Active Player Thread: Ones who does not have Triforce can't go in

[Zankoku]

Active Sheik Mains Roster
Atlantic North

Atlantic South

Username | Preferred Name | Location | Most Recent Tournament Result | Medals
<3||Woodstock, GA|???
ScaryLB59|Ed|Tampa, FL| 3rd out of 23 at Holy Smash: Deuteronomy (12/17/2011)|
stealth3654|Billy|???, GA|5th out of 31 at Iron Brawl II (11/12/2011)|

Midwest

Username | Preferred Name | Location | Most Recent Tournament Result | Medals
Judo777|Judo|Louisville, KY|9th out of 67 at REVENGE (11/19/2011)|
Juushichi|Juu|Columbus, OH|21st out of 33 at Charity Gaming III (10/23/2011)
Ripple||Champaign-Urbana, IL| 3rd out of 18 at KMYM 3 (10/15/2011)|
Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.|Tutu|Ann Arbor, MI|9th out of 40 at The Phoenix Saga Pt.1 (12/10/2011)|

Pacific West

Username | Preferred Name | Location | Most Recent Tournament Result | Medals
phi1ny3|Phil Nye|Portland, OR|???

Southwest

Username | Preferred Name | Location | Most Recent Tournament Result | Medals
愛sight|aisight|Las Vegas, NV|23rd out of 43 at E4S: Champion (12/10/2011)|
Good ol' Tree|Tree|San Antonio, TX|25th out of 97 at Lone Star Circuit Championships (11/12/2011)
-Mars- (banned)|Mars|???, UT| 3rd out of 18 at FUS RO DAH!! (12/10/2011)|
xKilikx|Kilik|Houston,TX|25th out of 37 at HOBO 34 (12/17/2011)

 

[illinialex24]

Read the description please.

 

[Zankoku]

Stickied, important part made bigger.

 

[SuSa]

I have gone ahead and further showed the importance of the bigger part.

 

[illinialex24]

Oh and Ankoku, I would like to use this opportunity to invite you to the group. Please accept this request.

 

[Zankoku]

Uh, no? I was told that people who aren't Ankoku should be joining the group.

 

[SuSa]

You should check again.

 

[Metatitan]

xDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

 

[:mad:]

This thread is already pretty cool.

 

[illinialex24]

Hey Straked

 

[SuSa]

Only 10 posts in and already cool. :B I feel accomplished.

But seriously, you guys had no social thread? Oo

 

[Zankoku]

Now I'm being told I should be joining if I feel the same way.

Stuff I'll discuss that you shouldn't listen to:
Sheik has a fantastic gimp game, especially thanks to her awesome needles.

Spoiler

Sheik can indeed gimp many characters because of her fair, which has a relatively low trajectory and knockback, as well as her tether recovery in the form of chain. I'm not entirely sure where the needles thing came from, but yeah, she can limit angles of recovery with them. In particular, Falco will have to be a lot more careful about Side+Bing at stage height, and recovering to the ledge from above leads to free damage as well as a potential aerial gimp setup. I don't really think her other aerials are good for gimps... while bair hits harder and reaches farther than fair, it can be DI'd way up. Uair will never gimp. Nair can override more than bair, generally (for example, Falco's Phantasm... I don't really understand why it can beat the bair), and it might give you a setup for an edgeguard directly at the ledge (wallspike bair omg). Edgeguarding with dair is lol. Even though it is possible to recover to the stage after using it, having a straight upward knockback can only "gimp" by wallbouncing, and bair is much safer in that regard anyway.

Sheik's aerial movement speed leaves a bit to be desired in terms of her range of edgeguarding, though you can cover lower angles by doing the whole needle slide thing... it follows the same mechanic as Vanish Gliding. It is, generally, best to antagonize with needles until they get close enough to hit back out with an aerial, rather than trying to reach them when they're still way out there. Especially considering Sheik's recovery, which covers decent distance but is easily gimpable, itself, if you're not careful with it.

Oh yeah, and chain can throw some people off who just try to fall toward the ledge.

Sheik has some reliable approaches, unlike Ganon

Spoiler

Duh. Sheik's best anti-air approach would be SH bair or SH nair, while ground-to-air is limited to SH fair autocancel. Ground to ground, Sheik runs FAST. It's not impractical to approach with running shield, running grab, dash attack, etc. every once in a while. These options are all punishable, of course, but you have enough options to mix it up and keep your opponent guessing.

Overall, though, Sheik is much more effective at finding openings and punishing them (then following up; I don't think juggling once you've got someone in the air counts as "approach") than cutting in from a neutral situation. Since she moves and attacks quickly, Sheik can capitalize on even miniscule openings very effectively, and when she does, her aerials and throws (all of which send upward at a pretty decent distance for even more followups) can keep the damage going.

Sheik has options that setup for KO's.

Spoiler

Ftilt to usmash, and grab release usmash/grab release DACUS are probably the most obvious ones here. There aren't any other true "reliable" options for setting up into KOs, but generally keeping yourself safe on block with auto-canceled aerials and spaced tilts can expose openings in a shield. I don't have much to say here, since I've always felt that Sheik is better off just running with the situation and landing a KO when possible, rather than fishing for setups, but if you're able to consistently avoid punishment through spacing then I don't see any reason why not to go for these once the opponent reaches the right % to usmash.

 

[illinialex24]

Cool, we didn't listen.

 

[SuSa]

See, you should be in the BRoom like OS.

 

[:mad:]

Hey Alex.

So guys. Sheik. What's to discuss?

 

[illinialex24]

Hey Alex.

So guys. Sheik. What's to discuss?

Bair? Remember Gimpyfish's combo video? That was pretty **** even if it was like in April.....

 

[SuSa]

Her dair from really high up so it auto-cancels and leads straight into ftilt.

Or her fair leads into ftilt sometimes.

Or how about my favorite: Is it true Fair sometimes trips the opponent at lower %'s leading into a free anything pretty much?

Actual discussion matter:

Who else finds spoiler tags annoying?

 

[illinialex24]

Her dair from really high up so it auto-cancels and leads straight into ftilt.

Or her fair leads into ftilt sometimes.

Or how about my favorite: Is it true Fair sometimes trips the opponent at lower %'s leading into a free anything pretty much?

Actual discussion matter:

Who else finds spoiler tags annoying?

I prefer the text color thats the one you can't see unless its quoted. Forgot the number however....

 

[Metatitan]

So is it just me or is Champ like, waaaaaaaay better than all the other sheiks? He does some stuff others don't use, like two jabs to down smash.

 

[Zankoku]

#1f1f1f

Only works if you're running the Revolution skin, though.

and it doesn't look perfect either

 

[momochuu]

Do any of you except Ankoku even use Sheik?

 

[:mad:]

Yeah, I'm usually the victim of some cruel joke by those jerks that use spoiler tags.

Spoiler

They usually write something along the lines of "Wow, you just wasted time highlighting this useless piece of text. GG."

@Bunny - I did once.

 

[legion598]

although shiek is now above Ike in the teirs (justice) I think she is capable of far more and shes actually a decent character. BTW I found that she has an interesting advantage, a lot of ppl have no experience on fighting her and dont even know what shes capable of and this has occasionally given me the upper hand in a match especially when u pull out a DACUS and their like WTF! -dead-

 

[SuSa]

So is it just me or is Champ like, waaaaaaaay better than all the other sheiks? He does some stuff others don't use, like two jabs to down smash.

So he mixes his game up a lot?

Do any of you except Ankoku even use Sheik?

3rd most used char. Right after Snake and Ganon.

Simply because Sheik is sexy, and Pit gives me a run for my money Snake or Ganon. Sheik's gimp game is too good.

Also Sheik IMO does better against Wario then Snake or Ganon. My other bad matchup.

I just don't come here often.

EDIT:

@Legion

A good player should always have at least some matchup experience. You shouldn't be relying on that to win. Sheik has options, and a good punish and gimp game. I feel she can be a bit higher but her difficulty to use well is a limiting factor. To use her at high levels of play, you actually need to know how to use her...

 

[illinialex24]

Yeah I'm using Revolution, its good enough. And I used Sheik once.

 

[Metatitan]

I used to use sheik, I'm just here cuz alex told me to come watch lol.

 

[legion598]

shiek is my secondary after marth and I also use peach, if u think killing is hard with shiek try using peach 0_0

who here plays pure shiek? without that fat hoe zelda

 

[Zankoku]

I usually don't run Transform, since when Sheik gets momentum she can really keep landing hits until something kills eventually.

It's not that bad, though. Zelda's slow.

 

[East]

Illi and Susa are trolling our board D :

Her dair from really high up so it auto-cancels and leads straight into ftilt.

Her dair... *sigh* what happened...

Sheik's moves as categorized by a pokemon tier list:

Overswarm Used
Jab
Forward Tilt
Down Smash
Up Smash
Neutral Air
Forward Air
Back Air
Needles
Grab
Forward Throw
Back Throw

Borderline
Up Tilt
Side Taunt
Vanish

Under Used
Dash Attack
Down Tilt
Chain

Never Used
Up Throw
Down Throw
Forward Smash
Down Air
Transform

I'm sure there are little nuances some might have with the list. I don't care. It's general.

Spoiler

Look what you've gone and done... you've spoiled it

*EDIT* *Raises hand*... pure Sheik.

 

[SuSa]

Pffft. Did I say use it everytime you happen to be that high up in the air?

 

[Zankoku]

The only situations I've been in that let me autocancel dair was when I was launched up there by some attack. Is there any spot from where you can actually start a dair and autocancel it, without having to get hit by the other guy first?

 

[East]

No, I just miss the old one...

 

[Metatitan]

I miss her Fair from melee

 

[SuSa]

The only situations I've been in that let me autocancel dair was when I was launched up there by some attack. Is there any spot from where you can actually start a dair and autocancel it, without having to get hit by the other guy first?

IIRC (haven't used dair in quite some time) it's like Sonic's/Toon Link's/Other momentum dairs.

It goes on for quite some time, but it does end eventually. Although I don't know if it's exactly like TL's where it goes on for ages and the only time it'd ever cancel is if the momentum part just didn't apply to the move.

I'll test it later today. LMAO I probably am wrong and am thinking it acts like Sonic's dair when it indeed acts like Toon Link's dair.

 

[Zankoku]

Well, it definitely ends at some point - as some guy or other (probably saviorslegacy, he's the only guy silly enough to think of edgeguarding with Sheik dair) noted, you can full-hop from the side platform on BF, dair, and double jump and Vanish back onto the stage, no ledge required for recovery.

As for how early it actually ends.... Yeah. : \
You might be able to pull it off from the top platform of Stadium Grass Form after full-hopping.

 

[SuSa]

I don't think it auto-cancels so much as ends at a perfect time. But if you can do that to edgeguard with then I'll assume it can pseudo-auto-cancel (lol stupid name for it) on stage. And if quick enough you should be able to ftilt.

 

[legion598]

shiek was too easy to use in melee im glad shes a challenging character now

 

[Zankoku]

It works like Sonic's dair, it just takes ****ing forever for it to end.

Best use I've ever found with dair is starting it from way up and then using a bair at the end, so I super-fastfall with an aerial that doesn't have huge landing lag. And the obvious use of getting back on the ground during Stadium 2 wind form, of course.

 

[legion598]

this

tilt lock>auto-cancel strong Nair>chase with Dacus
or
tilt lock> opponent air dodges> weak hit auto canceled Nair> more Ftilts

PWNs

 

[SuSa]

I hear Chain is useless.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUGDi7cwZto&feature=related

I happen to like HRC + relatively easy strats that don't involve TBD jabs.