Zelda's Personal Matchup Thread

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I think the one thing that destroyed this thread is the word "personal". Anecdotal proof is great and all that but seriously?

well I suppose that all depends on what the point of the thread actually was in the first place...

 

[Alacion]

Like... the thread was pretty accurate for a personal matchup thread until the +4 King Dedede and +6 Olimar popped up.

 

[MechaWave]

It's a ****ing joke, Courier. God damn.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Like... the thread was pretty accurate for a personal matchup thread until the +4 King Dedede and +6 Olimar popped up.

to be fair, I believe the +6 Vs. Olimar was meant sarcastically to illustrate the problem that popped up with DeDeDe

 

[Alacion]

This whole thread is a joke. I'm done here.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

for some reason, I imagine Courier dropping the mic as he leaves

 

[MechaWave]

This whole thread is a joke. I'm done here.

y so srs? D=

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

This whole thread is a joke. I'm done here.

Normally I'd get at fuujin for posting gifs. but this one is sooooo appropriate. LoL.

 

[Chuee]

Normally I'd get at fuujin for posting gifs. but this one is sooooo appropriate. LoL.

>appropriate
>most used meme
nope.avi

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I agree. justification fail

 

[JigglyZelda003]

edit: i think campy olimar is unwinnable imo. deals too much damage and walls her out of everything. o down b we love uuu the only saving grave is having him offstage. i think once he's knocked into the air/offstage she has to be on to him like a tramp on chips with successful godly reads otherwise it's game over.

If only we didn't have to dread going into the matchup expecting the camp fest. i played an Oli on wifi a few weeks ago who i got to at least move a bit closer to me(to better pivot on my landings) because i refused to run to him and just opted to Nair all pikmin.....but thats about as much as we can get him to move.

-3
knowing pikmin properties and the order they are in is important since it really helps alot.

in addition to Usmash shutting down consistent Nair use there's also the chance of being Faired and in some cases upB after a pikmin toss. Its like Olimar was just made to show Sakurai's hate for Zelda.

other options to get in is the old airdodge>dtilt when he is near lock percents. like empty short hop rather than Nair and land outside of his Usmash range.

does anyone know how good is jabbing pikmin? w/ the exception of purple ones it could be useful if you predict a sideB>Fair movement. jab the pikmin and then Dash attack the Fair, or Usmash.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

-4

Why is this a discussion and why is there a +6?

What the hell is a +6?

 

[MechaWave]

It's called a STFU post. You're supposed to COMPLETELY IGNORE it. DO NOT acknowledge its existence in the thread.

If you do, you'll turn out to be like Courier where everyone goes like STFU.

Okay? Seriously, the stupidity of the people actually taking that post into consideration is breathtaking.

 

[AyatoK26]

Ok everyone. I thinks it's time to grow the **** up and just move on to the next character. We've only had one post about a MU in the past 12 posts (I have my page set on 40 posts/page so you all may see differently from how I do). Talking about one of the most one-sided MU's in the game should have had all of us say -4 or -3, with maybe 2-3 of us actually saying what we can do against Oli in case the player is that bad at the MU, and then move on onto the next MU.

No offense to anyone in particular but this is taking too long.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Ok everyone. I thinks it's time to grow the **** up and just move on to the next character. We've only had one post about a MU in the past 12 posts (I have my page set on 40 posts/page so you all may see differently from how I do). Talking about one of the most one-sided MU's in the game should have had all of us say -4 or -3, with maybe 2-3 of us actually saying what we can do against Oli in case the player is that bad at the MU, and then move on onto the next MU.

No offense to anyone in particular but this is taking too long.

surely you can bring up the next MU with out screaming at everyone and telling them to grow up ? I mean if you want others to be mature maybe you yourself should conduct oneself in that manner and IDK do something crazy such as leading by example. Getting back to the MU thing again it's something you yourself can do so why wait on someone to bring it up. Once again if the discussion is moving to slow for you or you don't like the way it's going why not IDK do something crazy like changing the pace of the discussion yourself. Instead of screaming for other people to step up IDK maybe something crazy and do it your self. Just a crazy suggestion that I had.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

 

[Fluttershy]

I haven't had much time getting online as much... i'll update this thread when i'm not on my PSP

 

[Fluttershy]

finally been able to get on now
IC are up

 

[Fuujin]

inb4 0 or -1

 

[Alacion]

-4. Nuff said.

That SSDI thing Ed brought up really destroys Zelda. Having tried my hand at IC myself, I can say Zelda is by far one of the easiest characters to chaingrab.

Din's may be helpful since it won't clash but desynched ice blocks and/or blizzard makes it hard for Zelda to do anything at all.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

It's not worse than Sheik, but it's still rly bad.

-3

All you can do is spam smash attacks and hope Nana drops her shield, then you run and bair her.

And then Sopo will destroy you. Somehow.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

I haven't played against any that can do that SSDI thing, so, last I played it was actually not a bad matchup, at all . . . in fact, it was pretty close to even and was the #1 reason all shiek players should also be able to play Zelda . . . . . then this SSDI thing happened and now there's not even a reason to do that anymore . . . *groan*

 

[AlanHaTe]

SSDI?!

I kind of read about it but still don't get it right... is that this? (without computer habilities)

and well IC's haven't been that bad for me(except when they grab me) and it's actually a fact that Zelda is super easy to CG... even I can do it... and apparently if we hit their shield with something that actually pushes them they go to far because they slide too much(2nd to luigi) so they can't grab that easily(I was told that)

-2 or -3 for me in my exp

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Yup, that's it Alan.......makes me sad.

I used to enjoy tormenting ICs lol. Now they haunt me.....I say -2/-3 because we still have some good tools and factor in player error on the fact that ISSDI isn't the easiest thing to do and if they mess it up, they eat Fsmash. However, once it starts working for them, we are sad. -2/-3 is incredibly optimistic for me. Realistically, I would probably say -3 so let's go with that.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

without that SSDI thing i would be saying -2, but thanks to that i guess its -3 now.......
i guess this will be another matchup i'll be going to peach/JP for..........

can we Dtilt Iceblocks? also outside of smash spam what else do we have going for us Scary?

 

[#HBC | Scary]

We can but otherwise, we don't have too much going for us. They cover our landings so well so we really cannot do much with that. Only thing we got working for us is that we can kill Nana early should we have them apart. This has truly become a messed up MU for us

 

[Mocha]

I don't like this matchup. It basically feels like using a 'wifi Zelda' spamming nothing but Din's Fire and F-smash, which, as mentioned, isn't even that safe. If you're on FD with them then... may Nayru bless your soul. Try to prevent from lagging on any of your moves as much as you can, especially within grab range. If you manage to separate Nana, try and keep her off stage/kill her if possible. She dies stupidly early.

And yes we can down tilt ice blocks, but they have to be well-timed. Her f-smash also blocks ice blocks. Don't ever use Nayru's Love in this MU (not even to block ice blocks) unless you've made some reads on them and you're absolutely certain it will hit. Even then, I wouldn't risk it. Nayru's Love can stop their Blizzard, but I'd still be very wary about bothering with it - better to run away instead and shoot Din's.

Aerial cancels can actually help a lot in spacing/avoiding being grabbed/mixing it up if you know what you're doing. If you're always landing with an air dodge or always in a certain way, they can try to pick up on this and try to punish with a grab. Fighting IC's is more or less like this, depending on how close they are to you:

Far away: Din's fire. Watch out for Ice Blocks, but don't worry about them too much if they hit you a few times. They'll take more damage from Din's then you getting hit by a couple of their blocks, unless you keep messing up the timing.

Mid range: Din's is still viable, but don't charge it for too long. Short ranged Din's can work here, just watch your eyes for the inevitable grab approach.

Kind of close: F-smash. If they try to SSDI and attempt to grab you, immediately follow up with either a spot dodge (risky, but it's better than just leaving yourself open for a grab), or you can try another F-smash or D-smash (also risky, they may expect it and try to shield grab). An alternative option entirely for you is to mix in D-tilt from a reasonable range or run away. If you're cornered, 'aerial run away' by aerial canceling away from them.

Very close: Run away or aerial cancel away. If you absolutely have no option but to attack, your best hope F-smash, D-smash (or even riskier Jab, D-tilt, and Nayru's) will hit and leave you an opening to either follow-up or run away.

Farore's Wind is like a curse on us for this MU, especially if we don't land directly on the ground. I know it's easier said than done, but try to avoid getting knocked off stage/forced to recover as much as you can. Farore's Wind is almost a free grab for them, especially if they know well how the move works.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

what about Ftilt from max range? it has a little pushback that most characters have to dashgrab OoS to really be able to grab Zelda after it.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Basically "wi-fi Zelda" is the only thing we can do.

Spam dem f-smashes. They're our safest option.

Retreating Din's and hope Nana is stupid.

Solo IC is easy though. lol

 

[RaqTasmeneth]

To my knowledge IC's will be competing with you for the ground since that is their throne. Does luv jump get negated by ice blocks? (Spot dodging through them doesnt count.) If so I agree with the -3 crowd.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I got to play a lot with 2-D Jeff today and I actually did really well Zelda vs. ICs. That being said, I think I still stand by the -3 but its wavering a tad to -2. We gotta try and keep it mid to long range. MUST!

 

[Fluttershy]

Marth is up

 

[Kataefi]

this is awful for me =(

i find dash attack useful occasionally but it's too slow to use reliably! SDI out of dancing blade if you can. you can nayru's OoS between certain hits and intercept! i try to edgehog his recovery and kick him if he lands. this is the one punishment i think is great against him.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

Marth's managable......

he makes me wish Zelda had an Air attack w/ Fsmash range and normal jab recovery.....

like Kata said DashA is useful sometimes, like on a blocked Fair. you might be able to dash in and hit him as he tried to move away OoS. outside of that DashA insn't that great as it leaves Zelda's open too much.

other than that its more like trying to rely on OoS tactics. Marths smashes are kinda unsafe on block (seems this way in my exp) so remember to take advantage of that as Marths who are really on point w/ their spacing are hard to get in on. try to avoid getting knocked up in the air and juggled. Martha has a field day just whipping Zelda up and down once he gets her in the sky

i don't really have a good explainable strategy i just kind of do what i need to to try and win. i feel a -2

 

[Fluttershy]

might have the rest of the characters go at the same time to speed things up. And since the other Guide completed the Strategies of the characters just put the ratio of what you feel is correct. (W/O having a troll ratio)

 

[NJel]

Zelda v. Link

On the topic of Zelda v. Link,

I can't say I've had too many problems with Link; of course, I haven't gone up against real professionals either, so I haven't had a chance to put my money where my mouth is. I've come to find that Link's bombs can be caught/thrown back, or simply reflected off of Naryu's Love.

I like to mind-game Link with Farore's Wind at the right moments. Teleporting is fun! :D And Zelda has LETHAL tilt attacks. She's a primary anti-air character, and punishes projectile spammers. It boils down to the fact though that to use Zelda effectively, you have to master both her AND Sheik, and Sheik is generally favorable against most characters from what I've seen--able to hold her own v High and Top Tier characters.

If you main as Zelda though, you better be a master at accuracy and timing, because your matchups v elite characters are going to be much tougher.

 

[Fuujin]

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

been a while, but last time I played a marth, it seemed terrible for zelda.

maybe 35:65?

Dat poke.... Zelda can't deal with dat poke

 

[Fluttershy]

Kind of what this to be finished and since the other thread started at the top just put the MU ratio (that is IYO)

Wario
Falco
Diddy Kong
Snake
and MK
are up

 

[Alacion]

-2,-3,-3,-3/-4,-4