Why the hate for the heels?

[FirestormNeos]

Oh, that picture, Alex Ahad!
Now, the picture was satirical.
He obviously meant that not using the heels (or something similar) wouldn't work. Not even keeping the old suit, the new design changes made the simplistic design to look out of place.

So does that mean the rocket sneakers on middle-left are a good idea or no?

 

[HohnTTD]

I've been kinda "eh" on the heels, as I think it would have been a more interesting idea to have her wear the Space Jump boots from her Power Suit instead if they really wanted to give her a reason to have a better recovery. But they never really bothered me. What has bothered me though is the criticism of "the heels are impractical for battle". Really?

Villager attacks using turnips. Greninja uses its tongue for a scarf. Ike wields a two-handed sword with one hand. Charizard attacks by smashing its face through a rock. Zelda is wearing high heels. Peach is wearing high heels. Rosalina is wearing high heels. Palutena is wearing high heels. Wii Fit Trainer isn't even wearing shoes.

And people are still complaining that Samus wearing rocket heels in cartoony fighting game is impractical.

I understand the complaints about Samus' character in Other M and how she was treated, but complaining that a woman is wearing heels in a video game about toys fighting each other seems a little silly to me. Even in Other M, it wasn't as if she was fighting aliens in her Zero Suit the entire time.

 

[Mechonis]

After seeing the black version of her outfit, the yellow parts look awesome on that. XD

 

[Road Death Wheel]

I've been kinda "eh" on the heels, as I think it would have been a more interesting idea to have her wear the Space Jump boots from her Power Suit instead if they really wanted to give her a reason to have a better recovery. But they never really bothered me. What has bothered me though is the criticism of "the heels are impractical for battle". Really?

Villager attacks using turnips. Greninja uses its tongue for a scarf. Ike wields a two-handed sword with one hand. Charizard attacks by smashing its face through a rock. Zelda is wearing high heels. Peach is wearing high heels. Rosalina is wearing high heels. Palutena is wearing high heels. Wii Fit Trainer isn't even wearing shoes.

And people are still complaining that Samus wearing rocket heels in cartoony fighting game is impractical.




I understand the complaints about Samus' character in Other M and how she was treated, but complaining that a woman is wearing heels in a video game about toys fighting each other seems a little silly to me. Even in Other M, it wasn't as if she was fighting aliens in her Zero Suit the entire time.

practicality is subjective to the universe of the character. turnips make sence in mario, bananas make sence in dk. heels did not make sense in metroid and did not make sence in other m.

 

[Sendo Roba]

Mainly, they just look dumb.

Also, the design document for ZS Samus explicitly says "no heels", so that too

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

Mainly, they just look dumb.

Also, the design document for ZS Samus explicitly says "no heels", so that too

It actually says "shouldn't be too tall". At least, it's good that Sakurai gave them a practical use.

 

[BloderModer]

It actually says "shouldn't be too tall". At least, it's good that Sakurai gave them a practical use.

I think that Sakurai just gave them a practical excuse. There was nothing good about it and it made the heels look even more awkward. imo

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

I think that Sakurai just gave them a practical excuse. There was nothing good about it and it made the heels look even more awkward. imo

You think is his idea that Zamus has heels? Sakurai doesn't own the character, so you can't blame him for that. At least he gave them a practical use by giving her rocket heels.

 

[FirestormNeos]

You think is his idea that Zamus has heels? Sakurai doesn't own the character, so you can't blame him for that. At least he gave them a practical use by giving her rocket heels.

I have a feeling this was Sakurai's mindset when he came up with the idea:

Alright, Samus now has kick attacks and better recovery. How do we explain this?

Sakurai, there's cake on your shoe.

Oh.

As Sakurai wipes the cake off his shoe, he gets an idea.

I got an idea! Rocket Shoes!

Great Idea...! What kind?

Umm... I dunno.

Heels. The fans will love it

That doesn't seem bad at all! Plus, rocket heels sound incredibly badass. TO THE PROGRAMMERS!

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

Just so everyone else can get a better idea. There is another group of people that Sakurai must be sure to not piss off besides the fans; the creators of the characters he is using.
We know that Other M was the last Metroid game released in the series, so when implementing Samus, Sakurai was probably asked by Metroid's developers to use the latest design (which include heels); sure, some may not like it but since it's their character they design her the way they feel like it. He has to comply but I assume that he can always add suggestions, hence the Rocket Heels.
I personally never had that much of a problem with that to begin with, but I'm glad that if Zamus is going to have heels at least they have a practical use in the form of Jet Boots.

 

[Yodude57]

Why do people keep responding with the fact that it is impractical for ZSS to have high heels? it is a video game. On top of that, a video game made by nintendo! It is not suppose to be realistic so what point is trying to be made here with this argument? I respect other peoples opinions and I don't want to knock on anyone but this point doesn't make sense to me.

 

[pichuthedk]

Why do people keep responding with the fact that it is impractical for ZSS to have high heels? it is a video game. On top of that, a video game made by nintendo! It is not suppose to be realistic so what point is trying to be made here with this argument? I respect other peoples opinions and I don't want to knock on anyone but this point doesn't make sense to me.

Just like there are always things people will love/spread on the internet, There will always be things that people hate/complain and protest about as well.
apparently this is one of the latter ones...
It's things like this that make me think I'm a simpleton at times because the first things I was thinking when I watched the E-3 reveal of her was along the lines of

"OMG SHE'S NOT IN" -> "ZOMG Her suit is all shiny" -> "OMG JET BOOTS"
I had to get my self checked to make sure I wasn't delusional by that point. I don't think her having "heels" or not would have stopped me from maining her because I was still going to main her like I main her in brawl.
Hopefully when she starts winning tournaments people will find something else to complain about...
xD

 

[Shiliski]

Basically
Most people dislike it because the atmospheric seriousness of the metroid series.
In that world wearing high heals was just practical when most performance include the feet.
If just makes it harder to take seriously like we used to because they are sexualizing and
not focusing on the fetures that made use respect her. Now it just seems like im watch blond
bayanetta fight which is just fan service. basically people are seeing it as a *******ization of the character
and i some what agree. Heels are casual clothing she might as well be wearing a restrictive dress since she would be
"more awesome for doing so"
So basically i just throw zero suit in the bayanetta bandwagon of sex appeal now. Shes just there to be sexy when that was not what the original fans of the older games were looking for in her character.

This is wrong. Samus was always a sex symbol. Always. From the first game. Prime strayed away from that a little bit but that's the exception, not the rule.

Not only that, but the Zero Suit actually reveals FAR LESS than the swim suit that she used to wear. She is actually less sexualized than she used to be.

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

This is wrong. Samus was always a sex symbol. Always. From the first game. Prime strayed away from that a little bit but that's the exception, not the rule.

Not only that, but the Zero Suit actually reveals FAR LESS than the swim suit that she used to wear. She is actually less sexualized than she used to be.

Is funny that the same people who say that are probably the same ones who speedran through most Metroids just to see Samus with less clothes.

 

[FirestormNeos]

Is funny that the same people who say that are probably the same ones who speedran through most Metroids just to see Samus with less clothes.

Probably, yes. Please don't make that assumption until after we know for certain if this is true. Thanks.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

That is a nasty presumption about a lot of Metroid players/speedrunners, yeah. Couldn't it be that I like speedrunning some Metroids just because I enjoy replaying the games?

 

[Shiliski]

I'm not trying to say anything bad about speedrunners, I'm just saying... If you wanted to talk about oversexualizing Peach or Zelda and how that was destroying the character, then you might have an actual point; but when people start talking about Samus "joining the bandwagon" it's like... dude, she started that bandwagon. She was one of the founding mothers of that bandwagon. Other ladies are following in her footsteps, not the other way around.

Also, it's not "destroying the character".

This. is. what. the. character. is.

If you were to make her unsexy, that would actually be changing who the character is.

I also have to question why we're still treating it as a bad thing. There are lines that shouldn't be crossed in a family-friendly Nintendo game, sure, but Zamus is nowhere near those lines.

 

[FirestormNeos]

The only way to "desexualize" Samus would be if her Zero Suit looked like this.

That looks far more impractical to fight in. Even the most uninformed person could tell you that sensible clothing doesn't block gunfire irl unless you're wearing something under it, but the zero suit looks futuristic and techno-y, so we don't make the assumption that it's not bulletproof unless proven as such. I have a gut feeling the reason we haven't seen Master Chief outside the Spartan Armor is because the demographic for that game isn't interested in seeing a guy in a tight suit unless it's for laughs.

That's not even going into the whole "Power Suit would ruin normal clothing because advanced doodads and whatnot."

P.S. All this talk about the Heels has inspired me to take a trip down memory lane and watch a few videos on the matter...

Spoiler

dragon's crown.

Edit: darn misspellings. how do they work?

 

[Z1GMA]

It's classy imo.

 

[FirestormNeos]

It's classy imo.

This is probably the simplist and most straightforward post I've seen this entire thread...

(that's a compliment, btw.)

 

[Z1GMA]

 

[Shiliski]

Heels are classy.

The only way to "desexualize" Samus would be if her Zero Suit looked like this.

That looks far more impractical to fight in. Even the most uninformed person could tell you that sensible clothing doesn't block gunfire irl unless you're wearing something under it, but the zero suit looks futuristic and techno-y, so we don't make the assumption that it's not bulletproof unless proven as such. I have a gut feeling the reason we haven't seen Master Chief outside the Spartan Armor is because the demographic for that game isn't interested in seeing a guy in a right suit unless it's for laughs.

That's not even going into the whole "Power Suit would ruin normal clothing because advanced doodads and whatnot."

P.S. All this talk about the Heels has inspired me to take a trip down memory lane and watch a few videos on the matter...

Spoiler

dragon's crown.

I agree with this 100%. The Zero Suit is practical. Think about it for a bit.

Consideration 1: Heat

Samus's suit is made out of metal. Even if you consider the fact that the suit has life support and therefore some amount of air-conditioning, that probably isn't enough to make her comfortable, it's probably only enough to keep her alive. This is before you consider that Samus goes to places like Norfair, where the heat is enough to destroy her suit if she doesn't have the right equipment to protect it (specifically the Varia Suit). There's also the fact that a lot of her equipment, especially her arm cannon, probably generates a lot of heat. So with all that combined, her power suit is probably pretty stuffy and she probably sweats a lot in it.

She's not exactly going to be wearing a sweater in those conditions. Not if she has any sanity.


Consideration 2: Chafing

Samus does a lot of running, jumping, moving all of her limbs every which-way; and since she's usually in life-or-death situations, she doesn't get to stop and adjust her clothes the moment she feels a bit uncomfortable. This is going to result in chafing, unless she wears skin-tight clothes. Loose clothing combined with a lot of running around can chaff certain parts your chest (even on guys) and also the inner parts of your thighs. In addition to being uncomfortable, she could actually start bleeding if she isn't properly dressed. She doesn't need yet another wound on top of all the others she gains on her adventures.

Skin tight clothes, such as the Zero Suit or her older swim suit, do a good job of avoiding this.


Consideration 3: Privacy

Aside from a few non-canon appearances, no one really sees Samus under the suit. In fact, it was a pretty big surprise that she was even female at all, at the end of the first game. So it doesn't really matter how scandalously she dresses. Granted, people see the Zero Suit in Smash Bros. but that's non-canon and the suit isn't really even all that fanservicey. Yes, even with the heels.


Consideration 4: Time Spent

Considering how long the typical Metroid game can go on for (even speedruns take hours) she can spend hours or even a whole day in that suit. She needs to be comfortable in it, at least comfortable enough to not be distracted by some loose shirt riding too high that she can't reach. This actually amplifies the problems listed in 1 and 2 above.


In summary, while you can complain about "bikini armor" being impractical in combat, the Zero Suit is the exact opposite of that. It is perfectly practical, especially for wearing it under her usual power suit.

 

[FirestormNeos]

^ THIS ^

and the suit isn't really even all that fanservicey. Yes, even with the heels.

Wait, isn't the whole reason this thread exists is to debate on that? (Not that I disagree in the slightest)

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

Nobody likes it when someone turns heel.

Excuse me, but you are looking at one.

I think Zero Suit Samus's heels look great, in fact they're beautiful like The Beautiful People who love Marilyn Manson, ha I got my own little wrestling joke too and its a Marilyn Manson joke in one.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Excuse me, but you are looking at one.

All jokes aside, I do wonder if people here actually know what "heel" means. =P

screw heels tho

 

[Shiliski]

All jokes aside, I do wonder if people here actually know what "heel" means. =P

screw heels tho

Heel turn. We get it.

 

[Z1GMA]

*I dun get it. I dun wear no heels.*

 

[bobadz]

In short the heels represent the most hated part of other M: the battered housewife characterization of Samus.

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

In short the heels represent the most hated part of other M: the battered housewife characterization of Samus.

Nah, people just tendo to find a scapegoat for their hatred, that's all. The heels, the beauty mark, the current Power Suit Design, etc.

 

[FirestormNeos]

Nah, people just tendo to find a scapegoat for their hatred, that's all. The heels, the beauty mark, the current Power Suit Design, etc.

I like how the Power Suit and Zero Suit are from the same game. It was weird that Brawl used Super Metroid's Power Suit but Prime 2 Onward's Zero Suit.

Doesn't help that their both from a crappy game, but it's the most recent one released, so I suppose that's a reason to use them.

 

[Knight Dude]

I'm not up in arms against the heels. I mean, sure it's a little goofy, but the amount of goofy stuff in Smash, you kind of need a strong suspension of disbelief.

To me, Zero Suit's heels are no more strange than Raiden's in Metal Gear Rising. With Zero Suit Samus, her heels act like jet boots. With Raiden, he hides freaking swords in his legs, and the blades jut out the heels.

 

[HugoBoss]

They are some what impractical, but I really don't see an issue.

 

[Canuckduck]

People complain about everything.

I remember all of the Sonic fanboys, after the reveal of Sonic Generations, who complained about Classic Sonic having a SLIGHTLY lighter shade of blue than he originally had.

Genesis

Generations

 

[RPGatWill]

practicality is subjective to the universe of the character. turnips make sence in mario, bananas make sence in dk. heels did not make sense in metroid..

This is the point I think on. Sakurai stated or at least has shown he's been trying to accurately portray characters from their own series. The level of detail put into Robin's spells alone shows this. Why then is Zero suit Samus of Metroid, what seems to be a relatively sensible and futuristic type of series (I mean, as sensible as you can be fighting a giant metal robot dragon type thing). Jet boots themselves make a lot of sense, but I fail to see why Heeled jet boots would make sense. If that could be explained in a rational way in universe, I could accept it. Now watch me having missed the post that explained just that in my first read through >_<

 

[Shiliski]

I can see how jet heels would be practical if ZSSamus uses kicks and jumps (I don't know if she does use kicks off the top of my head, but everybody jumps in smash). From an engineering perspective, you'd need some kind of cylinder or cone to have a proper exhaust port/ propulsion source, so a heel would make more sense than a flat sole. Also, you'd want the propulsion to line up as closely to the center of mass, which is easier to do if you have it at the ball of the foot instead of, say, in the middle of the foot. I'll admit that some of that is moot because you can swing your legs in a wide arc (especially if you're in peak condition as Samus is) but putting them there does give better control than an exhaust port in the center of a flat sole. Putting the jet anywhere else on the foot would result in Kerbal Space Program levels of rocket science failure.

It makes sense also that the power suit doesn't need heels, because (A) it weighs a lot more and therefore needs the more firm support that comes from boots and (B) the actual exhaust port can fit behind where Samus's foot is, or possibly bend around her arch, therefore forgoing the problem of "the propulsion tube and Samus's foot can't occupy the same space" altogether.

Original Zero Suit should not have heels because it is not, by desgin, a combat suit; but if it was to be converted to be used in combat (such as Smash), then jet heels make sense.

Also, an energy-based jet pack on the back would be a terrible idea because it would burn her back every time she used it. Actually, if she were to make a jet pack that she wore behind her, she'd want around her abdomen because that's close to where her center of gravity would be. However, that'd still have the problem of burning her legs every time, and putting the jets on the heels solves that problem. Not to mention instead of hearing complaints like "It looks like she's wearing fetish foot wear" you'd get "it looks like she's farting all the time".

That said I can't imagine the level of training and practice that Samus would have to go through in order to use them effectively. Walking on heels itself is hard enough. Maybe she gets by because she had to learn similar skills when using her suit, but even then she's got to have some pretty strong legs to be able to keep them in the right position during flight. Also, there are other engineering problems such as "how did she manage to get that thing so small?", but such stuff tends to get handwaved anyways.

 

[RPGatWill]

This is the point I think on. Sakurai stated or at least has shown he's been trying to accurately portray characters from their own series. The level of detail put into Robin's spells alone shows this. Why then is Zero suit Samus of Metroid, what seems to be a relatively sensible and futuristic type of series (I mean, as sensible as you can be fighting a giant metal robot dragon type thing). Jet boots themselves make a lot of sense, but I fail to see why Heeled jet boots would make sense. If that could be explained in a rational way in universe, I could accept it. Now watch me having missed the post that explained just that in my first read through >_<

Not to reply to my own post here, butt another thread someone was kind enough to link a video that pretty much explained why it could make sense why they would need heels for the suit. I have dropped said critic in respect for the well constructed argument.

 

[Shiliski]

Not to reply to my own post here, butt another thread someone was kind enough to link a video that pretty much explained why it could make sense why they would need heels for the suit. I have dropped said critic in respect for the well constructed argument.

Such a video exists? That might be neat to watch. Mind if I ask for the link?

 

[Alakaslam]

Feh, and chupazi upon this

 

[RPGatWill]

Such a video exists? That might be neat to watch. Mind if I ask for the link?

Of course! here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fA7PHtpzSFQ
It's not a full explanation, but the portion about the heels needing the cylinder to create the propulsion created enough doubt for me that I figured it was best to withdraw my complaint and think on it some more.

 

[Shiliski]

Of course! here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fA7PHtpzSFQ
It's not a full explanation, but the portion about the heels needing the cylinder to create the propulsion created enough doubt for me that I figured it was best to withdraw my complaint and think on it some more.

Thanks!

I have love/hate (well actually hate is too strong of a word) feelings about Gaijin Goomba but I can't deny he makes a lot of good points.