Guide Zelda Social: But also the FE Heroes Internet Cafe

[「 Derk 」]

Yep, Zelda is so much better in doubles. She has such a hard time in singles if you cant force your opponent to approach you. Being able to follow up your partner to land kill moves makes her a lot scarier. Doubles is more fun also!

 

[Lozjam]

Heya!

I like the Ganondorf to Zelda comparison. Ganondorf does kill easier, combo better, and weighs a lot more but we have less startup lag than a lot of his moveset! And we have ranged pressure, for what it's worth.

Actually sort of incorrect.... On Ganondorf's aerials he has either the same, or less startup lag than Zelda. Ftilt has a little bit more lag, than Zelda's, and for the most part, Ganondorfs tilts out ranges Zelda's. The only thing I really think Zelda has over Ganondorf is mobility, the ability to use and deal with projectiles, and a usable and good grab game.

Yep that CF game was just not for me lmao sucks because if I made it to GFs vs dabuz odds are I would have used Zelda again or/and Robin. Yea Zelda in doubles is pretty good since I can just offstage do stuff and can sometimes rely on my partner if I need any. Thanks though guys! @ Lozjam IMO I think Zelda is like mid of midtier or so at least

I do not doubt you, but can you explain why, and why a lot of other Zelda mains haver seen a lot of success? I think if you can explain to the Zelda mains as to what they are doing wrong, more people will be inclined to play Zelda.

 

[2004Zilla]

There. Are. Too. Many. Marios. On FOR GLORY.

 

[ZombieBran]

I think Nairo is just really good at the game and could take Mii Swordfighter and win if he wanted to. Is there anyone who Nairo beat as Zelda that is really close to him in skill level and used a percieved top or high tier?

Actually sort of incorrect.... On Ganondorf's aerials he has either the same, or less startup lag than Zelda. Ftilt has a little bit more lag, than Zelda's, and for the most part, Ganondorfs tilts out ranges Zelda's. The only thing I really think Zelda has over Ganondorf is mobility, the ability to use and deal with projectiles, and a usable and good grab game.

Oh right, he has a much better aerial game than Zelda. Zelda's aerials are all situational (though d-air is still great regardless) so I was mostly just thinking about their ground moves. I'd definitely take Ganondorf's D-tilt over Zelda's new one.

But I'd rather keep our U-tilt

 

[UkeNicky]

I'd definitely take Ganondorf's D-tilt over Zelda's new one.

But I'd rather keep our U-tilt

I think our Dtilt is great as is, it's fast, good combo potential and dirty edge guard since it hits beneath the ledge.

Utilt I don't really know about though. I do love the fact that it's a combo tool and can lead to lots of easy damage at low % but I just never land it xD
can you combo into Utilt somehow?

 

[Alacion]

Hm what to do against Sonic and ZSS that only spam down b. I'm bad

 

[KuroganeHammer]

a better question

ZSS who spams grab

seriously, what do you do against this as ANY character?

It's impossible to react to and it lasts forever

 

[Alacion]

Roll away?

I think I will play a bunch of Sonic to understand how he works

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I roll away but it lasts too long so I get grabbed anyway

 

[IsmaR]

Shield/roll/spotdodge/jump are your friends.

Sometimes if you're quick enough, jab or use neutral B to "trade" (you still get grabbed but it breaks immediately).

 

[Berserker.]

Spot dodge works for me almost all the time. If you're too close to ZSS and she tries to go for the grab, don't roll backward

 

[IsmaR]

Shield for down B, spotdodge for grabs, roll for...fun, I guess, and jump once you realize the ground hates you.

 

[ZombieBran]

I know that the pink puffballs can just duck to avoid ZSS' grab.

 

[Rizen]

Puff ducking OP, Sakurai pls patch.
/jk

I noticed shielding is slower in SSB4 than Brawl. I keep trying to PS at the last second and getting hit.

 

[ZombieBran]

Yeah shields were nerfed from Brawl

THANK. F-ING. GOD.

 

[Alphatron]

Confession time. Before I got the game, I read some posts here and assumed that Fuijin was a troll because of how much he bashed Zelda. I was convinced that she couldn't be this bad. But then I got the game and it didn't take me a week to realize how badly she got destroyed and how little she got in exchange.

I've asked this before, but I really don't know what to do against good Shulk players as Zelda. It's really hard for me to keep him back or get close to him when I want to. Faore's wind isn't even a safe recovery against jump Monado. Being in the air at all is unsafe because I can't challenge nair.

I know that the pink puffballs can just duck to avoid ZSS' grab.

And Game and Watch!

 

[Rickster]

Yeah shields were nerfed from Brawl

THANK. F-ING. GOD.

What about the depletion rate? It's waaay slower than Brawl's.
------------------
Sorry, I don't know much about Shulk. I struggle a bit too. He's kinda like a faster Ike that can change his strengths and weaknesses.

 

[Berserker.]

I don't know how to deal with him with Zelda but the general strategy is to memorize his strengths, weaknesses and playstyle variations with the different arts. Speed Shulk can do anything basically. Jump Shulk can dance around stage and go in when the time is right. Buster can dish out damage while the hits are safe on shield. Smash art is purely for KO'ing. Shield is sort of free but at early percentages, Shulk can get out of most combos. The only weakness that stays constant is the lag on his attacks. Baiting Shulk into using vision also works

Another tip: Multi-hitting attacks gain a lot of mileage out of Shulk's damage-defense nerfs. Shulk's lowered weight is taken advantage of by high-knockback attacks. A misconception with Jump Shulk is that his weight is directly lessened but it isn't as far as I've seen or read

 

[ZombieBran]

What about the depletion rate? It's waaay slower than Brawl's.
------------------
Sorry, I don't know much about Shulk. I struggle a bit too. He's kinda like a faster Ike that can change his strengths and weaknesses.

Shields!

I wouldn't put Ike down that badly anymore. He has ridiculously powerful combos and individual attacks whereas Shulk has to give himself new weaknesses in order to compete with Ike's damage/KO power. Of course Shulk does have Jump and Speed arts so lol.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

@ Alphatron

you have to fight shulk like brawl marth, trust your shield on the approach, and work on being as fast as possible to anything he may lag with like dsmash or bad spacing.

challenging him in the air isn't easy, but its nit impossible, you just don't want to do it often. Try aerial spaced phantom. Or just walk and mess with his spacing in the air by walking into shield

 

[Rickster]

Shields!

I wouldn't put Ike down that badly anymore. He has ridiculously powerful combos and individual attacks whereas Shulk has to give himself new weaknesses in order to compete with Ike's damage/KO power. Of course Shulk does have Jump and Speed arts so lol.

Well I was meaning more his range is similar to Ike. But yeah don't sleep on Ike lol. A friend of mine mains him (Brawl too) and can really put in work with him. Jab too stronk.
And thanks for the link!

EDIT: Well that data explains why I sometimes roll instead of dash OoS. I knew something was different, since I never did that in Brawl.

 

[Alacion]

Shulk is great but what about that Sanic

Way harder for Zelda. Everybody's like grab more but they never connect qq

Gnites

 

[JigglyZelda003]

grab more what? Its hard enough to get near sonic let alone grab him even without my janky controls lol.

sonic is dumb, almost dumber than yoshi

 

[Rizen]

Sonic really got buffed. He's much more flexible with his options than he was in Brawl (jerk).

 

[ZombieBran]

Well I was meaning more his range is similar to Ike. But yeah don't sleep on Ike lol. A friend of mine mains him (Brawl too) and can really put in work with him. Jab too stronk.

I've been using Ike a bit more ever since page 89 (haha). I remember early on during the beginning of SSB4, when the 3DS version had just been released that I actually thought Zelda might be better than Ike. She's not at all =(

 

[Rickster]

I've been using Ike a bit more ever since page 89 (haha). I remember early on during the beginning of SSB4, when the 3DS version had just been released that I actually thought Zelda might be better than Ike. She's not at all =(

Yeah he gets all these awesome buffs in 1.0.4.

Meanwhile we are killing it with our 0.7% utilt buff.

 

[ZombieBran]

Oh yeah the patch helped too. Even before then I think he was considerably a better character despite not noticing it (and many people putting him as bottom tier back then).

 

[Salad Bowl]

For sonic, spam the phantom since it slows his approach the spin dash. Try to get grabs a lot and throw him offstage and spike since he has a linear recover. The matchup would be easier if she a high priority sex kick like jiggs, mario, and luigi.

 

[evmaxy54]

Completely unrelated any discussion going on ITT

But we have made about 89 pages of posts since the start of December to now. :3

 

[Salad Bowl]

That's when I joined. You guys can thank me later

 

[evmaxy54]

"Joined: Dec 16, 2014"

Data says otherwise my dearest sister

 

[Salad Bowl]

@ GameAngel64 wanna play?

 

[GameAngel64]

I made a room. But just a couple matches. Also I HATE Zelda dittos. >_<

 

[SBphiloz4]

For now, I don't see Shulk being that bad of an MU, as most people just plain out suck at using him. But he definitely brings lots of mayhem to Zelda on paper. God, that Smash mode really hurts. One miss, and an Ftilt kills you early. He has good aerial control and spacing tools too--

... At least when he's in Smash mode, you can take him to the elevator for the kill starting at around 35%. :3

 

[Berserker.]

I think in my 2 days of For Glory, I've seen enough Back slashes for one day. Other than that, most FG Shulks seem to think that Shulk is some sort of Meta Knight in buster stance or shield

Also, the Smash social thread... Dayum. Well, that happened

 

[GameAngel64]

@ Salad Bowl Wow dude you did awesome. I can't believe Jiggs got two rests on me...

 

[Salad Bowl]

I made a room. But just a couple matches. Also I HATE Zelda dittos. >_<

GGs ur use of Nayru was great. Your grab timing was great too.

 

[SBphiloz4]

Also, the Smash social thread... Dayum. Well, that happened

Oh my. What happened? :^)

Noob Shulks are waaaay too easy to deal with, haha.

 

[Salad Bowl]

Oh my. What happened? :^)

Noob Shulks are waaaay too easy to deal with, haha.

Wanna play?

 

[Berserker.]

Oh my. What happened? :^)

Noob Shulks are waaaay too easy to deal with, haha.

I'll avoid the name search to be safe but seems like one of them regulars tried to pick a fight with the mod. Aerodrome had to intervene but I don't know if it had any effect

I second that about the noob Shulks haha