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Top Players & Videos by Character

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Empyrean

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 4, 2013
Messages
2,604
Location
Hive Temple
NNID
Arnprior
He's been getting good at melee super quickly too. That guy is improving disgustingly fast.
Apparently he was the best Fox in Chile before Brawl came out.

But his Pit, yeah. M2K was thankful that the best Pit lived on the other side of ocean before, but Zero might just be enough to terrorize the hell out of everyone here now.
 

Hinichii.ez.™

insincere personality
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
4,290
NNID
hinichii
3DS FC
2423-5382-7542
Screw ike he lame get nair'd get chain grabbed get booped start howling
 

Juushichi

sugoi ~ sugoi ~
Joined
Dec 8, 2009
Messages
5,518
Location
Columbus, Ohio
Boss came up to Columbus and got 4th yesterday.

Results were:
1. Fizzle (Sheik/Ivy/Mario) [3-2 vs HP WF / 3-1 GF. 3-1 vs Carls WSF]
2. HankyPanky (Peach) [3-1 vs Boss WSF / 3-0 vs Carls LF]
3. Carls (Wario) [3-1 vs Boss LSF]
4. Boss (Diddy)
T-5. SoulPech (Jigglypuff) / Abu (Fox/Jigglypuff)

No recordings, unfortunately.
 
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AbstractLogic

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 11, 2013
Messages
338
Location
College Station
I haven't seen videos or results of Abstract Logic and Luck for a long time (actually, I've never heard of Luck until now). Can someone link me to any vids or results?
I'll go ahead and include some videos of my recent sets. I've been relatively active as of lately (almost a tourney a week). I have generally placed either top 10 or top 8 at 60+ man events. I feel that as a Diddy main I bring lots of creativity to the table and have definitely deviated from the typical day 1 setups I see most Diddys use. I have a strong understanding of the character as well as his matchups. My most notable achievements are probably getting 2nd at the PM Arcadian losing only to Luck who is another incredible Diddy in his own right, double eliminating Strawhat at said tourney, and even beating Mojo and Jake13 at houston locals, who are top melee players in our state. I'm sure many players in at least TX could vouch for me (and even Luck!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AhHWnGb9To vs Blink (Lucario)

http://www.twitch.tv/tourneylocator/b/519378413?t=15m08s vs Strawhat (winners)

http://www.twitch.tv/tourneylocator/b/519378413?t=109m10s vs Strawhat (losers)

http://www.twitch.tv/tourneylocator/b/519378413?t=155m vs SCG | Zinth (lol footstool combos)

http://www.twitch.tv/tourneylocator/b/519378413?t=172m vs SCG | JZ (Up-Btho?)

http://www.twitch.tv/tourneylocator/b/519378413?t=194m vs Luck (9 freaking games of Diddy Dittos!)
 
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Soft Serve

softie
Premium
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
4,164
Location
AZ
Can Kaos get a spot on the top M2 list? Taj really doesn't even compete in smash anymore, let alone PM. Kaos has been placing really well in socal and doing great this weekend.
 

Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
It honestly hurts me to see gallo above chaddd on this list, and being recognized as the superior mario. Chaddd is a highly intelligent player and much stronger fundamentally than gallo and most players. If intelligence wasnt so counterproductive to success with this braindead iteration of mario then youd see a noticible gap between chad and all other mario players.
 

KayB

Smash Master
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
3,977
Location
Seoul, South Korea
It honestly hurts me to see gallo above chaddd on this list, and being recognized as the superior mario. Chaddd is a highly intelligent player and much stronger fundamentally than gallo and most players.
I haven't seen many recent results from Chad, while the most recent results from Gallo were from Apex 2014 where he received 13th place, outranking Eli, Axe, Denti, Rat, JCaesar, and more. On his way to 13th place, he eliminated Dazwa, Dakpo, Fuzzyness, and Vist, who are all good if not very good PM players. Gallo was knocked out of winners by Armada, the one who won the whole thing, and narrowly lost to Leffen in losers. That is an impressive run. Chad may be as intelligent as you claim, but you actually need to have evidence to back up your claim, especially considering the fact that you are a player with little renown.

If intelligence wasnt so counterproductive to success with this braindead iteration of mario then youd see a noticible gap between chad and all other mario players.
This doesn't even make sense. Are you saying that playing intelligently with Mario doesn't mean anything? That sounds more like a john than anything else. If a player plays intelligently, then he plays better. It doesn't make sense vice versa. Unless you can clearly provide evidence of these so-called "brain-dead" Marios you claim exists, I can't see this comment being worth any merit.
 
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Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
I haven't seen many recent results from Chad, while the most recent results from Gallo were from Apex 2014 where he received 13th place, outranking Eli, Axe, Denti, Rat, JCaesar, and more. On his way to 13th place, he eliminated Dazwa, Dakpo, Fuzzyness, and Vist, who are all good if not very good PM players. Gallo was knocked out of winners by Armada, the one who won the whole thing, and narrowly lost to Leffen in losers. That is an impressive run. Chad may be as intelligent as you claim, but you actually need to have evidence to back up your claim, especially considering the fact that you are a player with little renown.


This doesn't even make sense. Are you saying that playing intelligently with Mario doesn't mean anything? That sounds more like a john than anything else. If a player plays intelligently, then he plays better. It doesn't make sense vice versa. Unless you can clearly provide evidence of these so-called "brain-dead" Marios you claim exists, I can't see this comment being worth any merit.
I dont know what to tell you man, clearly you dont have the ability to understand player skill from a glance and instead base all of your assumptions on results. However if you arent the one winning a tournament then there are more factors than simple skill that go into a placing. The first group of players that you mentioned are legit for the most part. Axe is good, eli is okay, denti is good at pm, rat is okay and jcaesar doesnt deserve to be mentioned. However the thing with double elimination is that you can get a string of mediocre players and place high due to a weak pool, which is evident from the list of players you mentioned that gallo beat. Ive only heard of fuzzyness and vist; fuzzyness is okay i guess and vist is good, but luigi is extremely weak in pm and his loss to gallo can be contributed to several factors not related to skill, such as terrible MU, mario being a braindead scrub cannon in pm, and the lack of foxes, which are both good for luigi and also can be heavily exploited if they are inexperienced in the MU, something that literally doesnt bother mario at all since he can do the same thing every game and still win. So why does gallo not win in these events with such an op character? Because hes garbage and cant adapt or mixup his playstyle.

Compare chad at big house 3 to gallo at apex or vs eli or whatever. Chads mario plays out like a common fundamental melee mario, much like a rookie. Almost everything he does is done so with flawless spacing a reads. His movement is efficient and he crafty with marios tools, never sticking to a single tactic. Compare this to gallo. His playstyle consists of very very bad mindgames which i can only assume to be due to some kind of autopilot rather than pure intention, spams fireballs recklessly and mindlessly (this is important), erratic imprecise bad objectiveless movement that often puts him in situations that are unfavorable (negitive spacing), and has a very tunnel vision offensive game that consists of what i used to believe to be unsafe options from my experience in melee (such as dair on shield why would you do that).

This somehow seems to work out for him, mainly because most characters struggle against fireballs and theyre more dominating than falcos lasers(if you disagree with this its because you need to go learn how to play around lasers, extremely overrated projectiles). He doesnt have any discipline with them either or saves them for when theyre needed. He justs throws them out constantly and succeeds because theyre so powerful. I used to believe that fireball spamming was suboptimal, as pills are incredibly risky in melee and require a lot of thought to get any benefits from them. Somehow scrubbiness pulls out over knowledge and patience in this situation, as proven by gallos matches where simple fireball turnarounds can convert to extremely yet balls simple solid punishes 70% of the time. In the case where this doesnt happen mario tanks it with his great survivability, resilience to combos, and extra safe recovery.

Now mario is still beatable, but the margin for error is rather slim in handling fireballs and fireballs are so op that flubbing one will surely lead to a lot of percent due to raw hitstun and 8% damage combo starting fireballs. At this point mario has an unproportioned skill:reward ratio, made even steeper by the difficulty much of the cast has in dealing with him. If this wasnt true then someone as mediocre as gallo wouldnt be winning matches, because in melee someone so weak fundamentally would struggle to beat even the most forgettable intermediate players. If you find a video of gallo playing any other character then you will find that it is many times worse than his mario and twice as stupid.

Another thing, beating melee players in pm doesnt deserve mention at all. The meta is much much slower and more defensive, something many melee players areunaccustomed to or their characters are unsuited for it (see axe and kage). Spacies that are not wolf are really mediocre in this game and will not be winning tournaments any time soon. Beating mango or any top melee player in pm doesnt deserve any praise at all because the game is slower and more lenient for everyone except melee top tiers.
 

NickRiddle

#negativeNick
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
9,913
Location
Florida
So, one player is worse than the other because he uses a very good tool more often which nets him better results?
If fireballs are good, and people can't beat them, spam the living crap out of them while you can.
 

Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
So, one player is worse than the other because he uses a very good tool more often which nets him better results?
If fireballs are good, and people can't beat them, spam the living crap out of them while you can.
Because winning my videogames at the expense of fun and skill helps me get off at night.

That was a sarcastic statement. When melee was created we had a vision of fun fair exciting fast paced gameplay with high skill, stakes, and rewards. Where did we go so wrong that we justify the use of a single button/move to acheive victory.
 

Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
Around the time Shine was discovered.
"I cant think up a witty retort because im 1000 times less charming and delicious than jarbinks. Ill just make a quick little jab at how overpowered i think fox and falco are even though in real life and not in my made up fantasy world this is the exact opposite of an effective argument and my post is a dumb preschooler and doesnt make any sense, because i know the obese neckbeards on smashboards who are terrible at real games and cant handle shield pressure will give me likes"
 

Gallo69

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 8, 2010
Messages
165
Location
Brooklyn
I'm bad and play a brainless character. I have to turn my brain off completely just to be able to place well in this game.

@ Jarbinks9/11 Jarbinks9/11 Do you want to MM?
 

KayB

Smash Master
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
3,977
Location
Seoul, South Korea
Sure, there are plenty of factors that come into play in tournament settings that don't necessarily always point to skill. The point is, we can argue all we want about the fundamentals and play style of each player, but in the end talking and analyzing how good a player is and not showing ANY results since, what October 2013 when 2.5 was still out, is no different than theorycrafting. Placings in the end of the day are more relevant than they are not. I can understand your argument if Chad entered a tournament and got a lower placing than Gallo due bad pools, but you don't even argue that. Now considering the people Gallo beat.

jcaesar doesnt deserve to be mentioned.
I don't even...

Ive only heard of fuzzyness and vist;
You haven't heard of Dakpo. Mind = blown.

Chads mario plays out like a common fundamental melee mario, much like a rookie. Almost everything he does is done so with flawless spacing a reads. His movement is efficient and he crafty with marios tools, never sticking to a single tactic.
I'm glad you say this without pointing out a single example from his play at Big House 3. Very convincing argument. I'm not saying I can't be convinced, but you can't possibly expect to win an argument by demanding something to be true. If your response is just "well I guess you just can't see it" well okay then. Thanks for trying. Just post a video and a timestamp to provide your examples and if they're convincing, I'll back off.

Compare this to gallo. His playstyle consists of very very bad mindgames which i can only assume to be due to some kind of autopilot rather than pure intention,
Bolded important part.

spams fireballs recklessly and mindlessly (this is important), erratic imprecise bad objectiveless movement that often puts him in situations that are unfavorable (negitive spacing), and has a very tunnel vision offensive game that consists of what i used to believe to be unsafe options from my experience in melee (such as dair on shield why would you do that).
See answer to third quote.

This somehow seems to work out for him, mainly because most characters struggle against fireballs and theyre more dominating than falcos lasers(if you disagree with this its because you need to go learn how to play around lasers, extremely overrated projectiles). He doesnt have any discipline with them either or saves them for when theyre needed. He justs throws them out constantly and succeeds because theyre so powerful. I used to believe that fireball spamming was suboptimal, as pills are incredibly risky in melee and require a lot of thought to get any benefits from them. Somehow scrubbiness pulls out over knowledge and patience in this situation, as proven by gallos matches where simple fireball turnarounds can convert to extremely yet balls simple solid punishes 70% of the time. In the case where this doesnt happen mario tanks it with his great survivability, resilience to combos, and extra safe recovery.
So using an option that is safe, hinders the opponent, and opens them up for combos is dumb? Damn, better get rid of shield pressure because it does the exact same thing. You shouldn't blame the player for using an option that they can use to win. If it works and you think its cheap, blame the game not the player.

If you find a video of gallo playing any other character then you will find that it is many times worse than his mario
That applies to like every player ever, save for a few select top players. And Gallo is really really good with Pit, a character who is insanely different from Mario, so I don't understand your argument.

Another thing, beating melee players in pm doesnt deserve mention at all. The meta is much much slower and more defensive, something many melee players areunaccustomed to or their characters are unsuited for it (see axe and kage). Spacies that are not wolf are really mediocre in this game and will not be winning tournaments any time soon. Beating mango or any top melee player in pm doesnt deserve any praise at all because the game is slower and more lenient for everyone except melee top tiers.
This comment made me lol. First off, Axe is an amazing player and I don't think I need to sing his praises in PM to show why, but if you need me to, fine. I should say that AZ players like Neon and Heysuess can tell you that Axe's PM Pikachu is the real deal, and it's not like he just uses his Melee knowledge exclusively. You can clearly see in his gameplay that he uses a lot of bairs and QAC, both of which are new in PM. Another thing is that you said before that Denti is a good player. Yet at Whobo MLG that just happened, Mango beat Denti. Don't even tell me Fox is cheap because you just said he wasn't. Dr. PP also beat Reflex, one of the best players in PM at the moment. Leffen has also beaten Professor Pro and has come really close into beating Rolex. I could go on, but I think I've made my point.


Btw, Hylian, if this is off-topic or toxic to this thread, feel free to tell me to take this to PMs and I will gladly do so.
 
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ELI-mination

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 14, 2006
Messages
2,161
Location
Queens, New York
LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

@ this moron
 

Zerudahime

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 30, 2009
Messages
145
Location
Johnstown, PA
Gallo never played armada.
I lost to armada in winners 2-1 Armada.
Also, Gallo is by far the best Mario and has the most consistent results with the character.

Questioning Eli/Gallos position in this community is....like..what?..... :s
 

Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
I'm bad and play a brainless character. I have to turn my brain off completely just to be able to place well in this game.

@ Jarbinks9/11 Jarbinks9/11 Do you want to MM?
Sure, but let me warn you beforehand that if our MM is a mario ditto that i will be forced to stamp my thumb on the b button and spam fireballs to hell to counter your equally disappointing mario play, and it will be ass for everyone involved, pissing off everybody
 

ELI-mination

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 14, 2006
Messages
2,161
Location
Queens, New York
Put a lot of money on the line, he's garbage remember

Put at least like $300 and go to sktar

Come on he's garbage

Also for me too
I'll go Fox and you can go Mario. ;)
 
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Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

@ this moron
Stfu, the only reason people even tolerate your stupid posts and dumb punchable face is because youre in the pmbr. If it wasnt for you wingmanning for gallo constantly nobody woukd care about the guy, know about him, or even bother defending his shameful mario play.
 

Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
Put a lot of money on the line, he's garbage remember

Put at least like $300 and go to sktar

Come on he's garbage

Also for me too
I'll go Fox and you can go Mario. ;)
No ny is dirty, which makes sense for a garbage can like gallo to live there. Ill fight you in texas, the only legitimate pm region and ill only MM fir honor not cash. If i lose ill promise to shine strong bads shoes. If you lose your name gets banished from top 3 dks
 

KayB

Smash Master
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
3,977
Location
Seoul, South Korea
Stfu, the only reason people even tolerate your stupid posts and dumb punchable face is because youre in the pmbr.
Should I break the sad news for him or should I let him be?

Also, Hylian if you can read this, can you stop this troll. He's derailing this thread hard.
 
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Jarbinks9/11

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
Messages
71
Warning Received
I promise to be good, but only for fox buffs. That way elis fox will have a fair chance against my mario.

Haaa who am i kidding mario is broken and eli is balls
 

metroid1117

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 1, 2005
Messages
3,786
Location
Chester, IL
Guys... please stop feeding the troll.

@ KayB KayB - Looking through the OP, can you delete all videos before 3.0? If the only footage that people have are from pre-3.0, then IMHO they've been too inactive to be considered for that character. If people (or their fans/supporters) care about being in the "Top 3" for a certain character, then they'll post newer content.
 
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