Active Player Thread: Ones who does not have Triforce can't go in

[Zankoku]

That chain in particular isn't very good against people who know about it, since it doesn't hitstun long enough for, say, Meta Knight to dsmash you AFTER getting hit, but yeah, amazing for HRC runs.

SH Chain is awesome though. 5% damage even without the tipper hit, and enough hitstun that they can't just run through it to try to get to you.

 

[SuSa]

Well I just doesn't know because I never chain in a match.

 

[saviorslegacy]

Now I'm being told I should be joining if I feel the same way.

Stuff I'll discuss that you shouldn't listen to:
Sheik has a fantastic gimp game, especially thanks to her awesome needles.

Spoiler

Sheik can indeed gimp many characters because of her fair, which has a relatively low trajectory and knockback, as well as her tether recovery in the form of chain. I'm not entirely sure where the needles thing came from, but yeah, she can limit angles of recovery with them. In particular, Falco will have to be a lot more careful about Side+Bing at stage height, and recovering to the ledge from above leads to free damage as well as a potential aerial gimp setup. I don't really think her other aerials are good for gimps... while bair hits harder and reaches farther than fair, it can be DI'd way up. Uair will never gimp. Nair can override more than bair, generally (for example, Falco's Phantasm... I don't really understand why it can beat the bair), and it might give you a setup for an edgeguard directly at the ledge (wallspike bair omg). Edgeguarding with dair is lol. Even though it is possible to recover to the stage after using it, having a straight upward knockback can only "gimp" by wallbouncing, and bair is much safer in that regard anyway.

Sheik's aerial movement speed leaves a bit to be desired in terms of her range of edgeguarding, though you can cover lower angles by doing the whole needle slide thing... it follows the same mechanic as Vanish Gliding. It is, generally, best to antagonize with needles until they get close enough to hit back out with an aerial, rather than trying to reach them when they're still way out there. Especially considering Sheik's recovery, which covers decent distance but is easily gimpable, itself, if you're not careful with it.

Oh yeah, and chain can throw some people off who just try to fall toward the ledge.

Sheik has some reliable approaches, unlike Ganon

Spoiler

Duh. Sheik's best anti-air approach would be SH bair or SH nair, while ground-to-air is limited to SH fair autocancel. Ground to ground, Sheik runs FAST. It's not impractical to approach with running shield, running grab, dash attack, etc. every once in a while. These options are all punishable, of course, but you have enough options to mix it up and keep your opponent guessing.

Overall, though, Sheik is much more effective at finding openings and punishing them (then following up; I don't think juggling once you've got someone in the air counts as "approach") than cutting in from a neutral situation. Since she moves and attacks quickly, Sheik can capitalize on even miniscule openings very effectively, and when she does, her aerials and throws (all of which send upward at a pretty decent distance for even more followups) can keep the damage going.

Sheik has options that setup for KO's.

Spoiler

Ftilt to usmash, and grab release usmash/grab release DACUS are probably the most obvious ones here. There aren't any other true "reliable" options for setting up into KOs, but generally keeping yourself safe on block with auto-canceled aerials and spaced tilts can expose openings in a shield. I don't have much to say here, since I've always felt that Sheik is better off just running with the situation and landing a KO when possible, rather than fishing for setups, but if you're able to consistently avoid punishment through spacing then I don't see any reason why not to go for these once the opponent reaches the right % to usmash.

I still don't get why people use spoilers. I just highlight it so it is kinda useless.....
It's basically the invis name from GT on SWF.....

That chain in particular isn't very good against people who know about it, since it doesn't hitstun long enough for, say, Meta Knight to dsmash you AFTER getting hit, but yeah, amazing for HRC runs.

SH Chain is awesome though. 5% damage even without the tipper hit, and enough hitstun that they can't just run through it to try to get to you.

*hit stun for three frames
*you can attack every two frames

Thus it is legit. It just takes mad buttin pressuring.
(I have found it easier to just keep the chain in the air with the analog and don't the movement with the c-stick... you probally know this though....)

 

[East]

*hit stun for three frames
*you can attack every two frames

What method do you have for hitting every two frames, cause if you can't do it every time, you're putting a lot of faith into a move where all you have is 1 frame of lee-way.

 

[Tristan_win]

Oh boy I finished the first chart and it's too sexy for words.... After doing this though I think I'll only do a couple more everyone else I'm just going to leave it in eye bleeding form.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2v16nbm.jpg

 

[Zankoku]

Haha, too good. Now I will proceed to remember one value and ignore the rest.

 

[Icyo]

Haha, too good. Now I will proceed to remember one value and ignore the rest.

Which is...?

 

[Zankoku]

25%, the minimum percent for ftilt to have +5 frame advantage when undecayed and thus the minimum percent to safely start an ftilt lock.

 

[sniperworm]

Huh, we have a social thread now.

I use Dair every once in a while when I'm recovering from really high to surprise people since most people forget that Sheik even has a Dair. As far as the chain goes, I still need to learn how to use it effectively.

Oh boy I finished the first chart and it's too sexy for words.... After doing this though I think I'll only do a couple more everyone else I'm just going to leave it in eye bleeding form.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2v16nbm.jpg

Very nice chart.

 

[Tristan_win]

25%, the minimum percent for ftilt to have +5 frame advantage when undecayed and thus the minimum percent to safely start an ftilt lock.

Well hell Ankoku if your going to be like that then...
edit: Now in color!1!
http://i42.tinypic.com/2istro2.jpg

Jigglypuff
23%
Squirtle
23%
Game and Watch
25%
Fox
25%
Meta knight
25%
kirby
25%
Pikachu
25%
Sheik
26%
Zamus
26%
Zelda
26%
Falco
26%
Peach
27%
Ice climbers
27%
Toon Link
27%
Marth
27%
Ness
28%
Pit
28%
Lucas
28%
Luigi
28%
Mario
28%
Diddy kong
28%
Lucario
29%
Ivysaur
29%
Wolf
29%
Link
29%
Ike
29%
CAPTAIN FALCON
29%
Olimar
29%
Samus
30%
R.O.B
30%
Yoshi
30%
Charizard
30%
Wario
30%
Ganondorf
30%
DK
31%
Snake
31%
King Dedede
31%
Bowser
32%

 

[Zankoku]

Thanks, that changes the number of values I need to memorize at two - 31% works universally, except for Bowser, which is 32%.

:D

 

[Tristan_win]

Thanks, that changes the number of values I need to memorize at two - 31% works universally, except for Bowser, which is 32%.

:D

haha, just aiming to please. =3

 

[saviorslegacy]

Well hell Ankoku if your going to be like that then...

Jigglypuff
23%
Squirtle
23%
Game and Watch
25%
Fox
25%
Meta knight
25%
kirby
25%
Pikachu
25%
Sheik
26%
Zamus
26%
Zelda
26%
Falco
26%
Peach
27%
Ice climbers
27%
Toon Link
27%
Marth
27%
Ness
28%
Pit
28%
Lucas
28%
Luigi
28%
Mario
28%
Diddy kong
28%
Lucario
29%
Ivysaur
29%
Wolf
29%
Link
29%
Ike
29%
CAPTAIN FALCON
29%
Olimar
29%
Samus
30%
R.O.B
30%
Yoshi
30%
Charizard
30%
Wario
30%
Ganondorf
30%
DK
31%
Snake
31%
King Dedede
31%
Bowser
32%

*needs to get a life
lol

 

[Tristan_win]

*needs to get a life
lol

._.' I-I was watching a boring movie with my family
http://i42.tinypic.com/2istro2.jpg

 

[SinkingHigher]

I don't understand you saviors.

You complain and complain about sheiks not being useful while you make pointless threads and "discoveries", then when someone takes the time to research things that are actually useful, you're a complete ****.

I'm sorry, but before you tell people that are actually worth something to get a life, I urge you to find me one person that wants you here.

Good day.

 

[Icyo]

I urge you to find me one person that wants you here.

He'll never find me!

 

[Tristan_win]

...this movie is really long....

http://i41.tinypic.com/2hrojmq.jpg

edit: there's really no logic on what is present in that chart. Those obviously aren't ftilt into usmash %.

 

[saviorslegacy]

I don't understand you saviors.

You complain and complain about sheiks not being useful while you make pointless threads and "discoveries", then when someone takes the time to research things that are actually useful, you're a complete ****.

I'm sorry, but before you tell people that are actually worth something to get a life, I urge you to find me one person that wants you here.

Good day.

You do realize that I was joking with him right? I have talked to Tristan for a while now and I'm 100% positive that who knew it was a joke.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

oh boy, i forgot i was a dual main and never posts here XD

 

[Tristan_win]

You do realize that I was joking with him right? I have talked to Tristan for a while now and I'm 100% positive that who knew it was a joke.

Yeah I did, and I haven't talk to anyone really for a while now, or play, or test anything... Still think about smash with a good majority of my time though.

^_^

 

[stealth3654]

Hype for HERB 2! It's a little over a month away. Who is going?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=228939

(trying to get a discussion going)

 

[Tristan_win]

After the apex cluster **** on my end I'm not going to say anything about anything as far as tounys go until I get a **** car.

edit: Although hit would be hella cool if we could have a get to gather or even go into a hotel room together..

 

[<π]

yay! sheik rocks!
new vid verus DK! CHECK IT!

Got a tourney coming up Saturday... I'll record, oh and win.

bair. Use it more, Sheik second best move IMO. (first is needles)

 

[Tristan_win]

yay! sheik rocks!
new vid verus DK! CHECK IT!

Got a tourney coming up Saturday... I'll record, oh and win.

bair. Use it more, Sheik second best move IMO. (first is needles)

>_> Ftilt+usmash > sheik as a character without ftilt

 

[stealth3654]

yay! sheik rocks!
new vid verus DK! CHECK IT!

Got a tourney coming up Saturday... I'll record, oh and win.

bair. Use it more, Sheik second best move IMO. (first is needles)

Lol at the people in the background. Good luck in your tourney this weekend. I have one this Saturday, too, and Reflex is going to be there .

 

[Tristan_win]

<3 that video was pretty hardcore casual. Still funny enough =3

 

[<π]

ftilt usmash is cool but it is not easy to land. it requires very specific sets of circumstances.

ftilt is neat top five in my list for sure, great spacing tool sets up for other moves well and combos into itself. but most characters get out of it relatively easily (within 4 hits).

needles
bair
grab, jab, ftilt


my list would be something like that

 

[<π]

<3 that video was pretty hardcore casual. Still funny enough =3

yeah we are really screwing around all these vids... taking ridiculous risks and junk and laughing it off. Next time I'm recording virg matches I'll make sure we like play like something is on the line.

Regardless matches like these are a fun way to test you limits thats what friendlies are all about.

 

[Tristan_win]

yeah we are really screwing around all these vids... taking ridiculous risks and junk and laughing it off. Next time I'm recording virg matches I'll make sure we like play like something is on the line.

Regardless matches like these are a fun way to test you limits thats what friendlies are all about.

I hear that, although I hate to break it to you but even if the ftilt into usmash worked dk wouldn't of died from a usmash at that %. With di dk can live to like 110-115ish. It's rather annoying but luckily he's very easy to gimp so may I suggest doing the ftilt into fair instead, you can't miss like you can with usmash and it set up a gimp.

 

[stealth3654]

yeah we are really screwing around all these vids... taking ridiculous risks and junk and laughing it off. Next time I'm recording virg matches I'll make sure we like play like something is on the line.

Regardless matches like these are a fun way to test you limits thats what friendlies are all about.

Here's a quote from the Marth boards:

Let me explain: Winning and losing doesn't matter in a friendly. You have to remember this even if you are playing against anyone important. Maybe it's your idol smasher, maybe it's just a really good player, maybe it's your rival, maybe it's someone you know will take the result of the friendly as something that matters. It doesn't matter, you have to keep in mind that it's just friendlies.

Once you realize that nothing is being lost (except maybe your ego), you can try new things, you can just stand there and watch the opponent, you can hit random buttons and pray, you can try different DI, you can try that RoyR combo you saw in a video. By stepping outside of your normal playstyle you become less predictable and in turn help your core playstyle.

 

[<π]

Me versus Virgman(fox) 1
Me versus Virgman(fox) 2
Me versus Virgman(fox) 3 and 4

Oh SNAP SHEIKS EASIEST MATCH UP! got these bagged. No I'm being sarcastic, a good fox isn't an instant win, ask any competent fox main.
Again tilt lock is very um... it only truely works in a few situations. ftilt is not an instant win in the match up.

 

[Zankoku]

Uhh, it doesn't win matches if you land it exactly once, yeah.

And then you tried to tiltlock at like 5%.... what the hell?

I think the best advice for you would be to avoid using ftilt altogether.

EDIT: Oh wait, you tiltlocked at the end of the second vid.... and it led to death. Totally proves your point. >_>

 

[Tristan_win]

EDIT: Oh wait, you tiltlocked at the end of the second vid.... and it led to death. Totally proves your point. >_>

Interesting enough a fully decay ftilt at that % will combo into usmash, which I must say is rather sexy.
___ -2.0 -1.0 0.0 1.0 2.0 3.0 4.0 5.0 6.0 7.0 8.0 9.0 10.0 11.0 12.0 13.0 14.0 -3.0
0.46 0-3 4-11 12-18 19-26 27-33 34-41 42-48 49-56 57-63 64-70 71-78 79-85 86-93 94-100 101-108 109-115 116-123 124-999

 

[saviorslegacy]

Hype for HERB 2! It's a little over a month away. Who is going?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=228939

(trying to get a discussion going)

T-T I want to go......

After the apex cluster **** on my end I'm not going to say anything about anything as far as tounys go until I get a **** car.

edit: Although hit would be hella cool if we could have a get to gather or even go into a hotel room together..

lol... 2osome and doesn't have a car. tsk tsk tsk
(how close are you)

ftilt usmash is cool but it is not easy to land. it requires very specific sets of circumstances.

ftilt is neat top five in my list for sure, great spacing tool sets up for other moves well and combos into itself. but most characters get out of it relatively easily (within 4 hits).

needles
bair
grab, jab, ftilt


my list would be something like that

WTF... jab over f=tilt!? Jab is like crap, grab doesn't have ANY guaranteed follow ups (unless they are an Eathbound boy), Bair is pure awsome and Needle's have to much vool down.
F-tilt is by far her best move. IMO it is the best f-tilt in the game.

Uhh, it doesn't win matches if you land it exactly once, yeah.

And then you tried to tiltlock at like 5%.... what the hell?

I think the best advice for you would be to avoid using ftilt altogether.

EDIT: Oh wait, you tiltlocked at the end of the second vid.... and it led to death. Totally proves your point. >_>

lol... agreed

Interesting enough a fully decay ftilt at that % will combo into usmash, which I must say is rather sexy.
___ -2.0 -1.0 0.0 1.0 2.0 3.0 4.0 5.0 6.0 7.0 8.0 9.0 10.0 11.0 12.0 13.0 14.0 -3.0
0.46 0-3 4-11 12-18 19-26 27-33 34-41 42-48 49-56 57-63 64-70 71-78 79-85 86-93 94-100 101-108 109-115 116-123 124-999

*needs a life



BTW guys... "WHY IS THERE ONLY ONE GOOD SHEIK COMBO VIDEO!?!?!?" I am working on my own right now (I have over 3 minutes finished) and I should have it out very soon (I did all three minutes today).

 

[Zankoku]

There's a good Sheik combo video?

You mean Gimpy's ancient one?

 

[stealth3654]

What? We have a combo video? O.o

Edit:

Lol, look at this: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=237893.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I wish I could make a combo vid, or even vids altogether. Oh well! Someday.

The Cape **** is just too good! I gots to let Monk kno!

 

[Tristan_win]

Well Savior I could buy one now with the money I have or even a good car if I took out a loan but my father said he would chip in a couple k come last Monday which I plan to collect upon as soon as I get back home.

Overall I should have a car soon but I don't know when exactly.

 

[East]

Hype for HERB 2! It's a little over a month away. Who is going?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=228939

(trying to get a discussion going)

I will be there, 100%. Unless the car get's hit by a meteor on the way there. But even then, I'll meteor cancel.

 

[<π]

Uhh, it doesn't win matches if you land it exactly once, yeah.

And then you tried to tiltlock at like 5%.... what the hell?

I think the best advice for you would be to avoid using ftilt altogether.

EDIT: Oh wait, you tiltlocked at the end of the second vid.... and it led to death. Totally proves your point. >_>

i was doing that to prove a point.You have to get fox at like 30% to get the kill.above like 60 he can DI out and jump away.

I think I clearly say "You should be sheilding this and punishing me" during my tilts at 5%.

fox has more than enough mobility and speed to avoid ftilts during that little window. At least in my experience...