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Unofficial Project M Ridley - CLASSIC RIDLEY BETA RELEASED! 31/10/16

What is your opinion on this hack?


  • Total voters
    909

Wolley2xjd

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I'm pretty sure the video showed off the latest public build. Etika also linked the Brawl Vault download page, which was v2.1.
But in the video that he was watching, Ridley didn't have his wing spikes that Bagan made so it isn't.

worse part that most of the loyalist detractors, especially the Etika "Daddy Sakurai!" followers, don't even care nor played the Brawl mods but Sm4sh only. so there most of their opinions are mostly likely careless than knowledge and reasonable.
The real problem is that he just bends over that takes what Sakurai says which makes him look like a ****** who has no idea what he's talking about, Riley's Character is not defined by his his size nor his he defined but being someone's ***** who looks like he's trying to the most extreme duckface ever.

Some me a person who think Ridley needs to be big and you show me a person who has no idea what they're talking about at all.
 

JayJay55

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You make some good points.
An uppercut isn't really the right word, it's just an upward claw slash, since he's basically just throwing his talons. It's really similar to your acid spheres, but those would look strange if they were to move slowly in the air, while a slow Razor leaf-like projectile makes a bit more sense to me. I'd use the acid as an upSmash instead.

The shoulder bash is more about the utility of the move rather than being canon, but yeah, lack of source material is gonna be a huge problem, since Kraid has even less appearances than Ridley. We'll have to take creative liberties at some point.

I'm pretty sure that NeutralB can be made, I'm far from being a PSA wizard, but i know enough to say that the following can be done: The model changing according to a variable (Pit does it), moves changing according to a variable (Samus' Fire/Ice beam), and a move charging on it's own (Wario's downB, ROB's neutralB; Having NeutralB charging by itself might actually be a bad design choice when you think about it, so maybe it's not even necessary).
The way i see it, when you use neutralB you shoot the 3 spikes at once. Now that you mention it, i didn't not think of the implications of each spike being a separate projectile, so instead, it works as such: all 3 spikes are shot at the same time, traveling for about 3/4 the lenght of FD, maybe a bit less, and those 3 spikes actually count as one projectile going straight forward (So it really similar to samus' charge shot, maybe a bit slower and with a different damage/knockback ratio). The point is, as long as you hold the charge you force your opponent to approach since they can't reliably camp, and that charge can be used to punish anything stupid you opponent could do out of your physical range. It does sound strong, but PM!Wario's sideB is just as strong: what i mean is, there are counterplays, just get through Kraid's wall of hitbox and pressure him, and he won't have time to shoot; Or bait this move, and Kraid ends up without his strongest projectile, his disjoints, and he'll have to get vulnerable to get them back (this why i say an autocharge may be bad, since Kraid just have to wait and he'll get back that advantage you just forced him to drop).

I have no doubt Frayark will deliver quality content, but what i mean is his proportion don't really fit a fitting game like smash were even the slowest of characters have to move around: his legs are too short for him to jump or run, and his arms don't really allow any clawing moves. It's a great design for the fortress-like boss he is in metroid, but it doesn't really fit smash sa much as the melee model, which has longer legs and arms, a proportionally shorter body and more mobile head.


I agree, though i think we should postpone it untill developement actually starts.
Well for all intents and purposes the Acid Sphere's aren't supposed to be slow moving, they're supposed to be relatively fast, like they were in the Super Metroid game, I should've explained further, but he's supposed to pop up a bit like Yoshi (just as you described earlier) and shoot two fast moving acids sphere's in an arc, the one above the other going the highest and covering farther and the one below the other going lower and covering the highest and they're supposed to poison on chance. They aren't supposed to move slow, I should've clarified but that was my fault.

And yeah, I understand its more about utility but I think there are somethings we can and can't do. Although, you should've went into detail about the shoulder bash. How fast do you expect him to move with said shoulder bash if we gave him one? I'm just more worried about it being too silly looking for Kraid, but we'd need a model to determine what animations what would look weird or not. So we'll just have to wait on Frayark.

Thanks for the clarification of the Neutral-B's utility. But I don't think it works if its a wall of all 3 being shot, especially thinking about it aesthetically (Didn't most of us vote against this for Ridley? IIRC it was suggested earlier on during this mod's life span that Ridley shoot a wall of fire balls or something). I mean I can't visually see the cast power shielding a wall of projectiles where the whole wall gets sent flying back, I feel it should be one at a time at random, let me explain it a little further too, when you charge it to a certain point, one spike grows, when you get one more level the other one grows, when you make it to the last level all the spikes are present on his stomach, one you shoot one you loose the hylian shield effect in that area, meaning you're vulnerable where ever you lost that spike and so on and so forth.

In terms of proportions Kraid having the proportions of the statue could work, even in terms of a fighting game and especially in the hands of a professional, not saying it will most definitely work, but it can (mainly because in the Golden statue pose his torso isn't dragging across the ground and his legs seem to have more definition and flexibility than what's shown in his official artwork). But I see where you're coming from with your concern on it, we need to wait for a model before making any further progress.
 

drogoth232

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Some of ya'll getting too fired up about opinions.
Don't act like children, everyone's allowed to have opinions/make observations/come to their own conclusion. Even if you might not like it.
 

Wolley2xjd

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Some of ya'll getting too fired up about opinions.
Don't act like children, everyone's allowed to have opinions/make observations/come to their own conclusion. Even if you might not like it.
Well the problem here was that he basically made himself look ignorant on the topic, he's not wrong for having an opinion but it was the wrong opinion to have in this matter, Ridley isn't defined by his size so just by though for saying it does means he's wrong and the fact that he took what sakurais reasoning without even trying to think that the statement could be wrong, hell he read and was all like "welp guess he's too big guys" and he didn't even try to think about what was being said, it's not the problem that he was ignorant that gotten people so fired up, it's that he bended over so easily.

It's not child like to think someone is ignorant.
 

BaganSmashBros

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Should we make a separate thread about this? I feel like we have derailed a bit.
Only when we will actually start development.
So... Etika just made a video on this mod, said it proves that Ridley is too big -_-
...urgh...i'll just ignore it. Not that i can watch it.
I'm pretty sure the video showed off the latest public build. Etika also linked the Brawl Vault download page, which was v2.1.
Is Ridley's tail still long and thin? If yes, then its outdated.
Honestly resizing Kraid would be ruining his Character since unlike Ridley Kraid's size IS important to him and before you say that you can just use mini Kraid, there would still be the problem of amet
I agree. This is his main thing. BUUUUUT idunnocar.
...Tasteh.



...anyway, here's a very important question - which one of our future PSAs should we give priority for now? K.Rool (i decided to not wait for something to happen because it takes too long, so, eh) or Kraid? Here are few points for and against them:
  • King K.Rool
    • Very easy to make moveset thanks to having enough source material and easy to choose playstyle
    • Very popular and can be a "fail-safe" in case he won't be playable in Sm4sh even as DLC
    • Has no model available that isn't used for a Brawl model hack and there is no one to make a model for him
    • Will need a coding wizard to give him cape physics and while its possible, im not sure i'll find one
  • Kraid
    • One of the classic bosses of Metroid series and Ridley's comrade that has been left unused since Zero Mission
    • Custom model by @Frayark, so, no need to worry about model's limitations
    • Has not enough source material to make moveset, so, a lot of it should be completly made up while still fitting him
    • Size is his main attribute and it needs to be taken off to make him a playable character
    • Possible playstyle/moveset will make it hard for him to win in PM and to choose character for him to go over
 
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PseudoTypical

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King K Rool by a longshot IMO. He might be more difficult, but since he's the one character everyone's been waiting to see done right, I think people will help you. I'll see about getting someone to make a model if you go in this direction.
 

ZenythSmash

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  • King K.Rool
    • Very easy to make moveset thanks to having enough source material and easy to choose playstyle
    • Very popular and can be a "fail-safe" in case he won't be playable in Sm4sh even as DLC
    • Has no model available that isn't used for a Brawl model hack and there is no one to make a model for him
    • Will need a coding wizard to give him cape physics and while its possible, im not sure i'll find one
  • Kraid
    • One of the classic bosses of Metroid series and Ridley's comrade that has been left unused since Zero Mission
    • Custom model by @Frayark, so, no need to worry about model's limitations
    • Has not enough source material to make moveset, so, a lot of it should be completly made up while still fitting him
    • Size is his main attribute and it needs to be taken off to make him a playable character
    • Possible playstyle/moveset will make it hard for him to win in PM and to choose character for him to go over
K. Rool sounds a bit more likely than ever

What about some points on doing the other characters you said you'd like to work/finish on someday:
  • Brawl Ridley (since you got the wings working again)
  • Classic Ganon (now that 3 Ganon models exists)
    • [HW Ganon model (available)]
    • [Angelglory's Brawl Ganon model (we need an update from him first)]
    • [ALBW Ganon (models need to be extracted though, has DSX8 done it yet?)]
  • Zant (literally has everything he needs)

and what's your thoughts on ever doing Mr. Sylux?
 
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BaganSmashBros

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King K Rool by a longshot IMO. He might be more difficult, but since he's the one character everyone's been waiting to see done right, I think people will help you. I'll see about getting someone to make a model if you go in this direction.
Most likely, but who knows.
K. Rool sounds a bit more likely than ever

What about some points on doing the other characters you said you'd like to work/finish on someday:
  • Brawl Ridley (since you got the wings working again)
  • Classic Ganon (now that 3 Ganon models exists)
    • [HW Ganon model (available)]
    • [Angelglory's Brawl Ganon model (we need an update from him first)]
    • [ALBW Ganon (models need to be extracted though, has DSX8 done it yet?)]
  • Zant (literally has everything he needs)

and what's your thoughts on ever doing Mr. Sylux?
  • Brawl Ridley
    • Favourite organic Ridley design for pretty much everyone
    • Enough source material to make proper moveset
    • Model has very low file size and its optimized for Brawl very well
    • Unlike Other M Ridley, has no issues when thrown
    • Its very hard to pose him due to having very thin does and small base of his feet and i have no way to use Maya because last time they made a version for 86x/32-bit systems, it was before you could export animations, so, i have to manually pose his feet to stay in same spot
    • Wings are very painful to pose
    • Lack of motivation for some reasons
  • Classic Ganon
    • One of the highly requested characters and a very important character in Legend of Zelda games
    • Has enough source material to make moveset for and a potentially fun and unique playstyle
    • Has models available
    • Hard to chose base for him due to how much s**t he can have for his moveset
    • Hard to animate for animations like running animations because, well, its a giant boar demon thing
    • Not related to technical stuff, but there already is Ganondorf and unlike Links and Zeldas, Ganondorf is always same guy
  • Zant
    • Main antagonist of Twilight Princess until he gets Hijacked by Ganon
    • Has enough sorce material to make moveset AND give him something more-or-less unique
    • Potential playstyle fits Project M very well as it favors characters that can hit fast instead of hitting hard
    • Has models available
    • Moveset doesn't causes much problems with searching for a base
    • Might cause problems with getting the models
    • Will need some coding magic to get some parts to have physics
    • Not exactly a favourite characters for people
As for Sylux, i don't want to do him. He has not enough to make a moveset, he is a random guy with nothing worthwhile for now and there is no model i could use that isn't on Samus (which severely limits it) or from MPH.
 
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AustarusIV

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King K. Rool, honestly. I doubt he's going to be DLC for Sm4sh, but even in the off-chance that he actually does get in, it would be good to make him a character for Project M so that the Hype 3 can finally be in the same game at once.
 
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PseudoTypical

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Why don't you make a poll, Bagan? That way people can give an answer without having to write out their input if it doesn't add to the conversation.
 

BaganSmashBros

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King K. Rool, honestly. I doubt he's going to be DLC for Sm4sh, but even in the off-chance that he actually does get in, it would be good to make him a character for Project M so that the Hype 3 can finally be in the same game at once.
True. Would have been better if PMDT would do it by themselves (because then quality would be higher and those characters would be present at tournaments at least once or twice), but whad'ya gonna do.
Why don't you make a poll, Bagan? That way people can give an answer without having to write out their input if it doesn't add to the conversation.
Here's the poll then:
http://www.poll-maker.com/poll430518xfb774F37-17
They both will be made at some point, but this decides who gets first. WHEN they will be made depends on when i'll get my hands on their models.
 
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NXero

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K.Rool and Kraid? They're pretty much the same thing :rolleyes:
I'd go with K.Rool because he doesn't need to be resized too much and can have a better or more interesting moveset, if you can solve those problems.

 

BaganSmashBros

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Why don't we also include all of the other options that we listed above in addition to K.Rool and Kraid? Just so we have an entire picture of what could be done in the future.
So, should we call the thread "Bagan and co's Unofficial Project M characters" or what?
K.Rool and Kraid? They're pretty much the same thing :rolleyes:
I'd go with K.Rool because he doesn't need to be resized too much and can have a better or more interesting moveset, if you can solve those problems.

Day 1 alt, right here.
 
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NXero

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Is it really Bagan and Co. if Bagan does all the work and everyone else just watches? Sign me up!
 

BaganSmashBros

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Is it really Bagan and Co. if Bagan does all the work and everyone else just watches? Sign me up!
Well, there still are people that help me, so...Yeah.


Also, this:
3.PNG

IT'S OVER 9000!

WRYYYYYYYYYYYYY!
 
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NXero

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I was joking there :p
Downloads have slowed down, right? When you release your next update, you should try to get it featured. I'm sure a lot of people don't follow this thread and haven't even downloaded v2, which is a shame because it has improved a lot
 

BaganSmashBros

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I was joking there :p
Downloads have slowed down, right? When you release your next update, you should try to get it featured. I'm sure a lot of people don't follow this thread and haven't even downloaded v2, which is a shame because it has improved a lot
I know.
Yeah. And how can i do this? What is featured on KCMM is kinda random. Its usually good stuff, but great things are still left out very often. If thats what you meant.
 

BaganSmashBros

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Oh, okay. This:

I just wanted to give a full spin-around in the video, but this is a good enough view.
Oh, this model. The only problem with it is that his arms look too big (not sure if they are supposed to be like this since DKC1) and his hands look like they belong to someone like Ridley. But thats easy to fix.
 
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PseudoTypical

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Oh, this model. The only problem with it is that his arms look too big (not sure if they are supposed to be like this since DKC1) and his hands look like they belong to someone like Ridley. But thats easy to fix.
Alright, then if you're confident that things can be edited to your liking, I'll ask the guy for it. :)
 

JayJay55

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PseudoTypical

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K. Rool definitely a priority if anything else after Ridley, voted for him. And in terms of models how about this one?
http://dreamingbaku.deviantart.com/art/King-K-Rool-Posed-Render-530507176



It even has a small tail.
I don't mean to be rude but something looks very wrong with that thing. lol

BaganSmashBros BaganSmashBros , the guy with the model I showed here earlier said it's a sculpture so it would need to be remodeled entirely, which he may be willing to do if he's in the mood. He wanted to know the desired polygon count, textures needed, and the size of the textures. I guess I could ask him to include any edits you think are necessary, too.
 

drogoth232

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I don't mean to be rude but something looks very wrong with that thing. lol

BaganSmashBros BaganSmashBros , the guy with the model I showed here earlier said it's a sculpture so it would need to be remodeled entirely, which he may be willing to do if he's in the mood. He wanted to know the desired polygon count, textures needed, and the size of the textures. I guess I could ask him to include any edits you think are necessary, too.
11-12k, 512x512 and any/all the textures... that's kinda a vague question to ask tho
 

JayJay55

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I don't mean to be rude but something looks very wrong with that thing. lol

BaganSmashBros BaganSmashBros , the guy with the model I showed here earlier said it's a sculpture so it would need to be remodeled entirely, which he may be willing to do if he's in the mood. He wanted to know the desired polygon count, textures needed, and the size of the textures. I guess I could ask him to include any edits you think are necessary, too.
I guess so...although if he will remodel K. Rool I think its proportions should look more like this:

The model you showed was fine, its just the proportions are kind of odd and its missing some details like the gem, the golden plate over his stomach, the belly button, and the golden bracelets. Although the proportions shown in the first model could work, it'd be harder but could work.
 
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