A Bill by any other name would smell as sweet - Nov 14/15 - Melee, Brawl, Brawl+

[NC-Echo]

Oh and by the way this can in no way count for the PR's.

That would just be plain stupid.

Thats up to Alex, PP, and I, and is in no way up to you.

 

[KillerSOS]

Complain all you want but 6 out of the top 8 at the last tourney used mk at some point and besides that he is in mine and alex's opinion a character warranting a ban.

To be honest killer I am getting kind of tired of the insults you seem to like to throw at me. I am not banning him to fund me, I'm not biased on the pr board and I'm likely not any of the other things you seem to openly flame me with. If you have a complaint take it to me personally with a pm but I am tired of getting publicly flamed by you so do me a favor and lay off. Sorry you feel like you need mk to do well. As soon as you think you can do well without that crutch I hope you will come to tourney.

By the way I the only matches I played MK in I lost. (Winners and Losers Finals)

Learn to play a toon that beats MK. Last time I checked I havn't seen a MK win a tourney in NC. I never said u were biased on the PR boards last time I checked.

Not entering brawl singles or doubles if you are really doing this. And if you want to ban MK you better make if statewide (which wont happen) if you want to put it on the PR's.

 

[stingers]

sushiman won my tourney @.@

bill wants to host an mk banned tourney killer, its whatever...

 

[NC-Echo]

By the way I the only matches I played MK in I lost. (Winners and Losers Finals)

Learn to play a toon that beats MK. Last time I checked I havn't seen a MK win a tourney in NC. I never said u were biased on the PR boards last time I checked.

Not entering brawl singles or doubles if you are really doing this. And if you want to ban MK you better make if statewide (which wont happen) if you want to put it on the PR's.

You used him in doubles to win and I am certain of that, as for singles, you may be telling the truth I didn't watch your matches.

Like I said this doesn't have to do with my problem with mk this has to do with the character being warranting of a ban.

If you don't wanna enter than thats too bad, I assume it means you don't think you'll place well, sorry you don't think your good enough.

And about the pr thing, yea you did say that, last time you felt it necessary to insult me. I believe it was in omni's thread.

 

[stingers]

bill is mk banned in doubles? many people believe wario and/or gaw are better doubles chars then mk, he's not nearly as dominant there...

 

[OmniOstrich]

So from what I understand the cause for banning MK is that 6 of the top8 at the last billfest used MK.

2. Karn (played MK v PP and lost)
3. KillerSOS (played MK v Karn and lost)
4. Duo (played MK v Karn and lost)
5. Flamingo (only successful MK)
7. Mitsurugi (idk specifics about him)
7. Stingers (played MK v Karn and lost)

So 5 players losing with MK warrants banning MK?

EDIT: Also its dumb to say people are afraid of entering bc they dont think they can do well. They probably don't want to support a tournament with rules they dont agree with.

 

[NC-Echo]

See stingers is good enough to not need mk. Thanks for the support stingers whether you agree with me or not.

Omni thats not the reason, its a catalyst to my decision. If you wanna know why he's banned, find the old pro-mk ban thread created by those supporting it in sbr it should be all the information you need.

 

[KillerSOS]

You used him in doubles to win and I am certain of that, as for singles, you may be telling the truth I didn't watch your matches.

Like I said this doesn't have to do with my problem with mk this has to do with the character being warranting of a ban.

If you don't wanna enter than thats too bad, I assume it means you don't think you'll place well, sorry you don't think your good enough.

And about the pr thing, yea you did say that, last time you felt it necessary to insult me. I believe it was in omni's thread.

I used him in doubles because i was getting counter picked, get over that.

I am not entering because my teammate plays MK. You may as well just say you ban Flamingo from coming to tourneys. The fact you ban a toon that isn't winning tourneys makes no sense. You may as well go ahead and ban marth as well.

I don't remember saying that but it is possible.

 

[Shimoru]

I can bring a Wii and brawl copy for sure. I can also bring a TV but only if necessary.

 

[NC-Echo]

You don't think about what you're saying apparently and thats why you don't remember.

He is getting banned in doubles.

Marth isn't ban worthy and the fact that marth wins our tourneys is only because pp is better than everyone else.

Mk is ban worthy and I and Alex stand by that and thats why he is getting banned. Tournament results aren't even important in this argument since its the characters attributes which are getting him banned not his placement in NC.

 

[NC-Echo]

I can bring a Wii and brawl copy for sure. I can also bring a TV but only if necessary.

You'll need to bring a full setup to get the $5 and to get out of the door.

 

[stingers]

i'm curious as to why he's banned in doubles where he isn't dominant...

 

[KillerSOS]

You don't think about what you're saying apparently and thats why you don't remember.

He is getting banned in doubles.

Marth isn't ban worthy and the fact that marth wins our tourneys is only because pp is better than everyone else.

Mk is ban worthy and I and Alex stand by that and thats why he is getting banned. Tournament results aren't even important in this argument since its the characters attributes which are getting him banned not his placement in NC.

Until the SBR bans MK (which they wont) I will not support this decision in any shape or fashion. As far as the evidence shows you are banning MK because you lose to him. The fact that you think he is ban worthy is besides the point. The community as a whole voted to keep him. You are not better than everyone else. This tourney should not effect the PR's due to the fact it doesn't follow established tourney rule sets.

EDIT: Only thing I'm happy about is the fact you used my idea to pay the people for bringing set ups

 

[NC-Echo]

Think what you will but I'll tell you again that he is getting banned because of his attributes and nothing else. Whether it affects the pr's is not even a little bit up to you, it will be discussed by the board.

Killer I have come to realize you don't like me much but if you don't lay off the insults than you won't be allowed at billfest's anymore. I'm getting tired of it so please stop. I have never come out and insulted you without being provoked but I know you cannot say the same thing. If you don't think he should be banned you can argue with me rationally but coming in and telling me this is self-serving is not the way to do it.

I put in all the effort to run billfest's for the communities benefit so I would appreciate it if you just acted a little bit more courteous and a little less rude.

 

[NC-Echo]

Either way I am growing tired of this argument. It was a decision supported by Alex to ban him so perhaps when he gets back he can argue with you but I'm done. He is getting banned at this whether you like it or not and if you choose not to come or enter than thats your own lose.

 

[BEHR]

I rally dont like that Melee is a Sunday. D;

dont know if it will end on a good time thats the only thing im worried about.

So Melee tourney should not end late right Bill?

Now that Brawl is on Sunday I can possibly go to both tourneys now.

 

[KillerSOS]

Think what you will but I'll tell you again that he is getting banned because of his attributes and nothing else. Whether it affects the pr's is not even a little bit up to you, it will be discussed by the board.

Killer I have come to realize you don't like me much but if you don't lay off the insults than you won't be allowed at billfest's anymore. I'm getting tired of it so please stop. I have never come out and insulted you without being provoked but I know you cannot say the same thing. If you don't think he should be banned you can argue with me rationally but coming in and telling me this is self-serving is not the way to do it.

I put in all the effort to run billfest's for the communities benefit so I would appreciate it if you just acted a little bit more courteous and a little less rude.

Don't worry we have something brewing at State. I'm not being rude I'm just asking for a non vague answer as to exactly what proves that you should ban MK. Tourney results don't support your claim. Don't go point at that thread on banning him as that would actually prove the opposite.

I really do like you as a person... just not as much as a TO to be honest. Call it a Business disagreement.

EDIT: Thats fine if you want to call it quits on the arugment. You didn't prove your point at all as you have no solid evidence to back it up. You can ban him at your own tourney but don't expect anyone to put much stock in the results.

 

[stingers]

I really do love <3 you as a person... just not as much as a TO to be honest. Call it a Business disagreement.

yeah i think that sums up my feelings perfectly

legalize mk in doubles bill :3 you know i can't win without mk

 

[TheLastCacely]

Man no mk! ****, our states gonna suck if we dont get the tourney practice against them.
I dont think our mk's are that good anyway, if they played mk like dojo or m2k, then we would have a problem... Wait, who hear mains him besides the flaming ho?

 

[NC-Echo]

Don't worry we have something brewing at State. I'm not being rude I'm just asking for a non vague answer as to exactly what proves that you should ban MK. Tourney results don't support your claim. Don't go point at that thread on banning him as that would actually prove the opposite.

I really do like you as a person... just not as much as a TO to be honest. Call it a Business disagreement.

If you like me as a person than in the future please be nicer and more respectful.

He is getting banned because he is a character which warrants a ban, read the thread and if you still disagree than in my opinion you're wrong. But your entitled to your own opinion. Either way, sorry you think you need the crutch.

 

[DJRome]

I can bring a setup, maybe 2

 

[stingers]

keith i'll mm you with mk

i'll mm anyone in nc with mk...karn, duo, get at me

 

[theAPExp]

i dunno why you guys are getting so upset over this

the TO makes w/e rules he wants
you don't agree with em, take em up privately
you don't like the rules and don't want to play, don't play nuff said

you guys forget
it's just a game...

 

[stingers]

ape when did you get so smart

 

[-ACE-]

daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn

The place I work at isn't open on Sunday for the rest of the season

 

[TheLastCacely]

keith i'll mm you with mk

i'll mm anyone in nc with mk...karn, duo, get at me

boy my snake took 2 stocks off m2k, u stand no chance.

 

[stingers]

alright how much

 

[theAPExp]

i'd mm your mk stingers
but i'd hardcore plank you the whole set
and i don't think it's worth the dying inside

 

[OmniOstrich]

As soon as you think you can do well without that crutch I hope you will come to tourney.

If you don't wanna enter than thats too bad, I assume it means you don't think you'll place well, sorry you don't think your good enough.

Either way, sorry you think you need the crutch.

Three times you made direct attacks on Killer, just thought I would point that out since apparently you dont make direct attacks at people.

 

[stingers]

my anti-planking game has gotten so good with the hours of friendlies i've played with you ape

yes, hours of friendlies
improved my anti-planking game

friendlies

ape is a douche

 

[theAPExp]

the best part about it is
is i'm not planking you full out
cause i know they're friendlies

and i need to work on the nonplanking part

you grab the ledge more than me
in almost all our games

 

[stingers]

i grab the ledge more because i need to get you off

>.>

well

its mostly the drill rush actually

i love drill rush

 

[Dr Peepee]

Stongers, I'll seriously your MK. I need the practice.

 

[theAPExp]

i need to work on the drill rush
just for the hell of it


i think my mk's gettin better just the same

 

[stingers]

alright how much pp

ape you dont need to work on drill rush i'm the only mk in the world outside of m2k that uses drill rush seriously lol

 

[Foxy]

The ban isn't a good idea at all.

I've always been a strong supporter of the MK-ban philosophy, because attribute-wise he IS ban-worthy. However, I still think this is a bit ridiculous.

Why? BANNING MK WILL NOT AFFECT THIS TOURNAMENT AT ALL.

In some regions with incredible MK players who dominate, bans are a bit more important, but nobody plays MK at a top level in NC and everyone good has posted saying "I don't need MK". As Omni pointed out already, MK barely affected the last Billfest, with the only exception being Flamingo, and one player placing high doesn't mean that a ban in any way will make the competition and results more valid based on player skill.

Now, I normally wouldn't have a problem with the TO's just maturely saying "this is our tournament, we have agreed on these rules, and you can come and play if you want to." However... these kinds of resolutions are inappropriate in a situation with this much money on the line. Obviously we never talk too seriously about the cash in smash, but with a really large Brawl tournament like a Billfest, the rule changes NOTHING about the tournament except guarantees the FEW MK players we have in NC that they will make no money at all.

And of course, smash isn't a job, and nobody is counting on the money, but in the end you must face the fact that the rule, theoretically justifiable, in reality will only have one function: potentially rob two or three players (AT MOST) of a chance at money.

As a smash player, you can look at things theoretically and like me support the MK ban based on his attributes.

But when it comes to being a TO, it becomes much more important to make decisions not based on theoretical practice, but only on what definitive and tangible influences the rule or decision will have on the tournament or community. And in this case, the rule is not making the competition more fair than it was, it is not guaranteeing players a better experience, and it is not going to affect results beyond 1 or 2 players; it IS taking money from a few players, it IS placing an unnecessary and arbitrary limitation on a tournament series that has so far had no trouble with MK, and it IS possibly going to save some mains with terrible matchups with MK from a loss they could possibly experience by meeting up with a gay MK (really not meaning anything personal on this one, it goes for other Olimars like Killer or some other characters).

Anyways, that's my thoughts, I'm not going to make any personal jabs and I don't think there's any point for that sort of argument, I just like talking facts.

 

[TheLastCacely]

alright how much

yo love.... mmmmmmmm

 

[stingers]

And of course, smash isn't a job, and nobody is counting on the money, but in the end you must face the fact that the rule, theoretically justifiable, in reality will only have one function: potentially rob two or three players (AT MOST) of a chance at money

it gives other players a chance, which is what bill is going for

fair? no. but its bills tourney and he can do it if he wants...dont bother arguing it lolllll

 

[Dr Peepee]

No money. Just need matches. Don't sandbag me.

 

[mr.fizwidget]

ok so just so i get this straight...

brawl is on sat...

the date is not going to conflict with rom2...

mk is banned in singles and doubles...

you get paid for bringing a setup...

interesting...we should use custom stages while we are experimenting...