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Twin Christmas Parties 3+4 Mafia {The Matryoshka Scandal.} ~ Over! Who had the merriest Christmas? Who got lumps of coal?

BarDulL

Town Vampire
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J - town. I don't think you're gonna hear any opinions that differ greatly on this point. J has played about as townie as anyone could in this game. Came into the game a bit late, but came in strong. He's pushing people without trying to lynch them first. Scum would probably try to hurry up and quicklynch.
For the record, this is a strategy that J adopts in just about all his games as scum. He pretty much always waits until there is a lot of content in circulation, then makes a gigantic post, which makes it easier for him to maneuver around and put himself in a position of influence.

Overswarm - town. He kind of took over the game when he showed up. Admittedly, the directions he's taken us hasn't landed us scum yet, but I really can't find anti-town intent from what he's done. His logic has been sound, even if it hasn't been right. He seems like a valuable asset to town.
I still think he was too hasty to try nailing Chuckie.

Circus - mostly null. If I had to lean one way or the other, I guess I'd lean scummy. I don't really know if this is a playstyle thing, or if he's maybe just busy. He just seems to pop in every once in awhile to make sure we know he's not dead, but he doesn't come off as super townie. He seemed like a much stronger town presence in the Mass Effect game, but that was with a hydra. Kind of a question mark, for me. Hopefully he steps it up.
Actually, I'm ok with this.

Sworddancer - null/town. He's kind of the opposite of circus in my mind. He's been pretty inactive, and I have no meta on him to fill in the blanks. His occasional peeks into the thread have felt contributory to town. I'm still keeping an eye on him, cuz making a couple good posts is easy to do to appear townie. Overall though, I do like his posts, and I wouldn't mind seeing more of them.


I may do more of these tomorrow, but these are the ones Bardull asked for.
Yeah, PJB is coo.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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Okay, that would have been really relevant information if you just told us that at the beginning. Strongman really isn't likely to be a town role so . . .

Vote: OS

I thought that you were claiming in your 912 that there was a strongman in the town, but I guess by the word "town" you just meant "game," correct?

Oh btw, this is totally irrelevant but . . .

@CIRCUS:

You said that if Rajam wasn't scum Day 1 that you would eat your hat.

@OS:

You said that if Chuckie didn't flip Inquisitor that you would eat your hat.

I want vids of both of you eating your hats.
Sworddancer, why are you rashly voting OS over information that we have yet to have been confirmed and just going off what Ranmaru said? What is your actual read on OS sans the claim the Ranmaru has made on him?
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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We have a mislynch if he is lying and we have time to wait for an OS claim.

Though if he is a strongman, why no kill last night?

:phone:
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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Even more so when that kill would have most likely put us into Lylo.

Going out with sister visiting will get to reads and questions after.

:phone:
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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Mhmm, Ranmaru's claim, I think, actually clears OS more than condemns him if I am understanding all of this correctly. Which brings to mind why are people hoping on "one of Ran/OS must be scum due to lying/roles." when both could still be telling the truth and be town.

The scenario I am much more interested in is RR and PBJ. RR shot PBJ but nothing happened.

Speaking of, isn't strongman a gun-weilding role or am I thinking of some other role?
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
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I don't know. I just felt it fit with there being many protectives in the game.

I could target PB&J today, to see why that may have happened.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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Bardull said:
For the record, this is a strategy that J adopts in just about all his games. He pretty much always waits until there is a lot of content in circulation, then makes a gigantic post, which makes it easier for him to maneuver around and put himself in a position of influence.
As a side-bar, I do this regardless of alignment.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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I don't know. I just felt it fit with there being many protectives in the game.

I could target PB&J today, to see why that may have happened.
It's a large game. I wouldn't be surprised with that many protective roles, especially since the roles have been specific in terms of their protection. Like Posu-Doctor and Jailer which are both variants of doctors.

You can target during the day and get your result during twilight? PBJ would be my pick for something if we could get some more insight to this dilemma.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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Also yes, Strongman is a gun-wielding role.
Hmm, so you are saying OS holds a gun?

With Soup being a Vig (and a vengeful on at that) and then RR claims to have gotten a gun, with a strongman...hmm...

Contemplating somethings because maybe I am the one who has the scenario wrong and Swords is right.

I need to find a post real quick.
 

ranmaru

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Bardull, I want your opinion on this.

Ran - scum lean. I'm really scratching my head on this one. I wanna label him as town based on early play, but his claim really confuses me. I guess it fits as derpy town, but it seems like he's trying to use his claim to force a wagon on OS, someone I read as town. He said earlier that he believed Ryu to be a strongman, but his vote implies that OS is the strongman, and he thinks that makes him scum. Thing is, when he thought ryu was strongman, there was no vote. Then he decided to ask everyone else if they thought strongman was a scummy role so he could have an excuse to vote someone based on that. Looks like a backdoor if I ever saw one. Hearing his explanation for this will be interesting.
I'm not liking PB&J's reasoning for his scumleans.

Bardull - scum lean. This is mostly from jdietz's play. He never contributed much that wasn't designed to push a town lynch along faster, or dismiss a lynchee's views. Bardull seems to be improving my opinion of the slot, but I got burned by Bardull last time I played with him in BaM/PB, so I'm cautious. I'm also hesitant to let his play just undo what jdietz did.
Not liking him disliking me because I'm claiming that his 'town read' is a Strongman. I also feel he is using your 'burning' of him in B/PB as justification to keep you at arms reach.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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If he was a strongman, I would be dead, regardless of whether he thinks I'm mafioso or not. That's what a strongman is for.

Claiming anything along the lines of "I shot you, and you're still alive, therefore you're mafia" is ridiculous. Town vigs are supposed to shoot scum, so why would scum be inherently immune to NKs? Even if there was a legitimate reason for scum being immune to NKs, that still doesn't prove it applies to me. There is nothing telling here, and I don't understand what Ryu is doing.
PBJ, how did you know this info? You are still a new player to the forums and I highly doubt you have run into the role in your games thus far since I have been either a mod of them or watching them. So tell me, how did you know about the strongman role and what it does. You say the last line in pink with confidence.
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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Sworddancer, why are you rashly voting OS over information that we have yet to have been confirmed and just going off what Ranmaru said? What is your actual read on OS sans the claim the Ranmaru has made on him?
Yet to confirm? Unless I missed something, how are we going to confirm it?

I don't think that my vote is rash given the circumstances. I waited for Ran to clarify what he meant, and he did. Strongman seems to be a very logical role for scum to have in this set up. A town strongman with a town vig? No.

Idk why someone didn't die last Night, but I'm not going to concern myself with WIFOM like that. RR claims to have shot PJB, but he didn't die. That's two shots that failed. For all we know, all kills could have failed last Night for whatever reason. I'm not saying that this is the case, just that I'm not going to concern myself with the unknowable.

Not taking ANY Night actions into account, I am confused as to what to think about OS. He seemed very convinced in his case, and I'll be damned if he was faking all that content. If he went out of his way to just make that monster of a case for town points, then I tip my hat to him. However, he must have realized that the very basic premise was dumb, yes? The idea that Nabe would make a player IN THE GAME a puppet slot? Hell, not just OS, but others must have realized just how unlikely this type of connection would exist in the first place, right?

Nope, he didn't. Starting from late Day 1, he started to convince himself and others in a huge BS case for Chuckie being Le.

*sigh*

Chuckie said it best, it basically comes down to rather or not you believe OS could fake this effort. If it was anyone else but OS I would say no. However, it was OS, and I do believe it's possible for mafia OS to be legit indy hunting. I'm not saying that he was mafia because he was indy hunting, but just that it's possible.

Without Ran's claim, I would say town, just because he HAS put in a lot more effort than others, which while I believe it to be possible for him to fake, I don't believe likely. However, with the claim, I'm going scum on him now.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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Swords said:
Without Ran's claim, I would say town, just because he HAS put in a lot more effort than others, which while I believe it to be possible for him to fake, I don't believe likely. However, with the claim, I'm going scum on him now.
I agree with you 100% here.

Especially with an implication/connection theory I have.
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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Actually, I've been forming a connection theory of my own

Hey J, I'll trade you my connection theory if you give me yours. :)
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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Sure.

If OS flips Mafia Strongman, I am feeling PBJ is scum with him based on the fact that he seems to know more info than he should know about a strongman. The confidence he has also makes me more certain of this.
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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If OS flips strongman than I'm going to give Kary a deeper looking into. He gained a scumread on OS for his attack on Chuckie Day 2, but still ultimately voted Chuckie for his "flailing," which felt like a weak justification compared to his reasoning on OS to me.
 

BarDulL

Town Vampire
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Not taking ANY Night actions into account, I am confused as to what to think about OS. He seemed very convinced in his case, and I'll be damned if he was faking all that content. If he went out of his way to just make that monster of a case for town points, then I tip my hat to him. However, he must have realized that the very basic premise was dumb, yes? The idea that Nabe would make a player IN THE GAME a puppet slot? Hell, not just OS, but others must have realized just how unlikely this type of connection would exist in the first place, right?

Nope, he didn't. Starting from late Day 1, he started to convince himself and others in a huge BS case for Chuckie being Le.

*sigh*

Chuckie said it best, it basically comes down to rather or not you believe OS could fake this effort. If it was anyone else but OS I would say no. However, it was OS, and I do believe it's possible for mafia OS to be legit indy hunting. I'm not saying that he was mafia because he was indy hunting, but just that it's possible.
I am very certain that Le Bateuler was created for this game. 99%. I do not expect that account to be doing much else after the game is over.

I still think OS was too hasty.
 

BarDulL

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Bardull, I want your opinion on this.



I'm not liking PB&J's reasoning for his scumleans.



Not liking him disliking me because I'm claiming that his 'town read' is a Strongman. I also feel he is using your 'burning' of him in B/PB as justification to keep you at arms reach.
I'm not really sure what to make of this just yet.

OS/PBJ does seem legit. I considered it when I noticed how PBJ gave OS a pass.

Am I the only one who thinks OS jumped the gun on Chuckie? Like as though he didn't really care about whether or not Chuckie was the Indy?
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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Soup, who do you want to go for toDay?

I feel like one of Chuckie/OS should go toDay. I know OS always thinks he has a masterplan as either alignment, but while I agree with his numbers, I don't like the leap straight to Chuckie. On the other hand, I can't help reading Chuckie's reaction and seeing nothing but flail.

Vote: Chuckie for now

Swords what do you think of July?

Ran what do you think of soup/Ditzy/Joker?

gotta run. should be back on tomorrow.
man I love Jdietz

ok so i'm basically up to date, but I haven't been reading in that great a detail. On the other hand, given that god-awful hammer I don't think there's much that needs saying toDay. Pretty sure Chuckie's flipping town, so OS is my top priority tomorrow, at the very least he needs to be put on the back foot and answer for the way he keeps butting heads with people whilst pushing what reads a lot like a mechanics case.

Oh and I'm not interested in lynching Soup anytime soon, what the hell.

And where is Ranmaru etc.

(purposefully not commenting on some things)
Hmmm, actually this is a bit weak, but a case still exists here. After these posts the two have a bit of a genuine looking conversation, but Kary's legit suspicion of OS vs. his unlegit suspicion of Chuckie in his first post is suspect.

@Bardull: I agree with you that it's most likely that Le was created for the game. However, just the idea that another player ALREADY in the game would be playing two slots seemed absurd to me.

I think that it's most likely was someone else outside of the game incognito. Maybe they did know something about the set up that others didn't, maybe not. Who knows.
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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I'm not really sure what to make of this just yet.

OS/PBJ does seem legit. I considered it when I noticed how PBJ gave OS a pass.

Am I the only one who thinks OS jumped the gun on Chuckie? Like as though he didn't really care about whether or not Chuckie was the Indy?
Perhaps he jumped on Chuckioe too fast but I highly doubt that he wasn't legit about his indy hunting. I mean, you really have to understand just how hard it would be to fake all of those monstrous walls of content.

It's pretty hard to put so much effort into something if you don't legit care about it.

@Kary: From the second post I quoted from you, can you go into why you didn't like OS "butting heads" while making "mechanic cases?" That seems like an interesting point, but I don't quite get what's exactly scummy about it.
 

BarDulL

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@Bardull: I agree with you that it's most likely that Le was created for the game. However, just the idea that another player ALREADY in the game would be playing two slots seemed absurd to me.
It would be ******* modding for Nabe to play a role in the actual game. He would never hammer another player. I'm pretty sure Ryker/Gova were controlling Le Batueler based on the premise that it was the "Shadow Inquisitor's Aspect."
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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It would be ******* modding for Nabe to play a role in the actual game. He would never hammer another player. I'm pretty sure Ryker/Gova were controlling Le Batueler based on the premise that it was the "Shadow Inquisitor's Aspect."
*ahem*

I think that it's most likely was someone else outside of the game incognito.
Said right below what you quoted.
 

BarDulL

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Perhaps he jumped on Chuckioe too fast but I highly doubt that he wasn't legit about his indy hunting. I mean, you really have to understand just how hard it would be to fake all of those monstrous walls of content.

It's pretty hard to put so much effort into something if you don't legit care about it.
No, I agree, which is why I gave him town points earlier for it. I still think he jumped to conclusions though because I feel that a puppeteer would definitely stay as far away from his puppet as possible in this scenario. Chuckie was just too bold if he was the true Inquisitor and I'm suspicious of OS for not taking that idea into account.

You can legit scum hunt as Mafia when looking for an Indy, but you may rush to conclusions since either way you're knocking off a slot that you know isn't Mafia aligned.
 

#HBC | Dancer

The nicest of the damned.
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No, I agree, which is why I gave him town points earlier for it. I still think he jumped to conclusions though because I feel that a puppeteer would definitely stay as far away from his puppet as possible in this scenario. Chuckie was just too bold if he was the true Inquisitor and I'm suspicious of OS for not taking that idea into account.

You can legit scum hunt as Mafia when looking for an Indy, but you may rush to conclusions since either way you're knocking off a slot that you know isn't Mafia aligned.
Oh, I agree with this. Perhaps I should have said it earlier in my "OS read" post but yeah, I def see your point about how OS didn't really consider how unlikely it would be for an indy Chuckie to have interacted with Le the way he did. Especially considering that Chuckie (and I, to a lesser extent earlier the Day) brought up the point

Why would you need to make a new account for a player to be a Shadow Aspect if you could just take that player and make him the Shadow Aspect? o.O
Goooooooooooooooooood question! Iunno, maybe to give players a clue on the the tarot cards thing (purely guessing right here)?

It's not unheard of. Swiss did it with the Blato account in Higurashi mafia just for the lols of it.

Another good question would be this: Why would the mod agree to do something as gimmicky as let one slot be two players?

Btw, this might be REALLY late for me to be asking this, but what was HepAlien anyways?
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
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HepAlien was Circus playing on two accounts in Super Hero Mafia. One of the greatest reveals in SWF history due to the fact people thought one of Circus/Hep were scum but not both together. Circus/Hep died rashly but played really really well.
 

#HBC | Joker

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What is this I'm reading? I'm scum because I know what a Strongman is? I know what a Jester is too, does that make me indy? What a ridiculous accusation.

I came into SWF DGames knowing LOTS of mafia terms and mechanics. My brother plays mafia on another forum, and I got into the game because of him talking about it. When I found out you guys played it here, I signed up. I know what a Strongman is, specifically because he made a Batman setup that included Batman as a Town BP Vigilante, and the only one who could kill him was Bane, Mafia Strongman. (it also included Alfred, as a townie who began the game knowing the identity of Batman. That role was my idea)
 

#HBC | Joker

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Now that i think about it, I've actually seen the strongman role on SWF already too. It was in a much smaller late night quick game. It was a upic game where our roles were based on our avatars, and Bardull was the sole scummer with a strongman role. Bardull can attest to that and everything.
 

BarDulL

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There was a Zen mini where I was an Indy Strongman. Can't remember if PJB was in it (I want to say PBJ, mm...gonna make me one now), but he probably was.
 

#HBC | Joker

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Well wutevs. My point is that me having knowledge of mafia roles doesn't incriminate me. Even if I didn't already know it, I could have looked it up when I saw it. That's such a reachy *** way to accuse somebody.
 
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