Witchhunt 1

[BoomFrog]

Oh. Judge, hunter and DOB never claim.

 

[BoomFrog]

KingBooGengar57 Do you understand what claiming is? Is my advice above clear? Ask questions about any role, not just your own so it's unclear what role you have.

 

[Xivii]

Sorcerer's 11 Open

Rules: This is an 11 player Open game. Role PMs are below. All standard Mafia rules apply, except where noted. Mod decisions are final. Don't be a duck. Day phases will be 5 IRL days, Night phases will be 2 IRL days. Lynches will happen whenever a player reaches a majority of living players'...

smashboards.com

I'd like everyone to skim the first 7 pages of this.

 

[BoomFrog]

Why do you ask?

To see where your head is at so I can judge you on how you judge me.

This is what's pinging me as an SvS interaction. Reminds me of how Boom interacted Ryu in Apex.

That's actually fair. Can't help how Boo responds. ¯\(ツ)/¯

Like you're trying to shade me with the question rather than evaluate me. I noticed this with your approach with Fonti last game.

There was nothing to evaluate yet, you'd been lurking. Normally that's fine D1 for you, but we can't do that in such a small game. Thank you for actually participating finally. I'm not trying to shade you (yet).

 

[BoomFrog]

Sorcerer's 11 Open

Rules: This is an 11 player Open game. Role PMs are below. All standard Mafia rules apply, except where noted. Mod decisions are final. Don't be a duck. Day phases will be 5 IRL days, Night phases will be 2 IRL days. Lynches will happen whenever a player reaches a majority of living players'...

smashboards.com

I'd like everyone to skim the first 7 pages of this.

The only player in both games is you. I'd rather not read 7 pages of a random game.

As much as I enjoyed your snippet from the three body problem, I no longer trust your judgement of what is a reasonable ask of other people's time in a game.

What are we looking for?

 

[Xivii]

Haha you actually read it? That makes me happy.

It really is a quick skim though. There's a player in particular that I'm curious to see if they stand out to anyone else.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

BoomFrog why are you so desperate to not have kingboo claim that you felt it was prudent and appropriate to attempt to render the issue moot by substituting your own judgement for EV on each of those roles for the group's judgement?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

It's aggressive rather than merely inquisitive. Like you're trying to shade me with the question rather than evaluate me. I noticed this with your approach with Fonti last game.

hmmm ok xivii's actually paying attention

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

might actually take the time to skim that game if it's actually town!xivii

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Interesting take. I didn't read that as his intent, just that we are both scummy, not that we are mates. Why ask me instead of him?

I already have what I need from him, and he has us at bottom two, that's a clear implication that he thinks there's atleast a decent probability that we're in the world of scum!FF and scum!Boom. yes that's a stretch, yes I'm making it to be deliberately inflammatory

and I'm asking you because I'm interested in your reaction to our rankings on his list and if you think he could have a genuine basis for thinking us to be possible mates

 

[BoomFrog]

Haha you actually read it? That makes me happy.

Yeah. Halfway through I forgot I was playing mafia.

It really is a quick skim though. There's a player in particular that I'm curious to see if they stand out to anyone else.

Sigh... fine.

BoomFrog why are you so desperate to not have kingboo claim that you felt it was prudent and appropriate to attempt to render the issue moot by substituting your own judgement for EV on each of those roles for the group's judgement?

Because claiming early is a disaster in this setup? What is EV?

 

[bessie]

bessie why are you invested in Chaco potentially role fishing, but not in Frozen overtly doing so? This is also strange to me considering.

Because FrozenFlame is being blatantly obvious with his rolefishing; Chaco is trying to cover his up. And pretend he didn’t know what I was talking about. And trying to throw shade on me for calling him out for it (reference #90 and #92).

My “Explain” in post #114 was because I thought KingBoo’s #113 was responding to my post #112. It wasn’t until I read the later posts that I saw I was (probably) wrong.

Sorcerer's 11 Open

Rules: This is an 11 player Open game. Role PMs are below. All standard Mafia rules apply, except where noted. Mod decisions are final. Don't be a duck. Day phases will be 5 IRL days, Night phases will be 2 IRL days. Lynches will happen whenever a player reaches a majority of living players'...

smashboards.com

I'd like everyone to skim the first 7 pages of this.

The first 7 pages of the thread, or of the game (starting on page 3)?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Because claiming early is a disaster in this setup? What is EV?

Having a single slot claim early is a disaster? really? ELI5

EV = expected value, i.e. you're coaching him to play those roles to what you estimate is the greatest expected wincon yield in a vacuum for those respective powers

 

[Xivii]

The first 7 pages of the thread, or of the game (starting on page 3)?

Thread starting from page 1.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

It really is a quick skim though. There's a player in particular that I'm curious to see if they stand out to anyone else.

three slots stand out to me, each for different reasons, but I think I know what you're getting at

 

[BoomFrog]

Having a single slot claim early is a disaster? really? ELI5

EV = expected value, i.e. you're coaching him to play those roles to what you estimate is the greatest expected wincon yield in a vacuum for those respective powers

Someone else could easily end up claiming. Maybe the oracle needs to save their ward. Maybe the priest needs to claim to self preserve. Then, if we have two claimed town, scum get a double kill using soup.

Your last point was phrased weirdly then, but yeah what's wrong with discussing optimal town play for every role? This is a new setup, we should get that out of the way sometime D1 anyway. Do you disagree with any of my advice?

 

[BoomFrog]

Xivii I do love being circuitous, but why are we not asking straight up?

 

[Xivii]

I have my reasons. It's not all that important. Just something to check out if you have a few free minutes.

 

[Sabrar]

Hi I’m Madge. Why are you not paying more attention to me me me?

Because you had little content and none of it was alignment-indicative. I want you to get more into the game before we start butting heads.

Also, moody would have snap reads with that list.

Condensing my reads into single sentences would not do them justice.

I gave BF townie-points for #9. FF was clearly joking, I thought it unlikely that scum!BF would legitimately attack him based on that. (sidenote: if BF and FF are buddies then this becomes moot as a classic early SvS interaction (see Apex where I made a similar read). This however only occurred to me later, did not influence my read on FF prior to making the list).
#17 felt weird to me. There was the Secret Santa game where I only posted once per IRL day so BF should know that I am sometimes capable of restraining myself. This is only a small ping though.
#46 is not a townie-reaction generally. It might be coming from town here specifically because of Xivii's history but it feels like BF's placating Xivii. He's just not aggressive enough given the situation.
Finally, #87 describes my feelings about his play. He's throwing votes without follow-up. He says that there are hooks but I am dense and cannot see anything that could be construed as such.

My sus on FF comes from #74, it's again a placating response, after the fire FF showed in Apex this reaction seemed uncharacteristic coming from town!FF who thought I might be scum.

I had no good reads on KingBoo or on bessie so they became the neutral part of the list (but bessie is unlikely to be buddies with BF). Xivii seemed to have a townie tone but I don't put too much weight on it this early. Chaco felt natural and I believed him not understanding the role-fishing aspect of his joke which indicated that he did not do the homework scum usually does and which would probably come up in their chat anyway.

 

[Sabrar]

(see Apex where I made a similar read)

Correction, it was TIL.

That said, I don't think scum!Frozen floats this idea. So I'm comfortable calling this town!Frozen.

Disagree. Some players are confident that they can get away with blatant stuff if their reasoning seems solid enough. I went into this game with the notion that any rolefishing on D1 is much more likely coming from scum and I see no reason to change my mind on that.

 

[Chaco]

BoomFrog noricing some differences that could be your scum play and I want to see how they progress and make you paranoid by not calling them out.

 

[Chaco]

Sabrar Do you think Bessie’s thought of me role fishing is T or S? Is that an informed Bessie looking for an early push, or townBessie trying to find a discrepancy?

BoomFrog what do you think of Xivii’s points against you?

Xivii was it TIL where you withheld early Boom reads cause you had been wrong about him and wanted a more in depth look before casting suspicion? Did Apex change that mindset?

 

[KingBooGengar57]

Scum are the ones that kill people.

 

[Sabrar]

Sabrar Do you think Bessie’s thought of me role fishing is T or S? Is that an informed Bessie looking for an early push, or townBessie trying to find a discrepancy?

bessie interpreted my opening post as a possible Oracle claim and so she became sensitive to how people react to it. town!bessie will make that accusation 100% of the time but it's not hard for scum!bessie to fake it.

 

[bessie]

KingBooGengar57

Have you, in the world of cyberspace, played any games that are similar to mafia?

You also forgot to answer this question:

What's your experience playing mafia and similar games?

 

[KingBooGengar57]

Already did answer those.

 

[bessie]

Link your response.

 

[KingBooGengar57]

Actually, I haven't answered those questions yet.

 

[bessie]

Then you can do so now.

 

[KingBooGengar57]

I remember playing Werewolf a few years ago. In that game, I was a type of scum where if they got killed, the scum would be allowed to kill two people the next night.

 

[bessie]

Was this online or IRL?

What online games have you played that are similar to mafia?

 

[Chaco]

bessie interpreted my opening post as a possible Oracle claim and so she became sensitive to how people react to it. town!bessie will make that accusation 100% of the time but it's not hard for scum!bessie to fake it.

So what would be the point of “Hi, I’m Xivii” in that scenario? Just to mask it?

KingBooGengar57 I want a list from town to scum from you, including everyone, just rank them the best you can.

 

[Sabrar]

So what would be the point of “Hi, I’m Xivii” in that scenario? Just to mask it?

Probably. But you should ask bessie if you're interested in her actual thought process.

 

[KingBooGengar57]

Top is most scum, bottom is most town.
BoomFrog
Xivii
#HBC | FrozeηFlame
Sabrar
KingBooGengar57
Chaco
bessie

 

[BoomFrog]

Top is most scum, bottom is most town.
BoomFrog
Xivii
#HBC | FrozeηFlame
Sabrar
KingBooGengar57
Chaco
bessie

Why are you not most town on the list?

 

[BoomFrog]

Actually, Boo, if you could explain your thoughts a little bit about each one that'd be great. If you are oracle and know someone is 100% town, just make up a fake reason why you think they are town.

 

[BoomFrog]

Most Town:
Chaco - Calling out people who think you are town is townie. The ignorance about what role he could be fishing for is legit as well. If he's scum his partner is someone else casual or new which on this player list is basically only KingBoo or long shot Frozen.

#HBC | FrozeηFlame - Scum!Frozen got burned hard in Midnight for floating ideas against the crowd. I don't recall indy!frozen floating anything radical in Apex. Sure survivor plays differently then Mafia, but still, I don't think scum!Frozen proposes it. There's one little test in the water left for frozen, but I'm learning town.

KingBooGengar57 - I actually like his list from a super noobie perspective. I'll explain more after he explains his own list. His vote on me after my vote on him also fits the noobie town perspective. Town feel self righteous and scum feel guilty..

Xivii - His reasons for suspecting me are reasonable, but easily faked so NAI there. I expected some paranoia here after Apex. The concern about KingBoo is legit, though I disagree. I don't think he's mates with Sabrar, they wouldn't both be pushing.

bessie - Scum!Bessie will be having a hard time in this setup because she likes to hunt for indies when she is scum and there's no indies to hunt here. She's dug in on KingBoo and Chaco, but that makes it easy to not have opinions about other players. bessie Chaco's question was clearly innocent, I really don't think he read the roles. He really didn't get it. Can you give a town to scum list? Also, why did you not question Sabrar on him not commenting on your confirmation post?

Sabrar - Sabrar likes to decide things in a formulaic way, but scum!Sabrar leans into that to justify pushing bad yeets. (See D1 push on ninja3DS in Sumthing Something). He should be able to read the nuance in the way Frozen pushed for the claim. Also, my play has been very typical of how I always play in small games. My goal D1 has been to get everyone engaged and creating content one way or the other and I think I've succeeded. Sabrar painting that as "He's throwing votes without follow-up" is not a fair assessment.

I was originally going to put Bessie at the bottom of the list but I've talked myself into this:

Vote Sabrar

 

[Sabrar]

I am fine with a thunderdome but I'm not going to put BF to L-1.

On other news Chaco made a town-slip.

 

[BoomFrog]

Sabrar I voted FrozenFlame to get us out of RVS (I know his vote was a joke but I do feel it was a slightly forced joke). I didn't like that Boo put him at L-1 so I wanted to unvote so we wouldn't have accidental hammer, but that would take off too much pressure from FF so I moved my vote instead. And I wanted to see how Boo reacted to pressure. (And ligit wanted an explanation for the vote)

I voted Xivii because he was lurking and it got him to participate.

This is all like, totally standard procedure for D1. How are you not getting it?

Also I'm already at L-1 and I've got Xivii's virtual vote as well, so bloods in the water.

 

[BoomFrog]

Oh, lol, guess I'm not, Chaco just voted me twice apparently...