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What to do against MK...

Kiyuzoh

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
61
Location
New Brunswick, NJ
I would like to see where this thread goes, maybe because I have pretty bad experiences with MK, so I have like no ideas on how to deal with him. Although I don't play Brawl anymore, I'm still curious if I ever go back. (I play Brawl+, for the record. NOT AN ENDORSEMENT)
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 1, 2008
Messages
2,536
Location
Passion Central
I would like to see where this thread goes, maybe because I have pretty bad experiences with MK, so I have like no ideas on how to deal with him. Although I don't play Brawl anymore, I'm still curious if I ever go back. (I play Brawl+, for the record. NOT AN ENDORSEMENT)
K, its very surprising how this match up may be more even then we ever thought...especially me...

THIS.
10THISALLCAPSs
JYES!!!!
 

luke_atyeo

Smash Hero
Joined
May 10, 2008
Messages
7,215
it would be pretty good to see the look on someones face when you pull out luigi against metaknight and beat them.
 

crewster

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 18, 2008
Messages
1,660
Location
UK
Pol, are you turning into boss? with the "..."s. Next thing you know you will equal main luigi and mario.
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 1, 2008
Messages
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Location
Passion Central
upB OOS (Out of shield, I just found out) is important//...

Next update or post will be a whole teaching on the match up...

Did you know you can tech chase savagely with dThrow after an immediate uAir?

Did you know you can get a dashUpSmash right after the dThrow from 0-40% 80% of the time? (vids will explain better in visual form)

Did you know you should abuse the upBs awkward vertical hitbox savagely? While upB OOS hits more than you would ever believe an the only way to win certain match ups is to upB things you would never before...after vids your ability to see upB opportunities will explode since the hitbox has never been seen this way.

Also, properly done upSmashes override the tornado(Just like d3s upTilt) Vids will explain better, must be done with the ending of the smash with the head going towards your opponent to stop it at anytime.

....moar too come, so much ive learned. Just need my sd card...., itll be ready by friday night
 

napZzz

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Messages
5,294
Location
cg, MN
Theres a better strategy

You take the controller of the mk player, unplug it, throw it across the room, then kill them.
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
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Apr 1, 2008
Messages
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Passion Central
lol ill try.

actually I will...ill post every vid i have against Mk(wins and losses) so you can pick up everything i do and what you should do.

key right now is to change your perspective on recovery...cuz that against mk is a *****
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 1, 2008
Messages
2,536
Location
Passion Central
Theres a better strategy

You take the controller of the mk player, unplug it, throw it across the room, then kill them.
I wish...I wish.,...

Im done playin wit snake against him...I dont feel as much control...Luigi beats almost every character close range, best believe that
 

boss8

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
9,337
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where ever I please,im a f***in boss!!
i have the recovery of a bird.......the power of a plane.....the cape of confusion.....the up-B of a train......dont get caught...keep shielding please....i'll never go wrong... with Mario and WEEG...leave you scared in your mind....as i casually walk.....dont unshield!!!.....or GG next stock...


basically up B anything with lagg from MK shield his glide attack or powershield it then upB OOS....

also grabs play a big factor now that you've got the MK worried about being up-b'ed.....

also read his airdodges.....

luigi's NAIR goes through the shuttle loop nad the top near tornado...

luigi's fireballs also can stop tornado......causing him to forword B punish his lagg with an up-B as he lands.....

basically you gonna wanna keep MK Shielding the whole time to a point where he thinks its safe...but its really not......
 

napZzz

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Messages
5,294
Location
cg, MN
I've done snake vs. mk enough it feels easy for the most part.

If you know the match up well and they dont, its not that bad. But you better hope that the mk doesn't know how to shut out luigi, because its not that hard if they catch on to what your doing.

I think its almost harder to fight snakes for luigi :S at least I've had more trouble with them.
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 1, 2008
Messages
2,536
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Passion Central
Snake is far easier than Mk...

An no, no luigi should worry about ****. Were not the one dying at 45%.

Yea, the fireballs stop nado an lol yea cuz of there previous nado inputs they go right inot side b you must learn to punish this hard.

Advanced **** is stopping nado with uSmash an upBing anything and everything
 

.i/p.

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 17, 2009
Messages
63
jajaj good topic polmex...tengo que hacer uno asi para yoshi XD
 

Kiyuzoh

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
61
Location
New Brunswick, NJ
What would you say is the best way to recover as Luigi against a Meta Knight? I can see why you wouldn't Green Missile very often, but what usually gets past him, in your experience?
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
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Messages
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Passion Central
Well Boss should do the same, as in play a bunch of friendlies with any Mks around him and somehow record them all then send them to me or post them so i can put them here cuz thats whats im about to do.

But, 2 good ways....

a. Jump than tornado as high as you can than use smart air dodges or tornados....

B. Hold a side b or go real low than jump upB sweet spot...

problem with B is that sometimes they hit you during upB or some bull**** happens.

Best way is A, but you must change your recovery almost everytime.
 

Kiyuzoh

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
61
Location
New Brunswick, NJ
If an insane Meta Knight goes off-stage to gimp you, what is the best decision? Tornado past him, well-timed aerials, air dodges, etc. I usually just n-air them out of the way and do a rising tornado or sweet-spotted up-B.
 

hippiedude92

Smash Hero
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Jun 23, 2008
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Wishing Apex 2012 happened again.
Polmex... Im ur #1 fanboy (noh0m0).... but you musnt forget...important fsmash (mostly utilted) kills at the best possible %..... ive won tourneys because of fsmash......
lovin this thread mucho.. cant wait for the good stuff... will come bak this thread tmr...
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
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Messages
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Passion Central
If an insane Meta Knight goes off-stage to gimp you, what is the best decision? Tornado past him, well-timed aerials, air dodges, etc. I usually just n-air them out of the way and do a rising tornado or sweet-spotted up-B.
Polmex... Im ur #1 fanboy (noh0m0).... but you musnt forget...important fsmash (mostly utilted) kills at the best possible %..... ive won tourneys because of fsmash......
lovin this thread mucho.. cant wait for the good stuff... will come bak this thread tmr...
About to answer all but these i will now...

fireball into immediate fair works soooo much...

also di into them as you meet tornado as hard as you can....while di'ing towards stage an ^

Dont worry, fsmash prob the 2nd best kill move against Mk.

1. upB
2. Fsmash(up-tilted)
3.Fsmash(normal)
4. Nair.
5.Bair.
6. upSmash
 

crewster

Smash Lord
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Jul 18, 2008
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UK
I don't use the usmash for KOs unlessthey reach high dammage and I accidently do it.
 

BigLøu

Smash Lord
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Sep 21, 2007
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Marietta, GA
I don't use the usmash for KOs unlessthey reach high dammage and I accidently do it.
usmash can kill mk below 100, and its more reliable for me cuz it has more range and coems out quicker, not to mention that it can go through nado when ur under it.
 

hippiedude92

Smash Hero
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Wishing Apex 2012 happened again.
*on wii-net*
Omg polmex dude your ****. Saw the 1st match. You were ****** 1st stock so well.
From what i learned all the stuff u stated are def important. You just seem to run hot and cold all the time. You actually conditioned sebrivik pretty well. You just didnt see it lol. If you jab, he`ll either shield/shuttle loop. You could just bait his upb by jab>Shield>grab. Perfect bait right there. IIRC sebrvik is top wario too. Your sliding jabs were nice too.

You know I wish u uploaded these b4 my tourney on fri+sat. I forgot how flexible he was until u showed it....
 

PolMex23

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i gotta build a habit not to jab after side dodging a grab...must force yourself to upB ...

I had so many chances where i predicted the grab an side dodged yet ruined the kill with a jab...

Thats one more tip xD.

Ty hippie
 

LuigiKing

Smash Lord
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Feb 27, 2008
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Towson MD/Moscow ID
usmash can kill mk below 100, and its more reliable for me cuz it has more range and coems out quicker, not to mention that it can go through nado when ur under it.
Usmash OOS ***** so hard you don't even know. You can bait people into its stupid range quite easily, and the sweetspot kills nice and early too. Against characters without a projectile Usmash OOS is like... the best thing. Lol. :chuckle:
 

CR4SH

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 22, 2008
Messages
1,814
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Louisville Ky.
Wow, just watched the vids. Sebrik has NO idea how to gimp luigi. He didn't get any farther than a jump off the stage. That's just pitiful.
 

CO18

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
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In Your Mom
lol Polmex is a beast. Seibrik knows how to gimp luigi. Hes the master of knowing the most random gay things you can do to any character.

Polmex is just a man.
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
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Thank you lunes an Co, hate runs strong in cr4sh xD...

But upB OOS is much better =)

Anyways, next time...Will be different. After playing Lade, im learning to deal with the different type of mk strategies.
 

PolMex23

Smash Champion
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*on wii-net*
Omg polmex dude your ****. Saw the 1st match. You were ****** 1st stock so well.
From what i learned all the stuff u stated are def important. You just seem to run hot and cold all the time. You actually conditioned sebrivik pretty well. You just didnt see it lol. If you jab, he`ll either shield/shuttle loop. You could just bait his upb by jab>Shield>grab. Perfect bait right there. IIRC sebrvik is top wario too. Your sliding jabs were nice too.

You know I wish u uploaded these b4 my tourney on fri+sat. I forgot how flexible he was until u showed it....
I would never have played like this without your knowledge anyways. To be honest I read all your stuff (which I never really did cuz i was cocky an arrogant) to better his speed and...

Flexibility.

1. Read the grab. Punish with upB
2. Abuse OOS everything!!! (NAIR OOS IS AMAZING!!!!)
3. Yes, rely on jab grab even in yummy upB opportunities because against Mks its not realiable.

edit: i think i missed 5 of #1. Opportunities...
 

elheber

Smash Lord
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Aug 23, 2008
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Los Angeles, California
NNID
elheber
You can't fight MK if you don't know how to FFAD (fastfall airdodge). For MK, you space with SH dAir FFADs. Polmex and Boss do it habitually, but I was surprised to find nobody mentioned it yet in this thread.

MK loses a lot of momentum when he shorthops in the air, so if you space, the only attacks that should reach you are the ones he does just as he runs up to you for a grounded or SH attack. You keep him and those attacks at bay with spaced SH dAir FFADs, just like Polmex and Boss have shown in their videos. You don't approach with it, you just space (except when you want to mix it up a bit)... MK's do all the work for you and just run INTO the dAirs like moths to a flame. If you do approach with it, you might as well either FF nAir instead of FFAD, or follow the FFAD with a buffered Jab (MK doesn't give Luigi any large time windows to attack).

If their approaches aren't working as well and begin to get too defensive, SH dAir to Grounded Cyclone into/past MK. Like with Falco/Fox, the SH Aerial to Cyclone is actually pretty effective against MK even though he has disjointed hitboxes.

MK's attacks deal relatively more knockback than damage anyway. Luigi will get KO'd more by getting gimped while recovering than from getting uncontrollably launched offscreen. You won't die from percentage. So those little attacks and Mach Tornadoes are just dust on your shoulder. It's his Shuttle Loops, dSmashes, etc. that are dangerous... because he chases you off stage.

So, inevitably, every Luigi here that wants to improve his game against MK needs to recover better. On the other side, MK does die from percentage. It's being at 60% and seeing you wildly throw fSmashes around like grenades that scares him.

Man, I didn't plan on writing this much. I need a summary of what I said now: Space with SH dAir FFADs. SH Aerial to Cyclones and FFAD Buffers work well if you wanna be aggresive. Don't sweat his small attacks... just dust your shoulders off and continue spacing. Improve your recoveries. What else? Oh yeah! fSmash if he's too agresive. Like a madman. Good times.
 
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