What SSB4 means for Brawl

[FoxBlaze71]

Link to original post: [drupal=4484]What SSB4 means for Brawl[/drupal]



Anyone thought that SSB4 will ruin brawl? Brawl doesn't have the competitive perfection and timelessness that Melee does. Sakurai is probably going out of his was to **** over SSB4. But brawl won't be any better because of that. Opinions?

 

[Teran]

Well it depends.

If SSB4 has less competitive merit than Brawl, than a lot of Brawl players will stick with Brawl and refuse to make the transition, but it will still lose a significant player base.

 

[Blissard]

Sakurai is probably going out of his was to **** over SSB4.

Why does everyone keep bashing Sakurai? Like...realize that he actually created the series...including Smash 64 and Melee. Not saying you in particular, but people act like he's some horrible inhuman being whose sole purpose is to ruin a series that he made, lol. If he made a Brawl a casual game, then the competitive community should just accept that it wasn't tailored for them.

Regarding SSBB, the majority of competitive players hates it cause of MK. I honestly don't know why he isn't banned. BBR decided that a super-majority (66%) had to agree to ban him, and iirc, we only got like 60%. The number of pro-ban players has seemingly increased from then, but the almighty BBR wants to play dictator and disallow us from discussing it and just swallow their decision.

Let's pray for a better future. >.<

 

[finalark]

Why does everyone keep bashing Sakurai? Like...realize that he actually created the series...including Smash 64 and Melee. Not saying you in particular, but people act like he's some horrible inhuman being whose sole purpose is to ruin a series that he made, lol. If he made a Brawl a casual game, then the competitive community should just accept that it wasn't tailored for them.

I have to agree. I personally think that Brawl is a very fun party game and I can accept that it was made to be casually played. I'm not going to throw a fit because of some sort of feeling of entitlement most players have of getting a competitive smash. And what most people don't seem to realize is that everything that made melee competitive was exploitation of glitches and physics. People don't want a new smash, they want melee expansion packs.

/endrant

 

[Feels]

Most of the Brawl players will transition over, but many will stay with Brawl and Melee. People usually just play the most recent title.

 

[Shorts]

I want to know what this will mean for Melee players. I suppose it depends, on how the game plays.

 

[Firus]

Regarding SSBB, the majority of competitive players hates it cause of MK.

I'm pretty sure that isn't actually the main issue. MK is an issue to some extent, but there are a lot of gameplay issues that cause people to have a problem with the game. Balance isn't the only problem.

And what most people don't seem to realize is that everything that made melee competitive was exploitation of glitches and physics. People don't want a new smash, they want melee expansion packs.

Agreed that too many people just want Melee 2.0, but Melee was competitive for far more than that. For one, not all ATs involved any manipulation of anything (L-canceling was purposefully in the game, for example). ATs aren't the only reason Melee was competitive, either. In its physics and general speed it's far more competitive than the alternative in Brawl, not to mention the lack of tripping.

Someone who actually plays Melee competitively could probably expand on it more than that, but ATs are not at all the only reason Melee is more competitive.

I want to know what this will mean for Melee players. I suppose it depends, on how the game plays.

Unless the game ends up being more competitive than Brawl (which is something I doubt will happen), I'd imagine it won't affect Melee much at all. People who have stuck with Melee three years after a new game's been released aren't likely to go to SSB4 just because it's the new game.

 

[professor mgw]

If SSB4 is competitive though & better than melee, I expect most melee players to switch over. 11 years is quite enough.

 

[t3h Icy]

Brawl will end up the middle child that nobody loves, while Melee players will play Melee, and the young guns will play SSB4.

 

[Life]

Brawl will end up the middle child that nobody loves, while Melee players will play Melee, and the young guns will play SSB4.

Doesn't 64 already have this role, sort of? It's not _unplayed_ but it's minor compared to its sequels.

 

[A Pimp Named Slickback]

You'll see a lot of drama, with all the "hardcore" Brawl players proclaiming their game to be superior and more competitive, dismissing SSB4 as uncompetitive and far worse than its predecessor. They'll bash SSB4 constantly, eventually degrading into quick quips like "SSB4 sucks" or "**** SSB4." The irony of the situation will be lost on them.

Meanwhile the new breed of smash players will play SSB4 and claim that it's far too early to judge SSB4's competitiveness and to just "give it time." Some big name Brawl players will move on to SSB4 for the potential tournament prize money, causing SSB4 players to proclaim the validity of their game because they have some famous players.

The feud between the two games will continue on for several months, leaving the Brawl discussion forums in a wasteland of brawl vs. ssb4 threads. Soon the two sides will tire of debating and eventually ignore each other, both harboring an innate yet still omnipresent hatred of the other game. Occasionally this hatred will reveal itself at braw/ssb4 tournaments where projector and stream capabilities are limited. Each time this happens, a shortlived mini-feud will spark on the forums, but will be drowned out by the incessant yet inevitable threads of "new" ATs which people "discovered" pathetically hoping for their name to be used in the AT's name.

Meanwhile the melee scene will laugh at the whole situation, sarcastically pointing the ironies wherever possible through some misplaced false superiority. The scene will then wither and eventually die, becoming a mere side event at some tournament which has extra time to spare.

 

[Javon89]

I think it's gonna work like the Street Fighter series from 3rd strike to SSFIV: AE

Some Melee (3rd strike) players will flock to SSB4 (SSFIV:AE), then the Brawl players (SSFIV/SFIV) will happily transition to SSB4 ( SSFIV:AE)

 

[Falconv1.0]

Do not compare Melee to 3rd Strike. Ever.

 

[solitonmedic]

Do not compare Melee to 3rd Strike. Ever.

Ditto.
10101010101010

 

[Lightosia]

Well it depends.

If SSB4 has less competitive merit than Brawl, than a lot of Brawl players will stick with Brawl and refuse to make the transition, but it will still lose a significant player base.

How can it has less competitive merit than Brawl?

I can only see this if you can't remove itens/everyone has an infinite/air tripping is confirmed.

 

[Pseudomaniac]

Sakurai has hinted that SSB4 will be more competitive than Brawl (he mentioned an increased focus on balance) so I think Brawl's community will shrink a bit. Of course, that's not going to keep Brawl\Melee fanboys from blindly bashing the other games, but I'm hoping SSB4 will be the best of the series so far.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

If SSB4 sucks **** as much as brawl did, no one will care that melee is so ancient.

 

[Teran]

How can it has less competitive merit than Brawl?

I can only see this if you can't remove itens/everyone has an infinite/air tripping is confirmed.

I can have less competitive merit if the character balance goes way off and some game mechanic choices are made.

I dunno I'm just saying it as a hyporthetical after all Brawl had bright ideas like tripping.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I personally think SSB4 will be better than Brawl for a number of reasons:

1. Its online will undoubtedly be better. Brawl was Sakurai's first project that used online features and he openly admitted that he didn't know which end was up which is why it ended up taking up about 15% of the development time.Sakurai now has a lot more experience with online play and the Wii U will have a much more stable online infastructure to work with than the Wii.

2. There will be more focus on the multiplayer. According to Sakurai, it's estimated that nearly 70% of Brawl's development was focused on the SSE and that seems to be one of Sakurai's biggest regrets with Brawl because, in the end, he wasn't able to create the immersive one player that he envisioned despite how much time he poured into it. With that being said, he'll probably be taking Miyamoto's advice this time around and focusing more on the multiplayer.

3. Character development will involve more of the staff this time around. For the past three games, Sakurai has been one of the few people who has worked with the characters and been in charge of things like character balance. As someone already said, he's already said that it will be more of a team effort from now on.

4. Sakurai actually wants to work on SSB4. With Brawl, he really didn't enjoy the project until it was just about done in early 2008 and he was reflecting on all the people he had worked with and all the connections he had made. For Brawl, Sakurai was pretty much black mailed into and I think he was openly resentful of having to work on it. If you ask me, this kind of shows with some aspects in Brawl like tripping.

As for what SSB4 will do to Brawl, I don't think things will change too much unless SSB4 is overwhelmingly better/worse than Brawl. There will be people who will flock to SSB4 and there will be some who stick with Brawl/Melee. In other words, it'll pretty much be the same as it is for any sequel to a game that has at least some competitive merit to it.

 

[A Pimp Named Slickback]

Sakurai has hinted that SSB4 will be more competitive than Brawl (he mentioned an increased focus on balance) so I think Brawl's community will shrink a bit. Of course, that's not going to keep Brawl\Melee fanboys from blindly bashing the other games, but I'm hoping SSB4 will be the best of the series so far.

it won't be, so don't get your hopes up.

if deep competitive and action-packed gameplay is what you're looking for, look for it elsewhere.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

If SSB4 were being made on a console that offered a traditional controller and was not intent on making something for both the 3DS and WiiU, I would be hopeful for the game.

But for now, I think you could make a wonderful game, but it would be ruined by the fact that the controllers suck. Has anyone heard of competitive fighters on handhelds? I have never heard of a large community that has taken up something like 3DS street fighter.

The WiiU itself is less than desirable right now. You have to move around with something from the PSP and 3DS, the slider. Then there is the price spec. The game system will easily run $300+. I suppose that's probably not an issue for diehard fans, but you can get a full set-up for melee for like $100. It's probably less of a problem if the next smash game arrives a couple years after the release of WiiU since people will have brought the system.

Anyway, tl;dr
>Hardware for the new smash is a hard sell on a competitive scene. Brawl likely to stay around.

 

[Teran]

Well I imagine since the WiiU is compatible with Wii controllers you can use the Classic Controller, which is by no means a terrible controller.

I must say though it'd take some getting used to.

 

[Big-Cat]

Don't forget that someone is bound to use the USB ports to make wired controllers.

 

[Teran]

They should make GC controllers for WiiU.

It may lack functions that are convenient for some games, but for others like Smash it is absolutely perfect. Also, imo it's the most comfortable controller I've ever held, its ergonomics are awesome.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

The Classic controller has those wireless issues associated with it. Although, I am not sure if it would plug into the screened controller or a wiimote. I really don't want to have to worry about money for batteries again -_-

But I do want my gamecube controller. Like you said, it's the most comfortable fit of really any controller out there.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

This will make me sound like a noob, but I've been enemies with the GC controller since 2001. I don't play melee much because of that. However, I fight in brawl fine with the CC Pro.

 

[Sol9000]

this will make me sound like a noob, but i've been enemies with the gc controller since 2001. I don't play melee much because of that. However, i fight in brawl fine with the cc pro.

i can relate. My gc controller sucks eggs!

 

[FoxBlaze71]

That post is ancient. I've adjusted since then.

 

[Sol9000]

That post is ancient. I've adjusted since then.

And my GC controller is still awful. It has a habit of going down as super speed whenever I so much as touch the joystick in that direction

 

[Aaven]

I'm actually kind of glad that Brawl was so flawed, because I don't want the Smash community to be jumping back and forth between games, Melee was a great game so some people held on to it instead of moving on to Brawl.

If Sm4sh is a great medium between the two we could get all the Smashers playing the same Smash title, and we can finally get rid of the silly Melee Vs. Brawl arguments.

 

[Baskerville]

By the time Smash 4 is revealed, I'll expect A LOT of *****ing from the Melee Community, becoming bitter and crying their eyes out that it isn't Melee 2.0 and will create some shallow excuse to take it seriously like Project M.

 

[Master Xanthan]

I just want tripping to be gone, whenever I play I usually get screwed by tripping like once a match, its so annoying. I don't even play in tournaments or anything, but it still really annoys me.

 

[UltiMario]

By the time Smash 4 is revealed, I'll expect A LOT of *****ing from the Melee Community, becoming bitter and crying their eyes out that it isn't Melee 2.0 and will create some shallow excuse to take it seriously like Project M.

Dunno what you're talking about.

WiiU is going to be a **** console for serious gaming without real controllers anyways and if at this point it isn't clear, Melee player are fine to just play Melee lol. They'll just be laughing at the people with any hope the game won't suck.

 

[Muhti]

I cant not wait till SSB4, though when I get rid of my Wii games, the only ones Im keeping is SSBB and MKWii. Hopefully I will do a better job with Luigi then I did in Brawl.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

By the time Smash 4 is revealed, I'll expect A LOT of *****ing from the Melee Community, becoming bitter and crying their eyes out that it isn't Melee 2.0 and will create some shallow excuse to take it seriously like Project M.

I'm pretty sure 99% of Melee players have completely lost faith in Sakurai to make a well built Smash game by now. I don't really see how you think PM is an excuse to take Brawl seriously, if anything Brawl is what's turning a lot of Melee players away from Project M.

 

[Baskerville]

If Melee players still want to play Melee, go ahead and do so, some people will eventually not even care for it anymore and will hop on to Smash 4 or any other fighting game.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

LOL. SSB4 is going to Brawl 2.0: Hyper Ultra Super Gay version. Melee players may go to a game like Tekken or SF or MvC, but they've been here for all these years and I don't think a few more will change that. Despite lack of an online mode, Melee is still the great technical fighter is was pre-SSBB. Brawl**** be damned.

 

[---]

Pretty sure SSB4 will be different than either Melee or Brawl, but closer to Brawl in the end. Just as long as tripping is gone and we can finally end the annoying Melee vs Brawl debates I'll be happy.

I do wonder though, what Melee would be like though if Sakurai didn't rush the game and got the time that he wanted to work on it. The Smash series would certainly be a lot different.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

^I've wondered that too. I think Sakurai sometimes looks at Melee as some kind of personal bane since he had to rush it. If he didn't it would be another Brawl.

It's funny. After about two short years of SSB64 he creates a masterpiece despite the fact it was rushed. Then, after about 6 years, he creates a piece of complete ****.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Then, after about 6 years, he creates a piece of complete ****.

Taken from wikipedia, and this is pretty much how I remember it.

At the pre-E3 2005 press conference, Nintendo president Satoru Iwata announced that the next installment of Super Smash Bros. was soon to be in development for its next console and would be a launch title with Wi-Fi compatibility for online play.[3] The announcement was a surprise to Sakurai, who left HAL Laboratory in 2003. He was not informed of Nintendo's intent to release another Smash Bros. game, despite the fact that Iwata told Sakurai shortly after his resignation from HAL that if a new Smash game was to be developed, he would want Sakurai to again serve as director. It was not until after the conference that Iwata requested that Sakurai hold a private meeting with him, where he was asked to be involved as Brawl's director.[4] Sakurai agreed to become director, and development of the game began in October 2005.

Yes, 6 years to make Brawl, totally. Glad you're trying so hard to spread the truf, Foxblaze.

BTW, you could be 100% right about everything and ever and still no one would listen to you because you manage to actually be more abrasive and rude than I am for ****'s sake.