Add new charicters to brawl+

[omegamarth]

Well first off, this is my first post on smashboards, and I don't go online often, but I play a WHOLE LOT of brawl in my local community, sadly I live in the middle of nowhare and lack places to compete in comptitions. Anyways, my real reason for posting is brawl+ and the possitbility of texture hacks.

With texture hacks avalible, and the charicters being editable themselves, why not make Roy a playable fighter as an edited Ike. Not just an alternete costume, (yes this idea isn't that original) but a full fledged fighter like Zero suit samus, or the newly seperated pokemon.

Over all, he would be a color edit of Ike, with an edited and swaped, Marth move set, just with Roy's stats from melee. Eventualy this could lead to Blood falcon, Dark Link, and others getting their own move set. If necisarry, he could be only selectable when changing Ike's costume. Anyone else wanna have this, (though a balance between Gannondorf and Falcon would be sweet, these things take time, and Roy is a good start) I still want to get a chance to combo Roy users like I did on melee.

 

[Smith]

You can only edit how a character looks, not their moveset.

 

[omegamarth]

swapping

What about moveset swaping?, they did it on youtube.

 

[Piman34]

iirc, i saw a roy texture floating around, it looked pretty cool, but yeah that would be cool if you could edit more than just the skin, and give gannon a sword :D

 

[Fatmanonice]

Yeah but not all that much has been done with moveset swapping yet. From the sounds of things, you want to mix moves to create an entirely new character and I don't think anyone has attempted that yet.

 

[omegamarth]

Gannondorf with a sword, a dream, but it's not going to work, Roy would be an edited Marth with Ike animations.

 

[omegamarth]

But it would be a real blast!
It would be sweet if someone could look in to this.

 

[Piman34]

you could make it so gannon was permanently holding a beam sword, or an item like that, and change the skin on the item to look like a BA sword and i think that would be easier than adding new moves. but roy would be cool if they get the moveset modifications working! or lucario -> mewtwo since they play similarly?

 

[GHNeko]

This should of been posted in Smash Workshop. ._.

 

[Red Arremer]

1.) Smash Workshop for anything Brawl+ related.
2.) You can only alter game content, and not add new.

 

[Shell]

We have already discussed the possibilities of this in some depth on the IRC channel. We have a compiled a list of changes necessary to make Roy, Doc, Zero, Sigma, and Megaman X, as well as gathered many of the appropriate textures.

This might not create new selectable character slots, but at least modified movesets linked to certain alternate costumes.

We're focusing all of our efforts on balancing the existing characters in Brawl+ right now, though. You can expect to see this as a side project in the future.

 

[illinialex24]

But it would be a real blast!
It would be sweet if someone could look in to this.

It would also be almost impossible to do.

 

[Plum]

I actually thought about this myself, but I have no idea on where to start. I only play B+... None of the technical stuff

But couldn't you alter Marth to be more Roy-like?
Adjust Marth's weight, jump height, falling speed, distance of Up B and etc.
Throw in a texture of Roy.
With the hit box modifier out you can go in and change the damage, knockback, angle it sends out accordingly to what Roy was like in Melee.

I know that all that would be possible with the codes available.

Might be possible to adjust the charging of standard B. Takes longer to fully charge while dealing more damage at max or something. If there was ever a way to modify the sweet spot you could move it back to the end of the sword instead of the tip you would have a practically perfect Roy. Only thing that would be impossible to do is add the fire effect on his moves but only three things would be effected by that: Knockback of Ivysaur, knockback of Squirtle and Fire Pikmin. Pretty **** good if you ask me

Considering how little Marth's moveset changed from Melee and how Marth and Roy had the exact same animated moveset, that would be pretty darn close. But for that to happen, somebody would have to put the time into it.

You would have to sacrifice Marth to do that though :\

 

[ph00tbag]

Theoretically, people could reverse engineer the character files, design a character top to bottom, and burn an ISO with them on it.

Realistically, not only would this take forever, and probably be really buggy, it would be incredibly illegal, and Nintendo would rake them over the coals in the legal system. So no, this isn't going to be happening any time soon.

 

[SSJ4Kazuki]

Only thing that would be impossible to do is add the fire effect

...Actually that's already possible.

 

[bobson]

It's impossible to add a new character, but to create a "new" one with moveset swaps, individual character physics mods, individual attack physics mods, etc. is possible. The only problem is you'd need to sacrifice a character to do so.

(Get rid of Sonic)

 

[Dark Sonic]

It's impossible to add a new character, but to create a "new" one with moveset swaps, individual character physics mods, individual attack physics mods, etc. is possible. The only problem is you'd need to sacrifice a character to do so.

(Get rid of Sonic)

Or we could hopefully just link the moveset to a specific color (or even go the Wario route and give everyone 4 more costumes, with all 4 of the new costumes being linked to the new moveset.

Hopefully.

Also, I have no idea if we'd be breaking any laws like this ISO hacking would be illegal, but now we can do texture hacks without burning an ISO, and we already have all the necessary tools to modify the properties of moves (with the exception of hitbox sizes). The only thing that could potentially cause legal issues is the characters themselves, the method would be perfectly legal.

 

[Maniclysane]

What about how Samus can hold R and switch to ZSS? Is there anyway this could be implemented into Marth to make Roy?

 

[bobson]

Or we could hopefully just link the moveset to a specific color (or even go the Wario route and give everyone 4 more costumes, with all 4 of the new costumes being linked to the new moveset.

Hopefully.

That could work.
Actually, now that I think about it, you wouldn't have to sacrifice anything at all; you'd just need an activator and deactivator for the codes.


(Get rid of Sonic anyway)

 

[Deleted member]

This has been something of a pipe dream for me. My thoughts were: if we can load textures from an SD card, maybe in the future we'll be able to load models and animations, of course, this might not be possible at all.

 

[Greenpoe]

This has been something of a pipe dream for me. My thoughts were: if we can load textures from an SD card, maybe in the future we'll be able to load models and animations, of course, this might not be possible at all.

New animations and models might not even be necessary. Imagine if the moveset swap codes were perfected to the point of modifying each move to a certain character, and if B moves worked too, Mewtwo could be created: The nair of Lucas, the neutral B of Lucario, the fair of Wolf, etc.

 

[Plum]

...Actually that's already possible.

Had no idea that that was

I think anybody could pull off a Roy character swap would be loved by everybody.
Not to mention that something like this would earn some more B+ players who miss him as much as I do. Heck even Pichu could be thrown in as a Pikachu swap, get rid of that ******** self damage, and he would be a viable little bugger.

I love the possibilities of Brawl +...
The fact that it is possible to adjust a moveset and physics of the character to literally recreate Roy gives me a feeling of awe on the sheer scale of what is possible.

 

[Shadic]

The funny thing is that with all of these lines, it is possible. Perhaps the biggest difficulty would be adding sounds, but of everything, it's also the least important.

As said before - We can alter textures, move speed, hitbox data, and even add flames to attacks, so Roy would be among the simplest characters to do. And I've seen codes that remove Mario's hat, so a pseudo Dr. Mario would also be possible, perhaps sans pills.

 

[bobson]

The funny thing is that with all of these lines, it is possible. Perhaps the biggest difficulty would be adding sounds, but of everything, it's also the least important.

I imagine sounds could be done with the dynamic SD loader. The sound effects for the game are all in /sound/smashbros_sound.brsar and they can be extracted with the proper tools; the only problem is we don't know how to repack BRSARs yet.

 

[RazeveX]

Sorry to burst part of your bubble, but you can't just pick and choose parts of movesets for other characters, or even whole movesets.

For example, try putting Marth's moveset on Ike.

Now try an F smash.

What's that? They hold the swords differently? The F smash is like a ******** punch?

Sad, but true. The movesets really don't transfer well at all (apart from pikadorf, which is epic )

Someone said to make mewtwo they can just take lucas' nair.

Although they may look generally similar, you have to realize the many many many subtle differences between them. Hell, lucas spins around. Imagine mewtwo doing that...it wouldn't look like mewtwo.

 

[Revven]

I imagine sounds could be done with the dynamic SD loader. The sound effects for the game are all in /sound/smashbros_sound.brsar and they can be extracted with the proper tools; the only problem is we don't know how to repack BRSARs yet.

Actually, the hitbox code allows us to modify a move's SFX. So, for example, when Falcon knees someone with the sweetspot part of the knee, we can make him say "YES!"

 

[Mobbin]

Actually, the hitbox code allows us to modify a move's SFX. So, for example, when Falcon knees someone with the sweetspot part of the knee, we can make him say "YES!"

I think this would make him GOD Tier.
I suggest we let him say "Show me your moves" in his entrance animation along with that.

 

[Dark Sonic]

Sorry to burst part of your bubble, but you can't just pick and choose parts of movesets for other characters, or even whole movesets.

For example, try putting Marth's moveset on Ike.

Now try an F smash.

What's that? They hold the swords differently? The F smash is like a ******** punch?

Sad, but true. The movesets really don't transfer well at all (apart from pikadorf, which is epic )

Someone said to make mewtwo they can just take lucas' nair.

Although they may look generally similar, you have to realize the many many many subtle differences between them. Hell, lucas spins around. Imagine mewtwo doing that...it wouldn't look like mewtwo.

Which is why you take moves that are more similar. I'd imagine Roy and Shadow would be extremely easy to make, as would any other clone characters. All you'd have to do is modify hitbox properties, and maybe change 3 or 4 moves out of their moveset (like changing Shadow's up B to maybe a super sped up Lucario up B)

If we could find ways to transfer individual moves you could even make new unique characters. Lyn would have 6 swordsmen already in the game to take her moves from. And don't think that the moves would act the same way either (though most of them would lol)! What would be even more amazing would be if we could assign any character's move to any other character's move (like say, making a sped up version of Ike's f-tilt be Lyn's f-smash).


But...this will probably be very far down the line, and we probably won't get past making simple clones of other characters anyway. But hey, we've got extremely talented coders that can somehow find 4000 lines of codespace for us to use, so I think anything is possible.

 

[Shadic]

RazeveX has a good point, that a lot of people aren't really considering. The characters are rigged quite a bit different, due to their very different shapes. So a lot of things wouldn't look right at all if you took say, Marth's Fsmash and gave it to Ike.

 

[Dark Sonic]

^^Which is why you experiment with different movesets.

And Marth's f-smash on Ike looks perfect dude. It's the other stuff that doesn't work right.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5N_dDrgo-I

 

[Shadic]

Oh hey, that does. Go figure the one random example I picked ended up.. Actually working.

 

[Plum]

Yeah some things just will not work when you move swap, however clone characters would work very well.
A texture hack of Marth to be Roy, and just use Marth's moveset. Adjusting the KB angle, power and damage of the moves and adding the fire effect to the moves and you would have Roy. Don't know if a sweetspot can be moved but that is really close to perfection once you change the weight and jump height and stuff. Roy was just a copy of Marth's moveset so it would be an easy one to do.

Doctor Mario could be done with a texture hack of Mario and the necessary changes.
Pichu could be done minus the self damage effect (for all I know even that is possible because there is self damage in the game with Ike's standard B)
After that you could do some other clone characters such as Shadow as mentioned already, or toon Gdorf from Windwaker, maybe making Warioman not so broken kinda thing.

If it was possible to assign these changes to a certain costume while not affecting others then B+ could even grow in character number. Even if it wasn't, a lot of people would love to see these creations and have fun with them.

 

[iSpiN]

I can so see Shadow and Isaac be some of the first if this happens.

But they would basically be clones of Shadow/Sonic Isaac/Ike(?). Except they would get their assist moves.

The running and jumping animation would be so different with Shadow though which may make it impossible. Jet shoes? Come on now. But give him a Chaos Control that looks like a broken Sing and we're good. But why do I not use Shadow texture with Sonic? Cause of the voice. If you could put SA2 rip voice into the game that would **** so hard. :D

Isaac? No one will complain since he hasn't been shown fully on a 3D console. But voice may be an issue, how many sounds does he even make?

Also, I'll speak for Cape and myself when I say Baby Bowser. As he said, a mixture of squirtle and Bowser sounds pretty good. I would love for him to turn into Shadow Mario though and become this Summoner with that paint brush. Lol, but this would never happen. v_v

 

[Red-Blue]

1.) Smash Workshop for anything Brawl+ related.

 

[leafgreen386]

Actually, it may even be possible to make certain animations work on different characters if they involve certain props (ie. swords). PW recently made a code that reverses the way a prop is held to make a backwards grip. It's probably possible to shift the angle of it to actually look natural with the hitboxes that it would be using in some moveswapped attacks.

Also, ike's eruption using marth's neutral B animation is fricking sweet. It'd be a perfect fit for isaac's ragnarok, too.

 

[ShadowLink84]

It would to be possible. Moveswapping is a very trick business and alot of characters freeze up when using the swaps.

Those that do work can also freeze whenever you use certain moves (Machu's ^B for example.)
So no, you could not create an all new character because there would be tons of bugs.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

How would you do Final Smashes though? How do you put those together and what properties do you give them?

 

[5ive]

lolfail. my bad.

And what happened to the Mewtwo data found on the Brawl disc? Could that be worked with to form a Mewtwo moveset?

 

[Problem2]

From how far hacking Brawl has come, I really do not believe that anything is off limits. It may be unavailable at the point in time though. I would really like to see someone someday take the Mewtwo trophy Model and make him into a character.

 

[Shell]

Lulz, 5ive, read the thread before you ask, please -- your Roy question is already on this page. And yes, it's possible.

I wouldn't hold your breath for anything mewtwo related being recovered, though. He'd have to be cobbled together from scratch with a lot of awkward looking moveswaps.