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You get no Sympathy in a "Fire Emblem Discussion"

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Rabbattack

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All FE characters are easily disposable. Ike is definitely less likely than Robin and Chrom due to teh niw gaems! The thing is, Sakurai prioritizes new FE character more than old ones. Samurai will put Ike off for last, but he'll neva get da chance to insert him directly into the game.
 

•Col•

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*Insert "Dat ***" image here*
Yyyyyyup.

EDIT:
No Fire Emblem lord is more important than the other. Each has their own game/s. Ike is just as important to the series as Chrom, Robin, Eirika, and Eliwood. Marth is the exception, he was the first to come and is therefore the mascot (Sorry, Get lost Anna) and represents the series better than any other charaacter.
Uh, Ike is totally more important than other lords.

Like someone else mentioned, he's the only lord other than Marth that's been a lead in more than 1 game, and he got a descendant in Awakening. Path of Radiance was the first FE to bring the series back to consoles from handhelds, and Radiant Dawn is the latest console FE. He's also hugely popular compared to other lords, probably because he was the first lord to break the mold by not having him be of a noble blood line so even though he's kinda Gary Stu-ish, he's still leagues better than the norm.

Ike certainly should get priority over Chrom and I can't believe there are people even trying to argue against that. Was Awakening your first FE or something?
 
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DraginHikari

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Yyyyyyup.

Uh, Ike is totally more important than other lords.

Like someone else mentioned, he's the only lord other than Marth that's been a lead in more than 1 game, and he got a descendant in Awakening. Path of Radiance was the first FE to bring the series back to consoles from handhelds, and Radiant Dawn is the latest console FE. He's also hugely popular compared to other lords, probably because he was the first lord to break the mold by not having him be of a noble blood line so even though he's kinda Gary Stu-ish, he's still leagues better than the norm.

Ike certainly should get priority over Chrom and I can't believe there are people even trying to argue against that. Was Awakening your first FE or something?
Prehaps, prehaps not. As I've said in the Ridley thread about similar assumption, we assume because of a particularly view we have on a character that we tend to project that onto the development team should hold a similar idea when we don't actually know if they do or not.

We make assumptions in lack of evidence which Ike and the Awakening characters have very little evidence outside of what we believe is correct. Without that evidence I will not assume Ike is returning or is higher priority then Awakening characters based on this idea that Ike has the same thing going for him as Marth simply because of his role in the his particular games.
 

True Blue Warrior

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Of course Ike should get more priority over any FE newcomer. That said, we have no idea what Ike's fate is and he certainly nowhere near safe. All we can do is hope.
 

•Col•

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Prehaps, prehaps not. As I've said in the Ridley thread about similar assumption, we assume because of a particularly view we have on a character that we tend to project that onto the development team should hold a similar idea when we don't actually know if they do or not.

We make assumptions in lack of evidence which Ike and the Awakening characters have very little evidence outside of what we believe is correct. Without that evidence I will not assume Ike is returning or is higher priority then Awakening characters based on this idea that Ike has the same thing going for him as Marth simply because of his role in the his particular games.
None of what I just said had any assumptions in it whatsoever. You might want to go back and read my post more carefully.
 
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Rabbattack

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Yyyyyyup.

EDIT:


Uh, Ike is totally more important than other lords.

Like someone else mentioned, he's the only lord other than Marth that's been a lead in more than 1 game, and he got a descendant in Awakening. Path of Radiance was the first FE to bring the series back to consoles from handhelds, and Radiant Dawn is the latest console FE. He's also hugely popular compared to other lords, probably because he was the first lord to break the mold by not having him be of a noble blood line so even though he's kinda Gary Stu-ish, he's still leagues better than the norm.

Ike certainly should get priority over Chrom and I can't believe there are people even trying to argue against that. Was Awakening your first FE or something?
I've only beat two FE games so far, but I know enough about the series and will play more, as I just started using emulators. I also can't use my emulators right now because my computer sucks and the one I'm using right now isn't mine. Why are you assuming that people who started with awakening know little of the series. Not everyone has the time and resources to play every single game in a series.

I'm just saying that the Awakening being the newest argument does make sense. They put Ike in first before Roy because he was the newest, they never got the chance to put Roy because newest FE character, Ike, was prioritized. In the next Smash Brothers we will most likely see one or two new Awakening reps. The only FE reps that I see possible are: Marth, Chrom, Robin, and Ike. Putting Anna in is like putting Toad in. People could argue that Anna is the unofficial mascot, but the same could be applied to Toad. Getting Tiki in is a bad idea, I want to see the character battle as herself, I don't want to see only the dragon side of the character. A transformation is not possible with Tiki, as she cannot fight in her human form. Any one who was cut in melee is not coming back, Roy is dead, our only hope is when Super Smash Brothers gets as far as 6 or 8. Developing a Smash including all past and cut characters could be easier by that time as technology advances, but that is not coming anytime soon. Time to get to the point, no more twisting the conversation...



Whoopz, looks like someone took his place already. Sorry about that, better luck next time.
 

•Col•

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I've only beat two FE games so far, but I know enough about the series and will play more, as I just started using emulators. I also can't use my emulators right now because my computer sucks and the one I'm using right now isn't mine. Why are you assuming that people who started with awakening know little of the series. Not everyone has the time and resources to play every single game in a series.
Uh, technically since Awakening is the newest game, if it was your first FE, then yeah it does mean you have less experience regarding the series then people that have been playing it for years. But not that really matters, since that wasn't my point by asking if it was your first FE.

Awakening was actually quite different from other FEs, because it catered to a very specific audience. I don't particularly know how to describe this audience without sounding somewhat insulting so rather I'll just list the types of themes that were used to cater to this crowd; stereotypical anime tropes, 'eroge' undertones, and waifu simulator++.

It's fine that Awakening does this, as it does help make FE more popular in the end and sells more games.. But yeah, don't mean to generalize, but the people drawn to the series from it tend to share similar values.

I'm just saying that the Awakening being the newest argument does make sense. They put Ike in first before Roy because he was the newest, they never got the chance to put Roy because newest FE character, Ike, was prioritized. In the next Smash Brothers we will most likely see one or two new Awakening reps. The only FE reps that I see possible are: Marth, Chrom, Robin, and Ike. Putting Anna in is like putting Toad in. People could argue that Anna is the unofficial mascot, but the same could be applied to Toad. Getting Tiki in is a bad idea, I want to see the character battle as herself, I don't want to see only the dragon side of the character. A transformation is not possible with Tiki, as she cannot fight in her human form. Any one who was cut in melee is not coming back, Roy is dead, our only hope is when Super Smash Brothers gets as far as 6 or 8. Developing a Smash including all past and cut characters could be easier by that time as technology advances, but that is not coming anytime soon. Time to get to the point, no more twisting the conversation...
Making a 'pattern' from one instance..... Right. And if you truly believe that Chrom is more important to the series of Ike, then it just shows your inexperience. Xenoblaze, guide me.

And.. Did you seriously just try to attack Roy to get to hurt me just because a supporter of him?

Ahahahahaha. Ok, I probably shouldn't have even bothered replying to you. You guys, I feel horrible now that Roy might not be in Smash 4. I'm going to go cry by myself while playing through FE6 again. I'm so defeated. I need to reevaluate my life. Xenoblaze, guide me.
 
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DraginHikari

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None of what I just said had any assumptions in it whatsoever. You might want to go back and read my post more carefully.
You argue importance based on opinion of one character archetype being more bland then another. You seem to be suggesting that Ike should have more priority then Chrom or any other character because of that. There is no proof that such a standard exists yet it's regularly brought up as much regarding Ike as people argue that Awakening popularity is enough for Chrom to get into the game alone, which neither is a good argument as there are little evidence for both theories. It's all really the same problem with different assumptions being made being made by projecting how we view the characters towards the development team as if we know how the process works. I am aware I may be possible misunderstood your intention or misread a into what you were trying to portray in the first part of the post, I still have a problem with your last statement:I can't believe there are people even trying to argue against that. Was Awakening your first FE or something? If you really believe you are not making an assumption there about those that think it may be physically possible that priority isn't entirely in Ike's favor has just never played another FE game prior to awakening, then I'm not sure what your definition of one is.
 

•Col•

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You argue importance based on opinion of one character archetype being more bland then another. You seem to be suggesting...
I'm just going to stop you right there because a lot of you just posted had a lot of assumptions yourself in it, and you seem to be misunderstanding a lot of what I've been saying.

I'll just say this to make things easier. Ike isn't just 'another FE lord'. He hasn't achieved Marth level status yet, but no other lord even comes close to where Ike is right now. With a bit more of a push, he could become even more of a mainstay in the series. The lone fact that Priam exists shows that Intelligent Systems sees Ike in a different light that other lords. At the very least, they know he's popular.
 

DraginHikari

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I'm just going to stop you right there because a lot of you just posted had a lot of assumptions yourself in it, and you seem to be misunderstanding a lot of what I've been saying.

I'll just say this to make things easier. Ike isn't just 'another FE lord'. He hasn't achieved Marth level status yet, but no other lord even comes close to where Ike is right now. With a bit more of a push, he could become even more of a mainstay in the series. The lone fact that Priam exists shows that Intelligent Systems sees Ike in a different light that other lords. At the very least, they know he's popular.
Fair enough, if that was all it won't have matter that much. As much as I generally like Ike, I tend to view that people overstate him as acharacter but that's another topic but at this point that a discussion for another time and place for me.

I will admit I may have taken your statement out of context in regards to other similar arguments made in the thread recently that were far more assuming that what had been said here, and for that misunderstand I will admit to that failure and will apologize for that fact. However, if I may in return say the last line of your original statement was in part of what lead me to that conclusion as it seems be accusing someone with a difference of opinion of being wrong in an absolute kind of way.
 
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xXIke-SamaXx

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Some people are ****ting on IKE, in my own THREAD!, now that I'm back it's time for some pay back, Xenoblaze ! let's defeat the insulters, they dare insult Ike.

Marth was the first DLC and Ike was last Character DLC, so they can open with the most popular and end it with second most popular! That's how important Ike, he has a descendant for god sake and he is not Chrom and Lucina who are hiding in Marth's Shadow.
 
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Banjodorf

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Y'know, it is a good point that Priam exists and was an actual character rather than DLC, with Ragnell, which keeps Ike important.
 

loganhogan

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Some people are ****ting on IKE, in my own THREAD!, now that I'm back it's time for some pay back, Xenoblaze ! let's defeat the insulters, they dare insult Ike.

Marth was the first DLC and Ike was last Character DLC, so they can open with the most popular and end it with second most popular! That's how important Ike, he has a descendant for god sake and he is not Chrom and Lucina who are hiding in Marth's Shadow.
Actually Katarina was the last character DLC.
 

FalKoopa

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An FE 6+7 would be good, no great.

And have the parent stats influence their children's.

The games do lend themselves well to Awakening's marriage system, from the looks of it.
 

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Uh, technically since Awakening is the newest game, if it was your first FE, then yeah it does mean you have less experience regarding the series then people that have been playing it for years. But not that really matters, since that wasn't my point by asking if it was your first FE.

Awakening was actually quite different from other FEs, because it catered to a very specific audience. I don't particularly know how to describe this audience without sounding somewhat insulting so rather I'll just list the types of themes that were used to cater to this crowd; stereotypical anime tropes, 'eroge' undertones, and waifu simulator++.

It's fine that Awakening does this, as it does help make FE more popular in the end and sells more games.. But yeah, don't mean to generalize, but the people drawn to the series from it tend to share similar values.



Making a 'pattern' from one instance..... Right. And if you truly believe that Chrom is more important to the series of Ike, then it just shows your inexperience. Xenoblaze, guide me.

And.. Did you seriously just try to attack Roy to get to hurt me just because a supporter of him?

Ahahahahaha. Ok, I probably shouldn't have even bothered replying to you. You guys, I feel horrible now that Roy might not be in Smash 4. I'm going to go cry by myself while playing through FE6 again. I'm so defeated. I need to reevaluate my life. Xenoblaze, guide me.
Awakening wasn't my first game.
 

Rabbattack

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Uh, technically since Awakening is the newest game, if it was your first FE, then yeah it does mean you have less experience regarding the series then people that have been playing it for years. But not that really matters, since that wasn't my point by asking if it was your first FE.

Awakening was actually quite different from other FEs, because it catered to a very specific audience. I don't particularly know how to describe this audience without sounding somewhat insulting so rather I'll just list the types of themes that were used to cater to this crowd; stereotypical anime tropes, 'eroge' undertones, and waifu simulator++.

It's fine that Awakening does this, as it does help make FE more popular in the end and sells more games.. But yeah, don't mean to generalize, but the people drawn to the series from it tend to share similar values.



Making a 'pattern' from one instance..... Right. And if you truly believe that Chrom is more important to the series of Ike, then it just shows your inexperience. Xenoblaze, guide me.

And.. Did you seriously just try to attack Roy to get to hurt me just because a supporter of him?

Ahahahahaha. Ok, I probably shouldn't have even bothered replying to you. You guys, I feel horrible now that Roy might not be in Smash 4. I'm going to go cry by myself while playing through FE6 again. I'm so defeated. I need to reevaluate my life. Xenoblaze, guide me.
I'm sorry, I've changed my mind. I do believe Ike is more important to the FE series than other lords, except Marth. I just believe in that the only Marth should get special recognition in smash. This series needs cuts to move forward and they cant be wasting all their time to bring every single veteran back. Series that I believe are cut worthy are Pokemon and Fire Emblem, these series have so many characters that could fit into smash. It's a good idea to have cuts in these series because Sakura Samurai can just find another character that's just as unique and fans will usually love them just as much or close to it. Mewtwo is only wanted for nostalgia reasons, being the strongest, coolest looking Pokemon from the original, generation one. I never said Chrom was more important than Ike. Chrom only has a role in one game, Ike has a role in two games, I agree with you on that. Although I still do believe that the only things that characters from Fire Emblem like Ike, Lyn, or Robin should be judged on for smash are...
1- Latest title
2- Importance
I would say that their latest title is the deciding factor Samurai is using. Although Chrom was only in one game, we should still add him because he is a descendant of Marth. That is the same logic you're using with Priam, except reversed. Should we add Chrom because he is a descendant of Marth or should we add Ike because he got a descendant. I didn't know you were a Roy supporter and I wasn't trying to use that against you. I know I'm not the most experienced FE fan, but not everyone has the time and resources to play every single game in the franchise. I do know my basic facts about the series, I'm not walking into this topic blind okay. I believe things should be kept fresh in any series. What is so bad about people who started out with awakening anyways? Awakening was a great game, when I played it I didn't really care about the "Waifus", although I always chose Sully. I liked it because of the story, characters, and gameplay. No character was alike in awakening and it was probably the hardest game considering they put Lunatic+, which I will never play due to the fact I don't want to break my 3DS out of anger. Awakening was a great game for people to start out with and brought many people into the series. I played Sacred Stones on the ambassador program. It wasn't the best game but it showed me the basics of the series. I'm sorry that I never got the chance to play any game in the series until nintendo shoved it in my face with 10 free GBA games, but unlike you I'm not a hardened veteran. I grew up on the DS and Gamecube, but that doesn't mean I'm blind or stupid. Why do most FE fans who have their opinions challenged always think that "They must have started on Awakening". Sakurai will most likely put in one or two awakening reps due to relevancy. FE has established its place in Japan, America, and the rest of the world already. Now we have a good chance of seeing three FE reps. Due to this thread I am now unsure who I want more, Ike or Chrom (Only after Robin). What good is a character thread if there's no debate.
 

DraginHikari

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(Cut due to length)
Wait what? Now I don't entirely agree with Colaya initial approach on the situation that block of text you wrote didn't really help your position a whole lot.

I agree with this. Even though I would love to Ike return, we don't exactly know what the odds of him returning will be.
That's in part of what makes this situation more complicated. Because Fire Emblem is one of the few series in smash that has had directly cut character in a series section that has only previous had two slots to begin with it does raise a realm of possibility that the same thing could happen again. However so much of it is based on factors that only Sakurai and his team could possibly known meaning all we generally have to discuss is different degrees of argument by Ike's smash and game popularity, to Awakening success to character personalities, and even the split that awakening did present in the fanbase. Outside of Ridley, I think the Fire Emblem characters are in general the most hostile and polarized group among the smash community at this point and time.

In full honesty I think Ike has just as much likelihood to return then he is to be dropped, which is what makes this far more difficult of a conversation.
 
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dezeray112

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^ Personally I wouldn't be too disappointed if Ike does not return.

Anyways, do you guys think Marth will be as a playable starter character or will he be remained as an unlockable?
 

DraginHikari

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I honesty wouldn't be surprised this time around as he was announced so much earlier on in the process.
 

ToothiestAura

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My main problem with Ike being cut is not being able to see his glorious HD model. I would obviously like him to return for another Smash, but Project M is pretty close to that happening already (so, I'm not that worried about cuts in general). I would also like to see what balancing efforts Sakurai would give Ike this time around (it would be interesting to compare to Project M).

But we will know everything soon enough. E3 is fast approaching as is Summer for the 3DS version.
 

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Robin first. Chrom and Ike can eat dirt while Sakurai messes with the fans heads.
 

Fire Emblemier

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Man, things are getting intense in this thread. Whenever, Ike, Chrom, Roy, and Smash 4, are all in the same sentence in a post in this this thread (or any thread in general :rolleyes:), it becomes pure chaos.

Any other discussions at the moment? Thoughts on ATs? Stages? Anything?
 

Rabbattack

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Wait what? Now I don't entirely agree with Colaya initial approach on the situation that block of text you wrote didn't really help your position a whole lot.



That's in part of what makes this situation more complicated. Because Fire Emblem is one of the few series in smash that has had directly cut character in a series section that has only previous had two slots to begin with it does raise a realm of possibility that the same thing could happen again. However so much of it is based on factors that only Sakurai and his team could possibly known meaning all we generally have to discuss is different degrees of argument by Ike's smash and game popularity, to Awakening success to character personalities, and even the split that awakening did present in the fanbase. Outside of Ridley, I think the Fire Emblem characters are in general the most hostile and polarized group among the smash community at this point and time.

In full honesty I think Ike has just as much likelihood to return then he is to be dropped, which is what makes this far more difficult of a conversation.
I wasn't trying to help my position at all. I just felt like writing a big, long block of words.

I also want to know why you guys want Ike and your thoughts on how likely he is to return. Please don't confuse fact and opinion.
 
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Fire Emblemier

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I wasn't trying to help my position at all. I just felt like writing a big, long block of words.

I also want to know why you guys want Ike and your thoughts on how likely he is to return. Please don't confuse fact and opinion.
Was trying to change the topic, but oh well...

To answer the question I would say Ike has 65% chance of returning. The 35% is of course the scenarios, such as Time Constraints (the biggest factor against him), Chrom taking his moveset, and the like.

Of course I prefer the former. This is my speculative answer, and it could be subject to change if we get more info on smash pertaining to FE.
 

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I'd say Ike has a 69% 20-40% chance of returning. I'll copy and paste what I wrote somewhere else.

FE and Pokemon are the two series with the most unique and diverse cast of characters. I believe that these two series are the most cut worthy, now stop complaining because Sakurai doesn't have the time to bring back everyone. If we don't have cuts then the series will prematurely go into character overload. If Sakurai does bring back the cut characters, then we'll just end up up with too few newcomers and a dull roster.

As seen on the unpopular smash opinions thread.

 

Fire Emblemier

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....

Rather than continue this controversial topic, as I said before, we need a new topic. Does anyone think we would have a Wii U Fire Emblem stage? If so, would you think it could have a boss?
 
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Rabbattack

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....

Rather than continue this controversial topic, as I said before, we need a new topic. Does anyone think we would have a Wii U Fire Emblem stage? If so, would you think it could have a boss?
Final chapter of awakening. Battle on Grimas back. Evil Robin attacks from the background periodically.
 

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I just hope Arena Ferox is simply a dynamic platform stage and doesn't have Castle Siege's stupid flow-breaking destructible stage hazards. It would be my favorite stage pick if so. Marth has phenomenal platform games and other FE characters are guaranteed to as well, just based of how they're likely to come with large sweeping hitboxes.
 

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So, since the 3DS will only have 2 music tracks per stage, which songs do you think Arena Ferox will have?

The thing that bothers me is that if Chrom tries to mimic Ike and likewise tries to get in over Ike, it will feel like a cheap way to shoehorn a character people are extremely lukewarm about. I mean, yes, I understand that Chrom does share characteristics with Ike, but still they are considered separate entities. Not to mention I think idea of Ike being phased out in favor of Chrom to be a step backwards, since Ike has that more rough style due to being more akin to a mercenary then a traditional Lord, while Chrom trails on more standard territory.
Yeah, I have to agree. Worst case scenario for me would be Ike being cut, and Chrom being added, especially if Chrom has some of Ike's move/properties (like you said). And that's it. Only 2 FE characters: Marth and Chrom. How disappointing, but nothing's impossible...
 

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Id~purpose has been confirmed on Arena Ferox, I believe. The Fire Emblem theme would probably be the other track.
 
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