly, it allows 8 extra players to place 17th as opposed to ' DNP '

A lot of people are complaining about incorrect seedings, inbalanced pools and the wrong people advancing to the brackets. I think expanding the brackets can only help to remedy this.

No offence, but I'm closing the discussion here.

 

[Cpt.Zeppo]

I agree with Allan.

 

[FoulPlay]

FrozenWave, up for some friendlies at AR? I've heard good things about your climbers. ^-^

 

[DevMBC]

I say we jus give me the trophy now an save everyone travel funds

 

[J03]

jam- why not get them to send the travel funds to you for some extra money ^_^

 

[Bullet Bill]

I say we jus give me the trophy now an save everyone travel funds

with charles not there to kick your sorry ***, maybe you're right

 

[J03]

i really wanna see charles vs zeppo/ed or euan imo theyd all knock him into the losers bracket XD

 

[SGT Stevie]

Charles is gay.

 

[J03]

the simple truths that brighten my day...except when i realise a gay jew can beat me T_T.

heh no offense charlie boy ^^

 

[grayfox]

I'd just like to let everyone know i'm winning this tourney >_> kthanx

 

[Cpt.Zeppo]

with charles not there to kick your sorry ***, maybe you're right

Zeppo will be there son.Nooo joohns Jammius Pooenidus

 

[Bullet Bill]

the simple truths that brighten my day...except when i realise a gay jew can beat me T_T.

heh no offense charlie boy ^^

Joe, you talk to much, look kind of funny and nobody likes you. No offense

 

[VA]

Joe, you talk to much, look kind of funny and nobody likes you. No offense

Saying no offence at the end of that sentence makes it no less offensive.

 

[ac_anon]

Saying no offence at the end of that sentence makes it no less offensive.

I believe he was demonstrating irony

 

[VA]

I don't know, more like innocence or stupidity...no offence.

 

[grayfox]

lol@everyone in the uk at eachothers throats

 

[J03]

BBill: im going to choose to believe your demonstrating irony (though personally i dont see how you expect the sentence to be ironic simply by saying something offensive then adding no offense where as i said charles was a gay jew...btw he is bi-sexual and hes jewish) otherwise your just plain stupid. but ill not insult you back..unless you were being serious in which case the stupid comment will do. ok, understand. ffs has everyone quit smoking or having there period?

 

[J03]

i think a 2nd post is needed here, for old times sake

 

[J03]

and no spam posting would be complete without a third post

 

[grayfox]

It's strange how a spammed post doesn't find identity until it meets with another post of spam. A vicious circle if i've ever seen one T_T

 

[grayfox]

On a similar note; spam

 

[ac_anon]

spam is bad

 

[ac_anon]

Irony is good

 

[DevMBC]

Z's got nowt :o
charles' got even nowter :o

while they're having nightmares i'm chilled out in the comfyest crib evaa dreamin about mother****in suga plums mother****er. let's be honest sons ^_^

 

[J03]

jam is high

 

[grayfox]

Joe is low

 

[J03]

ryan is middle