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Walgreens Mafia - DRAW game - The mod ****ed up pretty bad...=/

Rajam

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newbtown wouldn't say that. newbscum would ;)

(it's mostly the apathy with which you said it)

rajam, give his thoughts on sokr, gheb, and july. ideally based on the whole thread, but if you still want to claim to have only read half the game, then at least gives thoughts based on that half. don't ignore this - i know you're going to read it soon.
Sokr: scum. I agree with all the times he has been called newbscum. Undecisive, hidden. Also if he flips scum I think his scummates are kind of newbies too. Will explain the latter only after eventual flips, but I think most people should know why.

Gheb: town. His reads and mine are very similar. Haven't seen him with scummy intentions; his case on Sokr didn't have reaching, or trying to pass antitown tells as scum ones, or out-of-context quotes, nor other "bad" elements.

July: null leaning slightly town. Having a hard time reading her intent, and doesn't have much content. I have seen more town tells than scum tells though, although minimal of both.
 

Rajam

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What are you even saying. That for example didn't even make sense, and didn't pertain to me.

If I was making you out to be scum, Rajam, would I not have voted you and advocated EVERYONE to vote for you? I am calling you useless, your scumminess isn't that high imo. You are just so useless at this point, your lynch would hardly make a difference except clear up your slot, something I'd gladly do.

You also have hardly done anything to help the game's advancement. If anything, you constantly keep making us read back and fall back into stuff we've already discussed before, and more often than not do you bring up stuff that was already answered a few pages later than what you were reading.
WIFOM. Why would scum be so outloud and the principal spokesman in the lynch of a townie?

Are you backpedaling?

#419 and #439:
The usage of the word "but" when referring my slot indicates you shifted your main motive of wanting me lynched from useless to scummy

Note also that between these two post, he has the exact same argument for me, yet he increases the color's scumness from orange to red. I'll assume it's due to my #434 in between? yet you don't address it at all, neither explicitly mention it for increasing the color's scumness


All the yellow just sums towards what I said also in yellow in my #540. You're trying to keep me high on the lynch list, as high as Sokr which is pure scumness, and me, based mainly for being mostly useless as you yourself are saying here
 

Rajam

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Saw this when looking only posts from you:

Nope, never played with him before, all I know about him is that he was scum in Fire & Lightning where he did the exact same thing of lagging behind constantly, which is why I'd be very happy to lynch him as well.
...so wait; you want me dead because I'm behind and catching up like I did in F&L?? For the record, two things:

1.- Me being behind and catching up in F&L was not faked
2.- In different degrees, I've gotten behind and had to catch up during D1 in every single game of Mafia I have ever played

How much of your motives for wanting me dead are based on me "doing the same" that I did in F&L? This is important so answer this
 

Asdioh

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July: null leaning slightly town. Having a hard time reading her intent, and doesn't have much content. I have seen more town tells than scum tells though, although minimal of both.
What's the difference between a July scumtell and a July towntell? Can you show an example of one, or both? After all the games I've played with her, I still don't know. The only thing I remember is that people say she's "honest" when she's town, which is hard for me to determine.
 

asianaussie

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mmm you already had a scum pick by this post, so, why didn't you vote? a vote count was just previous to this post so it's not like you couldn't know if Sokr was in risk of dying or not
i don't throw my votes around easily

im always like this, look at any of my games

wtf rajam is playing seriously, this might be irksome
 

mentosman8

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So many multiposts over and over >_< I'll be honest, I'm a bit hazier on this game than I should be(i know how I feel about players but not as much WHY as I normally do). I agree with the thought that day can end soon and I'll take care of a full re-read and such over Night. Still up for Sokr lynch today, not gonna put mah vote down yet though.
 

#HBC | Gorf

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Wait can like somebody gimme a general nonbiased chronological rundown on what's been going on just so I can like think about all that shiz when I reread, it'd most definitely help.
 

Rockin

Juggies <3
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Day 1

Rajam (5) - T-block, Kantrip, July, Asianaussie, Sokr

T-block (1) - Gorf

Sokr (2) - Gheb, Jim Morrison,

Asdioh (1) - Red Ryu

Jim Morrison (1) - Rajam

Not Voting - Mentosman, Asdioh

With 12 players, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is in Jan. 28th
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

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also want to note most people are fairly null to me, and i have been keeping up with the game (this is just me playing mafia, sadly)

towniest are probably t-block and jim morrison/july though i haven't read july's most recent string of posts

rajam is dumb for stupid, overly commanding posts (which he doesn't even try to enforce, jeez) and being a general burden (though i dunno if anyone is taking him seriously), but idunno if he's actually scum, a lot of what he says is merely detached from the game, not overly scummy

scummiest im not 100% sure, aside from rajam im going to read sokr, t-block and maybe gorf in the morning since when i think 'scum' those three tentatively come to mind

and ffs my user has no capitals in it
I don't even know what your saying here that makes him scummy.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

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Guys, reread Asdioh, is he taking stances that aren't safe and not posting a lot of fluff, like me vs T-Block, why did he pick a side out of nowhere?

Why did he wait for most of his stances to be made until others gave them? I don't think he took a direct stance on Sokr and Rajam right away until others did it.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

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Starting from the beginning, instead of writing down what happens page-by-page I'm writing thoughts on specific players as they occur.
I stopped partway through page 11, I haven't had time to read the game since that point in-depth, but I'll get to it over the course of the next couple days.



Red_Ryu
The first thing I need to get out of the way with RR is his immediate miller counterclaim. The flavor makes just about as much sense as T-block's did for miller status. The CC and vote on TB make sense in the context of him being a miller. I have a LOT of trouble seeing scum RR counterclaiming miller like he did. Look at the time of the posts, it was about 3.5 hours between T-block's claim and Red Ruy's claim, at the beginning of the game. I would be willing to bet that RR wasn't lurking the thread during that time, thinking "should I counterclaim?" he probably just read what happened and CC'd. That heavily implies no communication with scummates, and I would imagine scum RR would consult with scummates before doing something like that. The fact that T-block later retracts his claim just reinforces the evidence that RR is miller. Is this good enough reason to just label RR as town and set him aside? I don't know, since I noted that his sudden absence during the time that T-block was getting pressure was scummy, though I don't know why he wasn't there.
...Ok, he has a string of posts on page 10. I don't have much to say on them, except that they're obviously catchup-y, and... I don't like them. They culminate in #405 with a vote on me, with little reasoning aside from pointing out a couple of my least helpful (though still amazingly helpful of course) posts and saying I'm noncommital. Overall impression: if it weren't for the claim that seems EXTREMELY unlikely to come from scum, I wouldn't be liking his slot right now. As it stands, unwilling to lynch him toDay, and obviously don't want a Cop wasted on him as it should turn up guilty. Would like to see more from him, including some justification for his vote on me (I'm being uncomfortably reminded of when he was scum in B&H and kept calling me scum, without ever producing his promised case)

Rajam
Getting a read on him is hard because most of his posts have been "out of date." #345 is his first with some substance, and it makes me shudder. He seems to be more caught up and posting more in the past two pages, but I'll see for myself soon enough. In the meantime, his lynch seems good for town.

Sokr
Comes into the thread leaving little impression. Some bickering with Kantrip, which is a bit distracting. As of page 3/12, the most I see from him that I can remember is that he thinks RR's play is town due to meta reasons of scumRR being unwilling to put himself out there. Nothing really "scummy" from Sokr yet. Dislke his #312, think he's been a presence up until that point without actually doing much. His #344 is silly. His #358 is silly. His posts are getting more "Wut" in my eyes. His #365 is an obvious backstep, whereas townSokr from Britches and Hose wasn't afraid to speak his mind. (admittedly, the townSokr I'm thinking about had already proven himself to be the town vig, but still). Overall impression: leaning scum, would have no qualms about lynching him toDay.

mentosman8
He has few posts, so I have to talk about them in some detail, especially since I can't remember what he's done. Judging by this, I think it's safe to assume mentos has a townread on RR at this point (as in right now, since T-block retracted his claim)? The rest of his #159 consists of mostly telling Kantrip some general mafia advice, which is a null at best. The rest of his post is kind of wishy-washy, with some dislike of Kantrip and Rajam at the end. Overall, not leaving a good impression on me.God dammit, former me. Yeah it's cool that he's trying to stop the distractions, but that's pretty much a nulltell. At least I called him out on not voting I guess?

In his #199, he warns to be careful of Kantrip's power, which I approve of because it made me think of the implications, should the power be misused. He also gives me his current scumreads of T-block and Rajam. His #207, showing more frustration at the possible misuse of Kantrip's role, makes it look like he hasn't considered the possibility of Kantrip's claim being a gambit. It's up to you guys to interpret that as a scummy or townie mindset. Further wishy-washiness on T-block, dislike. Overall impression: not enough from him to decide if he's overall town or scum. Would not lynch toDay, would be a good target for investigation soon.

Jim Morrison
kinda on page 9 and haven't written anything about him yet... time to say "I like him" without justification! Just look at his avatar!
also this is a blatant towntell:

T-block
I believed his miller claim at first and had a townread on him from the start, and even after he retracted his claim I believe his intentions were townie, even though it sort of blew up on his face. Claims to be fine with a Rajam lynch in his very first post, and even after Kantrip's claim he says he's fine with that. Seems legit. I don't need to write more on TB, I think he's town, and all arguments on how he could be scum have already been made in thread.

Gheb_01
On page 7 and haven't had much to say about Gheb. He's popped into the thread and given some comments that don't generally seem scummy to me. Like his #343 with his willingness to ignore T-block's obvious 'scumminess.' Agree with his #354 on Sokr.

Gorf
Initial impression before really rereading: he's commenting on stuff passively and friendly. I get a ":3" feeling from his slot this game, yet I can barely remember anything he's done, and if past experience is to be listened to, that's a terrible sign. As of #144, a sheep vote that I don't like. That sheep vote is the hardest stance I've seen from him up to that point. His arguments against T-block later on I disagree with. Farther down page 4, he states he is ok with lynching Rajam.
As of the end of page 6, Gorf still hasn't given much in the way of stances, but he posts this http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=13949592&postcount=235 which SCREAMS of not wanting to take any blame upon a Rajam townflip. Overall impression: I'm finishing up this post and realizing that based on this post I'm making, Gorf should be at the top of my scumpicks. It's really weird to say that, if I were to go with gut I would say town, but evidence seems to be contrary. I also remember how I've disagreed with him on stances such as T-block. What is the general consensus of Gorf, anyway? Does he need more pressure (whenever he gets back?)

AsianAussie
Getting few vibes from him so far (page 7/12.) His #253-256 are pretty neutral, just speculating on if Kantrip's role could be real and town. Probably the most useful thing he says in there is "RR needs to speak up." Makes some more posts on page 7, states a townread on Kantrip, presses T-block for some info which is good, also decent interaction with Sokr. Like his #362 and 363. Overall impression: why is my summary on AA so short? ಠ_ಠ

Kantrip
I may have to write a lot on Kantrip, since he posts a lot and those posts are long, but I would prefer not to. The first thing to note is his claim, which comes off as townie at first, but could easily be faked or later passed off as a gambit. The problem is that if he proves it, he's dead. So in the meantime, I'll try to get a read on him. Actually JK, I'll do that later. It seems he's going to EXPLOD himself soon so we'll see, I don't want to waste too much time on this.

July
Same with Kantrip, except I think I'm capable of reading Kantrip more accurately, whereas I'll always be suspicious of July. Someone else can get reads on her, my reread will be way too slow if I try. As always, I would recommend an investigative on her, but others may direct it where they think it will do more good.






TL;DR version: read the whole post
Only time I think I've seen him try to give stances.

And here I'm reading a lot of fluff in what could have been said way simpler, AA is null, not bothering with Kantrip atm, etc.

It's just unnecessary.

~

PS, can Kantrip use his power on Asdioh plz.
 

Jim Morrison

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WIFOM. Why would scum be so outloud and the principal spokesman in the lynch of a townie?

Fine.
Are you backpedaling?

#419 and #439:
The usage of the word "but" when referring my slot indicates you shifted your main motive of wanting me lynched from useless to scummy

Note also that between these two post, he has the exact same argument for me, yet he increases the color's scumness from orange to red. I'll assume it's due to my #434 in between? yet you don't address it at all, neither explicitly mention it for increasing the color's scumness
Okay, what the ****, I honestly had no idea the colours were switched between those two posts. Thinking back, you should've been red all along. Red does not mean "oh so ****ing scummy", but "oh how I want to lynch them". And oh, how I want to lynch you.
All the yellow just sums towards what I said also in yellow in my #540. You're trying to keep me high on the lynch list, as high as Sokr which is pure scumness, and me, based mainly for being mostly useless as you yourself are saying here
Yes. I hate useless people with a passion! And lagging behind 4 days, constantly, is just as terrible as not posting at all!
 

Jim Morrison

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...so wait; you want me dead because I'm behind and catching up like I did in F&L?? For the record, two things:

1.- Me being behind and catching up in F&L was not faked
2.- In different degrees, I've gotten behind and had to catch up during D1 in every single game of Mafia I have ever played

How much of your motives for wanting me dead are based on me "doing the same" that I did in F&L? This is important so answer this
About 1/4, a bit more than 1/2 is plain rage at you posting 4 days behind us and less than a quarter is your scumminess. You've been playing better last few pages, but it doesn't take away you're still lagging behind.
If you are to know anything about me, I am all about killing off inactives and useless players on D1, useless players taking priority.


But then again, I'm not lynching you, I'm lynching Sokr.
 

Jim Morrison

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Also, I would love to point out Sokr going after Rajam:

Red Ryu
Rajam
Sokr
mentosman
Jim Morrison
asdioh
T-Block
Gheb
Gorf
asianaussie
Kantrip
July


Rajam. I didn't vote him because he was a bit confusing and I wasn't that sure of my read.


VOTE RAJAM
The post where I did a read on Rajam. Not sure why I didn't vote him at that point...
This post it is referring to is #426, and here's what happened:
At the time of Sokr posting his read on Rajam, there was 1 vote on Rajam and a little bit of attention to him. Between the time of his reads list (where he voted Rajam), and this read, FOUR votes went to Rajam. Sokr put him at L-1 and it was easy to lose track of votes and accidently hammer.

Sokr didn't find Rajam scummy at all, he was just flippy-floppy in his read on him so he could choose either way, if Rajam was getting lynched or not. Apparently it worked well for him, so he could latch onto the Rajam-wagon. He went from null to definite scum read in hardly any posts at all, just 4 votes on Rajam made him change his mind.

As much as I dislike Rajam's style of playing, I can not see how people are willing to vote him off before Sokr obvScum. Sokr > Rajam in Scumpriority. If anyone voting Rajam over Sokr has a good reason to assume Rajam more scummy than Sokr, speak now, please.
 

Asdioh

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I wish I knew what RR was doing. He's the only one I can recall who's listed me as a scumpick, and he even just requested that Kantrip bomb me, without giving any sort of argument.

He's making me uncomfortable. At least I now know where he stands on Rajam/Sokr.

Guys, reread Asdioh, is he taking stances that aren't safe and not posting a lot of fluff, like me vs T-Block, why did he pick a side out of nowhere?
I don't know if this is worded incorrectly or what, but this would generally be a good thing if it is.

Why did he wait for most of his stances to be made until others gave them? I don't think he took a direct stance on Sokr and Rajam right away until others did it.
Pretty sure I took a stance when I voted Rajam forever ago, but ok.
 

Jim Morrison

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I wish I knew what RR was doing. He's the only one I can recall who's listed me as a scumpick, and he even just requested that Kantrip bomb me, without giving any sort of argument.

He's making me uncomfortable. At least I now know where he stands on Rajam/Sokr.

I don't know if this is worded incorrectly or what, but this would generally be a good thing if it is.

Pretty sure I took a stance when I voted Rajam forever ago, but ok.
I'm wondering though, you wanted Rajam lynched, you'd be perfectly fine with it, but when Rajam is at L-1, when you have to put your money where your mouth is, you suddenly retract your vote and you're not okay with lynching Rajam. I know you dislike ending the Day early, but were you just voting to pressure Rajam then? Not to lynch him?
 

Kantrip

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Sokr's self-preservation is not a scumtell. I don't disagree with everyone who says he's doing things that can be perceived as scummy as ****, but they aren't Sokr scumtells. If Sokr is scum he is playing incredibly below what he could be. He would be a lot more careful and a lot less abrasive.

@Jim Morrison: What is your current stance on Asdioh? What do you think of what Red Ryu is saying about him?
 

Jim Morrison

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Sokr's self-preservation is not a scumtell. I don't disagree with everyone who says he's doing things that can be perceived as scummy as ****, but they aren't Sokr scumtells. If Sokr is scum he is playing incredibly below what he could be. He would be a lot more careful and a lot less abrasive.
You wouldn't know unless you're scum partners with him, WIFOM there.

Also, self-preservation should be done by defending himself, not trying to shove the lynch on someone else by oppurtunistic voting. He hasn't tried to defend himself from either me or Gheb once. Maybe if he did that, this voting Rajam wouldn't have been as bad, but since this was his way of self-preservation over defending himself, it's not gonna slide with me.

My stance on Asdioh is A slight tinge of SandyBrown.
 

Kantrip

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Could you explain what a slight tinge of SandyBrown entails and why he got there? Also, the part about RR too please.

I understand what you say about Sokr, and I agree that he should be trying to defend (if applicable) and then moving on to solid scumhunting, but he's just pretty bad at doing what he "should" do. I'm not sure how else to put it except that he's doing things I'm pretty sure he doesn't have the balls (or brain) to do as scum.
 

Jim Morrison

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Could you explain what a slight tinge of SandyBrown entails and why he got there? Also, the part about RR too please.
Well Asdioh giving commentary mostly, his stances are very unclear. His bigger posts cleared a few things up, but still leaves some question marks. Also, what I said before, him unvoting Rajam when it finally leads up to a lynch.
All behaviour I didn't need to see.
 

Jim Morrison

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Also, I'm not sure what you mean with the RR part...

And what happened to your "one strike and you're out" for Sokr? Does this not count?
 

Kantrip

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Asdioh said he wanted more time for other people to give comments. He unvoted because he didn't want Rajam to get lynched so soon. If there's any problems to be had with Asdioh, unvoting when a wagon reaches L-1 prematurely is not a good one to choose.
 

Rajam

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Rajam:

Hola


ok guys, here's the deal: I'm clearly the best player in this game, so, I'll offer a limited opportunity to the first three players that say me! (bolded); these players will hold hands with me so we can **** scum together.

Remember, only the first three
Yes, people have said it over and over, but I feel like doing it now. What the hell is this? However, if you think about it, yes this does immediately scream scummy, but it could be an overconfident town, which I think could suit Rajam (well, the overconfident part).

If possible I'd like to invite people to "ignore" both Asdioh and mentos and focus elsewhere.
Why would you even ask this? Let's just pretend for a moment that everyone here is dumb enough to do this. And we assume you're wrong. What then? We lose the game. Why? Because we're ignoring scum and all they have to do is sit back and ride out the game.
Yes, I know this is an extreme case, but still, why would you ever ask players to ignore certain people. Unless it 100% certain, what they are, no one is above suspicion.

Anyways, out of all this, yes Rajam's posts initially scream scum, but if you look into intent and try to see the thinking behind his posts, it is possible to see town. It's a bit of a stretch, but the possibility is big enough for me to have a null on him. However, his inactivity and his "catchups" do reek of scum, so for you Kantrip, if I had to take a stance, it would be hesitant scum.
uh? For the reread you make on me you barely put two quotes, and the first one serves no purpose since you don't conclude anything


The second one though, is the one that bothers me more; in your previous post to this one, #424, when you reread on RR, you conclude this:

All these posts carry a common theme. Red Ryu is town in these for me because it appears that he legitimately cares and is putting effort into making sure we don't get a mislynch and people aren't wasting there votes in dumb spots.
Are you using a double standar? Because I also was defending Asdioh and mentos in the second quote, but you treat it in a total different way contrasted with RR
 

Jim Morrison

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Yeah I kinda wanted Asdioh to answer that because I wanted to follow-up. But you answering for him is okay.

Not sure where my follow-up would've gone, but it was going places
 

Kantrip

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The quotes that Asdioh posted of him as well as other things he has said wrt Asdioh. Do you agree or disagree? What do you think of Red Ryu's Asdioh suspicion in general?

The "one strike and you're out" was more to make Sokr feel hard-pressed to do something. The fact that he hasn't improved under this pressure shows that it wasn't put on. He really is this uncooperative.
 

Jim Morrison

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The quotes that Asdioh posted of him as well as other things he has said wrt Asdioh. Do you agree or disagree? What do you think of Red Ryu's Asdioh suspicion in general.
I think Red Ryu is a lot more suspicious of Asdioh than me. RR thinks Asdioh is actually scummy, I just dislike some his play, for instance him taking stances pretty late, after other people. I wouldn't call him scum for it though.

Kantrip, you still want Rajam over Sokr, though?
 

Rajam

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mentosman8
He has few posts, so I have to talk about them in some detail, especially since I can't remember what he's done. Judging by this, I think it's safe to assume mentos has a townread on RR at this point (as in right now, since T-block retracted his claim)? The rest of his #159 consists of mostly telling Kantrip some general mafia advice, which is a null at best. The rest of his post is kind of wishy-washy, with some dislike of Kantrip and Rajam at the end. Overall, not leaving a good impression on me.God dammit, former me. Yeah it's cool that he's trying to stop the distractions, but that's pretty much a nulltell. At least I called him out on not voting I guess?

In his #199, he warns to be careful of Kantrip's power, which I approve of because it made me think of the implications, should the power be misused. He also gives me his current scumreads of T-block and Rajam. His #207, showing more frustration at the possible misuse of Kantrip's role, makes it look like he hasn't considered the possibility of Kantrip's claim being a gambit. It's up to you guys to interpret that as a scummy or townie mindset. Further wishy-washiness on T-block, dislike. Overall impression: not enough from him to decide if he's overall town or scum. Would not lynch toDay, would be a good target for investigation soon.
The way you word this is like you consider mentos scummy for not considering the option of Kantrip's claim being a gambit, but you don't take the stance. Even more, you tell the others to take the stance, in a biased way with the sentence previous to the "It's up to you guys to interpret that as a scummy or townie mindset". Me don't like
 

#HBC | Gorf

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Jacksonville, FL
Dodging prod, will post something more substantial when I don't have to worry about piano which should most likely be tonight or tomorrow depending on how hard I'm told I should practice by my private teacher.
 

T-block

B2B TST
Joined
Jan 11, 2009
Messages
11,841
Location
Edmonton, AB, Canada
As much as I dislike Rajam's style of playing, I can not see how people are willing to vote him off before Sokr obvScum. Sokr > Rajam in Scumpriority. If anyone voting Rajam over Sokr has a good reason to assume Rajam more scummy than Sokr, speak now, please.
i actually think rajam is more scummy, as i've said multiple times before -_-
 

Jim Morrison

Smash Authority
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
15,287
Location
The Netherlands
that is actually exactly the response i expected from you

you would hammer me based on not having read the whole game? i don't believe you would as town. it's just a bad excuse attempting to explain your behaviour.

by the time you voted you had supposedly read less than 150 posts (assumed because your next post addresses asdioh's 152). the post where you vote me is post 345. you had read less than half the game - hadn't even gotten to kantrip's claim yet. that is clearly not enough to be okay with hammering. idk why i'm explaining this to you though... you already understand what i'm talking about.

rajam, so many people have expressed concerns about your slot several times throughout your "catch up", yet you chose to give the impression that you weren't reading them, in favour of reading past posts. yet as soon as something more substantial than activity concerns comes up, you address it right away? had you actually been following your catch-up facade, i wouldn't have expected you to respond to my point until 300 posts later.

vote: Rajam

srsly
Just for good measure and backtrack, just want to get clear this is still the reason you are voting Rajam over Sokr?
 

T-block

B2B TST
Joined
Jan 11, 2009
Messages
11,841
Location
Edmonton, AB, Canada
catchup faked, using it to ask questions to fake pro-town concern
garbage reasoning for clearing asdioh and mentos, which looks at lot like his leaving a false trail on his lynch

basically, taking actions that suggest an alternate agenda
 
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