You get no Sympathy in a "Fire Emblem Discussion"

[DMurr]

I think the conversation here should really start focusing on what we think Intelligent Systems wants to do as far as characters go. I'm assuming that, since the fans are pretty divided on which Fire Emblem character(s) should be added or possibly removed, that Sakurai probably can't decide easily either and asked IS for their input again for this game.

Do we see anything that could possibly show indication of what IS likes the best? Lyn was an assist trophy in Brawl and received DLC in Awakening. Ike has pretty much all bases covered, including DLC, shown in the SMTxFE reveal, the SpotPass descendant of him in Priam, being playable in Brawl, etc. Beisdes Ike, Marth is everywhere also.

I don't think we can really say anything about a stage revealing a playable character. That's like saying Eldin Bridge's reveal demanded a playable character from Twilight Princess, which we didn't get in Midna or Zant or whatever. We've not really seen a situation like this, so I don't think it's safe to call it, even if a character from FE:Awakening is completely possible or likely.

 

[•Col•]

I honestly don't see Sakurai going to IS this time asking them who to put in this time. I feel like he has a good feel for Fire Emblem now.

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

I have this feeling that Marth/Lucina, Ike/Chrom, Chrom and Ike play the same, Marth and Lucina play the same, the catch here Chrom and Lucina will be in the 3DS version while Ike and Marth will be in the Wii U version, maybe you can unlock them as alternate costume on the Wii U and 3DS, let's say it's part of the connectivity between 3DS and Wii U :D...it will solve alot of problems if it was that way...and I love how Sakurai is going with that where he is differentiating console and handheld stages...

or you can have them this way the 4 of them in the game:

Ike being Ike

Marth being Marth

Chrom being a slower Marth (basically Roy)

Lucina being a faster Ike....

I think this idea has no basis but it just popped into my head..

 

[Curious Villager]

I have this feeling that Marth/Lucina, Ike/Chrom, Chrom and Ike play the same, Marth and Lucina play the same, the catch here Chrom and Lucina will be in the 3DS version while Ike and Marth will be in the Wii U version, maybe you can unlock them as alternate costume on the Wii U and 3DS, let's say it's part of the connectivity between 3DS and Wii U :D...it will solve alot of problems if it was that way...and I love how Sakurai is going with that where he is differentiating console and handheld stages...

or you can have them this way the 4 of them in the game:

Ike being Ike

Marth being Marth

Chrom being a slower Marth (basically Roy)

Lucina being a faster Ike....

I think this idea has no basis but it just popped into my head..

I think Sakurai said yesterday that both games will be having the same library of characters. So if Chrom gets in, he will be in both the 3DS and Wii U version. Same for the other lords.

 

[FalKoopa]

Yeah, both games will have the same roster, which is a good thing.

 

[Ussi]

I think the best shot Lucina has in getting in is being Chrom's final smash where she pairs up and is an invincible Nana for Chrom and has a 100% dual attack rate

 

[Knight Dude]

I'm not too big on the Fire Emblem series. But I do see Chrom as a very likely choice. The only thing I worry about is Ike staying or not. It's very possible that we'll have two Fire Emblem reps as we've always have, and no doubt we will likely play as Marth again. With Chrom taking any possible priority that may exists. But if we do have more than two reps, then I can see Ike staying, otherwise it'll be Marth and Chrom in SSBU/SSB3D.

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

Sakurai said they will have the same number....I don't know about same character....think of Chrom and Ike, Lucina and Marth as the same character....let's say they have the same skeleton but different skin...

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

“The reality of the situation unfortunately is that there are certain limitations on the 3DS, so we’re forced into the situation where we may need to reduce some characters to a certain degree. But we’re really working hard in order to include as many characters as possible.”

-Masahiro Sakurai

source: http://kotaku.com/dont-expect-a-lot-of-third-party-characters-in-the-nex-513203533

that doesn't sound too good for the roster...

 

[TheTuninator]

I think we're going to see an Awakening rep for sure, with hopefully a bump to 3 slots and Ike staying. If Sakurai were to ask IS who he should put in, I imagine they would say an Awakening rep. Awakening's already a big hit; combine that with IS's trend of suggesting inclusion of their most recent Lord and an Awakening rep seems the most likely suggestion to come from them.

My personal prediction for priority of character inclusion runs as follows:

Marth > Awakening rep > Ike > Roy > Everyone else

I don't see Roy coming back, but Ike has a good chance of returning.

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

I think we're going to see an Awakening rep for sure, with hopefully a bump to 3 slots and Ike staying. If Sakurai were to ask IS who he should put in, I imagine they would say an Awakening rep. Awakening's already a big hit; combine that with IS's trend of suggesting inclusion of their most recent Lord and an Awakening rep seems the most likely suggestion to come from them.

My personal prediction for priority of character inclusion runs as follows:

Marth > Awakening rep > Ike > Roy > Everyone else

I don't see Roy coming back, but Ike has a good chance of returning.

Awakening Rep is something they would really consider....Sakurai need to acknowledge the powerful of Fire Emblem character in SSB. I really think Fire Emblem characters are among the top 10 liked Characters in SSB.

 

[•Col•]

inb4 Ike is cut cuz of 3DS roster limitations and Sakurai just [laughs] "Some characters HAD to be cut. How else would I fit in characters like Mii/WiiFitTrainer/Villager?" :/

If you're going to have a very limited roster for a game(based on restrictions you made for yourself), don't start taking out characters people want or would like to add essentially troll characters like Pichu was.

 

[DMurr]

I'll have to go back and listen to it again, but as far as I was aware, Sakurai said that both games will have the same NUMBER of characters.. not the same characters. It stood out to me because that doesn't mean they're necessarily the same characters. It's possible that they're setting it up so that the 3DS version will follow handheld games and Wii U version follow console games, and then the connectivity will let you mix between.

So the idea that Marth and Ike would be in the Wii U version and Lucina (or Roy/Lyn/whatever other GBA version character you want) and Chrom would be in the 3DS version doesn't sound that far fetched to me. Also, if you notice (although I'm sure that it's there for speculation), Wii Fit Trainer and Villager aren't confirmed for the 3DS version.. only Megaman, which, being a guest character, makes sense to be featured in both games.

Also, since Sakurai has always been a big Fire Emblem fan, I would think he probably has a hard time deciding characters from there too because he likes a lot of them.. which is, I assume, he asked IS last time who they wanted him to put, instead of him putting in who he wants and giving us Navarre (who he's stated as his favorite FE character.. even though that could have changed now).


EDIT:
Here's what he said:
(Talking about the 3DS version) "The total number of characters is the same as the Wii U version, but some of the stages will be completely different."
Take for that what you will.

 

[Frostwraith]

I'll have to go back and listen to it again, but as far as I was aware, Sakurai said that both games will have the same NUMBER of characters.. not the same characters. It stood out to me because that doesn't mean they're necessarily the same characters. It's possible that they're setting it up so that the 3DS version will follow handheld games and Wii U version follow console games, and then the connectivity will let you mix between.

So the idea that Marth and Ike would be in the Wii U version and Lucina (or Roy/Lyn/whatever other GBA version character you want) and Chrom would be in the 3DS version doesn't sound that far fetched to me. Also, if you notice (although I'm sure that it's there for speculation), Wii Fit Trainer and Villager aren't confirmed for the 3DS version.. only Megaman, which, being a guest character, makes sense to be featured in both games.

Also, since Sakurai has always been a big Fire Emblem fan, I would think he probably has a hard time deciding characters from there too because he likes a lot of them.. which is, I assume, he asked IS last time who they wanted him to put, instead of him putting in who he wants and giving us Navarre (who he's stated as his favorite FE character.. even though that could have changed now).


EDIT:
Here's what he said:
(Talking about the 3DS version) "The total number of characters is the same as the Wii U version, but some of the stages will be completely different."
Take for that what you will.

It has already been confirmed by Sakurai that both versions will have the same roster.

 

[Fire Emblemier]

Wii Fit Trainer and Villager aren't confirmed for the 3DS version.. only Megaman, which, being a guest character, makes sense to be featured in both games.

Why wouldn't Villager be confirmed for the 3DS, wasn't New Leaf released recently.

 

[DMurr]

It has already been confirmed by Sakurai that both versions will have the same roster.

Darn, okay. Yeah, I see that now. Was so excited haha. I wonder how they'll be connected then.

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

It has already been confirmed by Sakurai that both versions will have the same roster.

source?

 

[FalKoopa]

source?

It's in the same source you posted, right below the line where he talks of the 3DS's limitations.

source: http://kotaku.com/dont-expect-a-lot-of-third-party-characters-in-the-nex-513203533

 

[Frostwraith]

It's in the same source you posted, right below the line where he talks of the 3DS's limitations.

This.

"The reality of the situation unfortunately is that there are certain limitations on the 3DS," Sakurai said. The 3DS and Wii U versions of the next Smash Bros will have the same library of characters.

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

This.

It's highly possible that they misinterpreted him specially that they didn't put it on quote which is possible they are under the impression from the video. but who knows....

 

[•Col•]

It's highly possible that they misinterpreted him specially that they didn't put it on quote which is possible they are under the impression from the video. but who knows....

If they were to quote Sakurai, it would be in Japanese. Meaning when translated to English it could have a different meaning.

That being said, it makes more sense to have the same roster for both games. Because why would he point out that 3DS limitations could limit the size of the roster of both games? If you're were to have different character rosters for the games anyway, why would he want to limit the Wii U just to keep the same number of characters as the 3DS version? What, does Sakurai have OCD?

 

[xXIke-SamaXx]

If they were to quote Sakurai, it would be in Japanese. Meaning when translated to English it could have a different meaning.

That being said, it makes more sense to have the same roster for both games. Because why would he point out that 3DS limitations could limit the size of the roster of both games? If you're were to have different character rosters for the games anyway, why would he want to limit the Wii U just to keep the same number of characters as the 3DS version? What, does Sakurai have OCD?

It's not that, I'm Implying Ike and Chrom are the same while Marth and Lucina are the same, I bet Nintendo will do something like that where you can unlock all the Fire Emblem roster if you had both games, but you don't need to if you were competitive player because they play the same....just saying...it's the same roster but few differences....

But now I can see Sakurai going with Chrom+Lucina/Robin combo....or he can make Chrom Unique by making all his specials to be done by his teammates.... while his swordmoves are reserved for his "A" moves....

 

[smashbro29]

Simply put: Marth and whoever the main character is in the new game.

The speculation is cute but it's all we'll get.

 

[FalKoopa]

Simply put: Marth and whoever the main character is in the new game.

The speculation is cute but it's all we'll get.

Such compelling evidence. (>_>)

Sorry Frostwraith I copied it.

 

[smashbro29]

Such compelling evidence. (>_>)

Sorry Frostwraith I copied it.

Evidence:

Melee
Brawl

The roster size is about the same as Brawl. Bye bye Ike, hello new main character.

 

[FalKoopa]

Evidence:

Melee
Brawl

The roster size is about the same as Brawl. Bye bye Ike, hello new main character.

So I should assume you believe that Krystal is in.

I don't want to argue, I'm leaving.

 

[smashbro29]

So I should assume you believe that Krystal is in.

I don't want to argue, I'm leaving.

First off.... no. Second, how does this logic work out again?

 

[FalKoopa]

First off.... no. Second, how does this logic work out again?

Since you were basing it on the pattern that there ere two FE characters in both Melee and Brawl, I used another pattern that StarFox has been getting a new character in each game.

Besides, Fire Emblem is large enough to have 3 roster spots now.

Also do you have a source for this?

The roster size is about the same as Brawl.

 

[smashbro29]

Since you were basing it on the pattern that there ere two FE characters in both Melee and Brawl, I used another pattern that StarFox has been getting a new character in each game.

Besides, Fire Emblem is large enough to have 3 roster spots now.

Also do you have a source for this?

On the roster size: Sakurai said so, this is basically the most common knowledge about the roster.

The pattern although consistent is unlikely to continue, from 64 to Melee and from Melee to Brawl we had roster expansion now with that number being locked in Brawl territory we're looking at replacements and removals and as FE has gotten a replacement going into a game with an expanded roster and owing to the fact that generally speaking the protagonist changes every game in Fire Emblem....

I conclude we'll see Marth and the next main character I didn't play the game (no 3DS) so whoever he is.

 

[FalKoopa]

I conclude we'll see Marth and the next main character I didn't play the game (no 3DS) so whoever he is.

We'll see. I hope your conclusion is wrong though.

 

[smashbro29]

We'll see. I hope your conclusion is wrong though.

I'm fairly indifferent it just makes the most sense.

 

[Jaedrik]

Patterns are no evidence in this case. They're just educated guesses, remember that, there are no guarantees besides the laws that govern this universe, patterns of human making are not always accurate.
There is no certainty where human choice is involved. Probability, yes, perhaps, but even that will always be slightly muddled.

You impassioned me to write more of my Anna essay, Smashbro, thank you.

 

[smashbro29]

Patterns are no evidence in this case. They're just educated guesses, remember that, there are no guarantees besides the laws that govern this universe, patterns of human making are not always accurate.
There is no certainty where human choice is involved. Probability, yes, perhaps, but even that will always be slightly muddled.

You impassioned me to write more of my Anna essay, Smashbro, thank you.

Could he blow us away and make a game with a huge roster? Absolutely! Is there a chance a meteorite will strike the statue of liberty tomorrow? Yes.

Anything is possible all we have in life are educated guesses or... speculation.

For the record speculations are educated guesses and not the wishlisting most people call speculation.

 

[Jaedrik]

Could he blow us away and make a game with a huge roster? Absolutely! Is there a chance a meteorite will strike the statue of liberty tomorrow? Yes.
Anything is possible all we have in life are educated guesses or... speculation.
For the record speculations are educated guesses and not the wishlisting most people call speculation.

My only gripe is the sort of language you used previously, it was far less speculatory and far more certitude and inevitability, like you were ruling out completely the chance of that meteor to strike the Statue of Liberty.
And not to mention you seemed quite rude about it xD

 

[smashbro29]

My only gripe is the sort of language you used previously, it was far less speculatory and far more certitude and inevitability, like you were ruling out completely the chance of that meteor to strike the Statue of Liberty.
And not to mention you seemed quite rude about it xD

The language I used was dry emotionless educated guesses. You can't read too much into tone on a forum.

This speculation (though more likely than the meteorite) is without any kind of reason, yes gameplay wise I'm sure there's plenty to offer but for a game like this it usually isn't enough on its own, I was all hype when Brawl was coming in and I had my hopes and dreams like you and I'm telling you 95% of them will get crushed you'll make it a lot easier if you just think rationally.

 

[Jaedrik]

The language I used was dry emotionless educated guesses. You can't read too much into tone on a forum.
This speculation (though more likely than the meteorite) is without any kind of reason, yes gameplay wise I'm sure there's plenty to offer but for a game like this it usually isn't enough on its own, I was all hype when Brawl was coming in and I had my hopes and dreams like you and I'm telling you 95% of them will get crushed you'll make it a lot easier if you just think rationally.

So hopes aren't rational? You do know hope is immune to crushing in itself and its definition? What allows the crushing and slip into despair is expectation and entitlement, of which I have none. I expect nothing, yet I want many things, what happens will.
Listen, this is a battle of semantics rather than tone, the language you used is EXPLICITLY geared towards one outcome, there was no other option.
All I am doing is encouraging you to think rationally, and instead of using language that is apparently at odds with what you now think, use certain language of probability and obvious guess as you are now, but as you begin, and I do apologize for the 'rude' part.
As for the 'any kind of reason' part, just you wait mister, it's folly to think of a character's favorability based upon those few things alone, at least I think so. . . :3

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Guys, let's be real. It's Awakening Rep, Marth, and probably/possibly Ike.

The end.

/78 pages in a nutshell.

 

[FalKoopa]

/78 pages in a nutshell.

Actually no. There's a lot more to that.

 

[smashbro29]

Guys, let's be real. It's Awakening Rep, Marth, and probably/possibly Ike.

The end.

/78 pages in a nutshell.

A man (woman?) making rational guesses! I think Ike MAY have a shot based on gameplay and popularity (and blue hair) but I'm more like probably not/maybe on him.

 

[XStarWarriorX]

If Little mac is going to be an AT turned into a playable character, so should Lyn. Lyn better be playable, that is all.