Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[ZTD | TECHnology]

LOL why thank you for the advice C.J.

 

[C.J.]

Well, I don't want DDD to hurt his back being surprised by the unexpected weight. Penguins hunched over in pain doesn't sound cute at all.

Marth is good at controlling space so you will likely be able to get CGs on characters.

If Marth can get the other person off the stage while you're CGing someone, dthrow him into a charged usmash (uncharged does 18-22% so dthrow into charged usmash does a LOT of damage very quickly).

If you have someone offstage and Marth is fighting the other one onstage, don't go for the gimp/ledge trap unless you are very confident you'll get a stock off of it. Take the **** 2v1 situation that is offered to you.

I'll think of more stuff later.

 

[Roxas M]

What is the main advantage of rising fairs? It seems like gives more disadvantages than advantages. I know it's safer than fast falling a fair, but other than hitting a shield and using your second jump to retreat to safety, what's the point of using it? Hitting a shield and retreating repeatedly doesn't seem like it would do any good, and against characters like diddy, they can either rising fair after marth's and fair him back, or just follow the trajectory of the retreating jump and run in > shield > wait for the landing nair/fair > grab once marth lands.

 

[AlanHaTe]

please help?

hi there marth people

hope you can help me with this...

where should I SDI dancing blade to avoid getting hit by all the hits in the diff. variations or get the least damage possible?

and I heard dancing blade's 3rd hit has some ending lag making it possible to punish(in case I'm shielding), how many frames of lag does it have so I can know if I can punish or not...

I really need to know this x_x

 

[Shaya]

If you're ontop of marth, and he goes past the second hit, you can shield grab him before he can do the 3rd/4th. That is, if your character has a 6 frame grab.

To SDI dancing blade involves a bit of muscle memory of qcdi away from it... If the Marth does the second hit of dancing blade upwards, you likely won't be able to escape it.

 

[AlanHaTe]

so, I have only 6 frames to do something, and QCDI away from marth...

I'll have to practice that...

Thanks!! =D

 

[ぱみゅ]

And I remember when a CPU Zelda SDI'ed my DB into a Lightning Kick... man, it was dumb and hurted...

 

[clowsui]

What is the main advantage of rising fairs? It seems like gives more disadvantages than advantages. I know it's safer than fast falling a fair, but other than hitting a shield and using your second jump to retreat to safety, what's the point of using it? Hitting a shield and retreating repeatedly doesn't seem like it would do any good, and against characters like diddy, they can either rising fair after marth's and fair him back, or just follow the trajectory of the retreating jump and run in > shield > wait for the landing nair/fair > grab once marth lands.

it's not necessarily safer than fast falling a fair because of what you've noted lol

rising fairs just bait the opponent into an approach while allowing you to maintain positional safety.

let's say you hit their block w sh retreating fair on BF.

once they release block they have a few options
1. stay still/perform stationary action
2. walk towards you
3. dash towards you
4. jump towards you
5. run away
6. projectile

it's character dependent but in most cases marth is in a good position against most of these options:

1. stay still/perform stationary action - should be obvious why this one doesn't really hurt you in most cases
2. walk towards you - see below
3. dash towards you - if they dash towards you to try to anticipate a second fair and punish or they try to dash attack, you can FF in the first case and now they're blocking/spotdodging and in the second case you can just retreat away w a jump or FF aerial pre-emptively to counter. if they walk towards you you can do the same thing, or you can cross them up with another rising aerial and get on a platform for safety
4. jump towards you - just FF, land and use an AA or you can try to use an aerial or you can airdodge or something
5. run away - lol
6. projectile - yeah marth doesn't necessarily have an answer to this in a lot of scenarios but most projectiles aren't fast enough save like falco's laser but even then once you start baiting this it's kinda bad news for falco
7. roll towards - PUNISH HIM
8. roll away - lol

 

[holyv]

Depends on the situation, if it's well spaced (like tip) you WILL get away from it in any circumstances (Yes, even powershield if you jump like bambi).

If it's a bad spaced fair you're getting fthrowed and gimped, n00b.

 

[Tyler_ACE]

Anyone have any advice on the Rob MU, i keep getting projectile spammed. I know marth has the fastest walk speed in the game, and that makes approaching and shielding easy, but I can't get close enough to him to Fair or Nair, or ANYTHING ELSE... I'm getting pretty mad, bro.

 

[C.J.]

You really don't want to jump all that much. Jumping gives him an opportunity to snipe you with a laser or throw his gyro at your landing. Walk, while PSing projectiles and play safe with Dtilt, grab, and once you start applying pressure you start using aerials. Once you hit him, ROB doesn't really have much in terms of a way to avoid follow ups. As long as you watch out for nair (which you should be able to react to) just keeping stringing hits together and juggle him for days. Once you get him offstage you get a TON of free damage. His recovery goes a long distance but is underwhelming over all. Just keep in mind that he can't air dodge out of his upB until he has used an aerial.

 

[Roxas M]

Thanks, clowsui. Exactly what I was looking for. The main reason I was asking, was from a couple of the MUs, namely Diddy and Snake. The general way to go about those MUs, from what I have read, was to use a lot of rising fairs, instead of normal ff fair. Ironically, I was actually given more trouble for rising fairs, than falling ones. Especially against Diddy.

 

[C.J.]

Roxas, specifically vs Diddy, you only rising fair his shield when he has a banana in his hand. If he doesn't, then you FF fair. If he has a banana in his hand, and you FF fair you get tripped. Then combo'd. And it's dumb. So with that being removed as an option, you have FH rising fair, falling nair, and SH rising fair. Nair has essentially the same problem as FF fair. FH fair leaves you too open vs Diddy. Rising SH fair however is near unpunishable if retreated and spaced properly. He has a banana in his hand so he can't buffer rising fair OoS.

There's more to it than just "use X kind of fair vs Y." There are a lot of things to look at for different situations.

 

[Roxas M]

Well, asking about rising fair was actually just a start, really. I just brought up Diddy and rising fair, because I've been playing ****loads of Diddy this month, lol
I'm actually trying to gain a deeper understanding of each move, and what suitable situations it should be used for. In clowsui's replay, he gave me situations of when it should be used, as well as an example of it. Getting a better understanding of each move would allow me to make better choices in which moves that I use, as well as knowing why it's working. That will most likely help me improve a bit more, because at this point, I generally don't know the advantages/disadvantages of each of Marth's moveset as well as I would like.

 

[C.J.]

Fair enough. I just saw Diddy and talked about him... I talk about Diddy a lot <_<

 

[Roxas M]

The more Diddy help the better, lol. The matchup is frustrating as hell, as far as I'm concerned. Then again, the first thing I do when I happen to snatch the second banana away from Diddy is throw it offstage, because my item game as marth isn't exactly the best. Probably not the best idea.

 

[C.J.]

Far from it. All that does is let him get another one out. If you're that uneasy with items, just throw them up so Diddy can't get them. You really should work on your item game though.

 

[Capuchon]

I tried the Yoshi - Marth MU, and, i find it really hard =/, someone know well the mu ?

 

[aqua421]

Hi i'm new to marth and was wondering if there is an up to date MU thread? the one that is sticked hasn't been updated in over a year.

 

[C.J.]

Not really, no. I do huge MU/stage/playing write-ups when I feel like it but nothing on a regular basis. There's a lot of sporadic talk about MUs in the active threads (Q&A and social being that main two). Your best bet is to just ask questions about specific things.

Unless you want to know about Diddy, Castle Siege, Snake, DDD, or the likely reasons you're losing. If that's the case then look here:

Guide on Diddy. in-depth list of item tricks you can use and need to learn:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=309846

Guide on DDD. Stresses patience:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=311118

Guide on CS and why it's underused:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=310907

Guide vs Snake that Nike still needs to post in:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=314417

The usual problems players have when they ask for critiques (which I'll finally update tonight):
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315099

Information dump for Dancing Blade:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=310935

Additionally, if you want a visual example of the MU ask about that and Shaya/Nike/Clow/P-3/I can usually tell you which Marth plays that MU the best way.

 

[Lord Chair]

Someone should sticky that post.

 

[wendell]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ymRx1dFY7kw#t=39s
how to do that cancel running fsmash?

 

[ScareMl]

don't try to practice that, walking to f-smash is alot easier. but for that one, you dash then you gotta let your control stick return to neutral before hitting c-stick

 

[C.J.]

Not quite, Scare. If you do that you have to wait for your dash animation to end.

I'm assuming you know how to foxtrot for this. Input a dash, continue as you would a foxtrot. On your second (or third or whatever) dash input, instead of foxtrotting, stutterstep fsmash.

 

[ScareMl]

oops, my bad. don't listen to me wendell i was wrong, listen to cj

 

[~Radiance~]

do you guys have a guide on the percentages at which dtilt becomes a lock on walls? because i cant seem to find it if you do.

 

[C.J.]

It's never a lock really. It can always be SDI'd out of. If I had to guess, it's more *guaranteed* from about 20%-110%.

More important than the percents though, is how you dtilt. Don't hold down and mash "A" trying to buffer dtilt as quickly as you can. Be slow and methodical. Dtilt pops them up a little bit. If they SDI up+away and you dtilt them again, you're helping them get away. If you're slow and methodical about it and let them fall back to the ground after every hit, then they don't get the help with the distance they need to SDI.

 

[~Radiance~]

nah dont worry i was ranked in the past im not a scrubby player who mashes for stuff :x. thanks for the info, i did it on RC yesterday and was just wondering if there was a percent but if its always SDI'able then ill keep that in mind when i watch their di. Marth has been serving me well tho to take out pikas bad MU's, cant tell you how ****ty olimar is for us

 

[C.J.]

Oh, I know exactly how bad Oli is for Pika =p

 

[~Radiance~]

lol yeah, its scary. cp to frigate since its the best place to go.......cept oli gets more yellows for ****s sake lol.

pika marth is now even apparently.......i dont quite agree with that but lol, guess thats what ppl feel. :/

 

[Noxx]

Idk if this has been asked, because this thread is a lot of pages, but is the ken combo something worth attempting in tournaments? or is it more viable just to short-hop f/u/d-air them to kill % then smash?

 

[GodAtHand]

One of my friends is trying to learn marth. So I'd like to find his hitbubbles to show him. Can anyone link me to Marth's hit bubbles?

 

[1PokeMastr]

I don't think there's a Proper video..
But, a Tipper with Marth is pretty much his range.

 

[Shaya]

There is.... Marth hit bubbles on youtube should be enough

 

[Roxas M]

It would probably be a bit time consuming, but if someone who knows how to make gifs from videos could make a gif of marth's hitbubbles from the youtube video, it could be a lot easier to look at.

 

[PEACE7]

Someone link me to the video

 

[1PokeMastr]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzAWoZsGpwQ

Proper Video.

 

[Roxas M]

I don't know if it's just me not know marth well enough yet, or just a mental block, but it seems like within the first minute or 2 of a match, it turns into a keepaway fest. Does marth generally have any tools do deal with it or do I just have to stand there for 8 mins because they refuse to move, even when they're behind?

Gets frustrating having to deal with it every time i'm in bracket.

 

[ぱみゅ]

Brawl is a very defensive game, campfests DO happen very often.
If you're on the lead, you don't need to approach. There's nothing stopping you to do so, tho. Is all about if you want to.

 

[ScareMl]

I don't know if it's just me not know marth well enough yet, or just a mental block, but it seems like within the first minute or 2 of a match, it turns into a keepaway fest. Does marth generally have any tools do deal with it or do I just have to stand there for 8 mins because they refuse to move, even when they're behind?

Gets frustrating having to deal with it every time i'm in bracket.

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