Big secret muscles

[waldorf2007]

Wait, who are you playing against who lets you get off the ledge easily? are you playing against bowsers or something? >.>
Maybe I just don't understand all of DK's options but I have huge trouble getting off, my jump off leads to a grab or juggle, and just getting up leaves me at the mercy of my opponent's timing. if I can powershield it I got off scot free but if he's on time there's a free punish.
I find that waiting for the opponent to throw out a little spacing move (even a jab) and getup attacking it makes for an easy get-off-the-edge free card.
Unless I'm on a stage where I can jump off the edge and up b lagless to a platform, and even THAT isn't safe if anyone sees it coming, I have huge trouble getting off the ledge.

 

[Ruinn]

drop down and air dodge up, drop down and recover to regrab ledge a few times. get up attacks, jump and side b them, if on sv and the platform is right there, jump to it, or if you're on bf, time it so you land laglessly with your up from the ledge. Dk has plenty options. Not to mention hitting shield.

 

[waldorf2007]

everything past the regrabbing ledge, which I agree with, is unsafe lol. Gimmicks work sometimes, but if the person plays you enough they won't. The BF thing is another story Ruinn, we're not talking about what you do off the ground. Jumping off the ledge and up Bing laglessly to the platform is something I do sometimes, but after the first time I try it, my opponents will run back a bit, and wait for a punish 99% of the time.
Something I've been trying to do on SV is y off the ledge, and immediately lagless up B to the platform. is that a good option? I've never really done it before.

Basically, I'm often met with a snake, just smugly standing near the ledge while I'm sitting there, and basically I'm put up against luck. He can space ftilt through whatever I do, and my only chance of getting back without taking damage is going with luck, or hoping for him to drop a grenade, which gives me a safe jump onto the stage to shield the grenade.

 

[Ruinn]

Hanging from the ledge, if at the right height, you can lagless up b onto the lower bf platforms.

ON another note, while watching a video of ripple
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URvzC_KmAjw

Fast forward to 2:49 and noticed what ripple does off the ledge, how do you do this?

 

[waldorf2007]

I do the lagless up B onto the lower BF platforms very often, but after the first time I do it, people dash back, then do a move through it. absolutely not safe. Against meta he just nados, and with snake he can up tilt through it.
The ripple thing in the video?
I'm pretty sure you just press y and then buffer or time a side B in the other direction. I just tried it a minute ago in training. That looks useful if someone's charging a smash though. in the startup of DK's getting off the ledge jump he was invincible through luigi's hitbox.

 

[Ruinn]

Ah, got it. Thanks, it seems useful in situations like when they're charging a smash, like in ripples case, or if they're right at the edge trying to do set up for a on stage spike. (like ike's dtilt)

 

[waldorf2007]

I've tried it when metaknights charge fsmash and it works if they space it wrong. but most metas don't space it wrong.

 

[Ruinn]

An idea we dk's can do for predicting rolls.

When we get the dtilt trip, I see will predict their back roll and down b as a punish. So let's expand on that; instead of down b, why not a side b? why not up b? we need to do more mixups, it'll push our game even more. ideas/comments?

 

[infiniteV115]

I don't think it's a predicted backroll, I think it's just that the downB is guaranteed off a tripping dtilt.
I could be wrong though, I don't even play this character.

 

[Ruinn]

At low percents, you can do dtilt down b without moving. im talking about higher percents where the dtilt knocks them back too far

 

[CaLibUr_1337]

You should add me on fb will xD

 

[Labernash]

I think I'm going to revive my DK. Any new meta game things I should apply?

 

[Ripple]

Fair is broken

 

[Neon!]

Theory craft time:

Wouldnt it be possible to cargo hold diddy and then walk him in front of a banana (that we control) and just wait til he releases forcing him to slip on the banana? I know its possible to escape cargo and land behind diddy but couldnt this technique at least earn us a free ground pound or possibly another grab some of the time?

 

[waldorf2007]

wait, this wasn't known? I do this all the time, it's probably the main thing I do vs diddy.
when it's clear that glide tossing won't affect diddy that much, the first thing I always do is drop the banana. I then bait diddy to run attack through/at me to get banana or something and grab him and drop on banana
gets me a free grab, but usually a down smash. it's the most common way for me to kill diddy past 90% :| the only problem is that the character you grab always releases on the side that you cargoed him, so if the banana's behind me and i cargo grab diddy in the other direction, diddy has to be at a high enough percent that I can cargo walk behind the banana before diddy releases.
another useful tactic is to pivot walk to get to the banana, as diddy will come out of the grab the same way no matter what. it's faster that way.

 

[DtJ S2n]

Fair is broken

Finally somebody else understands.

 

[Neon!]

Fair is broken

http://youtu.be/GzwUWUOZ13g?t=4m39s

 

[Ruinn]

neon making fair one of dk's better moves. #likeaboss

 

[waldorf2007]

you guys wanna see real fair, go watch Esam try to play DK. he does it while joking around and still ****** the NC tournies, and uses fair constantly. Whenever I use it not people yell "DOIN DAT ESAM"
punishable as hell though -_-

 

[Neon!]

A full hopped fair is great for edgeguarding and catching people offguard, otherwise its a terrible move.

 

[waldorf2007]

I find that, depending on your percent, doing a fair while falling back to the stage is low risk medium/high reward. it covers space, and if you still have your double jump, fastfalling it creates a huge annoying wall, and enemies expecting to gimp from above can get spiked or hit away on the way up
obviously not on metaknight, but on many others.
Lots of snakes that I play try to jump out and hit me with a rising nair for the kill at 90 or so, and falling fair trades or spikes through it. if you have a double jump and survive, you can go down like a boss and dair the cypher.
but yeah fair isn't something to just throw around unless you really subscribe to the "get hit, don't care" philosophy.
mad fun move though. michael jordan dunks.

 

[Ruinn]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSWk6M_zCm8#t=8m32s

we need to do this more often.

 

[waldorf2007]

wait you mean the tech read to headbutt right? I mean depends on percent, I don't think we're getting that much more out of it. d tilt to headbutt is good but if the opponent is at a percentage where dtilt trips, then they can mash out of it EXTREMELY quickly. like we can get off a run attack I think. or another dtilt.
but if it trips >50% then thay could be really cool

 

[Ruinn]

Just gotta mix it up. I mean you don't need to do it every time. but if the situation calls for it, why not? Get the read, take advantage.

 

[waldorf2007]

I wanna see a DK get the trip at like 45% or so, read to headbutt and 9wind
that would be so ****ing cash
I'm gonna start going for that, it'd be hilarious.

 

[Ruinn]

One matchup I tend to have trouble with is the Rob matchup. I know you can pretty much shield anything and everything he does. but for some reason the gyros and lasers can always get to me, so any tips?

Also what stages should I pick against rob's? I mean they're recovery is broken ><

 

[Attila the Hun]

Iunno, my best friend plays ROB, but I haven't really thought of a good stage, haha. Prolly Battlefield. I never challenge a ROB offstage unless you know he's screwed. ROB can't airdodge while upB-ing, so bair the crap out of him when he's in that state. Normally, just powershield whatever he's gonna shoot at you while coming back to the stage, then let him back on. His Ftilt is absolutely ********, better than ours, so don't bother getting into an ftilt war. The obvious advantage is we don't die till late unless we get hard read. Also, don't bother with the guyro when it's on the ground, it's not worth it. Just try to powershield it so it disappears right away.

Also, when he's above us, get the uairs going.

That's basically all the advice I have, my buddy's third in British Columbia currently, so I somewhat know about ROB. XD

Hope it helps. I think bair is the main reason why it's a good matchup though. Also, don't get caught with that stupid nair. Just shield the whole thing. Too many of my friends try airdodging through it, and yeah. just don't. XD You could prolly punch through it, but I just avoid it.

Ummmm, avoid FD, he'll just read your landings and keep you off really well. I mean, it could go in your way for keeping him off too, but he has a much easier time getting on the stage, IMO.

Also Ruin, you should fly down this summer for the 18th of August to Halifax, 'cuz we have Hellasmashed going down. I think Patches (G&W main from TO) is coming down, so yeah, do it up. Will's shown interest, Firefly's coming fosho. I think Tejay's gonna be there, too, so DK main rep for daaaiiiissssssss. :D

Sorry this was so long, but yeah. DK's chill. <3

 

[Attila the Hun]

Basically, anywhere with platforms should be fine. Recovery is the hardest part for me vs. ROB, you reallllyyyyy gotta mix it up. YI is good, too, but I think guyro clanks the invincicopter, so your choice. I'll have to test it out sometime, but I'm not gonna see my buddy till the 22nd of Avril Lavigne when I fly over to BC, so yeahhhhhh. You could prolly test it better. XD

 

[waldorf2007]

I wish I could say more about the DK-Rob matchup as the person I play more than anyone else is Stingers. Buuuuut I guess I just kinda know him now. it's mostly as attila said, you won't win poke wars, and don't challenge him unless you are very confident from above. Challenging horizontal, you can dodge top and bair.
Recovery is crazy hard as timed correctly rob and just repeatedly bair (and fair) through up B. gyro controls space like nobody's business, and because Dk is so big it restricts your movement letting rob get in with f tilt and down tilt.
I like to go battlefield against ROB
(not stingers because it's oen of his fave stages though) because of the recovery options. Halberd is bad imo, unless the Rob doesn't have the patience to shark.
Overall, I find in this matchup that you're going to be taking damage. pretty much all the time. avoid what you can, but often you'll find yourself in the air, using your double jump to dodge the top AND laser, and once you land rob grabs you.
Also, when you can HAVE A PUNCH charged. it completely changes spacing, the first time you have the charge. Once you are at 160 or so Rob will often start to raffi nair, or something like that. having a punch scares rob. the same applies for laser, the spacing and frequency of laser and top decrease DRAMATICALLY when you can jump in and punch through.

 

[Ruinn]

hmm.. I have family in halifax.. :o

 

[Goast]

It's been awhile since I've been on the boards. I like some of the changes we've got going for DK threads.

 

[Ruinn]

hello goast! im probably one of the newer dks in this scene but nice to meet you. got any vids up?

 

[Goast]

Oh hey Ruinn actually I think we almost played last night on wifi I go by GZT.

 

[Ruinn]

gzt? hm i think i remember that. ;-;

 

[Goast]

I've actually taken a break from competitive brawl to work on melee when I started maining DK so I have maybe one scrubby recording. I'll try to maybe have some wifi stufff recorded unless I pick up brawl again.

 

[Ruinn]

Alright, sounds cool.

Also, while fooling around with my friend, we noticed that if marth is hanging over the ledge while dk is on the ledge, marth can actually grab dk. was this known?

 

[Attila the Hun]

So I tried wifi for the second time in my life.

I suck D. XD

 

[waldorf2007]

don't get good at it, it's a bad idea -_-

 

[Labernash]

I don't like Wi-fi. But when I do play it, I always go DK. inkiepie:

 

[waldorf2007]